300 blackout for hunting

[trixter]

I recently purchased a ar15 and now I am so hooked I want to buy a 300 blackout complete upper and hunt deer with it. Do you?

Pluses and minuses if you would.

Thanks

[missionary5155]

Greetings
I have a 300 BLKT and I would use it for corn crunchers where I hunt. When up north there I hunt in river bottoms. My longest white tail shot to date is at 33 yards. That was 20 years ago. Most are taken at 10 yards. So for me there is no long distance and the 300 BLKT is well capable of all the power and accuracy I need. But as of yet ILLinois does not trust us to use center fire rifles. Hand held lead slingers are OK. And again for me it is no issue. Last deer I stuck an arrow through was at 6 yards. My revolvers that start with 4 something will all do what I need.
So as I see it for my close up hunting any caliber 30 that can come close to the 30-30 will do the same. A 155 gr lead boolit chugging along at 1500 fps at 30 yards will easily harvest a deer through both lungs or through the spine.
If I was looking at 200 yard shots I would have to ponder reality. That 155 grainer probably is not going to have the "Umph" I want. It will not expand much and may not exit. I am getting to old to crawl about on my knees tracking little blood spots.
Mike in Peru

[RP]

I have one I shoot the 247 gr boolits in, They shoot great problem is speed of the bullet I believe. I shoot three deer with it first one ran off like I missed her. I looked for blood even got my dog that tracks blood trail chalked it up as a miss. Second deer I shot dropped in his tracks nice little 8 pointer but was almost at the base of the tree I was in. When I cleaned the deer not a lot of tissue damage more or less a in and out shot. Third deer was a real monster for this area, I have a deer on my wall that was 200 plus lbs I have two deer mounted last one was the 8 pointer I took with this weapon. When I went to hang him up the big deer makes it look a lot smaller then it is. This deer was a nice 10 pointer and in the 200 plus lb range took the shot at 50 yards I am sure it was a good hit but never found blood hair or the deer. Buzzards never showed up and I checked for awhile afterwards. Oh I also looked for the deer 4 hours after I took the shot. Since then I put that gun in the safe no longer going to use it for a deer rifle odds are I will not see another deer in that class. My rifle twist will not shoot a lighter bullet well enough to hunt with so if you looking a 300 BO for hunting I would strongly suggest a twist that will work well with the lighter 150ish gr boolits to get the results needed for killing a deer. Do not make the mistake I did thinking the 247 even at the slower speeds would work like a muzzleloader using soft alloy letting it expand looks like it still just punches a hole in and out leaving very little trauma. Well that's my two cents.

[bikerbeans]

I have (3) 300 BOs, two M4 platform and one single shot. The semi autos are great for plinking or 3-gun shoots, the single shot is a nice garden gun for woodchucks with a subsonic 230 or 247g cast boolit. I would never hunt deer with a 300 BO, everything has to be perfect for a good, quick kill. If I had to hunt deer with a 300 BO, I would go with Mike's advice and use a 150g bullet or boolit and push it as fast as I safely could.

BB

[IraqVet1982]

They work (not as well as a 450bm, but they work). I used a 150gr SP this year on a doe. Ran maybe 20 yards, hit a tree and dropped.
As always, shot placement is key. Through the breast and out the ribs hitting the heart on this one.

[bnelson06]

I would have no problem shooting deer with a "hunting " bullet in the 150gn range. On the other hand trying to take a deer with a heavy solid subsonic bullet seems like a bad idea.

[timspawn]

My nephew and son in law both killed deer on my lease in GA with my Handi Rifle in 300 BLK. 125 grain Nosler Ballistic tips. The buck went 30 yards and the doe fell in her tracks.

[Smoke4320]

A blackout is just fine for a 100 yd deer rifle using 125-150 gr bullet ..done it several times already.. Mi hec 312-159 HP 50/50/2
None of them went more than 35 yds some drt

[Gunnut 45/454]

Have a 300 blk AR but haven't been able to punch a deer with it yet my load will be the Speer 150gr Hotcor BT's runin 1950 fps. They mushroom nicely at 200 yards as Speer says they would all the way down to 1500fps. The Speer 130 gr HPs will work as well but energy says to keep them at or below 150 yards. Since the 300 Blk is just slightly less than a 30-30 in power why would one use it for deer. Many have taken bear and a few elk with it.

