196 gr bullet in .32-40 '94 Winchester

[FromTheWoods]

If you folks don't mind, I have several reloading questions I've been trying to answer from internet sources and loading manuals. Seems I either don't have the correct powder/bullet/weight combination, or something else is needing remedied. The questions and calibers are for the early 1894 Winchester rifles, 26" barrels. Might be best to ask them on individual threads.

I purchased a slew of 196 gr .323 gc bullets a while back. Thought they would work well in the .32-40 and in the .32WS. They do shoot well out of the .32 Special (have yet to gauge the trajectory), but I am having difficulty finding load data for the .32-40. Sources caution to not use the Ballard loads in the '94. Are the 196 gr bullets too heavy for my .32-40's? Will they have a rainbow trajectory? Are there published loads for these bullets using H4895, RL7, Hercules 2400? If these powders are not suitable, what is available that gives excellent accuracy?

[Wind]

Hey there FTW -- A bore slug would be helpful in selecting the correct diameter bullet for your rifle. There can be quite a bit of variation in these old lever guns. Original factory stuff was 165 grainers, and mine adores 170 grain gas checked over 2400. Here's some data that may help your cause...

128737

Hope this helps. Best regards. Wind

[FromTheWoods]

Hey! to you, Wind.

One of my new books has that page in it, though thanks for sending it along. That is what caused me to ask on the forum about the heavier bullets--this 184 gr load is about as heavy as I've found. Caused me to be suspicious of shooting heavier than that. And yes, I will slug the bores. These rifles are for my sons as soon as they can afford gun safes. The .32-40's are from 1903-05, so I want to treat them well.

While looking at that page yesterday, I began to do what I shouldn't do--started to "figure on" how many grains of powder to move the 196 bullets compared to the loads shown for the 184's--dangerous territory. I know just enough about powders and their personalities that I could do a fine job of blowing up pretty much any gun by guestimating powder amounts. It's a skill I have yet to utilize. (My eyesight is getting worse fast enough on its own without me doctoring it with Winchester parts.) The frustration of the "figure on" moment was haunting me at 2:30 this morning (yup, supposed to be deep asleep), so it seemed the forum help was needed.

Do you build your own bullets? Purchase them? And would you mind sharing your load info? And that brings up the question I have: If you use Alliant 2400, is it safe for me to duplicate it with the Hercules 2400 or change it to get similar performance and pressures?

PS--Aren't too many of us left who say, "Hey" up front.
Late last Spring, a young woman out of Oregon State University emailed me with questions about trapping and tissue-sampling beavers on my property. For me--on the edge of geezerhood--it was a treat when I opened her message and saw her "Hey" as the salutation. She is studying beavers in our Coastal Range. Sometimes finds cougar-killed beavs. She seems fearless; studies the beaver remains right there! She travels up many wild creeks, floats rivers, checks dens--covers a large area of our woods. She's quite an amazing person.

[Wind]

Hey again FTW -- I'm shooting the RCBS 82024 sized .324" over 14 grains of Alliant 2400 with excellent results. Before I ran out I was using Hercules 2400 in the same weight charge. I still have a goodly supply of bullets I purchased from Dave Jennings of Montana Bullet Works, but plan on having Tom at Accurate make me a mold when the time/need comes.

I'm a fan of looking to history and doing what has worked well for a hundred years or so. In my experience heavier bullets didn't play well through a Marlin 1893 (c.1896). Whilst it's a composite picture, these components have proved excellent...

128761

Hope this helps. Best regards. Wind

[OverMax]

Are the 196 gr bullets too heavy for my .32-40's? I'd say so. Heaviest bullet weigh I've ever seen in print for use in that cartridge is 184 gr.

Will they have a rainbow trajectory? Absolutely. All bullets show lift somewhere in their trajectory. Some more than others. 32-40 is one of the some.

Are there published loads for these bullets using H4895, RL7, Hercules 2400? None that I know of. You need to consult the bullet manufacturer in regards to their proper powder and its weighing. [Would be wise to do.] (196gr.) is a heavy bullet for the little thin walled 32-40.

If these powders are not suitable, what is available that gives excellent accuracy? Until you have a proper powder recipe for the bullet weight you intend to use. No powder is suitable.

My thoughts on it subject: I think you got a hold of some 8-MM Mauser bullets.Thinking they too would work in your 32-40. Not really. If they have a profile other than Flat Nosed their design is for use in some other weapon than a tube fed 1894 or 94.

[FromTheWoods]

Thank you, OM.

We have .32 Specials we can maybe shoot them out of. I guess the next step is to find a lighter .32-40 bullet. After that, since I've bought a dandy supply of those 196's, the only thing I can see to do is to buy several of those Schuetzen rifles in .32-40. No sense crying over the bullets when there are plenty more rifles to be shot! That is my trail of reasoning; I doubt my wife would see it the same.

[rhbrink]

One problem might be the twist a lot of the older guns used a slower twist maybe as slow as one turn in 16 inches not knowing how long the 196 grain bullets are but they might not stabilize in your rifle.

RB

[Jon K]

rhbrink is right on...16 twist will not stabilize your 196 gr boolit.

I have an Win 1894 32-40,16 twist will shoot 184gr, but not longer boolit, I tried 195 & 200, with lots of different powders.

The longer 196 & 200 work well in the 32SP 14 twist.

Jon

[OverMax]

Both the Marlin & Winchester levers have 1-16 twist rates for their 32-Specials. Slower twist rates shoot lighter boolits. Faster twist rates shoot heavier.
No sense crying over the bullets when there are plenty more rifles to be shot! That is my trail of reasoning; I doubt my wife would see it the same. Spot on reasoning.