Thinking of stepping up to a lubesizer..... looking for opinions.

[c1skout]

I've been tumble and pan lubing for the last year or so while this new casting addiction has grown in me. It looks like I'm sticking with it so I'm ready to get a lubesizer. I shoot mostly 38 & 45 pistol right now, but I've got a mold on the way for my 45-70, and my boy just picked up a 303 british so there's some more sizers to buy soon.

I like the look of the old Lyman 45, but was wondering if I would be better served with the 450 or 4500, or possibly the RCBS machine. The Star seems like it would be overkill and too expensive for me, and the Saeco not as easy to find dies and punches for, at least used ones.

Should I be leary of getting worn out junk if I buy decent looking used from ebay? Any particular models to definitely stay away from? Is a heater needed for use in a room that usually stays around 60 degrees? Are there advantages to buying new size dies over used? Is it hard to find top punches that work with Lee mold designs?

[Mike W1]

I've been tumble and pan lubing for the last year or so while this new casting addiction has grown in me. It looks like I'm sticking with it so I'm ready to get a lubesizer. I shoot mostly 38 & 45 pistol right now, but I've got a mold on the way for my 45-70, and my boy just picked up a 303 british so there's some more sizers to buy soon.

I like the look of the old Lyman 45, but was wondering if I would be better served with the 450 or 4500, or possibly the RCBS machine. The Star seems like it would be overkill and too expensive for me, and the Saeco not as easy to find dies and punches for, at least used ones.

Should I be leary of getting worn out junk if I buy decent looking used from ebay? Any particular models to definitely stay away from? Is a heater needed for use in a room that usually stays around 60 degrees? Are there advantages to buying new size dies over used? Is it hard to find top punches that work with Lee mold designs?

Everyone will have their own opinion, that much you can count on. I had a 45 at one time and personally didn't care that much for it. Now have a RCBS LAM II of which I have no complaints at all since I put a ball on the handle and did the little socket trick that let's you use a rachet handle. I'm sure a Star would be grand but 500/hr is enough for my needs!

A heater might be necessary in a 60° room depending on the lube. Mine's hard enough it needs it and my room is only a few degrees warmer than that.

I don't think there's that much that wears out on a lub/sizer so personally wouldn't be too spooky about a used one. Believe there's a site CastPics that may have a chart for top punches that will fit Lee bullets.

My 2¢ worth!

[engineer401]

The new Lyman cast bullet handbook has a chart for Lee bullets and Lyman punches. I recently purchased a d Lachmiller (now RCBS) Lube A Matic and a Lyman 45 that were rusted and did not work. Once I cleaned the rust off, they worked fine. I owned all of the sizers you referenced. I like my Star a lot. The Saeco and the LAM seem to be the tightest. I used the 4500. It worked OK. The 450 I now have seems to be built well enough. I guess what I am trying to say is you probably won't go wrong with any of them. The used ones I bought just needed a good cleaning. One thing to note, I found one RCBS die I purchased did not work in the 4500. It didn't fit at the bottom. It happened once so I stuck with the Lyman dies after that.

Here is a current posting on the Lyman 45. http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?268795-Lyman-45

Read through this posting for a used die description. http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?268545-Lyman-45

[georgerkahn]

A heater is not a bad investment, although after making a few melted messes I put a 0-110VAC Variac ahead of it. Others employ PID's, lamp dimmers, and some just put a lit incandescent light bulb close to the lub sizer of your choice. I'd suggest this (the "heater") as the easiest to answer of your questions. Even at >60*, the less wear on the sizer you elect, and enabling the softer from heat to better fill and adhere to boolit lub grooces surely, imho, makes it a sound "need".
I can only speak for me, and my not-always-rosy 40+ years of boolit making: When I wish to produce LOTS of one boolit (e.g., .45acp for competition) I say a little prayer of thanks to the Magma folks for producing the Star and site-members like Lathesmith who produce the requisite dies for it. HOWEVER, to me, it is a bit of a challenge to change dies on the Star -- MUCH easier on my Lyman 450s to do that -- so for small runs of most other boolits -- the 45 or 450 is the way I went.
You'll hear perhaps as many answers as there is to the question, "What's the best pizza?" -- all a matter of personal taste, preference, funds willing to spend, and of course -- "luck" (or bad luck) with what you elect.
I have no experience with the RCBS, SAECO, or other units out there.
Hope my 2-cents here helps a bit...
BEST!
georgerkahn

[Duckiller]

450 and 4500 are probably a little stronger than a 45. I got a "new in the box" 450 at a small gun show for about $40.00 in 2010. A cheap hair drier will provide all the heat you need to soften any lube. Lyman and RCBS use the same sizing dies and top punches. SAECO use different dies and punches that are less common and may be hard to find for cheap. They are all good machines and take some of the mess out of lubeing.

