What one hand gun would you buy for Alaska?

[huntersdog]

If your budget only allowed you to purchase one handgun, for Alaska what would it be?

I'm going to say 10mm. Can be used for defense and also in the bush.

[jmort]

If that is the case, then people would carry .357 mags when dealing with the big bears. Not enough gun. I would consider .44 mag the floor. I would carry a .45 Colt Redhawk. But I don't live in Alaska and the 10mm would be a good choice for me here in the lower 48.

[huntersdog]

If that is the case, then people would carry .357 mags when dealing with the big bears. Not enough gun. I would consider .44 mag the floor. I would carry a .45 Colt Redhawk. But I don't live in Alaska and the 10mm would be a good choice for me here in the lower 48.
Of my buddies that lives there they say bear attacks are nothing like the movies nothings picture perfect. I have buddies in southwest Alaska that carry and have killed. many critters with the 7.62x25 including bears on both Species. Headshots they say that the 7.62x25 is amazing at piercing the skull.

[jmort]

If that is the case why not "buy" that? I would always defer to the locals. I am armchair Alaska.

[NVScouter]

I bought the 4" Ruger Redhawk in 45LC with 340g cast over 1100fps for when I went.

[jmort]

That's what I want.

[GabbyM]

After bear hunting in the UP of Michigan for Black Bear. Then seeing the anemic effect a 30-06 with 180 grain bullets has on them. I'd say my Colt 44 mag 6" barrel with 255 grain SWC and a full charge of WW296 would be bare minimum. Velocity would be about 1,500 fps. Alloy would be 3% SN .05% Cu 5% Sb 91.2% Pb. Air cooled. I would consider a heavy 340 grain 45 at only 1100 fps to be way to prone to being deflected off a scull. However I'd not scoff at one if that's what I had to carry.

Once ended up chasing a wounded bear with nothing but a S&W 38 special snub nose. Hunter told me he hit it well and it was down. Well it jumped up and ran off when we approached. Never did get it and we chased it until 3AM. Then looked the next morning. Others had real guns and I stayed close to them.

My Win 94 in 30-30 with 200 grain cast over H-LeveRevolution would get the nod way over any hand gun. It's just not that much heavier than a BFR. Both would be the way to go.

I'd also choose a swing out cylinder revolver over a single action gate load. For ability to reload faster. Apex bear medicine IMHO is an AR platform 458 SOCOM with 420 grain FN at around 1,800 fps. Semi auto nine shot 45-70 ballistics.

[Outpost75]

I don't live in Alaska, but have known for 50 years Alaska natives who spent their entire working lives before they retired in Alaska bear country as civil engineers involved in government construction projects for the public health service and US Army Corps of Engineers. They say a handgun is better than nothing, but it should not be less than a .44 Magnum. They do not recommend any handgun for bear protection, but stated that a pump 12-ga. shotgun loaded with 00 buck is most effective.

[texasbilly]

Considering only your question regarding the purchase of a handgun for use in Alaska, I would suggest you obtain a double action 44 magnum. This would give you a quicker response if the need ever arose for protection from something large and hungry.

[RoyEllis]

For a sidearm, I'd carry my Clark .460 Rowland, it's proven to be a heck of a hog swatter so far. 8 rounds of .44mag ballistics from a 1911...what's not to like?

[fouronesix]

I don't live in Alaska, but have known for 50 years Alaska natives who spent their entire working lives before they retired in Alaska bear country as civil engineers involved in government construction projects for the public health service and US Army Corps of Engineers. They say a handgun is better than nothing, but it should not be less than a .44 Magnum. They do not recommend any handgun for bear protection, but stated that a pump 12-ga. shotgun loaded with 00 buck is most effective.

That's it ^^

During the 50s, Johnson (known for the Johnson conversions of the Win Mod 71) at Cooper Landing answered that question continually from touri and week-end warriors of Anchorage. He usually had a small number of 38 Spl revolvers for sale along with a wink and a smile. :).. or so the story goes.

[scattershot]

"I'd say my Colt 44 mag 6" barrel with 255 grain SWC and a full charge of WW296 would be bare minimum. Velocity would be about 1,500 fps."


Is that even possible in a 6" barrel?

[jmort]

".44mag ballistics from a 1911"

No, less gun than a .44 mag. Way less gun. Buffalo Bore is a good source of data:

Colt 2009 circa Gold Cup govt. Mod. 5 inch with Clark 460 conversion
a) 1527 fps - 958 ft. lbs. - Item # 35A - 185gr. JHP
b) 1351 fps - 932 ft. lbs. - Item # 35B - 230gr. JHP
c) 1353 fps - 935 ft. lbs. - Item # 35C - 230gr. FMJ-FN
d) 1298 fps - 954 ft. lbs. - Item # 35D - 255gr. HC-FN

.44 Magnum Ammo - 305 gr. L.B.T.-L.F.N. (1,325 fps/M.E. 1,189 ft. lbs.)
Ruger Red Hawk 5.5 inch-----------------1331 fps
340 gr. L.F.N. - G.C. (1,478 fps/M.E. 1,649 ft. lbs.)
5.5 inch factory stock Red Hawk - 1401 fps

[Ben]

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/019_zps5e2847cf.jpg (http://s1155.photobucket.com/user/Ben35049/media/019_zps5e2847cf.jpg.html)

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/018_zps340e37f2.jpg (http://s1155.photobucket.com/user/Ben35049/media/018_zps340e37f2.jpg.html)

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/017_zpsb697cf5e.jpg (http://s1155.photobucket.com/user/Ben35049/media/017_zpsb697cf5e.jpg.html)

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/012_zps5f60892f.jpg (http://s1155.photobucket.com/user/Ben35049/media/012_zps5f60892f.jpg.html)

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/011_zps94c90384.jpg (http://s1155.photobucket.com/user/Ben35049/media/011_zps94c90384.jpg.html)

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/008_zps9622d5ea.jpg (http://s1155.photobucket.com/user/Ben35049/media/008_zps9622d5ea.jpg.html)

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/007_zps47973678.jpg (http://s1155.photobucket.com/user/Ben35049/media/007_zps47973678.jpg.html)

[jmort]

Wow, that is impressive.

[RoyEllis]

Yep, factory load compared to handload...whatever tickles you

[jmort]

Those are factory loads.

[Mtnfolk75]

FWIW, I spent 10 weeks in Alaska during the summer of 2010. 9 weeks of that was spent in a solo spike camp on the Stampede Trail for 7-8 day runs with usually only 1 day off at a time. The first 3 weeks or so I carried a 5" Taurus .454 Casull Raging Bull in a Simply Rugged Sourdough Pancake worn crossdraw. I could not find .454 Casull ammo in Alaska so it was loaded with .45 Colt's of the 255 Grain RNFP variety.

After the first 3 weeks I went with a 2.5" Charter Arms Bulldog loaded with CCI Blazer 200 Grain Gold Dots in same location again in a Sourdough Pancake. I always kept a Mossberg 500 Mariner close by that was loaded with a mix of OO Buck & Slugs. I'm glad I never had to test the capabilities of myself or my equipment ..... [smilie=s:

[BRobertson]

5 1/2" Redhawk.

I would NOT choose a 7.62x25, and buckshot is NOT the best load to use in a shotgun!!!

Bob

[Fishman]

Any way you slice it those 460 Rowland numbers are impressive.

