Winchester 38-55 High Wall

[WinMike]

On the Browning .22 Hornet thread, I mention all the Browning low walls I've owned (22 Hornet, .223, 243 Rem, 260 Rem, .357 Mag). These were all purchased in the '90s, I've sold all but the Hornet & .357 mag, and it's been a while since I did any "activity," other than shooting, of course. They all were/are fantastically accurate and gorgeous to look at and shoot.

So when my neighbor was bragging about his new Win High Wall "Traditional" in 38-55 and pointed out a "Trapper" model in the same caliber, I couldn't resist. It's a cute lil thing....but at 6.5 lbs, glad I didn't buy it in 45-70. Miroku-made, like all the Brownings.

There was no information in the box nor on-line concerning bore/groove diameter, nor twist. I called Winchester/Browning and a nice lady told me it was built in 2003 (wonder why it took so long to get on the market?), had a 1-15" twist and groove diameter was .379".

But on the various bullet maker sites, there's a plethora of 38-55 bullets in various diameters. Obviously, I want to get the best bullet, so I slugged my barrel.

Well, well, well. No wonder all you guys keep telling us to slug our barrels. Mine came out with at .376". And my friend's slugged the same, even though it was made some 11 years later. Choosing a .377" bullet vs. a .380" could make a big difference, in pressure, for example.

When we called Winchester back, they explained that the rifling buttons become worn, but they're continued to be used within an "acceptable" range. Well, OK....but it would be nice if the manufacturers had it tucked away on their websites somewhere.

I'm not going to go back and slug all my firearms. But I will some.

Hmmm.....there's that Marlin 45-70 LTD with Micro-groove rifling....wonder what bore diameter it really is?!

[Tatume]

Sounds like a nice rifle!

[Clay M]

I have one of the older Browning Traditions Hunter Rifles in .38/55 It shoots really great with the RCBS 250gr GC bullets an a healthy load of Rel 7 ..Very impressive little rifle..

[WinMike]

Thanks Tatume. Here's a photo from the website.

Clay, my neighbor uses Rel 7, as well as some others. Because of the short barrel (16.5") in mine, I'm thinking a quicker powder.....he's recommended A5744. Now....if I can just find some [smilie=b:

[Clay M]

Thanks Tatume. Here's a photo from the website.

Clay, my neighbor uses Rel 7, as well as some others. Because of the short barrel (16.5") in mine, I'm thinking a quicker powder.....he's recommended A5744. Now....if I can just find some [smilie=b:

MP 5744 is a great choice.. Good luck on finding any..

[Doc Highwall]

I have a Browning Traditional Hunter in 30-30 Win., I also have two in 357 mag. and love shooting them.

[Dusty Ed]

Howdy Mike
I have a 3855Win. in the new Win. 1885 I was reading on the internet that they had a groove dia. of .375 some said .376.
Well I was shooting 300gr. cast bullet with black powder sized to .377 no problem ,then I got a mold for a 1886 38-56 ,magma eng. 230.gr.sized to.377.
So loaded in the 3855 Win., I couldn't believe the leading I was getting ,I messed around with lead hardness and different load still got leading.
Went to slugging the bore .377 ,so I ordered a sizing die .379 off of lathesmith , end of problem, it shoots like a dream.
Dusty Ed;)

[WinMike]

Dusty, your experience apparently isn't unusual. For some reason, there appears to be more variance in 38-55 bore than in other calibers. Not only is it true on modern rifles, but my readings show it was fairly common in 19th and early 20th century 38-55 products.

I guess Winchester/Browning/Miroku are just trying to be "historically accurate" by having variable bores.....;)

[oldred]

For some reason, there appears to be more variance in 38-55 bore than in other calibers. Not only is it true on modern rifles, but my readings show it was fairly common in 19th and early 20th century 38-55 products.


That may (or may not) have a lot to do with the development of the 375 Winchester. From what I discovered a couple of years ago when I was toying with the idea of building a 38-55 is that newer 38-55s, as one member here so colorfully put it, are nothing but a bastardized .375 Winchester. Apparently the "real" 38-55s are about .372 bore and .379-.380 groove while the "new" 38-55 is .368 bore and .375 groove, I assume the manufacturers just used the tooling for the 375 Winchester rather than starting from scratch plus the fact that there are so many more bullets suited the .375 available vs what can be found for the older style .379-.380 bores of the "real" 38-55. However this is just what I concluded from researching this round and I'm certainly no expert on it so bear that too in mind.

[Crash_Corrigan]

I have a Marlin 38-55 CB 336 Model in 38-55. I slugged the barrel and I need a .380 boolit in mine. With a decent loading I can achieve 3/4 inch groups at 50 yds and 2 1/2 inches at two hundred yards. At 300 yds I can plink at a steel 18" x 12" plate all day long and get all them on the gong. I added a decent tang sight and this is a very nice rifle.

[EDG]

The .38-55 was never a .375 in the rifle barrel or in SAAMI.

In SAAMI the bullet is allowed to be .377 +.000 -.003.

In SAAMI the groove diameter is allowed to be .379 +.002 -.000

Note the maximum bullet is .002 smaller than the minimum bore

The max bullet is .004 smaller than the max bore
The min bullet is .007 smaller than the max bore .381-.374 = .007!!

I am sure the SAAMI people take these number with a big grain of salt.

The 38-55 was originally a Ballard round from 1884 - that is 10 years before the 1894 Win but right on the time line for the Winchester single shot.

[WinMike]

"The 38-55 was originally a Ballard round from 1884 - that is 10 years before the 1894 Win but right on the time line for the Winchester single shot."


And 78 years before the 375 Winchester. Although.....some of the lower velocity 375 loads look tempting and perfectly compatible in my modern high wall 38-55. I have a boat-load of AA2230 and I see in a couple of manuals loads for 220 gr. JSP.

Ironic, ain't it? In "Pet Loads," Ken Waters bemoans the loss of one of his favorite cartridges, the 38-55. In the next chapter, he extolls the virtues of the 375 Win and predicts a rosy future. Now, the 38-55 is back big-time, and 375 Win loaders are searching, searching for components.

[oldred]

And 78 years before the 375 Winchester. Although.....some of the lower velocity 375 loads look tempting and perfectly compatible in my modern high wall 38-55. I have a boat-load of AA2230 and I see in a couple of manuals loads for 220 gr. JSP..


Actually for the handloader with a strong action it would seem the "modern" 38-55 and 375 Winchester are pretty much interchangeable for someone who desires a 38-55.

[d garfield]

I have the Uberti deluxe 38-55 hi-wall with the two triggers.It shoots beautiful and is a very nice looking rifle. Looks as good as any win or browning I,ve ever seen. Paid $900 for it.:-P

[Clay M]

I am fortunate enough the have a Hi Wall .38/55 built by the Ballard co In Cody Wy..
It has a rifle stock and a #3 barrel .just like the old original Winchester I wore out years ago.
It is my black powder cartridge rifle..The bore slugs .375 It has been set aside because of many responsibilities..Maybe I will get a chance to use it before I die..
If not I will probably sell the gun.