9mm oal 0.98 with Lee 358-125???

[captainvette]

Hello,

I have done some searching on the forum and read a few threads on the Lee 358-125 for 9mm. The common theme being you got to seat them deep...... but 0.98 ???

I have a Beretta 92FS and Sig Sauer P229 so I wanted to use this bullet sized to .358 and use it for both

Doing the kerplunk test I need to be at or less than 0.98 for the Beretta.... the Sig can go slightly longer but not much.

I sized some down to .357 and can take those out to 1.00 but I'm pretty sure the Beretta will get leading at that size as i have been down that road with the 356-120 mold sized to .357

I made up 15 dummy arounds and they seem to cycle fine @ 0.98 racking the slide

Im using Nitro 100 (which is all I have) and the MIN load data for Lead Cast is 124 gr - 2.3gr @ 1.05. MAX is 3.1 for +P. By the way 2.3gr of Nitro 100 is exactly the smallest disk setting on the Lee Auto Loader so I can't lower.

What kinda pressures am I looking at being that short? I don't want these things blowing up in my face.

Any insight before I go out and try this? lol

[runfiverun]

your oal for feeding is what you are gonna be stuck with, so you'll have to work from there.
I'd stick to the .358 you have decided on.
now the real question,,, the powder.
I think you'll be just fine with the start load, but I'm not super familiar with the powder and how it reacts to being placed in a confined area.
that is the deciding factor here.

[krallstar]

I have been looking at this 358-125 for my Beretta 92. I am using a 130gr sized to .358 LRN loaded to mag length. 1.170 very accurate. I am using the LEE 6 CAVITY BULLET MOLD 356-125 2R beagled to produce a .358-9 Then sized to .358

[runfiverun]

as far as going below the books starting load their start load is based partly on the amount of case volume left over after seating their bullet.
you are using a different bullet and are changing the available amount of air space so you are fine going lower.
now using the fixed disc does limit your flexibility here and it's what you are stuck with.
so you have to try and determine just how much more [percentage wise] case space you have used and see if it falls in line with the amount [percentage wise] the max load is bigger than the start load.
in this case it's about 25%.
so if you are decreasing the available case volume by 25% or so you should be just under a max load with the start charge.

[Dusty Bannister]

"I have a Beretta 92FS and Sig Sauer P229 so I wanted to use this bullet sized to .358 and use it for both "

Any reason not to simplify things and just pick one gun, work up a load, and use what you have learned to work up a load for the second gun? Since the Sig is "longer" work with that one and then see what you need to do for the Beretta. You "want" to use the same bullet and diameter for both, but that might not be realistic if they are very different in bore and groove diameter as well as throat or chamber length. What are the bore and groove measurements as determined by mic and slug? That might tell you more than "a bullet at .357 leads". Dusty

[Ed_Shot]

I really like the 356-125-2R. Mine drop at .359+ and 126~127 gr. and I size to .358. While I load for several 9MM's in my family I use a COAL of 1.055 because my CZ 75B has a MAX COAL of 1.063 with this boolit. The COAL of 1.055 works fine in all Lone Wolf 9MM tubes I've tried, also known for tight chambers. My 356-125-2R's are .565 long and seated to 1.055 there is .260 inside the case which allows more boiler room than the Lyman CB Handbook gives 356242 (120 gr) or 356402 (120 gr.) with the listed COAL's with those boolits.

I'm not familiar with your Beretta 92FS or SIG 229 it seems odd to me that they require a COAL of .980 with this boolit. I do recommend sizing 9MM boolits to .358. But I have two questions:

Does your deprimed and resized 9MM brass ( before you bell the case mouth) pass the kerplunk test?

What is the diameter of the case mouth measured at the lip of the case after you crimp your loaded round?

[captainvette]

I'm not familiar with your Beretta 92FS or SIG 229 it seems odd to me that they require a COAL of .980 with this boolit. I do recommend sizing 9MM boolits to .358. But I have two questions:

Does your deprimed and resized 9MM brass ( before you bell the case mouth) pass the kerplunk test?

What is the diameter of the case mouth measured at the lip of the case after you crimp your loaded round?

#1. Yes

#2. .3775

According to my math @ 0.98 there is .319 inside the case (the bullets are .545 long)

[wv109323]

I ran into the exact same problem with that bullet in a CZ 75B. Even sized at .3565 the OAL could be 1.01 and pass the kerplunk test. Any longer and there would be shaved lead accumulate in the chamber and soon the pistol would not go into full battery.
I got the mold due to another pistol that needed a .358 boolit.
i think the only solution is to buy a mold for one pistol.

[Ed_Shot]

#1. Yes

#2. .3775

According to my math @ 0.98 there is .319 inside the case (the bullets are .545 long)

I just double checked and my 356-125-2R's really are are .565 long.....our molds are different. Sounds like yours is shorter and fatter. I agree with wv109323 the best solution may be to try another boolit.

[Ed_Shot]

Sorry....I'll learn to read soon. Your boolit is the Lee 358-125-RF isn't it. I got a head lock on 356-125-2R.

[captainvette]

Just an update.... I shot 40 rounds of the 2.3 gr Nitro 100 @ 0.98 oal today

100% function in Beretta FS92, Sig Sauer P229, Beretta PX4 Storm, and S&W Shield. No keyholing. Slide always locked back on empty.

There were a few cases with overpressure signs..... slightly cratered primers.... so Im clearly near max load with this seating depth.

However all 4 guns had slight leading right after the beginning of the rifling but it didnt extend down the barrel. Leading after 10 shots seems like a fail to me.

So I don't really know what to do at this point

[Dusty Bannister]

Were all of your cases of the same head stamp? If not, were the cases that showed cratered primers of the same head stamp, and what are they? I must be missing it if you posted what your alloy and lube is for these bullets.

[captainvette]

Were all of your cases of the same head stamp? If not, were the cases that showed cratered primers of the same head stamp, and what are they? I must be missing it if you posted what your alloy and lube is for these bullets.

They were all different cases as its just random range brass.

The lead I used was WW/wc which I suspect might be too hard case running them through the lyman 4500 was a little tough....more so than normal. The lube I'm using is just a home made beeswax/paraffin/vaseline/STP mix

[Magana559]

Don't size them and reduce your load by .5gr.

[Magana559]

Try a softer lube

[lwknight]

Just get yourself a ruger forcing cone bored and feed it anything that will fit in the magazine. You will even have room for 1 more grain of powder when you extend the OAL.

[Ed_Shot]

Try easy and cheap first. You do not have much invested in that Lee mold. Try a different Lee mold. Both my Lee 356-125-2R and 356-120-TX drop at .359+ and I size to .358. They give perfect function at normal OAL's in several 9MM's I've used.

[rsrocket1]

I have to ask this and sorry if it wasn't posted earlier. Did you slug your Beretta FS92 bore? They tend to be big and your leading might be from gas cutting. If you pull some of your seated bullets, you might find out that they are considerably narrower than the throat of your Beretta and you are gas cutting the bullets before the pressure gets high enough to bump the bullets and seal the bore.

Those guns have pretty generous chambers (to fit all sorts of ammo) also so you might wind up by having to expand the case with a Lyman "M" die or if you have Lee dies, buy the 38 S&W expander plug and stick it into the powder through expander die of the 9mm set. You may not be able to use these loaded cartridges in your other guns, but maybe that's what you'll be stuck with.

The other option is to powder coat the bullets. It's the "poor man's" plating system and will eliminate leading from gas cutting but you may end up with some "burned powder coat" deposits on the barrel. It cleans up easily but it still indicates gas cutting and doesn't truly solve the problem of a poorly fitting bullet.