[BK7saum]

I think this boils down to two camps, heavy subsonic and light/midweight jacketed at high velocities. I have found the heavy subconics to be questionable. I have no doubt that j-words in the 125-150 range at 2000ish fps +/- will cleanly kill deer as that is nearing the 30-30 and 7.62x39 cartridges.

I have killed deer and lost deer with subsonic 300 blackout. Its fun to shoot suppressed and does great on armadillos, and I may try it on deer again, but shots will be close (archery range) where I am confident I can put it right in the heart area. I plan to let my daughters use the 300 when they start to deer hunt. But I'll be loading 125 grain noslers or Hornady bullets as as I can safely push them. Maybe 150s in some flavor if they will open up well.

Brad

[JSH]

This type of discussion in a caliber of this type always has me raise an eyebrow. The 300 blackout is nothing new. It has been around in various types, variations and names for well over twenty years.
Bob Milek was killing deer with the 30 herret back in the 70's. One of the bullets of choice because there were a LOT less choices was the 110 soft nose for the 30 carbine.
When it comes to cb's I will take a shoulder shot every time. You get way more expansion along with some bone fragments that act like shrapnel. Weight is always a plus IMHO but shot placement is key. I have read and discussed with neck shooters a lot. I still dislike it and won't use it myself. I am not crazy about lung shots unless the angle is so I can get up front into the engine room.
Bottom line is design and shot placement.

[dk17hmr]

My personal thoughts on subsonics for medium game is you need weight and diameter. You can get the weight part in the 300blk but you can't get the diameter.

300 blackout makes a great close range deer round when loaded SUPERSONIC with 110-150gr bullets. I killed a couple antelope with a 300 whisper and 125gr Nosler Ballistic tips a few years ago and it worked great.

[popper]

130 Gr. bullet @ 2200 fps from 14" barrel.
125 Gr. @ 2300 fps, Nosler Ballistic Tip preferred.
These two bullet weights perform great on deer and give you a good trajectory and plenty of energy for 200 yard shots.
30 Bellim/herrit specs easy reached with commercial 300BO ammo.

[Gunnut 45/454]

With the 300 Blk as with the 30-30 you must use bullets designed to open up at 2200-1500 fps range or less-most .30 caliber bullet are made for 1800 fps and up. Think '06,300 win mag etc. For the 300 blk think varmint bullet in .30 caliber. The 130 gr HPs I mentioned earlier act like a good soft pint at 300 blk velocities.

[Digital Dan]

Methinks for the most part what has been said here is quite realistic, but will add a couple of comments FWIW.

It is common for shooters, particularly those new or somewhat new to the sport, to focus on metrics which may or may not be relevant to such inquiry. For the record, there are 3 fundamental foundations of physics involved with shooting that begin with primer detonation. They are interior, exterior and terminal ballistics. If these three elements are dealt with is such fashion that they are complimentary and the shooter is able to apply acceptable precision to target, there will come a satisfactory conclusion to work in the field.

Without belaboring the merits of the .300 BO, but doing so with any cartridge which operates in the lower tier of energy/velocity, there comes a time when one must take a hard look at what the performance envelope is and more importantly, what that performance can accomplish. On assumption that placement is assured we are left to look at bullet performance in the terminal phase.

What was not stated by the OP was what range of velocity is considered for his rifle and therein is a very relevant point. Supersonic or subsonic? The difference goes to how bullet construction will respond to impact in tissue/bone at 'X' velocity. This is significant in context of wound parameters. Simply put, a bullet that neither expands or tumbles makes a very narrow wound channel and if intent on disruption of the cardiovascular system will quite possibly result in a long and possibly unsuccessful tracking adventure. Differentiate this from placement which disrupts the CNS via spinal or cranial wounding. The two parts of physiological structure, when disrupted, have very different responses. We all know that. So, the questions to me becomes not so much is the .300 BO suitable for hunting, but more of a question in reply, "How do you intend to employ it and with what style of ammo?"