[aspangler]

500 S&W Mag. Up close and personal. Or 45-70 at 50-100 yards.

[GabbyM]

"I'd say my Colt 44 mag 6" barrel with 255 grain SWC and a full charge of WW296 would be bare minimum. Velocity would be about 1,500 fps."


Is that even possible in a 6" barrel?

Good question. I checked my load records and it's 1395fps. So should of wrote about 1400 fps. 23.5 grains WW296 and it is brutal to shoot. Way nicer to shoot and no slouch is the Lyman 429215 over 20.0 grains of AA#9 at 1350 fps.

[Harles Dawson]

Ben,that looks like the one I picked up Friday. I shot it yesterday in about 10 degrees. Only had heavy .45 Colt loads to try. It shot pretty good, but I expect even better with stouter loads. I'll post some pictures in a few days. Harles

[Crawdaddy]

Having owned a 500 S&W magnum for three weeks now, it has quickly become my favorite wheel gun.

It would be my choice. It is, however, not for the faint of heart.

With a ton of muzzle energy it will take down just about anything when you do your part.

No way would I consider a 10 mm. I probably wouldn't consider any auto and would want a DA revolver no smaller than a 44 mag.

[contender1]

I already have enough guns to where I'd not worry about buying another one. I'd just have issues deciding WHICH one to take with me. But it'd be a bigger caliber than a 10mm.

[clum553946]

I would think the Smith & Wesson 460 with the 5" barrel would do well also. You can shoot 45 Colt & 454 Casull rounds in it giving it an edge in versatility! If you ever had to shoot a big bear with it, you might lose some hearing but I guess that beats becoming bear poop!

[crowbuster]

Very nice ben, you beat me to it.

[paralaska]

I carry a Ruger SRH .454 5" Toklat . . .

[MrBFR]

I'll likely never see Alaska, but I just bought this a few days back:

http://i.imgur.com/7rerDs5.jpg

[jmort]

Seems like everyone has one of these.

[Ben]

Mine is a " Keeper " ! !

[huntersdog]

For a sidearm, I'd carry my Clark .460 Rowland, it's proven to be a heck of a hog swatter so far. 8 rounds of .44mag ballistics from a 1911...what's not to like?
A wife and husband team on Kodiak carry and love the 460 Rowlands on the 1911 'platformsn

[wlc]

I carry a Ruger SRH .454 5" Toklat . . .


I'll likely never see Alaska, but I just bought this a few days back:

http://i.imgur.com/7rerDs5.jpg

I also have one of these. Just recently bought it and it is very quickly becoming my favorite handgun. Carried in a Diamond D Guides Choice shoulder holster. http://www.diamonddcustomleather.com/Chest_Holsters.php

All that said, What are you planning on doing up here in our beautiful state??? I would also suggest looking at a pump shotgun in 12ga loaded with slugs, not buckshot.

And to the poster that said he couldn't find any Casull ammo in AK, where were you looking? I find it in every gunshop, Walmart and other places I go. That's interesting.

[Bazoo]

Ruger blackhawk 357 magnum. Doug Wesson thought it was enough.

[snoopy]

Ill likely never get to go,but I would think taurus judge w/a couple of buck loads and then some HOT LC LOADS. Common sense should avoid mad bear encounters, for an extended period in deep backcountry though, nothing less than a 12 gauge.

[w5pv]

If was going to buy one gun it would be a 460 Smith & Wesson magnum.Reason being you could shoot all ammo from the 45 colt to 460.The 460 would take care of any animal that has four feet.

[MakeMineA10mm]

First of all: DO NOT consider a 10mm for wilderness protection. (Look at my user name, and I'm telling you to get at least a 44.) The 10mm, in my opinion, is the ideal personal defense caliber for use against humans, and it will do double-duty as a lower-48 deer and hog cartridge pretty well, but it is NOT a bear cartridge. In addition to the caliber inappropriateness, I would prefer to have a revolver in the wilderness.

Next: I believe the truth about self-defense in the wilderness in Alaska (and a few other areas) is that Moose are more dangerous than Bears. If you are smart and prepare yourself, you can avoid most encounters with bear and moose, but the moose tend to be more in areas where interaction with humans happen, so statistically, you'll run across them more often. And, Moose are just crazy mean. Worse than bears. So, I'd think hard about stopping Moose at least as much as I would worry about bears...

Last, I love Elmer Keith and there's no question he had a LOT of experience with wildlife of all kinds, including bears, but there have also been changes that have happened since he last wrote in 1981. Still, some of his experience is illustrative and helpful, so I'd go to: http://www.elmerkeithshoot.org/GA/ , scroll towards the bottom, and read the series of EK's articles about Black and Griz.

[44man]

.480 or .475 BFR. Nothing less then a .44 with at least 310 to 320 gr boolits. Either will go through a skull and never stop.
Double action? Not many can hit that way. I would still cock a SRH or RH. Just like my red dots on my guns, second nature to turn it on and cock the hammer.
Talked to a friend on the road during deer season. He shot a small doe with his rifle and it was still alive. He shot it between the eyes with a .357 and it looked at him like nothing happened. He went to the side and shot it under the ear. Remove the front sights from toys when the bear sticks it you know where.

[BruceB]

After several decades of carrying different .44 Magnums for bear defense in the Northwest Territories of Canada, and using them WITH CAST BULLETS on bison and moose, I say this:

With normal-weight cast bullets (my 429244s were 265 grains) the .44 penetrates COMPLETELY THROUGH (that's IN this side and OUT the far side) of animals even over 1000 pounds. I've seen it, and I've done it repeatedly.

If cast bullets are in the equation, what possible need is there for a heavier bullet that recoils harder, and will only exit to punch a hole in the air just like my 265s did? The penetration to go through-and through on a BISON is surely ample for any bear in creation, and YES, the bullets broke bone in some of the animals before exiting.

If soft-points are the chosen bullet, then maybe bigger/heavier might make sense, because expansion (and maybe some weight loss) will reduce penetration.

For me, though, a .44 with "normal" cast bullets is an amazingly effective device, and I was confident in its ability even in griz and polar-bear country.

[Three44s]

I'm with 44man on this one:

I traded for a SRH 7.5" in .480 Ruger a couple of years ago ...... and I like it alot!

I have never shot the .475 so I won't comment on it other than to point out it's like a .480 but with the big boy pants on! You can look at the numbers and see that.

As for BruceB assertion that a .44 hole is enough: I also am enamored with the .44 mag and still have two of them ....... traded my lesser used third sample of that caliber for my .480. Also, his in field experiences give me solace as to what my remaining .44s and now, the .480 can be expected to do.

After spending some time researching the effects of boolit metplat and velocity, I realize that "size and speed" matters!

I have two molds for my .480 by now ......... a RCBS 400 gr. and the Mihech mold with the extra pins of around 420 gr. ........ and you look at the noses on those dudes and look at what a load of just a grain under max in the .480 will put up and tell me it won't cut a somewhat bigger hole and break a bit more bone than a .44 mag at a little lower velocity?

The math says that 400 to 420 gr. of lead is just a shade off a 1 oz. shotgun slug ...... the long gun will give it more velocity but shotgun slug also carries a much bigger metplat.

I am gonna switch gears here ......... that much bigger metplat ........ can ........ can offer less pennetration ....... If you don't have enough lead behind a big nose, it can certainly lose momentum before doing a proper job.

I am not offering this to start an arguement though it likely will .......... just for food for thought.

