45 acp chambering

[pearcetopher]

Hello all,

I have a question about a 45 acp lee boolit


On my 452-230-r I find that in order to allow reliable chambering I have to seat this bullet deep so that it is not touching the grooves. I figure this out by chambering a long round and seeing where the grooves are marked on the boolit, and then seating the boolit so the grooves are at the case mouth.

This gives me plonk and reliable chambering, but a major concern for accuracy. Final OAL is 1.12 which I know is rediculously short for 45 acp so I backed the powder way off to 3.8 grains of bullseye. I get reliable firing and ok accuracy. Is this the right thing to do or should I be seating the boolit into the grooves? I only like to seat the boolit into the grooves on rifles where the round is easily extracted. I find that seating the round into the grooves on pistols can jam a round in which is VERY hard to remove.

Was this the right thing to do?

[prs]

I suspect you are working with the traditional lubed 452-230-1R and not the TL452-230-2R. Right? There was a recent thread about this very thing. Some of the problem is the "fat" ogive and some of the problem may be with how modern barrels in 45ACP are being made. The step from chamber end to the full rifling is often so abrupt as to be a 90 degree edge. Even with lead boolits with lesser "noses", even SWC can give erratic plunk tests as the exposed full diameter area of lead at and beyond the crimp tends to catch and hang on that squared edge. There is a sticky on this site about reaming a proper leade in these barrels. Do search out the recent thread about the Lee 1R and this problem, could not be more than just a few weeks back. Best of luck to you.

prs

[prs]

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?267036-Lee-230gr-2r-OAL

Read this thread and be alert that OP misidentified the bullet model at first, unless I am still confused :-)

prs

[9.3X62AL]

I did away with the Lee RN design for my 45 ACPs for just this reason. The ogival form on Lyman #452374 conforms very closely to that of the Browning-designed 1911 "Ball" bullet, and when seated at 1.260"-1.272" it feeds flawlessly in every 45 ACP of every make that I have owned, to include Glock with OEM barrel/chamber.

[Ed_Shot]

+1 for Lyman 452374 at OAL 1.272 for 100% reliable function in Glock, CZ and 1911 45 ACP. I gave up on Lee molds for 45 ACP and 40 SW also.

[9.3X62AL]

Ed--

Lee's truncated cone/conventional lube groove designs have done fine work for me in 9mm--40 S&W--10mm--and 45 ACP. I seat them with about .020" of front drive band exposed above the case mouth edge, then crimp gently to remove the case mouth belling. They run like water through my pistols.

[Love Life]

That bullet requires short seating. Big ol' fat nose and stuff. The RCBS 230 RN, NOE H&G 34 clone, HI #34 clone, Lyman mentioned all run well.

That being said, if you have to seat deep, it works, doesn't blow your gun up, and is accurate then roll with it. I shot bunches of them out of a Kimber Custom years ago. Sure kept the 45 fed without much expenditure.

[Ed_Shot]

Ed--

Lee's truncated cone/conventional lube groove designs have done fine work for me in 9mm--40 S&W--10mm--and 45 ACP. I seat them with about .020" of front drive band exposed above the case mouth edge, then crimp gently to remove the case mouth belling. They run like water through my pistols.

I use the Lee 356-120-TC (standard lube) in 9MM and its my best performer in carbine but not pistol. I gave Lee 401-175-TC and 401-145-SWC (both standard lube) an honest try in 40 SW but in my weapons the Lyman 401043 and 401654 are better performers. Likewise, I tried some of Lee's .45 molds but I'll stick with Lyman 452374, 452630 and the NOE 453-210 RF/HP.

[9.3X62AL]

I should have been more specific......the moulds I meant were 9mm-120 and 40-175, and the 45-230. I figured Lyman #401043 would do good work in 40 and 10mm, and I may snag one of those in 4-cylinder later this year if the mood strikes Lyman to do a run of same.

[Animal]

+1 for Lyman 452374 for proper, reliable function each and every time. In my opinion, a must have for defense. We are talking battle accuracy here.
+1 for Lee 1ogive molds for excellent accuracy. In my opinion, much better for accuracy. I might get 1 out of 250 to malfunction, but they are extremely accurate bullets.

Of course, I seat the 1ogive 228-1r at 1.245, which is the max length I can get away with.

Your experience will probably vary.