I don't personally characterize the thought of shooting large game with modest cartridges as "stunt shooting". Lot's of folks do. I do kill pigs, fair chase, with a single shot .22 RF using CB Shorts and over the last 7 years have dispatched over 100 in that fashion. All have been put down with CNS shots, two required a followup and one of those was with a LR gun. So the short version I guess, is know what you're about, know your limitations and don't rush to an unsuccessful conclusion. Virtually any game animal can be taken with any gun regardless of legality. It isn't the gun that limits potential, it is the operator.

For those with time on their hands and interest in the dark science of terminal ballistics as confused by a universe of variables:
http://www.rathcoombe.net/sci-tech/ballistics/wounding.html

[Certaindeaf]

My personal thoughts on subsonics for medium game is you need weight and diameter. You can get the weight part in the 300blk but you can't get the diameter...
You can if you can get it to tumble after it hits! That'd be my goal using almost 2"+ long? pencils going around 1000fps.

[dk17hmr]

You can if you can get it to tumble after it hits! That'd be my goal using almost 2"+ long? pencils going around 1000fps.

Don't get me wrong a tumbling bullet does some serious damage and will kill just as well as an expanding bullet. BUT insuring that the bullet tumbles after it enters is going to be really tough. If you take a 250gr 30 caliber and a 250gr 45 caliber both at about 1200fps which one would you be less worried about doing the damage needed to kill a deer cleanly....with a chest shot since head shots are taboo to some.

I use sub sonic 30 calibers a lot.....for rabbit hunting.....meplat does the killing there.

[clodhopper]

There are so many factors involved.
I have never killed a deer with 300 blackout, but I have killed them with 7mmTCU.
Lightly constructed (varmit) bullets will expand at the velocities a 300 can launch them. The sharp edges of the bullet can do a lot more tissue damage than a 247 grainer just pushing through.
Unexpanded bullets with small meplats can push organs and blood vessels aside at they pass.
The action of tumbling bullets can sure do lots of tissue damage, but having just enough stability to hit the target, then tumble is a very fine line to follow.

Then a whole uncovered subject, will the quarry be standing broadside unalarmed munching stolen hay?
Or alarmed by human sounds/smells and leaving in a hurry?

Sure a 300 blackout will kill deer, Do you want them to die where they stand? Or maybe across the fence where you do not have permission to hunt?

[Certaindeaf]

Don't get me wrong a tumbling bullet does some serious damage and will kill just as well as an expanding bullet. BUT insuring that the bullet tumbles after it enters is going to be really tough. If you take a 250gr 30 caliber and a 250gr 45 caliber both at about 1200fps which one would you be less worried about doing the damage needed to kill a deer cleanly....with a chest shot since head shots are taboo to some.

I use sub sonic 30 calibers a lot.....for rabbit hunting.....meplat does the killing there.
I hear you. I do know though that a lot of the killing goodness of our military FMJ's, though they of course scream along (55gr and 150gr), are because of reliable tumbling.
A tumbling 200 grain .38 Special (a quite long slug) going a piddling 700fps does an incredible amount of damage so I'd think that a 250gr .30 (much, much longer) going 1000, were it to tumble reliably (read the afore, those military rounds tumble reliably after hitting with quite good accuracy) would put the smack on 2-300lb critters.

[sparky45]

Grandson whacked a couple of Deer this season, on the same day, with a 300 BO @ approx 100 yards with a gun we built and ammo we crafted. Did the standard and took .223 LC Brass trimmed/formed it and loaded with Hornady V-Max 110 grain over a stack of H110. Reload data listed a 2200+ fps bullet. One of the Deer, a Doe fell in her place and the other, a Buck went about 30 yards. Doe was a through and through disrupting the Lungs and Heart and the Buck was taken through the Lungs and the bullet lodged in the off side shoulder. He's sold on the 300 BO and now prefers it over his 7mm WSM.

[Certaindeaf]

Grandson whacked a couple of Deer this season, on the same day, with a 300 BO @ approx 100 yards with a gun we built and ammo we crafted. Did the standard and took .223 LC Brass trimmed/formed it and loaded with Hornady V-Max 110 grain over a stack of H110. Reload data listed a 2200+ fps bullet. One of the Deer, a Doe fell in her place and the other, a Buck went about 30 yards. Doe was a through and through disrupting the Lungs and Heart and the Buck was taken through the Lungs and the bullet lodged in the off side shoulder. He's sold on the 300 BO and now prefers it over his 7mm WSM.

