Lee Pro 1000 or Loadmaster

[MaryB]

Looking for a higher volume press for reloading my AR for range fun loads(bounce targets etc). Lee is what I might be able to afford in June so which of the 2 lee progressives is the better press for 223?

[jmort]

I am saving for the 1000. The only rifle round it will reload is a .223 which is fine for me. I can do .308 and .30-30 on my single stage. I intend to use it with charged cases, so station one will be flair/expand, station two for bullet seating and station three for crimping.

[wallenba]

Pro-1000 will do jacketed fairly well (seat and crimp in one die). Die alignment can be a problem sometimes with small tall cases in my experience. If shooting cast you may want to 'm' die expand which will require an extra step. I have both presses, and I use them both a little unconventionally. I don't trust either of mine to do my priming during the loading process. I prime on the Pro with NO dies in the plate. That gives me a good 'feel'. I also decap the brass in the Pro prior to cleaning with just a universal decapper die. My full length sizing die has no decapping pin in it, so I can start my loading with cleaned/primed cases.
I don't load 223 in my Pro, but I do load 30 Carbine in it.

[wallenba]

I am saving for the 1000. The only rifle round it will reload is a .223 which is fine for me. I can do .308 and .30-30 on my single stage. I intend to use it with charged cases, so station one will be flair/expand, station two for bullet seating and station three for crimping.

I tried that, it works, but getting the bullet/boolit on the case in the #2 die station was difficult. The primer chute and the case in #3 station blocked my fat hand.

[jmort]

I figured that based on review of the videos of the 1000 in use. It may prove impractical, but I intend to give it a go.

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

I think if I were going with Lee to load rifle, I'd go with the Loadmaster. The extra stations can turn out to be real handy.

[shoot-n-lead]

I intend to use it with charged cases

That is a GOOD plan as that priming apparatus on the 1000 will drive you CRAZY...man, I would not go back thru that exercise in futility for anything. The 1000 IS the reason all of my reloading is done on blue equipment, now.

[vonzep]

I use the load master and It does well (stay on top of the details and adjustments) I have a budget loader case feeder and can load a respectable amount of 5.56 an hour. Add in the tool head stabilizing piece and you get consistent results.

[MaryB]

Yeah I was looking and the 5 die turret might be handier.

[shoot-n-lead]

Yeah I was looking and the 5 die turret might be handier.

That is the choice that i would make...it will do about anything that you want to do and will make a pile of loaded ammo relatively quickly. I think that you will be better satisfied with it.

[fryboy]

For j-words the pro kicks serious cartridges out,much prefer it to the loadmaster ( I have 3 pro's but only 1 load master) for boolits in rifle calibers go for the loadmaster ,for pistols the pro works for either flavor
BTW ? The pro will load the m-43,the 223 the 222 ,the 30 carbine and any rifle cartridge 223 length and shorter that you can get a shell plate for ,it's also kind of like fishing - anyone can throw a hook in the water but not everyone can catch fish [shrugz]

[shoot-n-lead]

t's also kind of like fishing - anyone can throw a hook in the water but not everyone can catch fish [shrugz]

Yeah, it is like fishing, and with the Pro...Lee is fishing for suckers.

[Recluse]

I think if I were going with Lee to load rifle, I'd go with the Loadmaster. The extra stations can turn out to be real handy.

I have one Pro1000 on the bench. I have loaded tens upon tens of thousands of rounds with it over the past almost thirty years. I have also uttered tens upon tens of thousands of profanities at it over the past almost thirty years. This particular press is at its best when it is set up for one caliber and left alone. For something like say, 9mm, it can flat crank 'em out--especially with that little twelve-dollar case-collator.

But. . . I've found that the taller and skinnier the case, the more problems (and thus profanities) I experienced. So for .223, I'd go with the Loadmaster and the extra stations. Also, it takes a lot more pressure to work/size the brass for .223 and quite honestly, I don't think the Pro1000 would last all that long.

Now, with that said, I'd more than likely opt in for the Classic Turret. With four hole turrets, you can do everything you need. The press is more than stout and once you get used to the Safety Prime system, you can work at a comfortable pace and easily load between 100 to 150 rounds per hour safely and reliably. And, you can get the Classic Turret for around a hundred bucks before shipping.

:coffee:

[TheDoctor]

Cowboy T has some good videos on youtube over the pro 1000 and classic turret. Might want to give those a look see. I had a pro 1000, and have a loadmaster. Going from a 3 hole to a 5 hole for me was a very good thing. Never tried to load 223 on the pro. I shoot a small enoigh volume of rifle that I decap and resize on the loadmaster, charge with blocks, and seat and crimp with a rockchucker.

[typz2slo]

I have both the Loadmaster and Classic Turret. I load 223 on the classic turret just fine. I have used it for 9 40 as well. The Loadmaster is set up for just 40. The Turret is a little slow but you only have one operation to tune the press for so less chance of error. The Loadmaster has worked well but you have to keep it clean and adjusted for it to perform well but for the money it has done what I have wanted it to do.

[wallenba]

One thing I can say about the Pro-1000 is that where it really shines, is de-capping spent brass. For that alone it's worth it. With my arthritis in my shoulder it's indispensable. With the right carrier installed, and no dies except the universal de-capper, just dump them in the collator and pull the lever. Fast, eliminates all those up and down, back and forth arm movements.

[dragonrider]

JMHO but forget about the pro 1000 and doubly forget about the load master, both will drive you crazy with all the adjustments that need to be done every time you start reloading. Been there and done that with both of them. Get a Dillon 550B, you will not regret it.

[too many things]

you will need a single to resize the brass. any lee wont last long

[typz2slo]

The adjustments on the Loadmaster arent bad. Just make sure everything is clean and be prepared to adjust the tension on the shell plate every so often. There are good videos on how to set everything up on on the interweb. I looked at a dillion before I got this one and decided to take a chance on the loadmaster and so far it has been good but I have heard the horror stories about them as well. I use a universal decapping die in station one and for priming i have a sizer die with the pin removed so it helps hold the shell when priming. That made a big difference in how it operated.