My personal favorite would be a Marlin loaded with some fine loads in .45-70 and an express sight and my .480 to help me fight back to that Marlin if that was also necessary.

Three 44s

[paul h]

I'm a huge fan of the 480, but that said the Toklat is far and away the most versatile hand gun you can buy, and I'd add two gunsmith tweaks, and action job to smooth out the trigger pull and a full moon clip conversion. With the moonclip you have much faster reloads and can quickly go from a cylinder full of full patch fodder to small game loads. I also believe you can run 45 acp which makes the platform even more flexible.

[Dan Cash]

All ready have them, Smith 57, .41 Mag with 250 grain LBT cast bullet or my 29-2, .44 with 250 grain Accurate bullet. The .41 will out penetrate the .44.

[EDK]

IF it's too big, it will stay in camp. IF it costs too much to shoot, you don't do very well with it to boot. I found out the hard way that anything bigger than a Model 29 with a 5 inch barrel (or a 5.5 inch Vaquero/Blackhawk) tended to stay in the safe while walking through the woods at home. Carrying for a day can be very educational.
Those heavy weights got horse power, but HEAVY WEIGHT means you might get tempted to leave it in camp...and run out of luck the same day.

[wlc]

First of all: DO NOT consider a 10mm for wilderness protection. (Look at my user name, and I'm telling you to get at least a 44.) The 10mm, in my opinion, is the ideal personal defense caliber for use against humans, and it will do double-duty as a lower-48 deer and hog cartridge pretty well, but it is NOT a bear cartridge. In addition to the caliber inappropriateness, I would prefer to have a revolver in the wilderness.

Next: I believe the truth about self-defense in the wilderness in Alaska (and a few other areas) is that Moose are more dangerous than Bears. If you are smart and prepare yourself, you can avoid most encounters with bear and moose, but the moose tend to be more in areas where interaction with humans happen, so statistically, you'll run across them more often. And, Moose are just crazy mean. Worse than bears. So, I'd think hard about stopping Moose at least as much as I would worry about bears...

Last, I love Elmer Keith and there's no question he had a LOT of experience with wildlife of all kinds, including bears, but there have also been changes that have happened since he last wrote in 1981. Still, some of his experience is illustrative and helpful, so I'd go to: http://www.elmerkeithshoot.org/GA/ , scroll towards the bottom, and read the series of EK's articles about Black and Griz.

10mm, I totally agree. When we first moved up here not a single soul warned us about bears. Many folks did however warn us to be cautious around moose. Especially a momma with her calves. A moose is not scared of you in the least and will stomp you into a greasy spot in a minute. I have learned to "read" them since moving here though. If you have ever been around horses you know when they get ticked they lay their ears back on their head. A moose does the same thing and will also bristle up the hair on the neck. You will see many more moose than bears while out and about except in certain instances when the bears congregate at some rivers when the salmon are running.

I would also say that there are more moose caused injuries than bear induced injuries each year.

http://ts1.mm.bing.net/th?&id=HN.608039366621793273&w=300&h=300&c=0&pid=1.9&rs=0&p=0

Not my pic, one I snagged off the web of McNeil River Falls when the salmon are running just for illustration.

[ballistim]

After several decades of carrying different .44 Magnums for bear defense in the Northwest Territories of Canada, and using them WITH CAST BULLETS on bison and moose, I say this:

With normal-weight cast bullets (my 429244s were 265 grains) the .44 penetrates COMPLETELY THROUGH (that's IN this side and OUT the far side) of animals even over 1000 pounds. I've seen it, and I've done it repeatedly.

If cast bullets are in the equation, what possible need is there for a heavier bullet that recoils harder, and will only exit to punch a hole in the air just like my 265s did? The penetration to go through-and through on a BISON is surely ample for any bear in creation, and YES, the bullets broke bone in some of the animals before exiting.

If soft-points are the chosen bullet, then maybe bigger/heavier might make sense, because expansion (and maybe some weight loss) will reduce penetration.

For me, though, a .44 with "normal" cast bullets is an amazingly effective device, and I was confident in its ability even in griz and polar-bear country.

Good to know! I had been looking at the possibility of a 44 mag SRH as a back up for bear hunting or where bear present & handgun is legal (not Canada, of course). Still trying to decide on barrel length knowing shorter is preferred for a close encounter but longer better for hunting. I have seen several used lately with longer barrels, considered checking cost of shortening to 5.5" as a possibility.

[27judge]

I don't think ill have the chance to go ,but I would feel pretty good with my BFR 500 JRH. Using a light load its about 1000 fps with a 440 gr bullet. Upping it to a med load its about 1200 fps both loads shoot ragged holes at 35 yards. Both loads are easy to control and the 5 1/2 barrel in a cross draw would be fairly easy to carry. I do shoot a lot of big game rocks and cans its a fun gun tks KEN

[W.R.Buchanan]

I have three guns and I would consider any of them adequate. S&W696 .44 Special, Ruger BH Bisley .44 Special, and Ruger SBH Bisley .44 Magnum. all loaded with either 429421 or 429244's at 900-1100 fps. These will go clean thru just about anything and leave a 7/16" hole behind.

If I was going light it would be the S&W 696 as it carries so nice and still packs a punch. I probably would bypass the BH Bisley and move right to the SBH Bisley simply because there is only a 2 oz difference in the guns.

I shoot the SBH best as it has the best sights.

Randy

[rockrat]

Probably take my S&W 44 mag, but might be tempted to take my Desert Eagle 44 Mag. Reload quickly and empty a mag pretty quickly too. The shotgun with slugs would be tempting instead. How about OOO buckshot?

[robertbank]

Good to know! I had been looking at the possibility of a 44 mag SRH as a back up for bear hunting or where bear present & handgun is legal (not Canada, of course). Still trying to decide on barrel length knowing shorter is preferred for a close encounter but longer better for hunting. I have seen several used lately with longer barrels, considered checking cost of shortening to 5.5" as a possibility.

We can apply for and get "Wilderness Permits" if your employment or work requires you to be in bear country. I have one frequently - they issue them for periods of a year and now the Chief Firearms Officer insists on revolver only.

While a friend of mine who I certify, carries a 5" 460 Smith I prefer either a 4.75" Uberti SAA in 45Colt or a 4 5/8" Ruger Flattop in 45 Colt loaded with cast 260 gr LSWC over 8.5 gr of Unique. I prefer the Uberti due to it's weight. If the 45Colt won't do the job at a range of 10 yards maximum then I am done anyway. We have Grizzlies and Black bears up here. Blacks are worse but both are pretty shy. The handgun only backs up my Mossberg loaded with slugs.

For large Grizzlies I think even the largest buckshot is just going to make the bear mad. A good load radio works as well or a talkative, preferably slower runner than you as a friend, helps as well.:p

Take care

Bob

[DougGuy]

Ruger Alaskan in .480 caliber.

[sixshot]

Something between the 44 maggie & the 475 that you can shoot well, accuracy is #1, missing the target is way down the list. Good, heavy cast slugs will work great & do not have to be driven at top speeds to get the job done. The heaviest bullets that your gun will shoot well is going to be just fine. One of the most famous gov. trappers of all time insisted on using single actions because you could quickly dump out 2-3 empties without dumping the loaded ones also, stuff a couple loaded ones back in & resume the fight & he did it for years. With a double action if you dump the cylinder the loaded ones come out along with the empties, how much fun would that be if things were a bit western! Again, maximum velocity isn't necessary but heavy, hard slugs are, that & accuracy will take care of you. Soft bullets will get you in big trouble! One last thing, a 340 gr. cast slug at 1100 fps is NOT going to bounce off the head of any bear, trust me!