I'd rather use a .223 than a .30 carbine... which that load approximates.

[yovinny]

The BO is still too new to me to consider it for deer, but I've heard of hit and lost deer from 4 out of the5 people I know that hunted with the BO this past season.
Two of them said they hit and lost 2 different deer each, while one claimed to miss one cleanly before hitting one dead instantly....

While the BO can certainly kill a deer, so can a 22lr.
The only thing I can probably say for sure and certain, is that theirs lots more dead deer for the coyotes to eat since the BO got so popular....

Personally, if I'm going to carry a rifle, it's going to be enough rifle to cleanly kill that once in a lifetime trophy at longer range and a difficult angle.
I prefer to do all my hunting before I pull the trigger,,, and the deer deserve no less.

Cheers, YV

[xacex]

I have harvested deer with the blackout without any problem. The problem with the BO, and deer that get away is the assumption that it is a 300 winmag, and any hit will bring down an animal. I have found proper bullet selection, and placement is key with this caliber. 308 bullets work at close ranges, but often fail to open beyond 100 yards sufficiently to kill. I have reservations using a varmint bullet for deer hunting because of their propensity to fragment, and lose penetration. I have used the Sierra 2120's with good success at blackout velocity, and also load the Barned 110 grain blackout bullet. Cast is another story, and I am still testing a bullet that seems to work, but fragments to violently under 50 yards. Some hollow point pin changes are in order, and should give an all around performer in the 125-130 grain class. For subsonic work a large hollow point to initiate tumbling is required. I hope to see the Mihec subsonic boolit done soon so I can begin testing. The Blackout works, but for deer on the run it may not be the best choice.

[Rustyleee]

I don't have a BO but in times past a lot of deer have been dropped with the .32-20 and the .30 Carbine.

[xacex]

so, it's like a 7.62x39? which hovers around 124gr and using a reliably expanding bullet at reasonable ranges I don't see an issue. With a heavy slow slug it's more like a handgun bullet without the frontal area so you suffer for upset. If it's a spitzer it may have a tendency to follow bones and muscle tissue. I wouldn't...... except perhaps w/ a 125gr ballistic tip or like jword.
Basically, yes but most data from x39 is from a longer barrel. I have found that the blackout nips at the heels of x39, but the problem is most people want to use a 8-9 inch barrel, and expect it to be an x39. It is not the same if that is your comparison. If you intend on using a short barrel expect it to be more like a 30 carbine magnum instead of a 7.62x39. Would you shoot a deer at 200 yards with a 30 carbine? 100 yards maybe, but people see guys on youtube shooting subsonic through a suppressor on a 9 inch SBR and lobbing them to 300 yards and think it will work good on an animal that is no longer there when the bullet reaches that distance. If you have a 16"+ blackout rifle 150-200 yards will get you meat in the freezer with a 125 grain bullet designed to expand at blackout velocity, with a pistol I would limit that further to 100-150. Subsonic is not ideal, and I would put that limit at 50 yards or less with an expanding bullet. Most subsonic bullets out there right now just pencil straight through. Barnes claims their 110 grain blackout bullet will do it out to 300 yards, or more but I have to question that from what I have seen. Not to mention 110 grains in a blackout will not have much energy to get a pass through at that distance anyway once expanded.

[kbstenberg]

I am surprised not one person has mentioned what twist rate they are using. I am assuming the light bullet faster speed crowd is using a 1/8 or a 1/9 twist. I have intentions of getting a 300 upper but I would like a 1/10 twist. Any suggestions? Kevin

[jmorris]

I have had perfect success with the 7mm BR on deer over the years and the 300 is not too far behind from an energy standpoint with supersonic 125g bullets (1300-1400 ft/lbs).

A 6.8 spc would be a better choice super sonic but not a huge advantage.

Subsonic the 300 blk speed and energy numbers are about the same as a 45 acp out of a 5" barrel. A 220g bullet subsonic is around 500 ft/lbs.