[freebullet]

I would go for the load master with the explosion guard if those were my only options. I'm not sure if it's included with a new one.

Honestly though I'd look for a nice used hornady or dillon. You can find a decent price on a used hornady Lnl ap and will be much better off. You just have to be patient for the right deal once you get the funds together.

[Recluse]

you will need a single to resize the brass. any lee wont last long

100% wrong on both counts.

Perhaps you might want to get a bit more experience or knowledge about reloading--preferably both--before offering bad information here.

:coffee:

[Joe504]

you will need a single to resize the brass. any lee wont last long
That's odd, my 2 lee single stages, turret press and loadmaster are all years old. My single stages are about 20 years old now.

Thanks for letting me know they will expire soon.

[TES]

.223 in a 1000....um don't think that's gonna work out to well for you.

[typz2slo]

I dont have a 1000 so i cannot make any comments on that but I do have a Classic Turret and it will crank out finished 223 pretty well.

[MaryB]

Dillon is NOT in my budget in any way shape or form. And used means getting someones problems at times and I do not want to be rebuilding a press and end up spending new on it. Looks like loadmaster is the way to go, I am okay with tweaking it to get it right. When my nephews come for a week or two in summer we go through a lot of ammo and I then spend a lot of the time reloading. I need to minimize arm movements some, with bad rotator cuffs in both shoulders and carpal tunnel on both sides I tend to watch repetitive motions.

I do not mind loading single stage for my accuracy ammo I use on ground hogs and coyotes etc. Doing 100 rounds now and then is fine. But last summer the boys went through 1,000 rounds of .223 in my new bolt action rifle and now that I have an AR I expect that to go way up. We have contests with the bounce targets to see who can get in the most hits before handing the rifle to the next person. Mid air hits count for 2.

On top of that they went through 1k rounds on the trap range, good thing they know how to reload those on their own now and all I have to do is watch. They have their own shotguns for pheasant and duck hunting.

[ballistim]

I have a Pro 1000 in .38 Special and it has cranked out more than I can count or remember since I bought it about 10 years ago, still think I'd like a Dillon 650 though for 45ACP & 9mm.

[fryboy]

unless you get a special powder thru expander for cast in 223 cast is a lil trickier with the pro , for j-words it spits them out as easy as it does pistol calibers , the trick is a lube that doesnt interfere with powder ( such as hornady's one shot ) and it'd be wise to deprime and clean the pockets first , if you do your prep work on another press ( such as deprime,size and then trim ) before loading you could use a m die in station one solving the custom powder thru expander angle
this is perhaps the single best tip i know for a loadmaster ( eg; spot on !)

...*chop*...I use a universal decapping die in station one and for priming i have a sizer die with the pin removed so it helps hold the shell when priming. That made a big difference in how it operated.
big difference is a understatement ! dont know how or why but it also smoothed out primer feeding issues for me ( and no i dont have the "new improved" primer chute and parts - still running the old ones and they work this way )
there is more to pay attention to with the loadmaster ,once the shell plate is full it's on but in essence it's 5 pulls for a single shell as opposed to the pro's 3 and speaking of shell plates ..work up to your first full one slowly , do one until you get the hang of it then every coupla holes then every other hole and by then you should have yourself trained to the machine and by that time dont forget to pay attention to the primer feed tray - it seems to empty very quickly !

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

you will need a single to resize the brass. any lee wont last long If you really believe both of those statements and are reloading, I hope you don't shoot next to me at the range. You displayed an abysmal knowledge of reloading with this post.

[Kilroy08]

I would go with the Loadmaster. I have one, it was great for what I could afford at the time. Like others have pointed out, keep it cleaned and adjusted. After 100 or so rounds mine liked to drift on the various adjustments. Combined with crud from de priming, it made the priming system go all kinds of wonky.

Here's two things to also consider:

1. RCBS just discontinued the Pro 2000. If you're vigilant, you might see it on clearance. If the price is right, skip the Loadmaster and get a better press.

2. Craigslist. If you watch it like a hawk, sometimes you can find stuff that somebody bought and immediately lost interest in (usually reasonable price and in good to like new shape) or they inherited and have no clue (good to like new and dirt cheap) I got my Dillon this way.

[dikman]

MaryB, if the handle causes problems you could consider an Ergo handle. They only make one for the Classic (single) press, but if you know someone who does metalwork/welding it shouldn't be much of a job to modify it to work on the 1000. The Loadmaster, however, would be more of a challenge to fit one!

[r1kk1]

:

1. RCBS just discontinued the Pro 2000. If you're vigilant, you might see it on clearance. If the price is right, skip the Loadmaster and get a better press.


where is this stated? I don't see anything on RCBS website saying its d/c.

take care

r1kk1

[Bonz]

IMHO, you can never have enough stations on a reloading press...

[jmort]

"Ergo handle. They only make one for the Classic (single) press"

The 1000 comes with an Ergo handle as well. Or you can buy one for around $35 for an older unit and it comes with the updated linkage.

[RobS]

Loadmaster on this end and have set up many of them for myself and various other individuals....... all are running well. Mount on a solid bench, keep clean (as all presses that are progressive) and there are a few modifications you can make to keep adjustments solid. Look over at http://loadmastervideos.com/ and the forum link is on the top left. There is a better manual and different tips etc.

I seat and crimp in two different stages on all my ammunition as I find it easier to have consistency. For me this reason alone makes the Loadmaster the press to own between the two you are looking at for purchase. I also use the second stage as a Lyman M-die stage which keeps the brass centered and straight while the press primes the brass.

If you are on a tight budget you can call Lee and ask them if they have reconditioned presses. I did this on a press about 8 years ago and it was about 15% off of a new press kit. I purchased the 45 Colt press as I already had 45 Colt dies so sold the dies when the press came in and saved more money.