Dick

[ballistim]

We can apply for and get "Wilderness Permits" if your employment or work requires you to be in bear country. I have one frequently - they issue them for periods of a year and now the Chief Firearms Officer insists on revolver only.

While a friend of mine who I certify, carries a 5" 460 Smith I prefer either a 4.75" Uberti SAA in 45Colt or a 4 5/8" Ruger Flattop in 45 Colt loaded with cast 260 gr LSWC over 8.5 gr of Unique. I prefer the Uberti due to it's weight. If the 45Colt won't do the job at a range of 10 yards maximum then I am done anyway. We have Grizzlies and Black bears up here. Blacks are worse but both are pretty shy. The handgun only backs up my Mossberg loaded with slugs.

For large Grizzlies I think even the largest buckshot is just going to make the bear mad. A good load radio works as well or a talkative, preferably slower runner than you as a friend, helps as well.:p

Take care

Bob

Thanks for sharing your experiences here, very helpful to someone like myself who has only been in situations where a large black bear or an angry moose would have been a possibility. I hope to hunt elk someday in areas where a grizzly might be encountered and a slower companion might not be available [emoji6]

[robertbank]

Making lots of noise as you travel through heavy brush certainly avoids surprising a bear. When my son and I go fishing we talk load always to and from the vehicle. Never had a problem and don't need one either he is faster than I am.:p

Take Care

Bob
ps Read BruceB's post it is very insightful.

[Petrol & Powder]

If you're with someone else my choice would be a Berretta Tomcat in .32ACP. Shoot your associate in the leg and while the bear is mauling him you should be able to get away or at least get to a long gun.

[ballistim]

If you're with someone else my choice would be a Berretta Tomcat in .32ACP. Shoot your associate in the leg and while the bear is mauling him you should be able to get away or at least get to a long gun.

I saw something like that in a movie recently!

[RJM52]

Probably the same gun(s) I carried while in Idaho and Montana for two months this year...4" S&W .41 Magnum.

Loaded with the original Remington 210 SPs that take a direct hit on a bone to expand at all or one of the hard cast loads from Federal, CorBon or Buffalo Bore will penetrate as well as anything else.

As to a Single Action or a Double Action the last thing I want to do if there is bodily contact between me and the bear is trying to cock a hammer to save my life. I have also seen semis jam during knock-down-drag-out fights between LEOs and badguys...

Bob

[EDK]

Probably the same gun(s) I carried while in Idaho and Montana for two months this year...4" S&W .41 Magnum............................................ .................................................. .................................................. ..................
As to a Single Action or a Double Action the last thing I want to do if there is bodily contact between me and the bear is trying to cock a hammer to save my life. I have also seen semis jam during knock-down-drag-out fights between LEOs and badguys...

Bob
When something is getting ready to chew on me, a double action revolver is the only answer...besides a quick exit! KISS principle,

[ole 5 hole group]

A couple years back a young lad got a job with the interior dept (I think that was the employer) in Alaska and he wanted to "borrow" an "Alaskan Handgun" for a couple months. Looked at the 500 Linebaugh Max, 500 Smith, 475 Linebaugh, 45/44 Redhawks but below is what he choose and several people up there in God's Country offered him a boat load of cash for that little gem.

Converted S&W 25-2 in 45 Colt with lanyard - carried 300 grain cast at 1,100fps. He saw several black bear up close and in/around camp but no problems and the only browns encountered were at a distance and never paid any attention to him. All shots fired by him and others in God's Country hit paper, cans & bottles at 10 to 40 yards.;) That little gem will be going to a grandson in the future.

127355

[warboar_21]

I bought a 7.5" 480 ruger super redhawk back in 09. I had it with me up in WA state while working and for a black bear hunt. The one thing I found when out hiking around was the gun was just to long to carry comfortably. Maybe a chest rig would have been a better way to go. I had complete faith in that gun when it came to stopping a two or four legged threat regardless of size.
I stopped carrying it while hiking due to weight and size and carried my 10mm with double tap 200gr wfn cast bullets at 1275fps from my gun. They did some great penetration on wet news print when I tested them. Again I felt fine with it.
If I were to be working up in the wilderness of Alaska I think I would carry either a 4" redhawk or a Mt gun in 45 colt. It is my favorite cartridge and is more than capable.

My good friend who used to be a fishing guide on a few rivers up there started out with a blackhawk in 44 mag and then moved to a scandium framed 44 mag. He also had an 870 loaded with slugs that was on the drift boat. He had one time in the 4 years guiding that he had a bear come close enough that required him to fire a warning shot in front of the bear. His client had saw the bear and lost his cool and started running back to the boat.

[Mohillbilly]

I went to Nome in 94 and took my Freedom Arms 454 Casull . If I were going today it would be be my BFR in 500 S&W

[Nicholas]

I have never been to Alaska, but one of my colleagues spent his summers working for a mineral exploration company. He carried a short barreled 12 gage slug gun. Told me he had a grizzly follow him around all one day so that he got little prospecting done. Too busy watching his back and was real happy to hear the chopper coming to pick him up. He had a 44 mag for a backup.

I wonder if the shotgun would be simpler to train for and manage than a BFR if charged by a bear. I know I would be better able to handle a shotgun over a big revolver in a stress situation.

Hey a bayonet on the shotgun might be useful after emptying the magazine at a bear.

[sw282]

A friend of mine got charged by a black bear some years back while fishing in Alaska. He stopped her @ 12 feet with his 4'' 629 loaded with old Norma steel jacketed 240 gr soft points.. She had a cub and would not stop. Were l to go to Alaska fishing l would take my Win Model 70 in FOUR-FIVE-EIGHT loaded with 510 gr softpoints.. For 2 legged predators theres my Colt Pocket Positive in 32Long Colt

[Gunslingerdoc]

Serbu Shorty in 12 gauge. loaded with slugs. thigh holster for kewl factor....Now its not a handgun but its close.

When we go halibut and salmon fishing, its generally some flavor of 44mag or 45 LC (loaded past SAA pressures)

Key thing when traveling abroad to hunt is trying to make sure you'll be able to get ammo once there if yours gets lost by the airlines...Been there done that and was glad to be using a 3006 for bear.

[GabbyM]

How about 20 gage round ball.

As a youth in Illinois where we were limited in deer hunting to MZ's or shotgun slugs. I quickly developed a poor opinion of the Foster hollow soft 12 gage slug. very poor penetration even in a deer. I purchased a 45 caliber cap lock muzzle loader when I was sixteen years old to fix that. Since then there are far more solid slugs on the market. If using a shotgun for bear I'd be careful to chose a good solid slug that can penetrate. Custom fit round ball load would be top on my list. For a gun. My Son In Law has a pistol grip short barrel 20 gage shotgun. Maybe a Mossberg IIRC. Very light and short. That gun slung well on the body loaded with solid cast round balls would be very formidable. It even points well from off balance shooting positions. He had a forearm vertical grip on it I tried to talk him into loosing. Silly thing gets in the way of the index figure point and shoot from hip shooting style. He scoffed so I had him throw five clays from the trap and hit three of five shooting from the hip. None more than twenty feet from the trap. I learned that trick at the Charelston, IL gun club from a man who'd been an M60 gunner in Vietnam.