The big bore AR's and heavy bullets are better as the only way to gain energy when you have a speed limit is mass. A 500 grain bullet out of a 458 socom subsonic has more than twice the energy.

[jmorris]

I have had perfect success with the 7mm BR on deer over the years and the 300 is not too far behind from an energy standpoint with supersonic 125g bullets (1300-1400 ft/lbs).

A 6.8 spc would be a better choice supersonic but not a huge advantage.
If a different bolt doesn't bother you the 6.5 Grendel will get you just shy of 2000ft/lbs.

Subsonic the 300 blk speed and energy numbers are about the same as a 45 acp out of a 5" barrel. A 220g bullet subsonic is around 500 ft/lbs.

The big bore AR's and heavy bullets are better as the only way to gain energy when you have a speed limit is mass. A 500 grain bullet out of a 458 socom subsonic has more than twice the energy from the start. At 300 yds the 500g bullet will still have more energy than the 220g has at the muzzle.

[Jaybird62]

When I bowhunt, I would never consider shooting at deer with field points. Although not an equal comparison to a subsonic .300 AAC Blackout/.300 Whisper/.300 Fireball, it does have quite a few similarities. Subsonic loads from a .300 BLK on deer is dicey at best. Recovery rates with bullets under 200 grains are dismal, and very marginal for heavier bullets in hunting conditions. On the other hand, a .300 BLK loaded to top velocities with a 110-grain Barnes TTSX up through a 125-grain Nosler Partition is a good short-range deer killer. This opinion is based upon killing more than 140 feral hogs/coyotes/deer with a .300 BLK. It's really revealing when you work on a sounder of pigs with subsonic 220-grain J-words and then swap mags with the same bullets driven at about 1,400-1,500 fps. BIG DIFFERENCE.

[Smoke4320]

Jaybird62
good analogy Field Points and Subsonic Blackouts .. there are many kills with subs and Blackouts but and I mean a real big BUT there have been a lot of lost deer as well.. I also concluded the same thing and started developing a 1400 FPS 50/50 Hollow Point 225 Gr Bullet.. Awesome expansion and dumps all the energy into the Target

PS 1400 FPS thru my suppressor is still hearing safe...

[popper]

A 145gr. LFN @ 1800 should do it well to 150 yds. 4" drop @ 150.
1400 FPS 225 Gr 8" drop @ 150, less energy too. Est. range good.
EDIT: 30/30 per boolit weight is 20-50% more energy than 300BO BUT close in the 140-160 gr. range. I.e. if you use a 150 (proper hunting bullet/boolit) either should do the job.

[kweidner]

My personal thoughts on subsonics for medium game is you need weight and diameter. You can get the weight part in the 300blk but you can't get the diameter.

300 blackout makes a great close range deer round when loaded SUPERSONIC with 110-150gr bullets. I killed a couple antelope with a 300 whisper and 125gr Nosler Ballistic tips a few years ago and it worked great.

Or just make an expanding subsonic. I do and they work great. 1020fps. exit size of a quarter. maybe ran 30 yards? there are three commercial vendors that would disagree with you can't get diameter. Mine have opened 2x diameter. It is more about picking the right tool for the intended application as well. I certainly wouldn't dpe ed on one to tumble but to open.....designed right yes.

[kweidner]

I have harvested deer with the blackout without any problem. The problem with the BO, and deer that get away is the assumption that it is a 300 winmag, and any hit will bring down an animal. I have found proper bullet selection, and placement is key with this caliber. 308 bullets work at close ranges, but often fail to open beyond 100 yards sufficiently to kill. I have reservations using a varmint bullet for deer hunting because of their propensity to fragment, and lose penetration. I have used the Sierra 2120's with good success at blackout velocity, and also load the Barned 110 grain blackout bullet. Cast is another story, and I am still testing a bullet that seems to work, but fragments to violently under 50 yards. Some hollow point pin changes are in order, and should give an all around performer in the 125-130 grain class. For subsonic work a large hollow point to initiate tumbling is required. I hope to see the Mihec subsonic boolit done soon so I can begin testing. The Blackout works, but for deer on the run it may not be the best choice.

Try a cup point for lead and 30-1

[xacex]

Try a cup point for lead and 30-1

I was considering that. I have a few extra pins, but think I will only modify one. It would be difficult to get two pins exactly the same let alone 4.