[charlie b]

If tight on budget then the Classic Turret is the way to go. FWIW, my first press was a Lee turret when they first came out. As an engineer I looked at a lot of different ones and the Lee was better built for 99% of reloading duties. I even swaged some bullets on it. Loaded quite a few rounds on it before I gave it to my gunsmith, who is still using it for a lot of his reloading. It is only 34yrs old now so I guess it will fail any minute if you listen the the Lee bashers :)

When I wanted a progressive to do rifle and pistol I got the Loadmaster. Yep, it can be finicky at times, but, normally it just cranks them out. I do not like the Lee bullet feeder but the automatic case loader works nicely for .45, .357 and 9mm. Longer it does not work as well (eg, .30-30 or .30-06) and small does not work as well (eg, .32 ACP). About the only issue I have with it sometimes is a primer catching on a case primer pocket (yes, I prime on the press, even the little .32ACP). If you don't catch it then the primer station 'locks out" and you have cases processed without primers. Not a bad thing safety wise.

FWIW, the most critical piece on the Loadmaster is that little plate that sits on top of the shell plate. If it gets worn you will have fits with it. Easy to get a new one, modified one or modify your own ;)

I also like Lee dies, especially their factory crimp die and collet neck sizing die. If you do cast bullets then get either a Lyman M die or the Lee tapered expander die (not as good as the Lyman, but, workable).

Have fun with it.

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

I also like Lee dies, especially their factory crimp die and collet neck sizing die. If you do cast bullets then get either a Lyman M die or the Lee tapered expander die (not as good as the Lyman, but, workable).

Have fun with it.Some additional useful information related to this topic is NOE, a very fine mold company, has started making inserts for the Lee expander dies that are in the M-die style, meaning they shape your case the same as the M-die. So you get the good/easy Lee adjustability and the Lyman M-die expansion shape for your cast boolits. A really nice product. I'm hoping they'll add powder through expansion inserts for both the Lee, Dillon, RCBS and Hornady expansion/powder dies in the future. Will really open up the options for powder through expansion and cast boollits.

[charlie b]

That is GREAT news. I will get one of those.

PS was just at their site and they do have pistol expanders for the powder through die!!

I suspect a hole through a .22 or .30 cal die might be too small for a powder through capability. Too much probability of a powder bridge with some rifle powders?

[Brett Ross]

I have both the loadmaster and the classic turret, for that matter the classic single stage also. As others have said the loadmaster can be lead to massive frustration, if you expect to dump it out of the box and go. On the other hand if you are willing to put in some time it is a way for those of us on a budget to load on a progressive. I have found time put into smoothing up the plastic bits makes priming on the press work. Is a Dillon better? One would hope for 3 to 4x the price, although I have never loaded on one myself. I load only pistol rounds on the loadmaster .38 Spcl, .45 acp and 9x19 and make a bunch to make it worth the tuning time. As for me I load .223 on the turret (I just do not go through enough to set it up) but cannot see why it would not be possible to make it work on the loadmaster. Also, I found in the past loading shot-shell on a progressive, of the need to remind myself, to take my time. The fact you are loading a round with every pull of the handle allows you to slow down, look things over, than pull the lever. After I convinced myself of this, working with progressives got much less frustrating.
Tony

[SSGOldfart]

Mary with out question the Lee pro 1000 is the way to go unless your budget will allow you to get a Dillon 550B. I'm running two Lee pro 1000's (9mm,44mag)& two Dillon square deals(40sw,38special ),and a Dillon RL 550(223& 45 cal) my wife love's her Lee pro 1000 she only loads 9mm

[dikman]

"Ergo handle. They only make one for the Classic (single) press"

The 1000 comes with an Ergo handle as well. Or you can buy one for around $35 for an older unit and it comes with the updated linkage.

The Lee handle is a roller handle, and isn't too bad, but the actual Ergo handle is re-shaped, so it finishes further forward past the press body on the ram downstroke and doesn't end up as low on the upstroke. I made my own and find it much better than the stock handle. I'm surprised that the Ergo people don't make one for the 1000 (although it is a bit more involved to make than their other models).

[dnotarianni]

Lee press owners are future Dillon owners. In any case your better resizing in a single stage cast iron press. After that your going to need a case trimmer to trim to lenght and a primer pocket reamer to remove the crimp. Now you have to ask yourself if it is worth it. Reloading with a jacketed head is going to cost you .23 per round after all the work vs .27 for your average imported steel case ready to go in the gun. Assuming the press costs you $200 plus a case trimmer and a primer pocket reamer your going to have to make 7500 good rounds based on a $300 outlay in equipment to pay for the equipment. http://www.handloads.com/calc/loadingCosts.asp

[garym1a2]

I am giving up on 223 or general use. Too much work to process the brass, I find the bother of crimp in primers, small primer flash holes to be a big hassel. Cases need well lubed as its too easy to stick a case. Tumble after sizing is needed for me, than remove the primer holes, trim cases and deburg them.
I see no value for a progressive for .223 and I have a pro1000, loadmaster and a new 550B.
My loadmaster is junk, my 1000 is great for every step except priming. I keep it step up for 45acp.
For .223 I use the Lee classic cast single stage.

P.S, you can find steel case for 25 cent if you look hard.



Lee press owners are future Dillon owners. In any case your better resizing in a single stage cast iron press. After that your going to need a case trimmer to trim to lenght and a primer pocket reamer to remove the crimp. Now you have to ask yourself if it is worth it. Reloading with a jacketed head is going to cost you .23 per round after all the work vs .27 for your average imported steel case ready to go in the gun. Assuming the press costs you $200 plus a case trimmer and a primer pocket reamer your going to have to make 7500 good rounds based on a $300 outlay in equipment to pay for the equipment. http://www.handloads.com/calc/loadingCosts.asp

[retread]

One thing I can say about the Pro-1000 is that where it really shines, is de-capping spent brass. For that alone it's worth it. With my arthritis in my shoulder it's indispensable. With the right carrier installed, and no dies except the universal de-capper, just dump them in the collator and pull the lever. Fast, eliminates all those up and down, back and forth arm movements.

