A little 22 Orberndorf Mauser followed me home today.

[303Guy]

This 22 Mauser was my Dads rifle from his early twenties I think. He hunted in the African bush with it taking small antelope. I shot with it as a boy and was pretty deadly with it. It was the gun I grew up with (that and his old Diana air gun from his boyhood). The bore had rusted during the war while he was up north but it still shot pretty accurately. He was a crack shot with it! Then it rusted again during my twenties and when I discovered it I cleaned it out and dulled the rust pit edges using kitchen abrasive cleaners. It still shoots accurately. And now I have it back! My Dad is now 95 and seems to be doing well (apart from his hearing and memory).

Photo's to follow.

[leebuilder]

Oh boy pics.
these i feel are the holy grail of 22 military trainers. I seen two over the years, the chraftsmanship was second to none.

[texassako]

I almost bought one of those the other day at the local Cabelas that Bubba had done his work on the stock trying for a target/disco theme. It was not quite cheap enough to mess with. I would like to see a picture of yours.

[Artful]

Military trainers are some of the best bolt actions out there.

[W.R.Buchanan]

If he is talking about a Mauser it is probably an ES 340 B if it is a single shot or a ES350 B if it is a magazine fed one.

I have had my ES340B since 1968 and it will be the last gun I sell, it is by far my most prized possession

Mine was made in 1929 and is in excellent condition . I also have a Weaver K4 scope for it that is mounted to an Anshutz one piece mount. This gun was sighted in in 1976 and the scope has been off and on the gun 100's of times and repeats perfectly everytime.

Many people think these were Military Training Rifles, they weren't. They were Civilian Target Shooting Rifles that doubled as small game rifles. Full sized mans guns at nearly 9 lbs without the scope. They are arguably one of the best .22's ever made.

I won our clubs Small Bore Silhouette title last year with mine with the scope removed. Best score 32/40.

Here's a pic of mine.

Randy

[jsizemore]

32/40 is an exceptional score for iron sights. Congrats.

I had one of the Orberndorf trainers "loaned" to me to wring out it's potential. I kept it for 6 months. It was such a great rifle to teach kids open sight shooting. Great squirrel rifle too.

[timspawn]

I had one of the single shots. I would take it on walks and shoot lizards and big grasshoppers with it. It always seemed to hit what it was pointed at.

[303Guy]

Here it is.

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo327/303Guy/DadsMauser22003_zps3cfc35ae.jpg (http://s388.photobucket.com/user/303Guy/media/DadsMauser22003_zps3cfc35ae.jpg.html)

In its bag. My Dad made that bag!

Out of its bag.

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo327/303Guy/DadsMauser22005_zps99b354dc.jpg (http://s388.photobucket.com/user/303Guy/media/DadsMauser22005_zps99b354dc.jpg.html)
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo327/303Guy/DadsMauser22006_zps4f6dfc9d.jpg (http://s388.photobucket.com/user/303Guy/media/DadsMauser22006_zps4f6dfc9d.jpg.html)
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo327/303Guy/DadsMauser22014_zps870cbda7.jpg (http://s388.photobucket.com/user/303Guy/media/DadsMauser22014_zps870cbda7.jpg.html)
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo327/303Guy/DadsMauser22013_zps5977547a.jpg (http://s388.photobucket.com/user/303Guy/media/DadsMauser22013_zps5977547a.jpg.html)
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo327/303Guy/DadsMauser22017_zps91069312.jpg (http://s388.photobucket.com/user/303Guy/media/DadsMauser22017_zps91069312.jpg.html)
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo327/303Guy/DadsMauser22018_zps7e94bf87.jpg (http://s388.photobucket.com/user/303Guy/media/DadsMauser22018_zps7e94bf87.jpg.html)

[303Guy]

It's been quite an emotional time for me, getting my Dad's rifle back.

Anyway, it's no military trainer. I can't seem to find the model on it anywhere, nor the year of manufacture. It has the same action and rear sight as Randy's does. This one as you can see, has a Schnabel fore-end and chequering. It will be the last rifle I ever part with. I have another sentimental rifle, that being the one my late son shot with, a Remington Sport Master that I used a lot in the field and at the club. I used to wipe out all the competition with it (I won all the prizes, one being a knife which I gave to my son that I know have back). But I digress .....