[VintageRifle]

I would recommend getting something of current manufacturer. Nothing worse than getting an older machine and finding it needs a part that is no longer available.

[blikseme300]

A Star is never overkill, but this is only my opinion. Not having to worry about different top punches or lube under bevel based designs makes this my sizer of choice. It takes very little time to switch dies and is not as fiddly to set up as some claim. I often do small number of boolits at a time and have no problems in switching dies if needed. A caliper to measure punch height and a notebook & pen to take notes eliminates the fiddling to get the proper setup of a Star.

[dragon813gt]

I would recommend getting something of current manufacturer. Nothing worse than getting an older machine and finding it needs a part that is no longer available.

RCBS still supply's parts for LAM1s and Magma will rebuild the Stars. Lyman customer service sucks so good luck w/ that one. And I have no idea about Saeco. So if you stick to RCBS and Magma/Star you will be just fine.

There are many many threads about this subject. One is maybe a week old. Search these threads out and make your decision based on your personal needs.

[Le Loup Solitaire]

Saeco is a good machine; well built and has been around for a while. Somewhat more costly than Lyman or RCBS. Uses solid stick lube. The sizing dies are more expensive as are the top punches. Has a built in gas check seater. Older models had black crinkle finish and newer ones have green. Handle pulls to the side. Have been running two of them for decades now and no sign of wear anywhere. LLS

[ascast]

IMHO- for about$50 the Lyman 45 or even the older Ideal can't be beat, be sure to get the mounting clamp for the Ideal or it's junk. The 450 and 4500 are stronger but the operating bars are wider and I find interfer with loading boolits. For around $100 the RCBS LAMS are better than the Lymans. Never used Saeco/Redding; top quality, just not interchangeable with Lyman,RCBS so used dies will be uncommon. The STAR is a high production machine, yes you can grease 10, change out and do 10 of something else, but you pay the biggest money for a machine that will do 100,s per hour with ease. Same money will get you 5 or 6 Lyman 45's and you don't have to change dies or lube.
Avoid antiques, like Phitzer, Meepos, Cramer unless priced as a Lyman 45 AND has some dies you need to use. You may not find others.
I never size bullets, and I think more than .002" - .003" is asking a lot of the machine, especially the Lyman 45. They can be broken.
ALso, you can break a 4500 handle off if sizing down 004" of hard alloy. Lyman will send you a new one that wont fit ( OR WORK) for about $15. And you make one in the shop.
Don't ask me how I know this to be true, just take it as fact.
Never used LEE stuff.
I never heated lube, but I have always kept the luber in a room at about 65-75 degrees. Never used any of the new fangled super lubes either.

[str8shot426]

I just graduated to a lubesizer myself. I went with the RCBS lam 2, for the easy to obtain punches and dies.
So far I am very pleased with its performance. I use a soft lube so no need for a heater in my 60-70 degree basement.

[1911aug]

I would agree with the comment,(Lyman customer service ain't good!). I have a Lyman 450 that my dad bought in the 80's and it is it worn out to the point that the ram is so sloppy the top punch smacks the size die every time you pull the handle to size a bullet. Called and emailed Lyman and was told sorry that is out of warranty. A buddy of mine had a Lachmiller (I beleive is the name, pre RCBS) sizer,
that he worn to all most the same point of my Lyman and RCBS replaced for him free of charge including shipping.
So for me when funds permit RCBS will be my new sizer. Sorry for the long post guys, but warranty plays big in my purchases.

[goblism]

I find my star to be my go to lately, if you were only lubing 50 or so bullets than the RCBS, Lyman, or Saeco would work but time is money in my eyes. Buy once cry once.

[blikseme300]

Using pricing for used equipment to compare products is subjective. I lucked out and got 2 unused but pre-owned Star's for $50 from an estate sale.