[44man]

Have to think about if you have the shot gun/rifle in hand or against a tree while you gut and cut. That is where a handgun on person can save you.

[Naphtali]

If your budget only allowed you to purchase one handgun, for Alaska what would it be?

I'm going to say 10mm. Can be used for defense and also in the bush.Perhaps the easiest question to which to respond I've experienced in a long while. Recognizing that bear defense is a non-starter for handguns - bear killing, yes; bear stopping, no - I would buy one of two revolvers. Freedom Arms Model 97 45 Colt with 4.25- or 5.5-inch barrel is as close to perfection for my/your intended purpose as is available currently.

"Why?" you might reasonably ask. Since where I live is surrounded by Lolo National Forest and "the Bob," our uses have strong overlap.
1. It is warranted for Ruger full sized Blackhawk 45 Colt pressures. This translates to handloading 300-grain SWK-GC bullets to slightly exceed standard 44 Magnum ballistics.

2. Unloaded revolver weighs 34 ounces. This translates to the same weight as the Colt Single Action Army in a slightly smaller package.

3. Ergonomics are excellent - trigger action, sights, grip.

4. Nearly impossible to wear out the revolver in your lifetime.

5. It will retain its full value. You will be able to obtain its value 30 years from now.

6. Accuracy potential well beyond your conceivable need. A friend and I used my 4.25-incher on 36 x 36 armor plate at measured 340 yards. He hit the plate at will. I could barely see the target but was able to "walk" my shots-point-of-aim until I identified the range. Then I, too, hit the plate at will.

7. Were you so inclined, CCi/Speer 45 Colt shot loads have the largest, most useful payload of any conventional handgun ammunition.
***
My kit for Model 97s was created by Wes Daems of 7X Leather in Ennis, Montana. It causes revolver, ammunition 12-round container - I loathe cartridge loops - knife sheath to disappear from conscious wearing. Hardware is protected, available, and easy to carry. Cartridge reloads are completely protected from the elements, and also from being laid upon, sat upon, fallen upon.

Since you limit yourself to one handgun, your problem becomes preference - 4.25- or 5.5-inch barrel?

Hope this helps.

[sixshot]

This started out as a do it all gun for Alaska but if we turn it into a wrestling match then its not going to matter if its a rifle, shotgun, single action or double action, that bear is going to pin wheel you at 30 mph & your gun is going to land 50 feet from whats left of your carcass. If we have to do hand to hand combat in this thread it better be a handgun with a landyard & you will need to be very, very lucky to not get digested along with 4-5 lbs of blueberry poop! For me, it will be my 5 shot custom single action 480 with 400 gr. cast slugs at 1100 fps & they will knock the blueberries out of him, done that!

Dick

[white eagle]

http://www.slickguns.com/sites/default/files/411545424.jpg
This is the only one I have for the intended purpose,if like Dick says we do hand to hand combat with ol grizz I will make sure this is in my hand
have it loaded with 300-320 gr hardcast water dropped ww/lino mix (75/25)

[snowwolfe]

If your budget only allowed you to purchase one handgun, for Alaska what would it be?

I'm going to say 10mm. Can be used for defense and also in the bush.


Lived in Alaska for 35 years and for the last 6 prior to moving out my choice was the 4 inch S&W 500. My second choice would be the S&W 69.

[tygar]

Lots of thoughts from folks who have never lived in AK & that's fine, but until you've had a pizzed off brownie bouncing up & down, clacking his jaws with slober flying all over at 20ft, you'll never really understand why a favorite saying of old timers to newcomer is, "just make sure you file off the front site of your (____) (fill in the blank) so it won't hurt so bad when the bear shoves it up your az!

I lived there for over 20 yrs spread over 4 decades, with friends & relatives born there & having hunted & fished in bear country & if you aren't carrying a rifle or shotgun make it the biggest, most powerful pistol you can shoot effectively.

Another thing. Sorry to all the single action fans but it is a bad choice. A bear can cover 25 yds in about 1.5 seconds. Single action you get 1 shot, double with practice 3.

I started with a .44 when it was the biggest, when the .454 became known, I tried the FAs, but went back to 44s because they were to slow. When DA 454s came out carried them, when .460 & 500 came out tried both & settled on the .500. Bigger is better in this case.

I will postulate that it would be difficult to carry the 500 concealed if you only can have 1, but then in AK you can open carry & don't need a permit for concealed for residents & any others can concealed carry with their permit.

[robertbank]

To each is own but there is nothing between me and the Alaskan Panhamdle but 200 odd miles if you were a crow. I wouildn't discount a 500S&W if 1) you can carry it and 2) if you can shoot it. Most won't and can't. 12 gauge with slugs is the easiest primary for most to shoot. Some guys carry 12" doubles for that (Legal in Canada), and a handgun when the shotgun is not in hand. A 45 Colt will kill a bear if you hit in in the head or slow one down if you get his hip. Otherwise you are not going kill the darn thing in time anyway. He will kill you before he bleeds out. All just wasted spit anyway. Bear attacks of any kind are very rare and up here where I live the bush is so thick you best be making a lot of noise as you walk through it.

The stats for bear attacks are available. So are stats for lightening strikes.

Take Care

Bob

[tygar]

If you re-read my post, I said "rifle or shotgun"! Then I said "the biggest pistol you can effectively shoot"

Stats are fine until your faced with reality. Lightning doesn't strike the same place twice - until it does.

I do know what I'm talking about, been there, done it, faced them, shot them. Stalked them, had them stalk "me"! I even lived in Ketchikan where it is the densest brush anywhere. As a matter of fact, that's where I was stalked - twice. Ask me about the stories sometime, they'll pucker your bung.

I've also hunted griz & moose in BC & fished the Babine, Kispiox etc so I'm not a chechoko there either. Saw the biggest black ever! Had to be close to an 8 footer! No lie was with 2 other guys coming off a trib to the Babine Steelheading.

The 500 4" isn't much heaver than the SRH & "is not" that hard to shoot. I carry the 6.5 & have no problem altho would prefer a 5". Also it does fall into the ft #s energy range to stop a bear.

You can kill a big brown with a .22 as is evidenced by the one in the airport that a guy shot a ways back.

LOL But, like I said, file off that front sight. It will hurt a little less.

[white eagle]

front site or not it would still be better than polite conversation

[robertbank]

tygar right you are. With the bush being as heavy as it is up here just off the coast you really don't have much time, as you correctly intimate. Things can go wrong in a hurry. I like the defender style shotguns personally.

I shot the 500 once. Once was enough. The fellow I was with had one was practicing on bear targets at 15 yards. He was a local guide and could shoot that heavy gun almost as fast as I could with my .357. Maybe even faster. Like I said I fired one shot and that was enough. The gun is not for the timid and for me at least, a rapid aimed 2nd shot was not in the cards. Others likely could. I can't.

