Pacific 45acp dies

[newton]

Picked up a set in the swap section. Hoping to cure my boolit seating issues I've been having. Having a heck of a time with RN and TC boolits seating crooked. Part of me wants to blame the expanding die, the other part the seating die. Lee dies of course.

Not a whole lot of info about the Pacific dies though....they were made before the age of Internet.....I understand the company history and all.

anyone use them for cast boolits with good sccsess? I've heard they were a good set of dies back in their day. It was a toss up between them and RCBS set. I choose the pacific because everyone speaks highly of them. Hope it's not just a nostalgic thing....

[Char-Gar]

Picked up a set in the swap section. Hoping to cure my boolit seating issues I've been having. Having a heck of a time with RN and TC boolits seating crooked. Part of me wants to blame the expanding die, the other part the seating die. Lee dies of course.

Not a whole lot of info about the Pacific dies though....they were made before the age of Internet.....I understand the company history and all.

anyone use them for cast boolits with good sccsess? I've heard they were a good set of dies back in their day. It was a toss up between them and RCBS set. I choose the pacific because everyone speaks highly of them. Hope it's not just a nostalgic thing....

Pacific has been making dies since the mid-30's and have gone through several design incarnations. They have always been good dies, but some of the older ones (2 die handgun set) were real quirky and are not up to snuff to the dies we use today.

[bhn22]

Pacific became part of Hornady. Are they Durachrome dies?

[newton]

I'm assuming they are the 3 die set. That is an assumption though. He said they had an extra seating die with them. Does not say if they are the durachrome.

[newton]

I'm going to guess they are not durachrome. He listed other pacific dies that say durachrome in the description. Oh well. Lol. Hopefully they are better than the Lee. I may should have gone with the RCBS dies he listed.

[newton]

I tried to do some research before committing. Guess I didn't see where they made 2 die pistol sets. I knew they made 2 die rifle sets.

[newton]

I just heard back from him. They are a 3 die set. I didn't ask about the durachrome thing though. Oh well. We shall see when they get here.

[Char-Gar]

Here is an early set of Pacific 38 Special dies. The first die sizes, decaps, expands and bells the case mouth. I know that sounds impossible, but they did make it work. The die produces a slightly bottle neck case, like most early dies did and the bell must not be to big or else the case won't exit the die on the down stroke. The expander is quite short and does not expand the neck the full length of the bullet. This darn thing seems so counter-intuitive to those of us raised on three die sets. I really didn't believe it would work, until I tried it. I am still not real sure how these can FL size, expand and bell all in one pass, but they do work. But I can sure see why folks went to three die sets.

the second die is a seat and crimp die, that works just as all others do. The seating stem is RN.

I don't use, these dies much because they are so quirky, but they sold very cheap ($5.00) because most folks assumed, as did I, these were an incomplete set. I am something of a 38 Special nut and wanted to see just what sized dimensions early Pacific dies produced. When I got the dies, disassembled them to clean and saw the expander in the sizing die, I did some research and found out by golly this was the way they were made. Really weird stuff even for a geezer like me. I am still a little bumfuzzled by them and think Pacific must have used some kind of witchcraft in their design. :-)

Pacific was the first to produce the modern 7/8" dies to go on their new C press, about 1931 or so, give or take a year. I am guessing these dies are pre-war, but I don't know for sure.

[MtGun44]

:veryconfu Wow! You can learn something every day. Size, decap, expand and bell in one die.
I do not doubt you, but it is hard to imagine.

Bill

[newton]

That is something else. It would drive me nuts until I figured out how it can size and bell the mouth.

I hope to get my die set soon. All total I am getting 4 dies. I have tried to look up info on how well they do at belling the case mouth for cast boolits, but cannot find much info. I can only assume that they do not do it like the Lyman M die does, but I would be curious if its any better than the lee expanding die.

[newton]

Where did you find info on those dies Char? I have searched and searched, all Pacific dies come up with are Durachrome ones. I cannot find ANY info for pistol dies that are made by Pacific which are not Durachrome. Driving me nuts. lol

[Love Life]

I reload with many different sets of 45 acp dies (I currently have 7 sets) because I really hate readjusting dies and stuff.

I have loaded many thousands of rds with those dies, shot them in many handguns from many manufacturers, and have not had a belling or sizing issue with any of them. Bell the case enough to just start the bullet=done. M-Dies or cool, but I don't go out of my way to use them as I have found many of the "maladies" they cure to be non-issues for me.

[newton]

Well, now that I look up 38 special I find them. Cannot find 2 die set for 45acp though. Very interesting.

[wv109323]

To seat your bullets straight you need the seating stem to match your bullet profile. You can use a drill and file/sandpaper to work on the seating stem. For the TC bullets I would have the stem hit the taper on the bullet and not seat the bullet using the nose.

[newton]

Well I tried the dies out the other day. Sure enough, not the durachrome. The die with the decapper does size. But, even though it has a flaring stem(that looks a lot like the Lyman M) it does not flare enough for cast boolits. I am sure it would work fine for jacketed rounds though.

I did not see what the die without anything does yet. I am sure its a sizing die though. Maybe its a taper crimp die.

But the two other dies were seating dies. One has the stem adjustable and the crimp adjustable. The other just adjusts the stem, but it also crimps if you screw the die body in like you do the Lee dies. Very interesting. I will take pictures of them soon.