The little Mauser is fine rifle and as Randy said, it is arguably the best 22 ever made. There are Anschütz's out there too. I have a fine Anschütz 22 hornet but again I digress ... [smilie=1:

[fast ronnie]

It's been quite an emotional time for me, getting my Dad's rifle back.

Anyway, it's no military trainer. I can't seem to find the model on it anywhere, nor the year of manufacture. It has the same action and rear sight as Randy's does. This one as you can see, has a Schnabel fore-end and chequering. It will be the last rifle I ever part with. I have another sentimental rifle, that being the one my late son shot with, a Remington Sport Master that I used a lot in the field and at the club. I used to wipe out all the competition with it (I won all the prizes, one being a knife which I gave to my son that I know have back). But I digress .....

The little Mauser is fine rifle and as Randy said, it is arguably the best 22 ever made. There are Anschütz's out there too. I have a fine Anschütz 22 hornet but again I digress ... [smilie=1:

If you want to know exactly what model you have, look in the book "Mauser Bolt Rifles" written by Ludwig Olson. The last chapter deals specifically with rimfires. That book has more information than you would believe!!!!

[303Guy]

Thanks Ronnie. I'll see if I can find a copy.

Well, it seems this rifle is a MM410b. I'm not sure on that yet though.

[Artful]

Good looking rifle - quite the keep sake - when are you going to post a target?

[leebuilder]

Nice 22! The center piece of any collection. I have a single shot Anshutz sporter, nothing special to look at, but it is very well built and it is the little things like the flawless roll stampings and polishng of all the parts,, that make them treasures (love that front sight hood on yours!)
I have a copy of that book. Will hit it tonight. Thought it would have been a trainer, got excited,,, i digress too. Nice history. Be well.

[richhodg66]

What a beautiful little rifle! I love it, cherish that one, both fpr the family heirloom sentimental value and also for what it is.

[gewehrfreund]

Yes it's an Mm410B. Those who think these were military trainers are wrong; these are classic sporting rifles used by the Germans for vermin control, etc. during the "off" or closed game seasons.
Also, just to clear up another error up above, the ES350B is not a repeater. The "ES" stands for Einzelschuss (single shot), so all rifles with and ES prefix are single shots. The repeaters will have and "MS" ( for Mehrschuss, or multiple shot) prefix in their model number. Of course the Mm410B has to be the exception to the rule.

[W.R.Buchanan]

OK then maybe the ES350B is the Deluxe Version and the 340B is the Plain Jane version. I thought the sights were the defining factor?

These guns are controlled round feed rifles and cock on opening just like the big Mausers The single shot guns have a wedge shaped recess in the bottom of the receiver which a cartridge is dropped into, then you simply close the bolt and the cartridge is picked up by the bolt and fed directly into the chamber. It works as fast as you can close the bolt and it works everytime.

I saw a Kimber Target rifle recently that had the same configuration on the bolt face and I assume this is where they got the idea.

The Rear Sights on these guns have interchangeable VEE and U notch sides and are removed by depressing the little lever on the sight. The Front Sights are also interchangeable. Mine came with the Inverted Vee Front Sight so I have always left it alone. There is a Bead style Front Sight Blade as well. I was told recently that there is also a taller Vee Front Sight Blade for use with Hi Speed Ammo. The Rear Sight is regulated in Meters and with Standard Velocity Ammo they follow the sights perfectly. Luckily our Rimfire Silhouette Course at the Ojai Valley Gun Club is laid out in meters.

My Scope is sighted dead on at 75 yards which yields 1" high at 50 yds and 3" low at 100. In the mid 70's when I installed the scope I shot a 10 shot group at 50 yards that was right at 1". Wish I had that target back. I also shoot the gun better with the Iron Sights, but for vermin control the scope is the hot setup.