Take Care

Bob

[High Desert Hunter]

Lived in Alaska for 9 years, carried a 44, 45, or 454, but I was never without my 300 Win Mag or 45/70. Phil Shoemaker, a Master Guide who is one of the most knowledgeable bear guides I know of, had a daughter who was also a brown bear guide, her last resort weapon of choice was a 357 magnum loaded with heavy cast bullets, they will not ricochet off of a bear's skull, nor will a 340gr 45 caliber bullet at 1100fps, bears are not mythical creatures that are bullet proof, some, like mine are able to soak up a fair amount of lead and copper, others drop like a rock with the first shot, and everything in between. I have never shot a black bear, but I can't imagine them being any tougher than a brown/grizzly bear. The best weapon you can take into the Alaskan Bush for bear protection is a level head and common sense. Look at the statistics of how many bears are killed by hunters for the reason of defense of life, not very many, and sometimes, it doesn't matter what you're carrying, when mr bear comes crashing out of the alders without warning and blind sides you.

[GP100man]

The biggest handgun you can shoot effeciently under stress ,as tygar said.

As JM says "when ya have time" you can do a lot differently than when ya don`t.

I`ve shot the X frames from S&W & while the 500 is bigger I feel the flatter shooting 460 will do better in a true hunting situation, but again I have time, for fast handlin up close a good 44mag gets the nod.

Boolit matters also !!

[BRobertson]

If anybody here would be willing to post them for me, I will email a couple of photos of grizz/brown bears that I have taken with .44 handguns,
I am not smart enough to post photos, and my computer helper(wifey)!! is too busy to help right now

Thanks
Bob

[tygar]

After my 85 BC hunt with a 338 where I made heart locker shots on both griz & moose & both ran; was the "last" time I didn't use one of my .375s for either! period! After that, never had anything go more than a few yds. Even turned a moose az over front.

For fishing my actual preference would be a 18" 12ga w/collapsible (not folding) stock. #4, slug, 2 buck, slug, slug, slug. But to hard to carry & get into action when fishing. The .500(or whatever) in shoulder or waist holster (whatever u like) is quick & easy.

Want to point out. Everyone is assuming "max" loads. The 500 can be loaded down a little for a better follow up shot & ur still putting a .5" slug at whatever wt. u want. I don't use "heavy" bullets. 375-400 w/385 my favorite. Dave at CH Tool & Die makes a 385 solid brass that he uses in Africa that will go thru a Buff that I alternate with a 385 HP that expands well. Figure that covers it. I do shoot hot but recoil is not a problem for me.

Hot pistol is a lot easier than hot rifle. I havn't owned a .460WBY in 20yrs or a 470 Nitro in 5. Straight wall 45s like Watts or Lott are about it anymore.

Shoot the most gun you can shoot "good"! Any hit is better than a miss, but a hit with .500 is better than anything else.

[tygar]

Heh Bob, just saw your post. Were still going back & forth on mine is bigger than yours nananan.

You guys still going to move back to Wasilla?

We been talking to my son in Anc about getting a place on one of the boating lakes or rivers in the valley.

With the Kings being so bad maybe I don't want to or maybe its a good time, lol.

I'd like to float the Situk again this yr for steelies for sure.

Drop me a line.\
Tom

[BRobertson]

Hi Tom,

We will be heading back North in approx. 2 years. We don't know where exactly, but probably close to Fairbanks. I can't tolerate anywhere other than Alaska, so the next move will be our final for retirement.
We had a great place to drop Steelhead fishermen off with a ski equipped 185 along the Situk. It was best when the ice would first allow floating the river in the spring. Those things look like sharks in that small river!!!

Bob

[deepwater]

What is the difference in recoil with S&W .500's that have 2", 4" and 6" barrels? I "assume" that all would have the muzzle break. A 2" barrel, although nice to carry, just does not seem right.

Anybody have a chart that could compare the energy of a 2" barreled S&W .500 and a 5" barreled .480 Ruger shooting 400 gr. boolits?

deepwater

[John Boy]

Is this the 1st handgun you ever bought? Appears your not familiar with the capabilities for various calibers and handgun models

[tygar]

lol I wouldn't be very interested in shooting a 2" full pop 500 load. 4" is stout & loud. 6.5 is not bad, 7.5 not bad, the 10s+ are like shooting a stout 44mag.

I want a 5" but the only make it in a 460.

As John says look at some books, but I personally don't really like the .480 compared to the .454, 460 & 500.

You need to shoot some big bore stuff to see what you like.

[.45Cole]

Does a m10 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQyUk1gVVGs) count as a pistol :bigsmyl2:

[sixshot]

I sure do get a kick out of these Alaskan handgun arguments! The original questions was, what ONE handgun for Alaska & they always turn into a Brown bear mauling, I love it! Most of the correct answers have been posted already, meaning you have to hit your target & if that target is a bear if, if ,if then its important to gets its attention as fast as possible. Yes, they are very fast, yes I've shot them, yes I've shot them with handguns & yes I've shot them in Alaska but I've never lived there. Some one posted about Tia Shoemaker using a 357 maggie for bear protection, thats correct but she almost always used factory solids made by Norma. Phil gave it to her & he started packing a 44 using heavy cast slugs.
Again if we are just discussing bears they are extremely fast, so fast that very few people can even get their gun out before the action starts, many people don't realize the danger at first & they don't draw their gun, my rules for me are, if I see a bear, the gun comes out NOW!
The argument about single actions & double actions will never go away, use what you are comfortable with, just make sure you get the gun in your hands as quickly as possible. I'll still stick with the single action although I can shoot a double action about as fast as anybody out there. I'm 70 years old now but just a few years ago I was #1 in the nation in A class revolver, last year in Arizona I made 4 straight runs on two seperate targets, 3 shots on each. String one was 2.03 seconds for 6 shots, 2.03 seconds for string 2 for 6 shots, 1.89 seconds string 3 for 6 shots & 1.93 seconds for string 4 & 6 shots, this was from the draw using a 610 revolver. I think its still on You Tube somewhere. The speed of the double action is great but if we're being charged by a bear I'll still take my chances with a good single action. My 3 Alaskan bears were on the south fork of the Kuskokuim, right down by the Styx river.

Dick

[deepwater]

I have been shooting big bore handguns for over 25 years. Started with Dan Wesson stainless .44 mag with a variety of barrel lengths and weights. Best group with open sights was (5) rounds in 5" @ 100 yards. Had a 7 1/2 FA .454 and did not like the grip for heavy recoil. 6" S&W 29 did not compare to the Dan Wesson. I currently have a .480 Ruger that SSK cut to 5 1/2", trigger job, uniformed the chambers, adjusted timing and cylinder gap, beveled forcing cone and muzzle, fine bead blasting to a satin finish and Hogue grips. I have arthritis in both hands from 35 years as an architectural blacksmith, so practicing is an issue.

I asked the previous questions because the weight of the Smith is over 1 1/2 pounds heavier than my Ruger. It was mentioned that 385 gr. boolits in the Smith would be a manageable load - I shoot 400 gr. boolits in my Ruger. The Smith loads have around 25% greater pressure than the Ruger. The Smith has a bigger grip than the Ruger. The Smith may have a muzzle break, my Ruger does not. Many contributors have commented on the "Backpaker" (or similar) versions with a 2" barrel. I was just trying to get general feedback on the very subjective nature of felt recoil.

deepwater

[BruceB]

I'm reminded of an article written by author Jim Wilson (in "Shooting Times", maybe?) wherein he followed a wounded hog into a thicket with his single-action revolver.

After a successful conclusion, he came out of the brush to find his pals laughing their butts off.

He asked what was so funny, and they said it was the first time they'd ever heard a single-action fired on full-automatic.

[paralaska]

I think that in an emergency situation . . . You don' t really notice the recoil (or sound) that much. I go with the biggest & baddest handgun that I can get on target and fire accurately and quickly. For me right now . . . that's a SRH 5" .454 casull.