Currently the Magma-Star is just under $100 more than a Lyman 4500 at $238.95

[georgerkahn]

Magma Star is but for the unit; dies are xtra. FYI, here's from their web-site:
130864
BEST!
georgerkahn

[c1skout]

Thanks for all the input fellows, I don't need one immediately so I'm gonna keep my eyes open for a good deal. It seems like there are a lot more Lyman sizers out there for sale than any of the other brands.

[cajun shooter]

There is a reason that Lyman has more used ones for sale, they wear out faster and the RCBS is made better. As far a top punches go and as long as you cast bullets with at least a small meplat on the nose, you can't bet the deal at Accurate molds. Tom sells a set of three top punches that will cover most all bullets made with a flat meplat. They are made of aluminum and sell for just $5 for the set of three. How's that for a deal?
I have been casting since 1970 and have owned as many as three Stars at once, all equipped with the air cylinder. If you are casting large 45-70 bullets over 500 grains, I've found that they pan lube better than trying to run them through a sizer/lube press. That is just my opinion, but again I casted my first 45-70 in 1970.
I had a bad medical problem hit me a few years back and sold all of my equipment as I thought my casting, shooting and reloading days were over. Well the doctors have installed a new pain pump in me that is showing some hope for me to start back with my SASS shooting. I purchased a new RCBS 11 for my lubing and sizing and so far it's doing the job. I also prefer the RCBS lube dies to the Lyman dies. JMHO again.
As far as a heater, it will depend on your lube choice, if you use a lube like Carnauba Red, then you will need one. I use a 4X12 piece of 1/2 inch aluminum to mount my sizer/lube press to. I then sit a travel size iron on the plate and dial in the heat needed, works great. Later David

[LenH]

I bought a Star from Magma & have a RCBS lube/sizer I bought back in the 70's and it is still solid as a rock and I still use it from time to time.
The Star is not nearly as hard to set up as some say but it is a bit time consuming. I bought my dies from Lathesmith on the vender site. He makes a great
product and is a bit cheaper than the Magma dies. I bought his punch nuts with the set screws, great idea of set and forget, you have the proper depth set
for the next casting session. my nickel's worth.
Len H.

[40-82 hiker]

If you're on a budget like myself, I like my 4500. If $$ are not tight you might consider some of the others mentioned, but bang for the buck I do like what I'm using.

[Petrol & Powder]

I went with a Lyman 4500 due to a slight savings in cost and the fact that it was available at the time I placed a large order, therefore saving on shipping as well. If the RCBS had been available at the time I likely would have purchased it instead even with the higher cost. I have always had positive results with RCBS equipment and service. That being said, the Lyman does what it is supposed to do and seems adequate. As much as I like SAECO/Redding products, the higher cost and proprietary dies turn me off to that choice. The SAECO design looks to be the best of the bunch but I'm not sure the price is worth it. The Star is in another league.

[TheDoctor]

I wish the RCBS had a ratchet like the Lyman. That back and forth thing gets old. Had I not started powder coating the majority of my boolits, I would look real hard at a Star. Truly do not shoot enough to really need one, but what does need have to do with anything?

[ascast]

HI again, I re-read this post and I think the real question is "what are you going to do with it?"
I had a Star with a 0.458" die and I thought it would work for my BPCR stuff, 45-70. Well, it was not right. 1st, I never size anything unless I have too to get it in the gun. 2nd, I could not get enough lube on the bullets for shooting black. 3rd the Star is a push through design and you really don't want your long range bullets dropping out in a pile and getting the bases dinged up. So my money, for high volume pistol-can't beat a Star, for slow fire long range rifle, probably not a Star. have fun

[cbrick]

Another point for the Star that hasn't been mentioned in this thread is that nose first push through sizing is more concentric than in & out sizing. Rifle or handgun a non concentrically sized bullet will not be as accurate as a concentric bullet.

Rick

[Char-Gar]

My thoughts on the subject at hand.

1. The Star is the absolute best on the market and the price reflects that. I don't have one.

2. The Lyman 45 while a nice piece of nostalgia, is a weak sister compared to the later generations of Lyman machines.

3. I don't there is any significant between the RCBS and Lyman, except the customer service and that prize goes to RCBS.

4. Me, I limp along with three Lyman 450's and have no plans to change unless I win the lottery, and then I will buy a bank of new Star machines.

[cbrick]

It's a different situation for those that have been casting for some time and would like to go with the Star. Once an investment in dies is made and that can be considerable switching machines means replacing all those dies. Makes switching a good bit tougher to justify. For those just contemplating their first lubrisizer such as the OP of this thread starting with what you may well want to end up with the Star is the way to go.

