Ruger Blackhawks...which one?

[nickeda85]

Went to local gun shop today and put a Ruger Bisley Flattop in 44 Special on the wishlist.
I did not realize that Lipsey's still had this model listed until this morning. :bigsmyl2:
Have couple guns being sold and would like their replacement to be a Blackhawk.
Been looking at Blackhawks in 357 and 45 when I ran across this.

Any thoughts or opinions?

Currently leaning towards the Bisley Flattop but also looked at 357 and 45, thinking 6.5" or 5.5" barrel respectively, and probably spring for conversion cylinder if went this route.

Hoping to do some deer hunting and general purpose gun for when I'm outdoors, maybe even pack for self defense.

Have learned a lot so far from browsing this site and am interested in any thoughts on these choices. Thanks.

DN

[DougGuy]

The .357 you can use or load full power loads in no matter which Ruger it is.

The new model flattop is built on the medium frame, so it's a little smaller and the cylinder walls are a little thinner than the full size Blackhawk or SBH, so you have to keep in mind that if you get a .45 on the medium frame, 23,000psi or .45 ACP +P is as far as it goes on the power scale, it cannot handle the "Ruger Only" loads for .45 Colt that the full size large framed guns can handle.

The .44 Special, -could- be handloaded to this 23,000psi max and be VERY deadly on deer, and the gun would be perfectly safe at this loading, it would be a lot of fun to shoot and won't have the recoil that the full power loads in the large framed guns can produce. I would think you could get a 200gr boolit to 1200f/s rather easily and still remain in sensible pressure levels, maybe even get a 240 to 1100 or 1150f/s and still be sensible about it.

About your conversion cylinder, you pretty much need to buy a convertible if you want this functionality in .45 caliber, unless it left the factory with the second cylinder, Ruger will not fit one to it.

[chsparkman]

I have the exact gun (4 5/8") you ordered. You will love it. Mine is more accurate when I use loads closer to the upper end of the published limits. The Lyman 429421 is a perfect projectile for the special.

[Thomas Traddles]

I've got the NMBH in both .357 and .44 spcl. I've owned the .357 longer and really love it. I've only had the .44 for a couple of weeks. The feel of shooting it over the .357 is much different. The gun is lighter, the balance of the gun is noticeably different and the recoil feels different as well. I appreciate the fact that the .44 spcl is as accurate as my .357. In my estimation, one would not go wrong with either one.

[osteodoc08]

The new flat tops have the older style XR3 grip frame and while good for handling, can really mess your knuckles up in short order with stout loads.

[Beagle333]

I have a .44sp on my wishlist too. :D 'Like I need to add a new caliber to my hobby.:roll:

[rintinglen]

My 44 Special is one of the most accurate guns I own. It is the only 44 special I have ever used that has lived up to the reputation that the caliber has for accuracy. I'd buy the 44 if I could count on it being as good as the one I already have. It shoots the "Skeeter" load wonderfully well.

[ejcrist]

I have the NM Blackhawk in 44 Special with the 5 1/2" barrel and love it. I'm loading 15.0 grains of 2400 for an average around 1,113 fps with the 429421. It groups around 2" at 25 yards off a rest with this load. I carried it javelina hunting a few weeks ago and it packs very nicely. I also like the Bisley's and wouldn't hesitate to get one. You can't go wrong with any you described but I'm very partial to 44 Special and 45 Colt.

[redneckdan]

I have a 4 5/8" flat top bisley in 44 spl, I picked up mine just after they came out. To give you an idea how much action it sees, I had most of the blueing worn off the sides of the barrel within about two months of owning it. I run three loads in it, the Keith, the Skeeter and one I developed with red dot under a 200gr HP.

In my mind, the only think that could top this ruger would be a 4 5/8 bisley flat top medium frame in 357 mag.

[NavyVet1959]

I recently came across a stainless 5.5" .45 Colt Bisley Blackhawk for $600...

http://i62.tinypic.com/2iav0bo.jpg (http://i62.tinypic.com/205l6s.jpg)

[Dale53]

I have a pair of the Lipsey Flattop .44 Specials (actually a 5.5" Lipsey and a 4 5/8" Talo flattop to be accurate). They can handle 25,000 psi loads all day long. Elmer Keith's load was at the 25,000 psi level and these handguns can handle them without issue (see Brian Pearce's article in the Handloader June/July 2009 #260).

