358 win from a Rem 700 tell me why I should not

[Smoke4320]

OK here goes.
I have Remington 700 buckmaster edition
7-08 24" lying around
Want 358 win
Tell me why I should not send the gun to JES to rebore to 358 win
If I do ...
What barrel length and why (mostly tree stand hunt around here)
What twist ....mostly will shoot 180 to 240 gr cast
What number of grooves
Thread for my 458 suppressor. ( just to lessen the report?
Looking forward to the suggestions and edgamafucation
PS I would add guns primary use will be deer and hog hunting

[Uncle Grinch]

My military FN sporter from ER Shaw has a 20 inch barrel and has served me quite well hunting from tree stands.

[Ben]

You will not regret it.

JES has done 3 for me.
All are nail drivers.

Ben

[dh2]

why not if the barrel is heavy enough to take being bored out to 35 cal. if not look at the .338 Fed. be a 20 inch no longer than 22 inch. shot from a tree stand are not normally long and the power in either of these will be slow burning by rifle standards.

[dragon813gt]

20-22", 1 in 14", 3 groove :)

[Smoke4320]

Ben
What rifles have you had done
What were the barrel lengths and # of grooves
What weight bullets do you normally shoot
Thanks for any responses

[richhodg66]

I have yet to shoot a deer with mine, but after having worked with one for about a year now, I'd say you'd be hard pressed to find a better (or equal) cartridge for cast bullet big game hunting.

The RCBS 200 grain FP, or in my case, the NOE version, is a real winner in this round.

[birddog]

I would have to believe that a new barrel would be cheaper than reboring. And then I would have it set up as a swap barrel, I have a 300 Win. and 358 Norma Mag set up on a Rem 700. Also have a 700 Rem short action set up with 22-250 and 7BR. and a Howa short action that is set up as factory 308 with 257 Roberts Improved and 6-284 heavy bbl. All are better shooters with the extra bbl's than the factory bbl.
My 2 cents
Charlie

[Larry Gibson]

Leave the barrel at 24". Have it done with a 16" twist (will handle bullets to 250 gr just fine). I'd get a minimum of 4 grooves and even 6 grooves for the larger bore. Grove depth should be .004 minimum and the lands should cover 33 - 35% of the bore. I've built several .35 Rs and a couple 35x57s (.358W capacity with an '06 length neck) using the 26" Shilen prethreaded barrels from Brownell's. The 16" twist and 6 grooves has handles cast bullets, especially the RCBS 35-200-FN to 2400+ fps.

Larry Gibson

[white eagle]

I am with birddog
had my model 70 compact rebarreled to 358 from 7-08 and had the barrel at 21",1-10 twist
shoots 250's into the same hole (or real small groups)at 100 yds
easy to carry and deadly on bull elk

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v730/kempobb/PDR_0860.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/kempobb/media/PDR_0860.jpg.html).

[Smoke4320]

Larry
Stock barrel measures .660 OD at 24, 22 and 20"
You you think there will be enough meat left in the barrel to bore to 358 leave at 24" and still be accurate?

[Larry Gibson]

Larry
Stock barrel measures .660 OD at 24, 22 and 20"
You you think there will be enough meat left in the barrel to bore to 358 leave at 24" and still be accurate?

Yes, my Shilen .35 measures .600" at 26" It is very accurate. Top two groups at 100 yards to zero my 35 Rem for hunting (35-200-FN at 2150 fps). First group was high right so sight was adjust and second group fired to confirm zero. Bottom target is 200 yards with +3 moa added.

Larry Gibson

125542

[Smoke4320]

Larry
That looks great.
Jes offers 5 groove with .349 land and ..359 groove so looks like that will fit the bill
Are you using the 1:16 twist to be gentler on the lead bullet to increase the top velocity?

[waksupi]

I have .358's in both 1-12, and 1-14. Both shoot heavy boolits extremely well, at what would exceed factory velocities, assuming the factories ever made real heavy projectiles. All I could go off was stated velocities for the next lightest bullet.