[tygar]

Hi Tom,

We will be heading back North in approx. 2 years. We don't know where exactly, but probably close to Fairbanks. I can't tolerate anywhere other than Alaska, so the next move will be our final for retirement.
We had a great place to drop Steelhead fishermen off with a ski equipped 185 along the Situk. It was best when the ice would first allow floating the river in the spring. Those things look like sharks in that small river!!!

Bob

Shoot, replied last night but guess I forgot to hit send & lost it.

To cold in FB for me.

Been talking to son in ANC about getting a place in the valley on a river or lake. Like floating the Little Willow for trout & kings & Nancy Lake so maybe there. Always liked the Deshka, & some of those places but don't want to drive my boat to get home.

Did several of the ski plane drop offs. Released 23 on 1 float, really pzd the guys off lol. also drove to one & floated down but cant remember the pull out.

Had my most difficult decision on shooting a Brown on the Situk. Was fishing silvers upriver in a john boat. We were beached on one side & on the other side 25yds down stream a bear popped up. He saw us & jumped into the river & crossed over to our side.

When he jumped in we pushed off & went to the other side. I had my 375 up & ready & started to talk him down. He's bouncing around snapping & growling etc & I'm saying don't put a toe in the water or your a rug. As you know up stream it's maybe 30' wide so not cool.

Well, here's my problem! I have my tag, I have a hunt planned for Kodiak later, this is a 4 yr area, Kodiak is 4 yr. but this is the most distinctive colored BB I have seen! He is Steel Grey with Silver Tips! But....again the but, he's only about 6'.

I'm talking to the bear telling him to calm down & go away, asking my buddy if I should shoot him, I'm screwed which ever way I choose. And to this day I'm telling this story & regretting NOT shooting him, because he turned away. And I didn't get a bear that year in Kodiak.

I really like that Yakutat area.

[Nicholas]

I'm reminded of an article written by author Jim Wilson (in "Shooting Times", maybe?) wherein he followed a wounded hog into a thicket with his single-action revolver.

After a successful conclusion, he came out of the brush to find his pals laughing their butts off.

He asked what was so funny, and they said it was the first time they'd ever heard a single-action fired on full-automatic.

I seem to remember that article being about a feral bovine charging him. Either way, the line about full-auto single action firing does stand for Jim Wilson, but for him, it was second nature.

[tygar]

Deepwater, give me a holler if your going to be in the Fredericksburg area & you can try out 454, 480, 500s from 5"-8", in most bullet wts, got rid of the 10-12" 460 & 500, a waste of time to me, just carry a rifle if you carry one of them. So you can at least get an idea of the recoil from the different sizes but with you having had the SRH, FA, & DW, you already have pretty much done it. I really don't find the .500 to be all that much more than hot .454s & the 4" 500 isn't much over the SRH in wt.

I think people make to much out of the recoil thing. If you can shoot hot 44s or 454s you can shoot most anything. A pistol is much easier than a severe recoiling rifle as the pistol recoils up & over more so than back. If it's getting your web I wear my thin shotgun shooting glove. Then again, after 2 neck operations, I'm pretty much a puzzy & most of my rifles that start with a 4 have breaks on them now lol.

[deepwater]

Tygar,

Thank you very much for responding to my question with the type of information I was looking for, without innuendo and unnecessary ego. I appreciate your offer and I look forward to meeting you in Fredericksburg. I will bring a few pieces you may find interesting as well.

deepwater

[High Desert Hunter]

I sure do get a kick out of these Alaskan handgun arguments! The original questions was, what ONE handgun for Alaska & they always turn into a Brown bear mauling, I love it! Most of the correct answers have been posted already, meaning you have to hit your target & if that target is a bear if, if ,if then its important to gets its attention as fast as possible. Yes, they are very fast, yes I've shot them, yes I've shot them with handguns & yes I've shot them in Alaska but I've never lived there. Some one posted about Tia Shoemaker using a 357 maggie for bear protection, thats correct but she almost always used factory solids made by Norma. Phil gave it to her & he started packing a 44 using heavy cast slugs.
Again if we are just discussing bears they are extremely fast, so fast that very few people can even get their gun out before the action starts, many people don't realize the danger at first & they don't draw their gun, my rules for me are, if I see a bear, the gun comes out NOW!
The argument about single actions & double actions will never go away, use what you are comfortable with, just make sure you get the gun in your hands as quickly as possible. I'll still stick with the single action although I can shoot a double action about as fast as anybody out there. I'm 70 years old now but just a few years ago I was #1 in the nation in A class revolver, last year in Arizona I made 4 straight runs on two seperate targets, 3 shots on each. String one was 2.03 seconds for 6 shots, 2.03 seconds for string 2 for 6 shots, 1.89 seconds string 3 for 6 shots & 1.93 seconds for string 4 & 6 shots, this was from the draw using a 610 revolver. I think its still on You Tube somewhere. The speed of the double action is great but if we're being charged by a bear I'll still take my chances with a good single action. My 3 Alaskan bears were on the south fork of the Kuskokuim, right down by the Styx river.

Dick
I knew Tia used heavy for caliber bullets, couldn't remember the manufacturer. If one were to look at the number of fatal attacks, you would find you're much more likely to die in a car crash. While I have a healthy respect for bears, especially after seeing how quickly they can cover ground, I never spent my days thinking about thwarting a bear attack, I have trained a good bit to counter 2 legged attackers, as I am much more likely to encounter one of them than I ever will a bear. There have been more bear attacks, especially fatal attacks in the lower 48 than there have been in Alaska since 2000.

[robertbank]

High Desert Hunter - that is likely because Black Bears, though shy, tend to attack for food. When they do attack you are lunch! Up here there are more Blacks than Grizzlies and the advice from those I respect, if unarmed fight like crazy a Black Bear and play dead for a Grizzly. The latter will bite you up until you cease to be a threat than leave you to tenderize, Blacks seem to prefer fresh meat.

I would assume you have more Black bears in the lower 48 than Grizzlies.

In the 12 years I have lived up here I have been chased off our golf course when a Grizzly took up temporary residence on the 15th fairway. He asked for some piece and quiet and two of us decided.... why not? The 2nd occurrence took place at our gun club in the back pistol pits. A Black Bear thought he might sneak a steak in before moving on to some wild cabbage. He decided he could hold off on the meat when his dinner retreated, gun in hand, to his truck.:-P Lastly, my son and I were out fishing and as we walked down to the Skeena, a female with cub in tow rose up as she crossed the railroad tracks we were walking on. My son is 6'3" so I had him raise his hands up over his head while I stood in front of him with mine extended horizontally. She was about 150 yards up wind and could not make us out for certain. I can only assume she figured whatever we were we were to big to bother with so she wondered off. I had the 12 gauge with me had she decided otherwise. No worries.

Take Care

Bob
I would think car crashes, snake bites and lighting might all rank ahead of bear attacks. For lightning I prefer tupperware over all metal guns.;)

[John Van Gelder]

I lived in Alaska for 22 years, and spend all but one of those years as a state trooper. I investigated a number of plane crashes in remote places, and even had some stories from NTSB investigators about having to deal with bears that had gotten to plane crashes before they did. I spent a lot of time out in the forest, and used to regularly hunt deer on Kodiak Island. In all of that time I never had a problem with a bear. I had a couple of different revolvers that I carried, a Blackhawk .45 with a short barrel, loaded with 340 gr. bullets and a generous amount of H 110. The other was a 7.5" Redhawk .44 with a 250 gr. Keith bullet and a upper H 110 loading.