[runfiverun]

when I designed the HM-2 9mm mold all I did was scale down the magma engineering 230gr RN design, and change the cog slightly by moving some of the weight around.
why?
cause I shoot the magma rn in my 45's.
I don't know the oal.
I just seat the boolit to the front drive band,,, taper crimp to .472, and shoot.
it's worked in every 45 I have ever tried it in, and I don't have to change my seating die, taper die, or powder weight when I swap over to the H&G-68 copy boolits I have.

[DougGuy]

Hello all,

I have a question about a 45 acp lee boolit


On my 452-230-r I find that in order to allow reliable chambering I have to seat this bullet deep so that it is not touching the grooves. I figure this out by chambering a long round and seeing where the grooves are marked on the boolit, and then seating the boolit so the grooves are at the case mouth.

This gives me plonk and reliable chambering, but a major concern for accuracy. Final OAL is 1.12 which I know is rediculously short for 45 acp so I backed the powder way off to 3.8 grains of bullseye. I get reliable firing and ok accuracy. Is this the right thing to do or should I be seating the boolit into the grooves? I only like to seat the boolit into the grooves on rifles where the round is easily extracted. I find that seating the round into the grooves on pistols can jam a round in which is VERY hard to remove.

Was this the right thing to do?

If you can't seat the boolit to your chosen COA because the throat in the barrel isn't A.) of sufficient diameter to accept the boolit, or B.) not deep enough/long enough to allow the loaded round to plunk reliably, then the throat needs to be addressed.

The right thing to do is to send the barrel and have it throated, then you don't have to compromise any of your load data or seating depth. A .452" boolit needs a throat that is at the very least slightly larger than the boolit diameter. Throating .45 ACP chambers to .4525" between the end of the chamber and the lead in to the rifling will fix the problem in a jiffy. There are several threads on this board, with photos, that will illustrate what needs to be done. If you decide you would like to have the barrel throated send me a PM, it will get the ball rolling.

[runfiverun]

if it's the boolit I'm thinking of it's for the 45 colt and it just don't play nice in the acp unless you seat it pretty deep in the case.
not a big deal, and it is what it is.
you just have to do the right thing as a reloader and back your starting loads off the same amount as you take up the extra room in the case, and start working up slowly.

[Pablo 5959]

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?267036-Lee-230gr-2r-OAL

Read this thread and be alert that OP misidentified the bullet model at first, unless I am still confused :-)

prs


Yep, I had the same thing going on 2 weeks ago.
order the R2 TL and be done.

[Echo]

I suspect you are working with the traditional lubed 452-230-1R and not the TL452-230-2R. Right? There was a recent thread about this very thing. Some of the problem is the "fat" ogive and some of the problem may be with how modern barrels in 45ACP are being made. The step from chamber end to the full rifling is often so abrupt as to be a 90 degree edge. Even with lead boolits with lesser "noses", even SWC can give erratic plunk tests as the exposed full diameter area of lead at and beyond the crimp tends to catch and hang on that squared edge. There is a sticky on this site about reaming a proper leade in these barrels. Do search out the recent thread about the Lee 1R and this problem, could not be more than just a few weeks back. Best of luck to you.

prs
I had the same problem with 452460's I reloaded for my son's new 45 - that wouldn't feed. The rifling originated at the chamber end with danged near 90* entry. I load my SWC 45's so that the driving band is proud maybe 1/32", to take care of end-play, and the new gun couldn't handle it. Reaming a new leade did...

[pearcetopher]

my mistake,

this is the round nose 228 grain normal bullet not tumble lube type

what do you guys load them too?

[pearcetopher]

i have the tumble lube 230 mold as well but I didn't think I could size the tumble lube bullet design

[fredj338]

my mistake,

this is the round nose 228 grain normal bullet not tumble lube type

what do you guys load them too?
If you are talking the 228-1R, I load that to 1.250", fits 6 diff 45s. You don't want to put a bullet into rifling, all kinds of issues there. Deep seating, shorter oal, freaks a lot of people out, but unless you are loading max, it's just not that big a deal, especially with the low pressure 45acp.
My own chrono testing shows insignificant pressure/vel increases shortening oal by 0.030". Once you head past 0.40", things start getting interesting. At 0.060", pressures/vel are up quit a bit from the base load you started with, but not unsafe if the load is not max to start. Fwiw, very few 45s will accept saami max of 1.272" with any bullet.