The best thing is, the one seating die is the ticket for my issues. I still flare with the Lee die, but the Pacific seating die seats the boolits perfect each time. I know its a combination of the nose fitting in the stem pretty snug and the stem being solid/non floating.

I will take pictures of the nose fit in the Lee stem next to the nose fit in the Pacific. There is not a ton of difference, but enough obviously. But the key, I think, is the stem does not move a bit on the Pacific versus the Lee.

Anyways, interesting dies for sure.

[Love Life]

Sweet deal if it eliminates your issues. How's that para running for you? Still good?

[Char-Gar]

What bullet are you using? If it has a flat spot on the nose of any size a flat nose seating stem works great. In all my handloading dies, I use only two stems, one for round nose and the other I turn dead flat in the lathe. This will cover them all and eliminate any bullet wobble due to poor nose fit.

Another issue with straight bullet seating of cast bullets in handgun rounds is the diameter of the straight seating chamber in the die. A good example is my 45 ACP dies I used to load the 45 Auto Rim round. My main "go to" dies for the 45 ACP/AR are RCBS and the internal seating chamber (. 453) will accept .452 bullet without a hitch. But, the die chokes on .454 bullet that I like to use in some of my 1917 revolvers. For that I have a Lyman 45 ACP, bullet seating die that has a larger (.456) internal seating chamber will seat the larger bullet with ease.

I guess the lesson here, is that not all seating dies are equal in terms of what size bullets they will accommodate. With most current production dies being made for jacketed bullets, those of us who use cast bullets larger than nominal jacketed bullet size, sometimes run into problems.

At any rate, I am glad the new/old Pacific dies have you back in the game.

[Love Life]

If you don't have a lathe, buy an extra seating stem, fill with JB weld, and then sand flat on a piece of glass or granite surface plate.

[bedbugbilly]

Char Gar - I recently picked up a Lachmiller two die 38 spl set and it also is the same as you describe in regards to all the operations performed by the first die. I got it just before leaving for AZ so I haven't tried it yet. While out here, I picked up another set of Lachmiller dies for 44 spl. that are the same way as my 38 spl. set. Not Pacific dies but the same technology from years gone by.

[Char-Gar]

Char Gar - I recently picked up a Lachmiller two die 38 spl set and it also is the same as you describe in regards to all the operations performed by the first die. I got it just before leaving for AZ so I haven't tried it yet. While out here, I picked up another set of Lachmiller dies for 44 spl. that are the same way as my 38 spl. set. Not Pacific dies but the same technology from years gone by.

That is an interesting fact to have. Lackmiller made good stuff. RCBS bought their line of bullet molds which became the genesis of RCBS bullet molds. I don't know whether they bought out all of Lachmiller or just their mold line.

[newton]

Sweet deal if it eliminates your issues. How's that para running for you? Still good?

It does fix them for sure. Its interesting. With the Lee seating die it would sometimes be good, sometimes not. Most of the time, even if the boolit was seated straight(mostly), I would still get a slight bit of lead shaved. With the new die, not a bit of shaved lead. You can really see the difference in the case mouth.

The Para is suburb. Its the only 1911 I own, so I don't have a good base to judge it, but it runs without any hiccups. I have right at 500 rounds through it now. Found the sweet spot with the Lee 230 RN and 4.5 Bullseye. Tight groups at 20 yards.

[newton]

What bullet are you using? If it has a flat spot on the nose of any size a flat nose seating stem works great. In all my handloading dies, I use only two stems, one for round nose and the other I turn dead flat in the lathe. This will cover them all and eliminate any bullet wobble due to poor nose fit.

Another issue with straight bullet seating of cast bullets in handgun rounds is the diameter of the straight seating chamber in the die. A good example is my 45 ACP dies I used to load the 45 Auto Rim round. My main "go to" dies for the 45 ACP/AR are RCBS and the internal seating chamber (. 453) will accept .452 bullet without a hitch. But, the die chokes on .454 bullet that I like to use in some of my 1917 revolvers. For that I have a Lyman 45 ACP, bullet seating die that has a larger (.456) internal seating chamber will seat the larger bullet with ease.

I guess the lesson here, is that not all seating dies are equal in terms of what size bullets they will accommodate. With most current production dies being made for jacketed bullets, those of us who use cast bullets larger than nominal jacketed bullet size, sometimes run into problems.

At any rate, I am glad the new/old Pacific dies have you back in the game.


Its the Lee 230 RN. I would bet that maybe it has a tight seating chamber. I size my boolits to just under .452"(bought a .451" die that does not size that small). I have to wonder if the Lee die had so much wiggle room that it allowed the boolit to cant more. May never know the exact cause, but it works now. lol

[newton]

I'm going to play more with the other dies that the package came with. I'm still curious about the sizing and flaring die. Me thinks it does not really flare it, just trues up the inside of the neck. If you think about it, logically, it would iron the flare back out since there is significant sizing down of a fired round when it enters the die body.

In any event, I think I may have some .451" jacketed bullets that I will see if the sized case accepts. But, a guy could hone out that particular die to allow the middle stem to flare the case. Then just use the other die, that is hollow with no stem, to size cases only. I have not used that die yet, but seems that's about all it could do.

[Love Life]

Good to hear about the para!! Keep shooting it for awhile, and when/if you want to upgrade, you'll know what upgrades you want. Have you bought Mr. Kunehausen's shop manual yet?