I had a Pro 100 before I got my 550 and I am sorry I sold it just for the above reason. It is a great de-capper.

[MaryB]

A progressive will cut down on hand and arm movements a lot is why I want to go to one.

I do prep brass on a single stage then stainless tumble it so when it goes on the press it is spotless! That gets rid of one headache of the depriming crud build up on the main press. And right now I am using a lee budget turret press for 223. Sure I can turn out a lot of ammo, with a lot of arm and hand motion loading everything manually... that is what I need to get away from.

And I do not compare the price of a brass reload to shooting steel case, that is comparing apples to oranges. Compare brass to brass and it is well worth it.

[Kilroy08]

where is this stated? I don't see anything on RCBS website saying its d/c.

take care

r1kk1

RCBS announced the Pro Chucker 7 and 5 at the SHOT show. Unofficial word circulating is the Pro 2000 will go in favor of the newer 5 and 7 station progressives.

[charlie b]

Lee press owners are future Dillon owners.

Hmmm, been reloading for over 30 years now and still have all Lee and no Dillon stuff. Wonder when your "future" will be? :D :D :D

[dnotarianni]

Hmmm, been reloading for over 30 years now and still have all Lee and no Dillon stuff. Wonder when your "future" will be? :D :D :D

To each their own but when you sit down and load 2000-4000 of a caliber at a time at 600+hr you can't beat a 650 Dillon with case feeder

[charlie b]

I wish I had that kind of money for ammo and that much range time to shoot it. :)

If anyone is loading that much ammo a week I'd expect them to at LEAST to have a 650 or a better press and equipment.

For someone who shoots about a 1000rds a month the Lee stuff is way more than enough.

[dnotarianni]

I wish I had that kind of money for ammo and that much range time to shoot it. :)

If anyone is loading that much ammo a week I'd expect them to at LEAST to have a 650 or a better press and equipment.

For someone who shoots about a 1000rds a month the Lee stuff is way more than enough.

I spend the winter casting and start loading in March. Set up and load a caliber a week. Loading mostly 45 and 38 lc with some 9mm 40 and 10mm. 44mag is for the lever action and 1000 rds covers me for the summer. 45 I am feeding 4 guns between myself and SIL and with cast heads I am at $60/1000 for 45 and will load 4-5000 before changing the 650 over to another caliber Average between the 2 of us is 10K rounds a year Thats practice 1 maybe twice a week and matches on Sunday.

[vonzep]

To each their own but when you sit down and load 2000-4000 of a caliber at a time at 600+hr you can't beat a 650 Dillon with case feeder
I have no problem cranking out 700 rounds an hour pistol ammo on the load master with the budget reloaders case feeder.

Rifle is slower.

I average about 550 hr when I'm not pushing.

[shoot-n-lead]

I have no problem cranking out 700 rounds an hour pistol ammo on the load master with the budget reloaders case feeder.

Rifle is slower.

I average about 550 hr when I'm not pushing.

You are obviously, exceptional.

I gave my last one away, if I had known how well you can make them run, I would have given it to you...cause I sure didn't want it anymore.

[RobS]

No surprise........every time a person simply asks about a Lee progressive there is always.............always those who just can't resist bringing up a different press. The original poster even stated later in the thread (post #25) that there was no interest in anything other than what the thread was title as, Lee LoadMaster or a Lee Pro1000.

[jmort]

"No surprise........every time a person simply asks about a Lee progressive there is always.............always those who just can't resist bringing up a different press."

Ain't that the truth. Lee progressive "get a Dillion"

[fryboy]

i sold a dillon and kept the lee .. in fact selling the dillon bought my only new ( not merely new to me like the rest ) pro-1000 and a bunch of powder !! eh, they flat work for me ( wish the lottery tickets did :P ) to be fair the dillon was a good press but ...parts cost more ( by way ) and set up time was a lot longer ( again by way ) , oddly enough the poor worthless lee hasnt had any parts replaced ( not even the nylon ) the only parts i ever needed was for the basket cased ones i bought for cheap ( musta been treated like a unloved"not a dillon" stepchild i suppose.... ) or a new shell/die plate for a new caliber

[dnotarianni]

Sorry I love my Dillon. I can beat on it like a red headed stepchild in the dark and still crank out good ammo. If your happy with your Lee I say great but Lee didnt stand up for me. My buddy likes his lee but he has 1 for each caliber so he never has to change anything. Changing calibers always caused him problems

[fryboy]

so .....about the original thread question ?
( as opposed to making it a "bash lee thread" )

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

PS was just at their site and they do have pistol expanders for the powder through die! Fantastic, they didn't have those last I looked.

I suspect a hole through a .22 or .30 cal die might be too small for a powder through capability. Too much probability of a powder bridge with some rifle powders? Nah, not at all. If it'll feed through a powder measure, it'll make it easily through a vertically oriented cylinder. But if it's a problem for, say, an extruded powder, you can always select and buy a spherical powder that'll flow through a small cylinder like what might be on a .22 caliber there just fine.

But good to think and ask such questions. Much cheaper than running out buying the item and finding out the hard way it won't work. Sometimes half the battle isn't getting an item, it's understanding how to get it to work for you.

[MaryB]

Pretty much leaning loadmaster for the extra stations. Nephews have powder, bullets for this summers shooting so I can reload in winter for the next year! Most of my shooting is for accuracy so I don't mind the slower pace of the Lee turret press. 100 rounds a month in summer and maybe 50 in winter max is what I run. They know how to reload too and will do some while here but I always need to restock over winter.

[MaLar]

I have a Lee 1000 been using it for years (30?).
It has it's little quirks but I still like it.
I have loaded thousands of 357 on it.
I keep it set up for just that.
Have loaded 222 on with out a hitch.
Plus 45 colt and 44 mag.

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

One thing that hasn't been mentioned is when it comes to running rifle calibers, it's different than running pistol calibers. One of the reasons I suggested the Loadmaster over the Pro 1000 is this very thing and the additional stations the Loadmaster offers. Not for filling each station, but for spacing things out to handle rifle rounds.