An alternative for nose first push through sizing is the LEE. You can have the push through benefit of concentricity and lube in a Lyman/RCBS etc. with a die .001" larger than used to size.

Rick

[BrassMagnet]

Now for my opinion.

I love the Star.
Most custom moulds come with a die to fit Lyman/RCBS sizers.
Magma customer service is poor compared to Star San Diego back in the old days.
If I can't do what I want with a Star due to lack of sizers or top punches, then I will go to a Lyman.

[Dusty Ed]

Howdy Fellers & ascast
First Of all I size an Lube on the Star Lubrasizer 45-70 ,45-60 ,40-65 ,50-90, 50 S&W ETC. If your 45-70 is to small that is your fault
for ordering .458 instead of a .459 or .460 on up ,as far as not getting enough lube It either not adjusted right or you have the wrong
holes plugged.
The push through is no problem You can catch each one as it comes though the Machine ,I drop my bullets in a Pan 6" drop ,it don't ding them .
You are right about it being right for pistol bullets ,I use the auto bullet feeder with 1/2" copper tubes 70 bullets per tube, I can run a tube in about 3min.
You can fix that problem with running the 45-70 through your machine.
Dusty Ed:cbpour:

[MBTcustom]

My opinion:
Lyman 450, 4500, RCBS LAM, and Seaco:
Pros:
Very strong units that will size even heat treated, fully hard bullets.
Cheap dies that are readily available all over the place.
Slightly less expensive than other models.
Excellent way to get a perfectly seated gas check.
No difference in use, between plain based, or GC bullets.
Cons:
They very rarely size a bullet straight, as the alignment at rest is different than the alignment under duress of sizing.
Very hard to clean the lube out if you care to change.
The special nut that holds the die in the Lyman offerings is easily cross threaded at which point the press is ruined.
Lube tends to get everywhere including the lube grooves.
Star bullet sizer:
Pros:
Absolutely perfectly concentric sizing of bullets due to the push through method with no "pinch between punches".
Speed. Raw unadulterated speed when casting plain based bullets. (did I mention it was fast?)
Lube is placed exactly, precisely, in the lube grooves you want, and no where else. Very very clean in this regard.
Easy to clean out and switch lubes.
Lathesmith dies. (truly excellent tools available from member Lathesmith, a CB VS. He will make them custom to the lube groove configuration of the bullets you intend to lube.)

Cons:
Very weak mechanical design (mine is the old Santa Fe model). Bullets must be soft in order to be sized. If you heat treat your bullets, they must be all sized within 3 hours of quenching or you will turn the handle of the Star into a pretzel trying to get the bullets run through there.
Dies are expensive and not commonly available on ebay etc etc etc like H&I dies are for the other presses
Harder to adjust perfectly than the Lyman RCBS or Seaco. The stroke must be set so that the lube grooves line up with the holes precisely and this can be frustrating if you're not used to it.
Gas checked spitzers are difficult. Because the press depends on the next bullet to push the first bullet through the die and take its place, pointed bullets will damage the gas check on the bullets ahead of them. This is easily solved with an aluminum or copper pusher blank that is used to push the bullet through the die, recovered from the pile of bullets below the press and used again. Not a huge deal, but it slows you down, and your life becomes the pursuit of the pusher blank, and not allowing it to fall in the bucket with the other bullets.

All things considered, I like the Star better than all the options despite its quirky nature and requirement for constant adjustment and tuning. It's worth it to me for the speed and precision.
That said, I use Lee push through dies and dip lubing more than any other method, and the Star is relegated to lubing large runs of bullets only (like 300+) while the Lyman 450 sits unused for the past 5 years.
Just my opinion.

Thank you.

[Love Life]

Hmmm. If starting from the ground up, get the star and call it good. You may not appreciate it now, but you will later on down the road. If you ever tire of it, you can sell it for what you paid for it.