When growing up there was essentially two Brands of .22 LR ammo available, Winchester and Remington. CCI came along shortly there after and I liked the plastic boxes they came in. Most of the Win and Rem ammo I shot was Hi Speed as faster was better for shooting Ground Squirrels and Gophers. The Winchester ammo had some waxy snot called Lubaloy on the boolits for lubing the barrel. This material pretty much alleviated the need to clean the barrel and my barrel was left uncleaned for nearly 30 years. Not to worry the gun was shot frequently and has been kept in a gun safe with a heater for the last 30 years, and I always cleaned it from the breach anyway so the muzzle is as new. The bullet lube really does work.

I took the gun completely apart (the bolt) a few years ago, and cleaned and relubed everything, and now I run a couple of patches down the barrel everytime I shoot it,,, just cuz.

Just to make you all very jealous I paid $50 for this gun in 1968. It is currently worth about $800, but it ain't for sale.

I would expect Peters gun to perform just like mine does.

I included a pic of the bottom of my Scope Mount. It was made by Anschutz and had Redfield Rings to mount the scope. You can see how the claws grab onto the 11MM dovetail grooves on the top of the receiver and since the mount is German it fits this rifle like it was made for it. I got this mount from an old Gunsmith who just had it laying around in a cigar box of parts in his shop. Funny how fate has a way of connecting you with important things in your life.

Randy

[W.R.Buchanan]

Peter: one of the things I have done to protect my guns over the years is to have a heater in my gun safe. another thing is having several bags of Desiccant material in the safe as well or in some instances in a gun case if the gun isn't kept in the safe. All of my good shotguns live in their cases full time . These bags suck up any moisture that is present in the air and prevent rust from forming.

I also keep all my good guns in the house. The ones I am working on live in the garage/shop until they are done,,, then to the house they go.

I also have silicon wiping cloths with all these guns and they are wiped down everytime they are put back in the case to remove any fingerprints.

I have recently started using Frog Lube. This stuff is amazing and it really works. It is one of the new crop of Cleaner, Lubricant, Protectants, on the market and as far as rust prevention you can pretty much store your guns in a bucket of water and they won't rust. Following the instructions closely is a key point with these new products, and with the Frog Lube, heating the metal so as to open the pores is a key part of the process. It allows the material to be absorbed into the surface profile of the metal and form a barrier that won't allow rust to start. It also forms a lubrication layer that works really well on automatic firearms and is so thin that it doesn't gum up the works. When I redid my #4Mk1 I coated every part and cooked it in and the gun came out nice. Surprisingly on the barrel of that gun even though it looked completely clean, repeated wiping with a Frog Lube soaked towel showed a rusty dirt coming off many times after until finally there was no more.

I would recommend taking your gun apart and doing a Frog Lube treatment on it, I think you'd be surprised at the improvement in the surface condition afterwards. Some 0000 steel wool with F/L on it will remove any surface rust, and heating it with a hair dryer or heat gun will cook the material into the metal..

Also applying a coat of heavy furniture wax like Johnsons Paste Wax to the wood using the 0000 steel wool to apply the wax will bring the wood right back to it's former glory. I use small circular "spit shining motions" to apply the wax as opposed to going with the grain as this method fills the pores better.

It also helps if you remove any surface grime on the wood first with the steel wool and Frog Lube and use a small wire toothbrush to clean out the checkering. Don't go spastic with the brush!

I also don't hesitate to do touch up bluing on guns with bare spots on them using Birchwood Casey's Super Blue. You can see the results of the complete gun clean up on my #4 Mk1 thread. I touched up every single part on that gun, mainly because I removed existing blue when I broke edges on the felt wheel or file.

I disagree with purists who are adamant about leaving a gun in the condition you found it so as not to alter the collector value. I say BS !!! to that. If you can advance a guns condition without a complete restoration there is no one who can say definitively that you have altered that guns value. I consider this to be part of "Gun Maintenance."

Also I learned last Thursday at the SCI Show after talking to several British gun makers, that it is completely proper for a gun to be returned to the factory for maintenance, or refurbishment or complete restoration, and it doesn't diminish the value of the gun in the slightest and in fact increases it. I am talking H&H, Westley Richards, Purdy and others and the guns I am speaking of were valued in the low to mid 6 figure range.

Royalty do use their guns hard and they have people to maintain those guns for them and part of the maintenance crew is the original makers.