I have a number of .44 Magnum handguns so my general purpose load in the .44 Special flattops is the old Skeeter load (7.5 grs. of Unique behind a 250 gr Keith).

Don't confuse the strength of a medium frame .44 Special with a medium frame .45 Colt (the Special will handle a bit more pressure).

FWIW
Dale53

[nickeda85]

Thanks for the replies. I have wanted a Ruger Bisley since I first hefted one at a Bass Pro Shop several years back. Felt amazing in my hand. Main thing I'm wondering now is how long of a wait do I have to look forward to.

NavyVet,
You have the gun I have drooled over. I think that combination would be perfect but with the price going up and up I think I am going for the 44 special version and no doubt be very content. Love the thought of being able to shoot heavy 45 Colt for hunting and 45 acp for plinking and general use. In all reality though where I am in the KY, OH, WV area I have no real need for heavy loads. A round of snakeshot maybe and five rounds of 44 should handle anything I need done. If not, I should have had a rifle too.

Thanks again.

DN

[contender1]

You will enjoy your gun. I immediately got a pair of the 44 Specials when Lipsey's offered them in the Blackhawk style. NEVER have I regretted it.
I also own several of Ruger's 45 cal SA's, including the same exact gun NavyVet has. I love them. Those were considered a "Williams exclusive."

[shoot-n-lead]

Those 44 special's, well, they are indeed, special. I have 3 of them and they are simply hard to beat...without doubt, my favorite Ruger's.

[runfiverun]

I have three of the 44 specials too one blue, one stainless, and a bisley.
I also have the 45 acp convertible..
I like my 41 mag hunter best of all,,,, okay, okay it's not an option here.:lol:

I do like the 44's with a set of new pachmeyer grips added.

[NavyVet1959]

NavyVet,
You have the gun I have drooled over. I think that combination would be perfect but with the price going up and up I think I am going for the 44 special version and no doubt be very content. Love the thought of being able to shoot heavy 45 Colt for hunting and 45 acp for plinking and general use. In all reality though where I am in the KY, OH, WV area I have no real need for heavy loads. A round of snakeshot maybe and five rounds of 44 should handle anything I need done. If not, I should have had a rifle too.


I was just checking out Armslist.com about 2 weeks ago and stumbled across it. Wasn't even particularly looking for a Ruger, much less one in .45 Colt / .45 ACP. I like to haggle (too much time spent overseas, I guess), so I offered him a bit less, but he wouldn't budge, but I did get him to toss in 100 pieces of brand new .45 Colt brass.

[contender1]

NavyVet, I gave $650 for mine NIB. You didn't need to haggle too much. Those guns are desirable to many! You got a fair deal.

[Char-Gar]

After 50 years deep into sixguns, I still don't get the fascination with the 44 Special. I have had many over the years and they have not proved more accurate than most other calibers. I know gun writers push the 44 Special as the nee plus ultra, but it has not proved to be so in my hands. There is nothing the 44 Special will do the 44 Magnum won't do doubled in spades. The magnum gives sterling accuracy all the way up the velocity scale from powder puff to full snort loads.

I like the 357 Magnum, the 44 Magnum and the 45 Colt in the Ruger SA handguns. My 357 is a 1971 old model, my 44 Magnum is a 1962 Super Blackhawk and my 45 is a Lipsey's 45 Flattop convertible. I would hate to choose just one, they are all fine sixguns.

I only have one 44 Special these days and it is a 1931 Smith and Wesson Hand Ejector that has been over the bench at Micro Sight back in the early 50 and has been upgraded to a serious target grade handgun. I don't shoot it often, but at least I can say I own a 44 Special. Here are the pics because that is the way we roll. We like pics on this board.

[BruceB]

[QUOTE=Char-Gar;3161570]After 50 years deep into sixguns, I still don't get the fascination with the 44 Special. QUOTE

Same here, amigo.

The .44 Magnum case has served me well since the late '60s, at every load level I could conceive.

From my ".44 Lite" (200 @ 800 fps) to full-snort RCBS 250s at over 1500 fps, the cartridge simply does whatever I need in the line of a .44 revolver.

I've never owned or loaded a single .44 Special case. Never needed it, never wanted it, don't miss it.

Clearly-identifiable loads in Magnum brass do it all for me.

[jmort]

"I know gun writers push the 44 Special as the nee (sic) plus ultra..."