[MT Chambers]

Both the Blackout (Whisper) and the 7.62x39 are well behind the 30/30 in power and the .30/30 is my self imposed minimum for close range deer hunting.

[rockrat]

If 100yds or closer I would use the 300blk, but with the Barnes bullets designed for the 300 blk or the 125 Nosler BT.

[FLHTC]

Both the Blackout (Whisper) and the 7.62x39 are well behind the 30/30 in power and the .30/30 is my self imposed minimum for close range deer hunting.

There isn't too much data out for the 300AAC so it doesn't have a track record for being adequate for deer. The 7.62x39 however, can be loaded up to the factory 30-30 in performance. The Speer #11 lists a charge of 30 grains of Norma 201 producing 2232FPS in the 7.62x39 with a 130 grain bullet. The 30-30 with the same bullet weight and a charge of 32 grains of the same powder produces 2194FPS. Since the 300AAC isn't chambered in 19th century guns like it's close relative the 32-20, I'm guessing that it's potential might surprise some when it's chambered in single shot and bolt guns. I find it perfectly adequate for deer for 100 yards and under.

[pilot]

I was reading a gun rag article this week that stated the 308 was the minimum for deer, and 300 Win Mag was much better. You should really use a 338.

We all know what to think of that guy. We all know one or two. The truth of the matter is the one thing that matters most is shot placement. If you don't put the bullet in the right place, you will lose deer. If you use that 338 and place the shot poorly, you may not save enough meat to bother looking for it.

The Blackout will work fine for deer. Just use a proper bullet, puncture both lungs, and you have made meat.

[flyingrhino]

I think the Blackout is absolutely capable of taking deer sized game. As with any caliber, use good judgment. I dropped a small buck from 102 yards with a Barnes 120 grain OT doing 2215 fps. It was a facing shot. Hit him just right of the breast bone. Went through the right lung and exited next to the spine shearing the last four rib bones from the spine on the way out. He dropped where he stood. He tried to get up several times but couldn't.

[Dinny]

I would like to hunt with my 300 BLK using a powder-coated RD 165 LFP. It shoots well with IMR 4227, but I will need to test penetration and expansion in wet phone books first.

Thanks, Dinny

[MT Chambers]

There isn't too much data out for the 300AAC so it doesn't have a track record for being adequate for deer. The 7.62x39 however, can be loaded up to the factory 30-30 in performance. The Speer #11 lists a charge of 30 grains of Norma 201 producing 2232FPS in the 7.62x39 with a 130 grain bullet. The 30-30 with the same bullet weight and a charge of 32 grains of the same powder produces 2194FPS. Since the 300AAC isn't chambered in 19th century guns like it's close relative the 32-20, I'm guessing that it's potential might surprise some when it's chambered in single shot and bolt guns. I find it perfectly adequate for deer for 100 yards and under.
You are using selective ballistics, the 30/30 will fire a 170 grain bullet at the same speed the 7.62X39 will fire a 125 gr. bullet, not even close.

[xacex]

There isn't too much data out for the 300AAC so it doesn't have a track record for being adequate for deer. The 7.62x39 however, can be loaded up to the factory 30-30 in performance. The Speer #11 lists a charge of 30 grains of Norma 201 producing 2232FPS in the 7.62x39 with a 130 grain bullet. The 30-30 with the same bullet weight and a charge of 32 grains of the same powder produces 2194FPS. Since the 300AAC isn't chambered in 19th century guns like it's close relative the 32-20, I'm guessing that it's potential might surprise some when it's chambered in single shot and bolt guns. I find it perfectly adequate for deer for 100 yards and under.
I am only 30 fps behind that 30-30 load with a 16" AR15, and a cast 130 grain boolit. I can surpass the 30-30 in performance with a 110 grain all copper Barnes tac-tx 300 blackout that will expand out to 400 yards. Those things are accurate, and spendy, but are the go to bullet for the blackout if you need it to perform 100% to its capacity. Like I said before, my limit on deer is relatively close, but I do not get cross canyon shots here in this thick Oregon coast brush so it works for me.