I figure that if it is considered proper treatment for a Westley Richards Double rifle made in the early 1900's then it is also proper treatment for my Mausers or my Winchesters or Enfields or Springfield's etc! or any other gun I own. The fact that I am doing the work instead of the factory has no bearing whatsoever and the fact that the Factories no longer exist only solidifies my point. Someone has to,,, or else the gun just rots!

I buy guns to shoot and use, and when I clean one up it ALWAYS looks better after I'm done. I seriously question the credibility of anyone who would downgrade the value of one of my guns after I have reworked it. I have friends in the High End Antique business and the things they do to furniture to improve it's salability would shock you to death. They convinced me along time ago that better looking stuff sells higher and easier than Dog Poo! Plus that your affinity for the item grows with your involvement with it so there is enjoyment to be gleaned from the work as well.

55 years of buying, selling, working on, and shooting guns is my reasoning for my opinions on this subject.

YMMV!

Randy

[leebuilder]

Hey 303guy. Acorrding to your pics and my mauser book. It is a Mm 410B, the barrel contours and the front swivel mount differ slightly. And no pic of the mag.

[W.R.Buchanan]

Peter: have you cleaned that gun up yet? didn't mean to hijack your thread, just trying to keep the conversation going.

Randy

[jumbeaux]

Outstanding rifles...how would the CZ 452 Ultra Lux compare with these fine classics ? I have a BRNO ZKM 468 Garden Rifle that is a basic single shot bolt 22 that is deadly. My brother has a NIB CZ 452 Ultra Lux (very long barrel) with a set of the Denny Target Sights (not yet installed) that I have been thinking about trading for...

[skeet1]

303 Guy,
It's great that you got your dad's rifle. It sure is great that you have and can enjoy it and then pass it on again.

Ken

[303Guy]

I haven't done anything to the rifle yet. The magazine shown is an after market. I have the original five shot mag. No worries about hijacking. I have a collection of 22's that need to have an outing. Maybe next Sunday.

I'm thinking of getting an original rear sight leaf. My Dad liked his shallow V's and fine front beads. I just want to be able to make it original.

[W.R.Buchanan]

Peter: There should be a U notch on the bottom edge of that rear sight. There is a little lever on the side of the rear sight that releases it and it slides out,,,, you flip over and reinsert.

Randy

[NoZombies]

The only Mauser .22 I own is a later semi automatic that was very rarely imported to the US, but based on how well it shoots, I've been keeping my eyes out for a Mauser .22 bolt to add to the collection.

[BCboy]

A few years ago I was looking at the rear ladder sight on my CZ452FS 22 LR when I got a funny feeling as I looked at the slide on the sight. Rummaging through my box of "parts", I found the ladder sight for one of the Oberndorf 22s, a piece that was given to me years ago and for which I have never had any use. The beautifully milled slide on the German sight is an exact, and I mean EXACT match for the Czech slide in every dimension. Off came the CZ slide which is a kind of die cast creation that has never matched the quality of the rest of the rifle, and on slide the deeply blued German beauty. Perfection! I can only guess that the Czech factory was using German machines, or at the very least they were using German blueprints. Moral of the story? Never throw out gun parts ( no matter how much the better half may be urging you to.) By the way, sadly, the actual Oberndorf ladder did not fit.

[quasi]

A few years ago I was looking at the rear ladder sight on my CZ452FS 22 LR when I got a funny feeling as I looked at the slide on the sight. Rummaging through my box of "parts", I found the ladder sight for one of the Oberndorf 22s, a piece that was given to me years ago and for which I have never had any use. The beautifully milled slide on the German sight is an exact, and I mean EXACT match for the Czech slide in every dimension. Off came the CZ slide which is a kind of die cast creation that has never matched the quality of the rest of the rifle, and on slide the deeply blued German beauty. Perfection! I can only guess that the Czech factory was using German machines, or at the very least they were using German blueprints. Moral of the story? Never throw out gun parts ( no matter how much the better half may be urging you to.) By the way, sadly, the actual Oberndorf ladder did not fit.

Most likely the other way around, the Checks had a bigger armament industry than the Germans until the late 30's.

If you like Frog Lube, get some Soylube 100, it is the same thing at 1/4 the price.