It is all good by me. .44 Special makes sense to me, but obviously not to all. I had a Charter Arms in .44 Special and felt safe with it. I get why some really like the .44 Special.

[DougGuy]

I'm beginning to want one of the medium frame Rugers, I wanted to convert a .45 ACP to .45 Schofield, and load it as a dedicated tier 2 platform, 23,000psi ceiling, 255-280gr boolits @ 1150-1175f/s for hunting deer, and generally fun shooting with lesser velocities. I like my full size Rugers but the recoil is a bit much most times.

The .44 Special in factory loadings is (to me) rather anemic and it never even got my attention because of this. Enter the game changer. The medium framed Ruger in .44 Special, we know would be safe with 23,000psi loads, and some experienced shooters rate it to 25,000psi because it has slightly thicker cylinder walls than the medium framed .45 caliber guns, so this would also be an excellent choice for a tier 2 platform, right smack between the standard pressure loadings and the .44 magnum.

It would be more practical than converting .45 ACP to .45 Schofield, I don't need a reamer to convert it, just brass, dies, boolits, powder, and load data. As a side note, it MAY even prove to be so close to the same case capacity as the .45 Schofield that certain combinations of load data could be interchanged.

[W.R.Buchanan]

I have a SBH Bisley in .44 Mag , a BH Bisley in .44 Special and a S&W696 in .44 Special. I shoot the .44 Specials most of all and even shoot Specials in my SBH as those rounds will fit all three guns.

Even though I have moulds for lots of .44 cal boolits(like 10 different ones) the two main ones I use are 429421 for revolvers and 429244 for my rifle. I can make solids or hp's for all the above.

I basically use the 429244's with gas checks in my top end loads for both the SBH and my .44 Marlin. (22 gr of H110 being the standard) All the Special loads are with 429421 at 6.0 gr of W231,,, as it is the one that shoots to the sights best on those guns. Lighter boolits always shoot higher and are a pain to deal with in that respect so they just don't get used much at all.

I find shooting in general to best be done with specific loads for each type of gun or caliber. Chasing the magic load that wrings out the "absolute most accuracy" from any given gun has always been a waste of time for me. Especially when there is so little difference between the best loads to begin with. Once I find one that works well enough for my purposes, I use that load for those purposes, and am done with the research portion of shooting that gun.

I get much more satisfaction shooting at steel targets that are shaped like animals, than I get out of shooting at paper targets that are shaped like circles or squares.

For me personally a .44 Bisley, either a BH or SBH is the way to go. I could see a .45 combo gun being nice to have but I already have three .44's that will do anything a .45 will do and in most cases,,, do it better.

I have no use for a .357 at all, and especially when there are .44's available. There is absolutely nothing a .357 can do that a .44 can't do better!

For me it is like driving a car with a big block V8 engine and then driving one with a 6.

It just seems like a step down.

YMMV?

Randy

[salvadore]

I bought a SBH in '68 sold it in '75, still have the flinch. Converted my .44 spec. SAA to .45 Colt because of .427 bore and .434 chambers. I really like my Ruger flat top and a Smith M-21 classic is extremely accurate and the 396 is kinda specialized, but great for carrying. The 44mag is more versatile, but who cares?

[NavyVet1959]

I have no use for a .357 at all, and especially when there are .44's available. There is absolutely nothing a .357 can do that a .44 can't do better!

Well, other than helping to conserve a dwindling lead supply... :)

[W.R.Buchanan]

Really? I'm good for a while.

Randy

[NavyVet1959]

Really? I'm good for a while.


I recast a couple hundred pounds of pure lead into stainless steel condiment cup ingots the other day. They are a nice size for dropping into my casting pot, so I use them instead of the muffin tins. I think they are 2.5 oz (liquid), but I don't fill them all the way up, so they're probably a bit less than that. They're small enough that when I'm casting, they don't drop the temperature of the casting pot too much with a put two of them (assuming I'm making a 50:50 Pb:WW alloy) in there periodically.

I still like to conserve my lead as much as possible now that it's getting more and more difficult to find wheelweights that are actually made from lead.

[45r]

I got a 41mag bisley hunter for deer hunting and it is very accurate.
It has become my favorite followed by 45colt in a redhawk and 357mag in a Blackhawk when it comes to Ruger six-guns.

[osteodoc08]

One of my favorites, well 2, are my SS 5.5" Bisleys. One in 41 mag and the other in 45 Colt.