[Sticky]

We can't hunt CF weapons here for deer, or I would try the 300blk. I'd load either the 125gr NosBT at the fastest speed I could maintain accuracy from, or.... if I were to venture into sub territory, I would load what I load for a PD/HD round, the Lehigh Defense 194gr ME. This is a serious subsonic projectile, expensive, but devastating at subsonic velocities.. ;)

Subs would be less than a 100yd shot, but the 125BT would reach out quite a bit more. One day I will take the peestol down to Tejas and try it out on some deer..

I am just starting to do some cast loads for the 300, we'll see how they work out soon!

[kweidner]

You are using selective ballistics, the 30/30 will fire a 170 grain bullet at the same speed the 7.62X39 will fire a 125 gr. bullet, not even close.


Yes ......at the muzzle........but look at the BC of the bullet. Very likely at 100 yds due to the pointed spitzer shape the 300 wins. The flat meplat of the 30/30 is going to loose much more energy than that pointed spitzer. I think we also have to remember bullet design here. Energy is not the single factor we have to look at. The 30/30 will have an expanded frontal area when it mushrooms but I would not think more that .5 or so. Bullet design on some of the monolithic stuff will go 2x caliber or better. We aren't exactly comparing apples to apples here. If energy is the only killing factor why will a 220 swift bring them down like a bolt of lightning shooting in the neck? Only a 50ish grain bullet but traveling nearly 4k. it relies on speed and a good fragmenting bullet. If you pick the right bullet design for what you plan to do anything is possible. I am not a believer in one size fits all application of hunting kill zones and bullets.

[FishnShoot]

A blackout is just fine for a 100 yd deer rifle using 125-150 gr bullet ..done it several times already.. Mi hec 312-159 HP 50/50/2
None of them went more than 35 yds some drt

I built a 300BLK rifle for my son (11) to use on a ranch hunt. Basically, a pig hunt inside 150 yards.
Since it was an AR platform rifle, the stock was much easier for him to handle and adjust for LOP
than my 308. Plus, the recoil was barely more than my AR-15 which he was already used to. These
are pretty much the reasons I had for 300BLK. It's definitely not a long-range sniper accuracy gun.

I'm going to start loading these, likely with copper (due to being in ***-backwards-commie-condor-
California).. and will probably stick with 130-168gn HPBTs.

Would welcome any advice.. Thanks!

(new here.. my 2nd post!)

[Sticky]

Welcome FishnShoot! There is a lot of data out there if you look around for loading jboolits (you can use that data for similar booits that are CA approved.. lol) in the 300blk. There are also tons of options, since you can load about any 308 bullet out there, from 110 to over 240gr.

I haven't really loaded a mid range load for mine, as I don't hunt with it, only up to 125grBT's and then subs from about 190 and up.

For supers for hunting, you have a lot of options even with a carbine length gas system, subs are tougher unless it is a pistol gas barrel.

[FLHTC]

You are using selective ballistics, the 30/30 will fire a 170 grain bullet at the same speed the 7.62X39 will fire a 125 gr. bullet, not even close.


However selective it might be, it's still factual and that's all that matters. Why would anyone use data that doesn't coincide with what they're trying to point out? Again, according to the Speer #11 manual, shows a max load of 29 grains of N201 for the 170 grain bullet, producing 1953fps out of a Winchester 94. The 7.62x39 will produce 2232fps out of a Ruger Mini 30, using a 130 grain bullet and 30 grains of N201. Both are max loads, both are with Speer components and printed by Speer.

[FLHTC]

I am only 30 fps behind that 30-30 load with a 16" AR15, and a cast 130 grain boolit. I can surpass the 30-30 in performance with a 110 grain all copper Barnes tac-tx 300 blackout that will expand out to 400 yards. Those things are accurate, and spendy, but are the go to bullet for the blackout if you need it to perform 100% to its capacity. Like I said before, my limit on deer is relatively close, but I do not get cross canyon shots here in this thick Oregon coast brush so it works for me.

I'm still experimenting with my Encore in 300AAC but I'm finding IMR4227 and the 311413 showing great potential. I don't know the velocity yet because it's too damn cold to set up my chronograph but I'm going to do more experimenting in the spring. The 311291 is another one I want to try with 4227.