MaryB,

I'm going to mention something that hasn't show up here yet and I want to ask you to seriously consider how you want to handle these tasks and suggest one way to do it to make the task much easier and much less painful.

For rifle, especially .223 and if you're using military surplus brass (plentiful and cheap, usually), you will need to deprime, resize, trim to length and remove the primer crimp before you can reload it. This usually involves tumbling in between the operations I just mentioned and reloading to remove any "nasties" picked up along the way. I've tried many ways, because I'm like you and have been on a tight budget for many years. After spending a lot more money than I didn't need to, I finally arrived at this process and found it to be the fastest and cheapest method in the long run. Let me share this process with you.

1. I'll call those operations I mentioned above the "brass preparation" stage and the reloading of the brass the "reloading stage."
2. I own a progressive, five station press. I'm not going to mention the brand, because it doesn't matter. What does matter is this can be done on a Loadmaster.
3. I run the brass in the two stages I mentioned above. I have a separate die holder/tool head/turret or whatever your brand of progressive calls it for each stage.
4. In the first stage, the brass preparation stage, I have a turret (I'll use the Lee terminology here, as that's the brass you'll looking at.) with an RCBS lube die for the appropriate caliber in station one. In station two, I have nothing. In station three, I have a Dillon resizing/trim die that works with their Dillon 1200 Trimmer. (Note: I bought both these items used from the Arfcom forum, where they show up fairly frequently at very reasonable prices. I bought the trimmer and the die from the same guy and saved shipping. I only wish he'd had more calibers.)
5. Attached to the Dillon 1200 trimmer I have a very small Shop-Vac I bought from Lowe's. It was inexpensive and the tubing it came with fit the 1200 Trimmer perfectly. I run the vac while trimming to minimize brass shaving buildup/mess. It works great.
6. After lube/size/trim, I swage off the press with a Dillon Swager, again, bought used. I've not had good luck with the "on press" swagers and I owned a couple different brands. They just were slow and either one or the other of the swages did not work properly. If I'd bought the Dillon Swager used in the first place, it would have been cheaper.
7. After finishing the "brass preparation" stage, I tumble the brass to clean off the lube and have it ready for loading. This gets out any primer nasty, brass trimmings and what have you that may still be stuck in the brass.
8. In the "brass reloading" stage, I prime, add powder, seat a bullet and depending on the load/rifle/bullet/boolit, I crimp. I use the on press priming, a Forster competition micrometer seating die (worth every nickel and having tried both, better than the Redding seater) and if a crimp is needed, I use a Lee Factory Crimp die (Excellent for rifle and jacketed bullets). I set the crimp about as light as I can and still have a crimp that will hold if the ammunition is intended for a high capacity semi-auto or automatic. (I don't own one, but have friends that do.)

This method is one I used to painlessly process 5000 milsurp cases and turn it into ready to shoot ammunition. I've tried many other methods to save money and found out they ended up costing me more over the years. Either in time lost or selling/changing equipment.

In the past, I would probably have recommended you not get the Lee Loadmaster, but nowadays, there's lots of information to help you and lots of mods people have come up with to resolve the loadmaster's issues. It no longer holds any secrets. My bet is if you head over to Loadmastervideo.com and read up, watch the videos, etc., you'll be able to get what you wish out of the Loadmaster just fine. I do recommend you purchase those improvements offered by that one guy. He appears to have resolved many of the Loadmaster's issues by elminating vibration, which seems to be a big issue for that press.

[xacex]

Great suggestions Dave. I have always de-primed, and sized in a separate operation, and cleaned afterwards. Once this is done my brass is stored for when I need it. I have tried a few of the lee presses, and have only kept the Loadmaster, and Classic turret press. I do my brass prep on the turret press, and use it as a single stage. The Classic has a nice primer disposal system, where the loadmaster needs to be taken apart to clean out the primers, and gunk. With the upgrades available for the loadmaster most if not all of the problems it had have been ironed out. Some things I do not use are the bullet feeder, or case feeders. I do it by hand and can do about 300 rounds an hour at a normal pace without issue. The more addons you use with the lee press the more problems it creates. Between those two presses there is no reason to go middle of the road with a Hornady press or RCBS, just use the Lee's until you can afford the Dillon.

[dikman]

But if Mary can get the Lee loading satisfactorily for her needs, why would she need to spend more money later for a Dillon?
One big advantage of a Lee is that if used like Dave does, extra turrets are cheap to buy. In fact, I just bought a spare 3-hole for my 1000 purely to use with the Universal de-primer - I like the idea of just dumping them into the feed tubes and away I go.

Lee do mention that the 1000 is intended primarily for pistol cartridges, so it seems to me that the Loadmaster is the obvious choice for your needs.

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

I do my brass prep on the turret press, and use it as a single stage. The Classic has a nice primer disposal system, where the loadmaster needs to be taken apart to clean out the primers, and gunk. It is unfortunate the Lee doesn't have primer disposal through the ram. That said, the system I'm using is faster than what you would get on a Lee's Classic Turret and it needs the extra station to provide room for the Dillon Trimmer, which does takes up some space due to the size of the motor.

Some things I do not use are the bullet feeder, or case feeders. While I agree on the bullet feeder, I would think the case feeder would work reasonably well if all the stabilizing mods are put into place for the Loadmaster.

I do it by hand and can do about 300 rounds an hour at a normal pace without issue. That is not a bad pace for a progressive. When one gets above about 400 RPH, one really needs to think about primer and powder alarms for safety, as that's about the speed where many operators begin to miss the little details in trying to keep up with the press, myself included and I'm a reasonably experienced machine operator.

The more addons you use with the lee press the more problems it creates. That's true of all the progressives.

Between those two presses there is no reason to go middle of the road with a Hornady press or RCBS, just use the Lee's until you can afford the Dillon. Having owned the Hornady, RCBS and Dillon presses at one time, I wouldn't advise assuming the Hornady and RCBS are middle of the road presses versus the Dillon. I prefer both the LnL and the Pro 2000 to the 550 I had. And I prefer the Pro 2000 I now have over my friend's 650 that I've operated a bunch.