[KAYDADOG]

I agree DustyEd. There should be no problem filling any lube grooves. One reason I could think of is possibly the lube is not flowing enough where a heated unit may be required. As stated the correct lube holes may not be setup correctly. All I can say is that I have invested in quality reloading equipment over the last twenty years. I still have an old RCBS sizer, push in, push out. There is no comparison using a feed through Star sizer. Everyone is on some kind of budget. If your going to do reloading the rest of your life the extra few $100 dollars will be well worth it.
I've also added some improvements over the standard machine.
Air pressure lube control.
Built custom aluminum plate to accept heating element.
PID temperature controller with bullet counter, raised base bullets drop through circular type proximity switch.
Bullets drop through bench and caught several inches below. If worried about dings, possibly rifle only, let them fall into a rag/towel. Never had a problem with dings unless I dropped one on the concrete floor.
Using the standard Star bullet feeder I built a small platform/stand above to accept 6/tube collators holding about 150/bullets. Have three different sizes to accept 25-06 rifle up to 500/S&W. It almost takes longer to fill the tubes than it does to do the sizing. That's how fast bullets can be sized taking your time. Not like some of the marathon videos out there seeing how many one can do. Always quality first. Reloading no matter what step your doing should not be a race against the clock, just common sense.
Like others said once you get a caliber setup take your punch extended measurement. After changing calibers back and forth the setup will always be the same. I took my documentation about ten steps further. I detailed each Star die I use and the lube hole locations in Autocad. Drew up the cast bullet details to actual size and placed bullet detail into die detail lining up the lube holes that will be used and not used. Based on the actual dimensions all I have to do is take a dimension how far down the bullet needs to be pushed into the die, perfect every time.
Just another point I never had a problem seating gas checks on rifle or pistol calibers. It takes longer only because you need to place each one on the bullet.
One of the best pieces of equipment you'll ever buy if your a serious bullet caster.

[Char-Gar]

It's a different situation for those that have been casting for some time and would like to go with the Star. Once an investment in dies is made and that can be considerable switching machines means replacing all those dies. Makes switching a good bit tougher to justify. For those just contemplating their first lubrisizer such as the OP of this thread starting with what you may well want to end up with the Star is the way to go.

An alternative for nose first push through sizing is the LEE. You can have the push through benefit of concentricity and lube in a Lyman/RCBS etc. with a die .001" larger than used to size.

Rick

That is the exact situation I found myself in with several decades of Lyman and RCBS sizing dies for my Lyman sizing machines. Absent a lottery win, it would be far to costly to switch to a Star.

17 years ago when this board was first born, we broke the code on how to size long slim rifle bullets without bending them in traditional base first sizing machine. A nose first push through sizing die was the answer.

Buckshot made some gizmos to hold RCBS and Lyman dies in a bench press to do this and it worked fine. They were made from aluminium RCBS expanding die bodies. Years later The Perfesser designed and made another gizmo for the same purpose. I bought one of the first and it also works to perfection. I think he still makes these things.

I use the same die I sized the bullet in to lube it in a Lyman machine. This is easy to do and there is no significant pressure on the nose to bend the bullet. By using the same die, I avoid the extra cost of having a .001 larger die just to lube the bullet. I have done it both ways and my targets show no difference.

The Lee press mounted sizing system also works well, but the diameters sold by Lee are very limited. However it is quite easy to lap a Lee die out a couple of thou. I use cast bullet coated with Clover 320 lapping paste. I clean the die and size a fresh bullet to measure the progress. I then use this fresh bullet to continue the lapping until I am where I want to be. It does not take all that long.

[Jeff Maney]

Good move on the sizer. Get the Lyman or RCBS, look for the best deal. Same tooling fits both.

jeff

[Ken in Iowa]

If you buy used, it's best to get one from a seller who knows what he's got and represents it fairly. Beware of eBay sellers who may not know anything and are selling a lemon. Caveat emptor.

[dragon813gt]

If you buy used, it's best to get one from a seller who knows what he's got and represents it fairly. Beware of eBay sellers who may not know anything and are selling a lemon. Caveat emptor.

But if you do that you will most likely pay more. It's definitely buyer beware. But sometimes a loan Star or LAM isn't listed properly and you can snag it for pennies on the dollar. Magma will rebuild a Star for you. And RCBS will send you parts to rebuild their sizers for free. I've rebuilt two LAM1s and both are in perfect working order. One now sports a custom paint job. Still green just a more pleasing color to look at :laugh:

[gwpercle]

Just get one, it doesn't matter which maker, they all make life easier.
I gave up the pan/tumble for a Lyman 450, late 60's or so, still using it , still the best money I ever spent. Back then hard lubes didn't matter to us home casters so soft lube was the norm. I'm still using stuff that doesn't need a heater and have no lead problems. Sometimes I believe the hard stuff doesn't work as well as the soft lube's.
Gary

[largom]

Any lub/sizer is better than no lub/sizer. Let your wallet pick the one for you.