[Digital Dan]

Yes ......at the muzzle........but look at the BC of the bullet. Very likely at 100 yds due to the pointed spitzer shape the 300 wins. The flat meplat of the 30/30 is going to loose much more energy than that pointed spitzer. I think we also have to remember bullet design here. Energy is not the single factor we have to look at. The 30/30 will have an expanded frontal area when it mushrooms but I would not think more that .5 or so. Bullet design on some of the monolithic stuff will go 2x caliber or better. We aren't exactly comparing apples to apples here. If energy is the only killing factor why will a 220 swift bring them down like a bolt of lightning shooting in the neck? Only a 50ish grain bullet but traveling nearly 4k. it relies on speed and a good fragmenting bullet. If you pick the right bullet design for what you plan to do anything is possible. I am not a believer in one size fits all application of hunting kill zones and bullets.

Sorta begs the question though, if a fella loads the thutty-thutty with a spitzer, huh? Myself, thinking the old dog wins and there are cast bullets with pointy noses out there.

On another point, disparate comparisons with other cartridges is something Einstein would have labeled as relative. Me too, but I don't get the point of the exercise.

Hodgdon LVR. .30-30 Win, .308", 150 gr., 2.550" OAL 35.0 gr @ 2,314 fps, 28,700 CUP start
.................................................. .........................38.5Cgr @ 2512 fps 34,800 CUP max

[popper]

If you can get the RD to 1800 in BO it should be good for 100 yds. If a 230 sub will take deer close, the RD will too.

[Jupiter7]

The problem with the 311-165 will be nose deformity. I've shot hundreds in my 10.5" 300blk pistol. Also feeding can be an issue, loaded with gas check even with bottom of the neck, under recoil the short rounds will move forward in the magazine, then when trying to chamber will cause a 3pt jam. Need to load as long as your gun will allow you to chamber without set back and still feed. I've had my best results with Lancer mags.

[kweidner]

Guys I have been working on an HP 220 grain cast for sub. I already offer an expanding swaged version. If you are interested shoot me a PM

[pls1911]

Location, location, location....Placement, placement, placement...out to 70-80 yards the Blackout subsonic in 220-250 grains should be fine, especially if you can get accuracy from your barrel.
If don't have consistency, and know your trajectory and range, you should stay in the observation and learning mode.
Most of my shots are more like 40 yards or less, so I expect full through-the-shoulders penetration when I get the chance to pull a trigger. If I cannot put the bullet where it belongs, I pass the shot.
Life is too short to spend hours tracking.

[flyingrhino]

What I got from this thread is that anyone who has harvested deer with the 300 blackout would do it again. Personally, I would feel confident out to 200 yards supersonic. I haven't shot subsonic yet but I think I would keep it to under 50 yards if I did. And if I'm going to be under 50 yards I'd just as soon use my bow.

[tallwalker]

Shot placement is the thing as has been said ad infinitum, but I have taken deer at 150-175 yds with 300AC handloads without problem. Honestly, It isn't sporting enough for me to shoot them much past 100 but that's just me. Even taken one at 30yds, but that was while hog hunting and I agree i would have rather have used my bow. Nice thing about using the rifle at those short ranges though is fast follow up shots if you want/need them. Especially for hogs. I have been using 150gr soft points which everyone says don't expand, but loaded toward hot I haven't seen that.

[flyingrhino]

I actually built my BO for hogs but enjoy it for deer hunting too. I haven't supressed yet but need to. The encroaching civilization complains of the shooting.

[xacex]

Another opinion, and I know the flaw with the study but I thought it adds to the discussion.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CB8QFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fdigitalcommons.unl.edu%2Fcgi%2Fvi ewcontent.cgi%3Farticle%3D1168%26context%3Dicwdm_w dmconfproc&ei=KVcAVerJL5CcoQSD94HYDg&usg=AFQjCNFAJxHAKdkQ1sLlM6JLAs7Jap6bdA&sig2=SwOei6_iNiwzNXhxwQlYLQ&bvm=bv.87920726,d.cGU

[chuck4570]

The Noe 311247 works well subsonic if hollow pointed. I shot a doe last season through the lungs @ 25 yards. She ran about 30 yards and fell. Fairly Large exit hole.
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