For you bottle neck shooters

[borg]

Does anyone make a carbide expander that will also bell the case?
I have several M dies and some Sinclair expanders with a carbide expander, however it doesn't bell the case.
I love the way the carbide expands without any lube.
Any help?

[gloob]

My steel M dies work great with no lube.

I take special precautions to make sure no lube gets inside the case neck. The only time I might have trouble is with brand new brass or wet tumbled cases. Just like with pistol expanders, no lube needed under normal circumstances.

Since steel works fine without lube when you expand from top down I suspect no one will make an M die out of carbide. That is a lot of material and grinding for very little gain.

[borg]

If I don't use any lube, the brass galls to the point the cases will split.
Take out your M die expander and look to see if there's any brass streaks on it.
If there is, you can usually feel it when you withdraw the case,, feels real gritty

[Motor]

I use a dry lube when I size the bass. I don't add anything more when I use the "M"die or any other neck expander.

I have also used M die and other neck expander without any lube at all. Never had an issue doing this.

Motor

[gloob]

My push thru expanders only get called with new or wet tumbled brass. Sometimes a steel pull thru expander doesn't even need lube if the sizing die is loose enough

[Yodogsandman]

Your "M" dies have a step on them to bell the case mouths. Adjust the stem down to expand the mouth to just fit a boolit far enough in it to between half way up to the top of the gas check. About .001" over boolit diameter.

I brush out the case mouths with a lightly lubed brush before F/L resizing and then run the case mouth up into an "M" die to expand the neck and to bell the mouth. I then clean the cases by running them in a vibratory case cleaner with ground corn cob. I've never experienced the grittiness you describe.

[geargnasher]

Sounds like your sizing die is sizing the necks down too far in the first place. Use a bushing-type neck sizing die to only size the necks sufficiently to hold the bullet with .002" interference, and add a slight bellmouth with a spud-guided tool such as the RCBS cast bullet expanding dies or, a distant second choice for me, the M-style two-step expanders. The RCBS cast bullet expanding die spuds are selectable and you can order a size that compliments the neck bushing to minimize working of the necks, they are also nitrided and require no lubrication. If body sizing and shoulder bumping are required as well in your application, RCBS and at least two other manufacturers make a body die that will accept the neck bushings, and at least one (Redding, I think) makes a shoulder-bump-only neck sizing die that accepts the selectable neck bushings and will also allow bumping of the shoulder, but doesn't size the body of the case.

Gear

[bedbugbilly]

I don't have any problem with either of my M dies that I use on the bottlenecks I reload. Have you tried just dipping your case mouths in some powdered graphite which should lube the inside enough to get the expanders and out - what graphite is left isn't going to hurt anything.

[Dframe]

I've used a little kit I bought from midway (I think), which consists of a neck brush and powdered mica, mounted in a small blue box

[mdi]

Does anyone make a carbide expander that will also bell the case?
I have several M dies and some Sinclair expanders with a carbide expander, however it doesn't bell the case.
I love the way the carbide expands without any lube.
Any help?

Anyone know? :confused:

[texassako]

I use Imperial Dry Neck Lube when I need a little lube on the inside of the neck, but that is a rare occurrence.

[borg]

Thanks guys.
I have eliminated all the expander balls from all my dies years ago
I have been using M dies since the 60's and have always had to lube in one form or another to keep it from galling. I just don't want to have to do each one using a progressive press, sorta defeats the purpose.
I have two of the Sinclair carbide expanders and they really work well, but they don't bell the cases.
Just trying to find one that will.
Thanks.

[geargnasher]

RCBS expanders. Don't use a die that sizes the necks any smaller than necessary. End of problem.

Gear

[borg]

RCBS expander? I haven't used an internal expander in over 40 years, always the M die, no case stretch.
I have no way to accurately hone the die out, even if I did, then all the different cases would require a different die.
I've been looking for a Redding die that uses neck bushings that would work with the shorter 300BLK case, but so far I haven't been able to find one.

[geargnasher]

Note that I wrote "add a slight bellmouth with a spud-guided tool such as the RCBS cast bullet expanding dies" in post #7. How would you do that with a drag-ball expander? I'm referring to RCBS cast bullet neck expanders. Not button type, SPUD TYPE. Most don't seem to know they exist. Look HERE: http://www.midwayusa.com/product/784123/rcbs-neck-expander-plug-311

Ok, that's the spud. You'll need the universal die body and the rod and locking nut that holds the spuds, sold separately. You can get these in a variety of specific sizes, .308", .309", and so on, unlike the one-size-fits-nothing Lyman M-die spuds. They are nitrided and HARD.

Use any .30-caliber bushing-type neck die, just cut the bottom of the die body off in a chop saw and grind it square to fit your case length. Preferably, bush the entrance to center the case. Or just hone out the neck of the die you have with a split dowel and sand paper. I'm trying to make your life easier here, not harder. Too bad no one yet makes an AAC bushing sizer die.

Gear

[borg]

Thanks.
I've been using the M die so long that I didn't realize RCBS made one, I thought you were referring to a button type.
Will have to check it out.

[Moonie]

Personally I use an old prescription bottle with some #9 shot and every now and then add a shot of graphite, perfectly dry lubes case necks without using to much.

[EDG]

In my opinion the RCBS type is no different than what RCBS has been selling in hand gun die sets since before 1970.

It is not really a 2 step die. It is a single diameter die that also flares. With the blunt end they are just as likely to push the case neck out of alignment. They would work better if you ground a long taper on them. Even the Lyman M dies would benefit from a longer taper.

['74 sharps]

Switched from neck bushings to the Lee Collet die, and am as happy as a duck in a pond, as it's a great way to keep neck tension consistent.

[gloob]

Borg. Are you using a wet tumbler with SS pins?

Try adding Armor All Wash and Wax, or something. Wet tumbled brass is the reason you are getting galling. I'd wager a donut and a cup of coffee.

[borg]

Yes, I do wet clean, but I've always had the galling problem before with dry tumbling.
If you think about it, unless you have a carbide expander or lube, any soft/hard metal rubbing together will gall.
Look into your sized, expanded cases and see the lines in the neck, galling however may be light may be heavy.
ETA might have to try adding a wax to see if it corrects the problem