There's a fella or two that's come up with a way to add a case feeder to the RCBS press and if that was done, frankly, the RCBS would be superior to the Dillon. It's easier to change over calibers and it's boringly reliable and the primer system just never fails. At least that's been my experience with it.

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

But if Mary can get the Lee loading satisfactorily for her needs, why would she need to spend more money later for a Dillon? I agree with this. 10 years ago, the information wasn't as available as it is today to get a Loadmaster running properly. Today, the information is available and there's that guy that makes the mods and sells them for reasonable prices. I think his name is Mike (?).

One big advantage of a Lee is that if used like Dave does, extra turrets are cheap to buy. Cost of die holders is a big deal. They add a good bit of cost to Hornady, Dillon and RCBS. I think die plates for my RCBS are $18 apiece now retail. I bought a ton when I bought my press and got both wholesale through a buddy, but not everyone has that advantage.

Lee do mention that the 1000 is intended primarily for pistol cartridges, so it seems to me that the Loadmaster is the obvious choice for your needs. There is never a disadvantage to a press with more space for and more mass in general.

Just my .02

[JeffG]

I enjoy my Loadmaster and also have the Classic Cast single stage. I got the Loadmaster from a friend for $100 and he was doing .223 on it. He wasn't happy with the ammo for whatever reason but I never really confirmed why. I believe I asked if it had to do with priming issues but he said no. In any case, I opted not to prime on mine, partly because of the issues that are well documented and more so because of what I wanted in each stage and the primers I was using (Lee doesn't recommend Federal primers on it). I de-cap and cap on the single stage and just feel better about it. The LM is setup for 9mm only and it just keeps working and working without issue. I'm using an M die and Hornady case activated powder drop, along with the case collator. I did get the turret stabilizer from mikes reloading bench.

[MaryB]

I always batch process, deprime, swage primer pockets, tumble then I am ready to load a bunch. And some of the steps like swaging and depriming I can do while watching a movie so it is no big deal if takes time. Time I have plenty of when not running a large laser job

[r1kk1]

RCBS announced the Pro Chucker 7 and 5 at the SHOT show. Unofficial word circulating is the Pro 2000 will go in favor of the newer 5 and 7 station progressives.

Thanks Kilroy see the video. I'm waiting to see what limitations there will be on the press cartridge wise.

take care

r1kk1

[GCBurner]

My reloading setup is one of those plastic-topped, break-down reloading stands from Midway with two reloading presses mounted on opposite sides, a Lee Classic Cast single-stage on one side, and a Lee Pro 1000 progressive on the other. I have a spare top that mounts 12-gauge and 20-gauge reloaders. I like the Pro 1000 for cranking out the pistol ammo I shoot a lot of for practice and IDPA competition, and have shell plates set up for .45ACP and 9mm Luger, and use the single-stage for everything else. Once it's set up, the Pro 1000 works fine, and I can put out 400-500 rounds per session with no problems. The only hitch I've had with it is that the primers occasionally stick in the feed trough and let a charged, un-primed case go by. Now I usually pre-process the brass, depriming and trimming the cases, and then reprime them with a hand primer before loading them into the feed tubes; I took the depriming pin out of the resizing die. I tumble, deprime, inspect, trim, and reprime my brass in batches whenever I have some free time, until I have enough primed cases accumulated to run off a few hundred reloads at a time. The Auto-Disk powder measure that came with the press is very consistent with charges of Tite Group or Bullseye, so overall, I'm pretty satisfied with it, for pistol calibres.

[MaryB]

For my pistol shooting (~100 rounds a month) the lee budget turret is fine, works fine for my low volume Pdog and coyote loads too. Only do 100 at a time. Told nephews that each has to bring 500 rounds of brass cases 223 for the AR this summer to boost my brass collection. Plan on teaching them to reload it with my help and watchful eye for no goofing around. They are very good when running the 12 gauge progressive press and turn out some really consistent trap loads. Reminds me, I better find more 7 or 8 shot...

[zomby woof]

you will need a single to resize the brass. any lee wont last long

My 25 year old Loadmaster disagrees.

[r1kk1]

My 25 year old Loadmaster disagrees.

The Loadmaster is not that old. It was introduced in 1992.

Take care

r1kk1

[prs]

I know nothing about the 1000. I use a Lee Classic Turret as my utility press for sizing boolits and bulge busting and loading up a few rounds just to see if I like the recipe. I have a Lee hand press for at the range. The bulk of my loading is on the Lee Load Master. I shoot a lot and use the press often and have minimal problems with it. I wash my brass spent primer in, I rinse that brass and lube it while it is still wet with Lee case lube. I dry it in a food dehydrator and run it through the press letting the Load Master size and deprime in stage 1, "M" die and reprime in stage 2, charge the cases in stage 3, mechanic's mirror at stage 4 to check powder leverl and then also seat in 4, then crimp in stage 5. I have a modification that lets the spent primers and filth continuously fall out the bottom into a clear collection tube same as the Classic Turret. I have a powder baffle in the ProAuto powder measure. And that is about it for mods. I had minimal problems with original primer feed devices, huge problems with the several updated primer feed devices, and NO problem with the current new primer feed device. This same press has been in regular use since 1994. Sure, I've worn-out some inexpensive parts and even cracked 2 carrier heads on it before I learned how not to use it. I've said for years that if this one wears-out or breaks that I will buy a 650 blue or a lock'nload red. But this dang thing just keeps on keeping on. I load 30-30 and 32 SPCL on it, but not a lot; mainly pistol caliber stuff. Check-out the site: loadmastervideos.com

Try not to be overwhelmed by some of the incessant promotion of mods and after market "improvements" there. Just glean the tips for getting the system set-up and running clean and smooth. What ever you get, let us know how it goes for you.

prs

[Garyshome]

Dillon!

[kopperl]

Guess I've been doing it wrong for the last 30 or so years. I will immediately junk all my Lee equipment.
Thank's for saving me from my self.

