Nose Softening Cast Bullets

[1Shirt]

I have been shooting cast bullets now for probably well over 40 years. However, until recently, the only warm blooded thing I ever shot with cast bullets in a ctg. rifle was woodchuck, and that was a few years back, with 311291 in a 30-30. Have shot deer with front stuffers with both cast RB and
REAL/Maxi's etc.
Am heading for Tex. to shoot boar in a couple of weeks, and am going to use 45-70 with 405PBFN at about 1500 fps. Have never messed with hard base soft nose cast, and am looking for words of experianced wisdom. I normally cast hot and water drop my bullets regardless of size, and believe they end up right about in the 18-20 B-hardness range, but haven't yet broken down and gotten a hardness tester. Have no doubts that these at that vol. are more than adequate for big hogs if hit right with the first round.
I just tried the stand the bullets in water bit with the nose exposed and heating the nose to almost melting with a burnzomatic. Base is hard, and nose is somewhat softer, but no itea how much at this point. Have thought of doing the Paco Kelly bit of small nose pour with pure lead, and rapid fill the rest with alloy, and sooner or later, guess I will have to try that. What I am interested in mostly is the experiance(s) of those who have tried both ways and then the results of either or both on game.
We in this country have always been hung up it seems on expanding bullets. In all my reading (since I will never be able to afford to hunt Africa) it seems that round nose solids were used by the Bruts in Africa to shoot just about anything that walked, and obviously with sucess. But then that's another subject.
Would also be interested in hearing from anyone who may have shot boar or feral hogs with cast in 45-70.
As always, I thank in advance all who respond to this thread.
1Shirt

[Bass Ackward]

What I am interested in mostly is the experiance(s) of those who have tried both ways and then the results of either or both on game.
We in this country have always been hung up it seems on expanding bullets. In all my reading (since I will never be able to afford to hunt Africa) it seems that round nose solids were used by the Bruts in Africa to shoot just about anything that walked, and obviously with sucess. But then that's another subject.
Would also be interested in hearing from anyone who may have shot boar or feral hogs with cast in 45-70.


If you are looking for the correct answer, only you can find it through testing. You simply have to taylor what you have to what you are after.

A 500 grain in pure lead possibly won't penetrate an Elk broad side. But a hard 300 grainer will shoot from stem to stern. Both of those bullets may be highly effective on Elk but have no discernable effect on deer. Or they might drop in their tracks. I have seen it both ways. But my statistics with soft lead are much better than with hard.

From my limited experience on hogs with cast, you will be fine with your bullet choice. But if you want to know for sure, then try the wet news print / plastic milk jug game at the range you expect to shoot, and find out if you have a winner.

[BABore]

I tried my hand at annealing the nose's of some 311041 bullets. It worked out real well. The bullets were cast from WW's, checked and sized, then oven heat treated. After a week set time I stood the bullets up in a shallow pan and filled it up with cold water to just above the top scraper band. A drop of water was placed in the metaplat of each bullet. Using a propane torch, I alternately heated each side of the nose until the water evaporated.

I did a hardness test on a couple of the bullets and found the noses to be 9 Bhn and the shank at 23 Bhn. I tried them in some well soaked newspaper along side some full HT bullets. Muzzle velocity was approx 2,000 fps with the media at 30 yards. The full hard bullets penetrated 20-21". Their initial wound channel was approx. 5/8" dia for the first 8-10" then it skinnied down. The bullet was now more pointed with the end chewed up. It retained approx 95% weight. The annealed nose bullets penetrated 16-18". The initial WC was 1"+ dia. and went 8-9 inches. The bullet had the chewed up point, like the full hard, but it was shorter. The shank was approx. 60% of the original weight. From the pieces I could reconstruct, the annealed nose appears to have mushroomed to 0.6" dia. These bullets seem to act just like a Nolser partition.

[1Shirt]

Bass Ackward & BABore, Good words of wisdom from both, and many thanks.
I hate days when I don't learn something new that I can use. Today it was the drop of water on top of the bullet until it evaporated. Will give that a try. Will let you know results of hunt. Rifle is a #1 Ruger, w/4x Lyman, and load is 26 1/2 grains of 2400 with 1/2 gr of Dacron fill under 405 PBFN. Vol runs around 1450. Now I need to see if I can soften just the nose of a flat nosed 224. Doubt I can get a drop of wated on it however.
1Shirt

[SharpsShooter]

I have to say that Bass is on the right track and agree that soft boolits are fine for what you intend. The 405fp will do the trick without hardening on boar. Given the toughness of the boar, I'd say you will still see plenty of bullet upset with the harder ones as well. I have a smokeless load with the same boolit that I use in my 1895 Marlin that runs at 1400fps and I would not hesitate to use it for boar.

Regards

[1Shirt]

Thanks SharpsShooter, Now if my old eyes can just pick up the critter in the scope, and if old body can hold steady, ought to be able to make pork.
1Shirt

[PatMarlin]

1shirt...

Here is a link that may be a great help:

http://www.beartoothbullets.com/tech_notes/archive_tech_notes.htm/35

;-) ;-) ;-) ;-)