Larry

[Mike W1]

I wish the RCBS had a ratchet like the Lyman. That back and forth thing gets old. Had I not started powder coating the majority of my boolits, I would look real hard at a Star. Truly do not shoot enough to really need one, but what does need have to do with anything?

I tried doing a search for a post I know I made. Couldn't figure how to find it. Anyways here's the pertinent stuff.

¼” drive - ½” 6 point socket with a slot cut in it to allow a bolt to go through
the top of the luber screw. An angle grinder readily cuts the slot.

http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u310/Mike4245/HPIM1847.jpg
http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u310/Mike4245/HPIM1848.jpg

[Doggonekid]

I bought a uses RCBS lube sizer from a local gun smith, he said he used it a lot. He also told me to go to Lowes and buy me some O rings and I could rebuild it for about $3. He was right. It lasted me for over 20 years. I let my friend use it and he loved it so much I hated to ask for it back so I bought me a new RCBS LAM II. I have never regretted since. I found the heater is a wonderful thing. I never used my sizer longer than a couple of hours, so I never had it overheat. It sure made it easer to lube my boolits. The Lyman heater works well with the RCBS machine. If you GC your boolits you need a lube sizer.

[rockitrob]

I am sorry I did not buy my Star sizer 20 years ago. Who can argue with a base punch that goes nose first? Anyone who says it is twice as fast never used one. Put bullet in, pull handle put new bullet in. 3 steps. RCBS , put bullet in, push forward and back, pull bullet out, put new bullet in.4 steps. The air feed also frees up steps and is easy to keep even pressure. Be ready to pay for it at first but I had probably 3 different punches for my RCBS, only about 6 for this one.

[Harles Dawson]

What he said. I use a wooden dowel to drive sizer die out, put proper size die in, check notes, adjust punch to proper
setting. Takes about as long as it did to type this.

[gloob]

I am sorry I did not buy my Star sizer 20 years ago. Who can argue with a base punch that goes nose first? Anyone who says it is twice as fast never used one. Put bullet in, pull handle put new bullet in. 3 steps. RCBS , put bullet in, push forward and back, pull bullet out, put new bullet in.4 steps. The air feed also frees up steps and is easy to keep even pressure. Be ready to pay for it at first but I had probably 3 different punches for my RCBS, only about 6 for this one.
??? So a Star is not twice as fast? Or it IS?

BTW, I don't see why you're counting "insert a new bullet" twice in your comparison. That's redundant. So I see 2 steps vs three steps.

And with the Star, while you are doing step 2 with your right hand, you are already reaching for the next bullet with your left hand, no? Seems to me the Star is at least twice as fast.

[altheating]

Want to see fast, put a bullet feeder on a Star. If your just lubing it's about as fast as you can pull the handle.

[rockitrob]

IMO, faster. 1/3 the time maybe less. Place a bullet pull the lever, place a bullet pull the lever. You don't have to fumble with the bullet to remove it. The go through nose first and drop out the bottom. Look at some of the you tube videos others have made and judge for yourself.

[David2011]

I find my star to be my go to lately, if you were only lubing 50 or so bullets than the RCBS, Lyman, or Saeco would work but time is money in my eyes. Buy once cry once.

He speaks the truth.

[David2011]

??? So a Star is not twice as fast? Or it IS?

BTW, I don't see why you're counting "insert a new bullet" twice in your comparison. That's redundant. So I see 2 steps vs three steps.

And with the Star, while you are doing step 2 with your right hand, you are already reaching for the next bullet with your left hand, no? Seems to me the Star is at least twice as fast.

I have a Star and Lyman 450.

Lyman: Place boolit, stroke both ways, remove boolit and deposit in container.

Star: Drop boolit nose first, stroke, repeat. Realistically, 3-4 times as fast but only for volume work. I use the Lyman if I'm only making 100 boolits or so. Like a progressive press, the setup time negates some of the benefit unless ou're sizing several hundred boolits of the same type.

I shoot USPSA and use the Star for my volume shooting. The Lyman gets the hunting boolit work. Last batch of 125 .44 Keiths has lasted 5 years but I only use them for hunting and a few practice shots. I size 20 pounds of .40 at a time.

David

[altheating]

The hardest part is spending the extra money on the Star. After that, it's easy. You won't regret buying one.