PS: I really get enough of people bashing what works.

[perotter]

/// Reloading with a jacketed head is going to cost you .23 per round after all the work vs .27 for your average imported steel case ready to go in the gun. Assuming the press costs you $200 plus a case trimmer and a primer pocket reamer your going to have to make 7500 good rounds based on a $300 outlay in equipment to pay for the equipment....

Comparable .223 imported steel case is more like $0.35 a round. That would be 2000 rounds to break even or couple weekends of shooting.

[perotter]

Sorry I love my Dillon. I can beat on it like a red headed stepchild in the dark and still crank out good ammo. If your happy with your Lee I say great but Lee didnt stand up for me. My buddy likes his lee but he has 1 for each caliber so he never has to change anything. Changing calibers always caused him problems

Indeed. To use a Lee one does have to have at least a basic understanding of how mechanical devices work. Those that never obtain that basic understanding maybe have to have Dilion.

FWIW. You only beat on presses or are you alos beating on a stepchild? Beating a stepchild is a very bad thing to do. If you are doing that I will for the 1st time on this forum put someone on my ignore list.

[perotter]

MaryB,

I've used a Loadmaster for over 15 years and think you would find it able to fullfil your needs. I've reloaded 10,000's of rounds with it including .223, .308, 7.7, 7mm, 9mm, .38. .357, 45 LC.... you get the idea.

[r1kk1]

Indeed. To use a Lee one does have to have at least a basic understanding of how mechanical devices work. Those that never obtain that basic understanding maybe have to have Dilion.

FWIW. You only beat on presses or are you alos beating on a stepchild? Beating a stepchild is a very bad thing to do. If you are doing that I will for the 1st time on this forum put someone on my ignore list.

perotter:
Beatin' like a red headed stepchild is an expression older than the hills. Since you cannot spell Dillon correctly I will explain something. Dillon does one thing and one thing only - progressives. It never fails that Dillon gets pulled into a Lee thread. I don't understand that. The OP was weighing out their two choices. I WILL NOT DEBUR, MODIFY, OR CORRECT ANY MANUFACTURER DEFECT! I bought my press back in the mid 80s, set my dies up and started loading. Been that way since. Defective stuff goes back. I use reloading tools and concentrate on the task at hand, the tool better not destract me or out it goes! The LM has the least amount of shellplates of any progressive capable of reloading long arms. I like it when manufacturers keep up with what's available. Can't wait for my 500 Linebaugh to arrive as well as the 17 PPC barrel. Yeah I needed a versatile progressive and its fits my needs then and now.

MaryB:

Weigh out your needs now and into the future. Make sure the press does what you want and understand its strengths and weaknesses - there are NO perfect progressive press made that will do what every person wants to do. The LM is on it's 3rd Gen primer feed so hopefully that has been solved. Take advantage of the modified M die plugs instead of decapper die to assist in primer feed. Mount the press SOLID! Take advantage of Pat Marlins RockDOCK or Inline Fabrications mount - both guys are members here. Use the case feeder and bullet feeders last when you get the press to do what you want. Start slow.

Most of all have fun. There are too many people who can assist with slight issues along the way.

Take care

r1kk1

[fryboy]

actually reloading isnt dillon's main thing ( want some eye candy ? http://www.dillonaero.com/ ) fat government contracts go further than us reloaders do in the terms of millions and billions of bucks [shrugz]

[r1kk1]

actually reloading isnt dillon's main thing ( want some eye candy ? http://www.dillonaero.com/ ) fat government contracts go further than us reloaders do in the terms of millions and billions of bucks [shrugz]

Yeah I know about that. He also has several other ventures. There are several brothers.
Jesse James who hosted Monster Garage tore a project up using one!

Take care

r1kk1

[Three44s]

I bought a bunch of loading equipment from a guy for a song. In the pile was a Pro 1000 and several shell carriers and a bunch of dies.

When I went to pay off the small price ...... I asked the owner why he was getting rid of the Pro 1000.

He said he lost confidence in it after he had to send a S&W revolver back to get a new barrel ....... the old one was bulged from firing a live round on top of a squib ....... a powderless squib. He said, that if he got back onto loading .... he was going to gear up with a single stage press. He said he got into the Pro 1000 from a guy that needed money and he bought in without much research. Go figure!

I knew about the issues going in but the other equipment more than paid the paltry $100 the guy charged me.

The whole affair caused me to investigate progressives more deeply. I really had not considered going to them ...... but now my "juices" were up!

I already had/have the Lee classic turret and a "three lung" Pacific press.

I looked at a lot of videos and read a lot of threads and studied the propaganda from the tool companies.

The Lee Loadmaster was enticing .......... so is Dillon.

I bought a LNL progressive instead.

If I have not gotten the LNL ....... I probably would have settled on the Loadmaster. By the time I was leaning towards getting a progressive, I was expecting it to do some rifles ......... not just .223 but larger cased ones as well.

The issue I have with the Lee's is the priming system ....... the other issue I have with the Pro 1000 is that you don't have enough stations to have a powder check ........ (enter the previous owner's squib of the unit I bought initially).

The loadmaster has enough stations ........ but it still has the priming issues. Lot's of folks work around it but I was adverse to it.

Now, the OP has stated that she likes to deprime and clean off line ..... that's good because even my LNL has issues with crud ........ it gets into the workings of the priming system and then you miss a primer and then you have powder floating around.

I know this is contrary to using a progressive in the first place but I see depriming, cleaning, sizing and priming off the progressive to avoid the potential for crud (end up with a missing primer and powder all over) and to also avoid a primer mass detonation on the loadmaster. At some point, you take enough work away from the progressive and having one becomes besides the point.

The other issue with progressives while loading rifle rounds is to run a powder that agrees with your charging system. Stick or extruded powders may or may not work. Ball and sphericals are better but some lee measures with leak with really fine grained powder ...... (it's always SOMETHING!)

I tried some outdated powder (Reloder 11) in my LnL and it bridged ...... brought my .223 stuff to a screaching halt!

