Seated Conical moving off powder

[soldierbilly1]

OK, how do we solve this problem?
I have a 50 cal Lyman Deerstalker and when I seat the Lee REAL bullet or the PA conicals, on the powder, it can easily move off the powder charge. Not Good. ( both 250 gr, lead)

Apparently, the Lyman barrel is tight at the top and more generous at the bottom. Plastic sabots and MaxiBalls (320 gr) don't move really at all off the powder.

I am thinking that once engraved they cannot spring back and this problem will always be there with a conical. (But then again, why does the Maxi Ball not move?) I am confused.

Your thoughts???

bill boy

BTW I have the Lyman 504617 (Maxiball 370 gr) on order. They are hard hitters I hear! they are recommended by Lyman for the deerstalker.

[mooman76]

That problem does exist especially in the field where you are moving the gun around allot. Some fit tighter than others depending on the barrel. You can try an under powder wad only put it over the conical. It has spring to it so should stay better. I also would check it ever so often when moving around and try to keep your gun barrel muzzle up as much as possible.

[Zouave 58]

Interesting; funny, I never had a problem with a Minie ball in a .58 musket I used to hunt with and that bullet was considerably undersized to the bore. Is it perhaps that the bullets are relatively short and there is little bearing surface to hold them in place by friction? Might a stiff bullet lube act to "glue" them in place? Is it perhaps that the bullets although undersized are well aligned in the bore and again there is little friction to hold them in place where a more undersized bullet would tend to "ballot" sideways and get mildly stuck? Could it be that the engraved band of a maxi-ball is a better fit to the choke bore and again is held by friction? Wow

[johnson1942]

bullets can move off of the powder if they are a tight sealed fit. their is air that is compressed between powder and bullets and the way to over come this is hold the bullet on the powder for a little while so the air can bleed slowly and completely out the nipple. if this isnt a problem, coat your bullets lees alox. its a lube but a sticky lube. you can also bump up your bullets a fraction before alox lubeing them by rolling them between two large clean flatfiles. this wont make them go down harder as the bump up is honeycombed and holds the alox lube better. just some thoughts that worked for me.

[Little Boats]

Your rifle will like the boolit from the Lyman mould. I shoot the same thing in my Deerstalker using an over powder wad and have had no issues with the round moving. As the Lyman rifle bore measures more than .50 I use a wad sized for .54 cal.

[LeadBrain]

Try a squib load or fouled bore. I find that this helps hold things in place.

[fouronesix]

I've never really seen a "choke bore" in that type of modern rifle. But, there could be a constriction at or near the muzzle. Could it be an artifact of dovetailing the front sight? The bores that really show that phenomenon are many of the old originals that have progressive depth rifling. While most really aren't choke bored, they do tend to show more windage nearer the breech- maybe a result of land wear/erosion.

No matter, if the conical is loose in the bore at the powder- not a good situation. I don't know how a Maxiball would solve it though. As the only land engraving is on the top drive band.

Might try to determine if in fact it has a true choke bore or if there is a constriction near the muzzle.

[Stonecrusher]

I have noticed the same thing with my T/C Hawken using REALS. They shoot great so when going hunting I seat a styrofoam wad punched out of a meat tray, the kind meat comes wrapped on from the supermarket, over the load. The styrofoam is so light I have not noticed any change in accuracy. I make it pretty oversized so it seats snug.

[Motor]

I use the 250gr REAL but never noticed a problem. If your bore is smaller at the muzzle I can see where it could do exactly what yours is doing.

The REAL has almost pionted driving bands and in 250gr is very short which reduces its contact with the bore even more.

Your maxi has a lot more surface contact with the bore which is probably why it stays put.

I like some of the ideas posted like the one using styrofoam on top of the bullet. The post that suggests fouling really is good too but maybe a little impractical in some situations.

Personally, I would switch to a hallow base boolit. When you seat the hallow base you force the bottom to open up and grab the bore.

Motor

[Good Cheer]

Once upon a time there was a muzzleloading boolit design posted on the forum that used a patched round ball as it's hind end. Had a rifling engraving front end about like a maxiball.
Anyone remember that?
I've tried to search for it and not found it.

[fouronesix]

soldierbilly1,
If in doubt about the Maxiball (or any projectile) staying seated on the powder- simply test it. Load a Maxi in a clean bore then thump the muzzle on a piece of wood a couple of times. Measure to see if it has moved forward. If not, you're good to go.

If it has moved, they can be seated a little tighter by using a bore fitting jag that has a seater recess that won't distort the Maxi's nose. Ram the Maxi down on top of the powder as per usual. Then, while maintaining a full grip on the ramrod, thump the Maxi again pretty hard. That will upset the top drive band, won't distort the nose profile and should keep the ball in place. Do it the same each time for consistency. I use the same technique in my rifle muskets when seating Miniés that are a little loose.

Don't "sling" or bounce the ramrod down on top of the ball as sometimes seen at the range or in the movies. :)

[Geezer in NH]

Paper patch the slug larger IMHO

[idahoron]

That was what I was going to say. All my paper patched bullets are way too tight to move. I test them once and a while but they never move.