My thoughts on carrying a hand gun for defense against bears are mixed, I feel that if you are not willing to spend the time to become proficient enough to shoot accurately under a very stressful situation , you would be better served carrying a shotgun.

[Texantothecore]

According to my Alaskan friends the .454 Casull is very popular. I also am aware that the.45-70 revolvers have a following in the bear guide community.

The bears up there are very aggressive and they attack from hiding are on you suddenly. They do not stand up and roar but get as close to you as possible and they are on you very suddenly.

Big, deep holes work on brown bears. Pepper spray is just a condiment.

[Side by Side]

I have a Freedom Arms 454, great gun

[dougader]

I refuse the premise of one gun for everything. For fishing trips or other trips out in the woods, I'd get a Ruger SRH in 480 and cut the barrel back to about 4.5".

For around town, I'll take my 1911 in 9x23 Winchester.

[tygar]

I lived in Alaska for 22 years, and spend all but one of those years as a state trooper..


John, when were you there? I trained K9s with Julie Grimes & Hans Brinke & some other troopers & APD back in the 90s-2000s.

We all agree that a 12ga or big bore rifle is best but the question is just a basic "what "1" pistol to carry if you can "only" have 1. So, it's just the usual my car is better than yours argument. Hell, as I've said before, I've killed a number of Browns, Griz & Blacks & the only one I shot with a pistol was my first black in 1966 with RBH 357 & it just pizzed him off & my bro in law put him down with a 30-30. Learned early to use enough gun. Personally I don't believe in their being to much gun when shooting dangerous game.

[Naphtali]

While we have had four grizzly attacks-kills in the general area the past three years, the only one with which I am familiar occurred three years ago the first day of shed season at the game refuge a couple of miles south just off highway 83. A grizzly "attacked" a shed hunter shortly after the season opened. The man fired three shots, all of which hit the grizzly's thorax, with his 44 magnum revolver. Many hours later rangers located the bear and dispatched it with rifles.

What I feel confident reporting is that any adult bear that escapes your notice until it is within 30 yards you will not stop from doing what it wants to do - take possession of the elk you are field dressing, for example - with any handgun. You also will not get more than one shot, and probably not even one. Where I hunt close to my home the bear protection-defense that is reassuring is your hunting partner standing watch while you field dress. On your knees with bloody, greasy hands - trust me - you will be unable to quick draw or deliberately draw a handgun. You will not be able to shoot accurately. Having your rifle close by will not improve your survivability. But your partner standing watch changes the otherwise bleak outlook.

Confrontations that are not you and the bear arguing over whose animal you are field dressing are a different bag of cats. Where I am, despite there being substantial numbers of grizzlies in the area, you are more likely to be struck by lightning on a cloudless sunny day than to meet a grizzly. So your handgun becomes the equivalent of a child's security blanket relative to bears. There are other things in my woods, so a handgun is not a total waste of effort. And one that is not a disagreeable chore to carry is more likely to be routinely carried than one weighing 50+ ounces.

That's my story, and I'm sticking to it.

[ballistim]

While we have had four grizzly attacks-kills in the general area the past three years, the only one with which I am familiar occurred three years ago the first day of shed season at the game refuge a couple of miles south just off highway 83. A grizzly "attacked" a shed hunter shortly after the season opened. The man fired three shots, all of which hit the grizzly's thorax, with his 44 magnum revolver. Many hours later rangers located the bear and dispatched it with rifles.

What I feel confident reporting is that any adult bear that escapes your notice until it is within 30 yards you will not stop from doing what it wants to do - take possession of the elk you are field dressing, for example - with any handgun. You also will not get more than one shot, and probably not even one. Where I hunt close to my home the bear protection-defense that is reassuring is your hunting partner standing watch while you field dress. On your knees with bloody, greasy hands - trust me - you will be unable to quick draw or deliberately draw a handgun. You will not be able to shoot accurately. Having your rifle close by will not improve your survivability. But your partner standing watch changes the otherwise bleak outlook.

Confrontations that are not you and the bear arguing over whose animal you are field dressing are a different bag of cats. Where I am, despite there being substantial numbers of grizzlies in the area, you are more likely to be struck by lightning on a cloudless sunny day than to meet a grizzly. So your handgun becomes the equivalent of a child's security blanket relative to bears. There are other things in my woods, so a handgun is not a total waste of effort. And one that is not a disagreeable chore to carry is more likely to be routinely carried than one weighing 50+ ounces.

That's my story, and I'm sticking to it.

I'm sure you're right, and take your word for it since I have no experience with this, but I think I still want my "security blanket" though!

[John Van Gelder]

tygar

Julie Grimes was a friend of mine and she got to be the director. We had a little story about Julie, she was also a pilot, she was out scouting the Matanuslka valley for grow operations found a really big one and sent us off on a raid, when the "raiding" party got there the field of "pot" was actually potatoes.. Sometimes it is hard to tell what you are looking at from the air.

I was in Alaska from July of 1972 until the last week in June of 1995.

My older brother was in Alaska back in the late 50s, he called my Dad one night and told him that he had just killed a brown bear on Kodiak Island. He did that with a Blackhawk .357. His comment to my father was "I really wish I had gotten the .44magnum".

I disagree about there "not being too much gun" if you cannot control/shoot accurately what you have then it is too much. If you get to the point where the bear has grabbed you then the 460 S&W or the 500 are good choices or maybe a 30MM.

If you are hunting in bear country your best choice is your rifle, if you go into big bear country carrying nothing but a hand gun, that's your choice and good luck. You are probably more likely to be struck by lightening that getting attacked by a bear.

[tygar]

Hi John, you came late to the discussion so I won't go back over it all. If you want read what I & others said but it's the usual Alaska gun stuff we old timers bandy about every once & awhile.

The "unspoken", but in this case, previously clearly stated, "most gun you can effectively handle".

Any way, knew Julie from when she came back from the bush to after she retired from being top dog in the Troopers & moved to FL with her husband.

Funny story, we both knew Gov Hickle & family & were in fact training their dog (they bought It from me) & she was a Major in the Troopers & we were at her house at a cook out talking & I said, "You are really in a good position! The Colonel is retiring & you being a women & with all your varied experience & good work, you could be in the running for head of the Troopers"!

LOL found out the next day or so, she knew she had already been selected but couldn't say anything!

She still trained dogs up until & even after she retired until Jim retired from APD then did undercover drug work for a while then they moved to FL.

LOL just go off the phone with my old training partner; he's down at his place in Yuma rubbing the 76 degree weather! But I got the last laugh, he has to go back for business.

[GabbyM]

Statistics are written with a large pencil.
My money is on your odds of hostile encounter with a bruin go way up when you carry around food. Especially fresh kill. Like a basket of fish down a river trail. Slaughtering an animal out on the ground.

[John Van Gelder]

The big bears can hit 30 mph in about three strides, thier hearts beat about 8 times a minute, so killing one from hemorrhage, is a long time proposition, you need something that will break major bones. Using kinetic energy is not a good measure of effectiveness, the Taylor formula, which is based on momentum, a better gauge, gives the .44 mag. a value of 20, the 454 a 30 and the 12 ga. shotgun with slugs a 53.