I don't know how the Lee measures are with smaller stick powder ......... I have no experience so can't speak how it would be on a Lee progressive.

Now, I am not going to let my Pro 1000 go by any means ...... I could see setting it up for a one trick pony and leaving it that way ........ another poster wrote that he used his for a decapping press ....... I could certainly try that as well.

The point is that after you research what the issues are .... you can either tollerate them or work the equipment in such a way that it does not "bite you". That's what I am resolved to do.

Three 44s

[MaryB]

My reloading bench is built into the house, it is actually part of a wall where they took the roof off the house at some point and added a second floor. I had studs dead end the perfect height for a bench so I built around them. Top is 1 1/2 inch thick 3 layers of plywood glued and screwed every 12 inches. Solid is understatement!

First 2 layers of ply on
http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd248/maryalanab/2013-04-10_17-35-23_470_zps019e5256.jpg

http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd248/maryalanab/2013-04-10_17-35-39_419_zps297ee50d.jpg

top on and stuff being mounted. I was working off an old folding table and was tired of wobble, this is rock solid being built into the house

http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd248/maryalanab/2013-04-13_17-34-49_465_zpsece2b90f.jpg



perotter:
Beatin' like a red headed stepchild is an expression older than the hills. Since you cannot spell Dillon correctly I will explain something. Dillon does one thing and one thing only - progressives. It never fails that Dillon gets pulled into a Lee thread. I don't understand that. The OP was weighing out their two choices. I WILL NOT DEBUR, MODIFY, OR CORRECT ANY MANUFACTURER DEFECT! I bought my press back in the mid 80s, set my dies up and started loading. Been that way since. Defective stuff goes back. I use reloading tools and concentrate on the task at hand, the tool better not destract me or out it goes! The LM has the least amount of shellplates of any progressive capable of reloading long arms. I like it when manufacturers keep up with what's available. Can't wait for my 500 Linebaugh to arrive as well as the 17 PPC barrel. Yeah I needed a versatile progressive and its fits my needs then and now.

MaryB:

Weigh out your needs now and into the future. Make sure the press does what you want and understand its strengths and weaknesses - there are NO perfect progressive press made that will do what every person wants to do. The LM is on it's 3rd Gen primer feed so hopefully that has been solved. Take advantage of the modified M die plugs instead of decapper die to assist in primer feed. Mount the press SOLID! Take advantage of Pat Marlins RockDOCK or Inline Fabrications mount - both guys are members here. Use the case feeder and bullet feeders last when you get the press to do what you want. Start slow.

Most of all have fun. There are too many people who can assist with slight issues along the way.

Take care

r1kk1

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

Dillon! Overpriced progressives and getting old and long in the tooth compared to other companies presses coming out. Nasty to use, builds up crud, crummy manual advance on 550. Yep, Dillon, had one, got rid of it, no thanks.

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

Nice bench ya got there MaryB

[Three44s]

Very resourceful! Looks good!

Three 44s

[dikman]

Looking good! Can't beat a good solid bench for mounting presses on (on one video I saw on youtube the guy had his press mounted on a portable table and every time he operated it the whole thing shook like a jelly in an earthquake!!).

[Three44s]

In my load room I have an Island I built with legs that are adjustable for height.

The frame work is steel. I had on hand 12" wide T rail that's 1/2" thick and the short leg is about 4" as I recall. Formed a rectangle and screwed two layers of 3/4" chip to it. The legs are made from DOM heavy wall tubing with a smaller set of tubing slid into it with feet welded on to them and clamping screws .... hence the table's adjustment for height.

The thing is man killer!

When I replace with the bench I want to build it's going back to where I built it .... our farm shop .... and it will serve there ....... likely with a steel top .......

That future bench is going to be framed with 4" heavy angle iron and it will go on the outside wall.

One word of advice to anyone contemplating an island ..........

Don't make it too large! The top becomes storage ....... don't ask me how I know!!

Your walk around in a medium or small room will also disappear.

Best regards

Three 44s

[MaryB]

Storage? I was moving stuff to the new gun cabinet so had everything laid out for an insurance pic, need to redo that, traded 1, added 3

http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd248/maryalanab/0de65215-98ff-4da9-8552-c3c7ede821c0_zps9c787c60.jpg

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

Storage? I was moving stuff to the new gun cabinet so had everything laid out for an insurance pic, need to redo that, traded 1, added 3

I've done that. Not sure if it's frustrating or beneficial. Have sold guns to make room, then bought other guns and clogged things up again. But that's the beauty of firearms. They never lose value, they last forever if you take care of them and they're fun while you own them. What's not to love?

[Tom Myers]

Storage? I was moving stuff to the new gun cabinet so had everything laid out for an insurance pic, need to redo that, traded 1, added 3


Mary,

Check this out for an excellent tool that can keep you always up to date with that firearm insurance information in addition to recording and documenting each individual firearm maintenance, repair, accessories, etc.

Precision Firearm Records Software (http://www.tmtpages.com/printarms.htm)

[MaryB]

I built a database using Microsoft Access that tracks everything, friends keep a backup of it on a memory stick for me.

[charlie b]

Interesting methods for reloading.

First, if I have milsurp brass I deprime and swage pockets on a single stage (also a Lee). Then reload as below.

I do pistol stuff in one pass on the Loadmaster. Resize/deprime, prime, powder and expand, bullet seat and then crimp. Clean cases? Yeah, I wash them in detergent and then dry them out after I get home from the range. Then sort. Yep, they look dirty after a few reloadings but have never had a case separate, even the heavily loaded ones.

Rifle is different. I usually resize/deprime, then prime on the press (yes, I prime on the Loadmaster), then expand the mouth. Off press I charge the cases. Then back to the press for bullet seating and then crimping (Lee FCD).

I just don't like to drop large powder charges on the Loadmaster. It can be done, but, I don't do it. And when loading mouse farts in the .30-30 or .30-06 I like to visually check the cases.

This has also reminded me, I need some more turrets for my press :)