[Ben]

Ben
What rifles have you had done
What were the barrel lengths and # of grooves
What weight bullets do you normally shoot
Thanks for any responses


If Ruger won't make a nice fast handling Ruger # 1 in 358 Win., you'll just have to take things into your own hands ( took me 9 months of metal and wood working , but it was worth every hour and every dime I've put into the project ) And YES, it is a shooter ! ! :

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/haysb/Ruger%20Number%201%20%20358%20Win/PICT0014.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/haysb/Ruger%20Number%201%20%20358%20Win/PICT0017.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/haysb/Ruger%20Number%201%20%20358%20Win/PICT0020.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/haysb/Ruger%20Number%201%20%20358%20Win/PICT0018.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/haysb/Ruger%20Number%201%20%20358%20Win/PICT0019.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/haysb/Ruger%20Number%201%20%20358%20Win/PICT0030.jpg

Solid steel barrel band

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/haysb/Ruger%20Number%201%20%20358%20Win/8765.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/haysb/Ruger%20Number%201%20%20358%20Win/PICT0023.jpg

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?63633-Ruger-1-35-Ack-Improved

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?217475-Getting-ready-for-deer-season

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?67463-358-Win-IMR-7383

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?60124-Are-HP-s-more-accurate

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?64868-2400-Powder

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?100428-Custom-Ruger-1-358-Win

[MarkP]

I have (4) 350 Rem mags all have 1:16" twist barrels in the following lengths 15", 20, 22". They all shoot a custom 273 gr FN & 247 gr FN well out to 175 yds. (never shot on paper any further) the 20 inch rifles are very handy in tight spots, the absence of even 4" is noticeable. I have shot the 15" XP at 200 m with Hornady 358-250 SP with good accuracy. Using a lathe, I turned the lead tips off of a few hundred so I could load from the magazine. The trimmed bullets shot just as well as the non trimmed spire points. But have not shot jacketed out of these for 15 years or so.

There was a Powley Computer program that was pretty close for predicted velocities with varying barrel lengths. However, the link I have for the Powley Computer is not working.
I have always contemplated a 358 Win but I already have more 350's than I can shoot.

[Wolfer]

Ben
That is one good looking #1

[Smoke4320]

Ben
Great job. I hope to someday have such a good looking gun

[Ben]

Thought you might like that one.
Many thanks,
Ben

[joatmon]

I'd go for it! Also DANG BEN don't know what slaps me first the quality of the wood and wood work you show or the quality of the photos you post! Both are mighty fine indeed.
Aaron

[butch2570]

How come one fella gets all the talent ?? Ben, that is simply a gorgeous rifle, Period.. And what a display of craftsman ship, along with your incredibly modest and humble personality, hats off to ya, truly impressive ...

[Ben]

butch2570 (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/member.php?34776-butch2570)

Gee. . . . , I wish I was 2% of all that.

Many thanks,

Ben

[Andrew Mason]

has anyone here been in contact with jes concerning reboring?

i have called and left messages, and e-mailed,
nothing...


anyone hear anything?

[9.3X62AL]

He may be closed for the holidays. He generally calls back in late morning to early afternoon during the week.

Any gunsmith worth his salt MUST severely restrict phone contacts, or the only thing he will do is answer the phone.......and no work will get done. Their time is extremely limited, so don't waste it with unsubstantial questions. Specific to JES, know the chamber/caliber, twist rate, and number of grooves you want cut prior to calling.

[ballistim]

has anyone here been in contact with jes concerning reboring?

i have called and left messages, and e-mailed,
nothing...


anyone hear anything?

I left a phone message two weeks ago asking about a rebore & he called back the same day, maybe he is off for holidays or busy in shop.

[Smoke4320]

I left a message Saturday and he called me this morning around 10:30 AM my time.. That would be 7:30 AM his time

[JesterGrin_1]

I would have to say without any reservation what so ever to do it. :). The .358 Winchester is a darn fine cartridge.

I took over a year to study the .358 Winchester before I had one built. I would say a 20" barrel in the .358 Winchester will do everything the cartridge needs to do. So really barrel length is up to you but I would feel comfortable with anything from 18" - 22" . As for twist I picked a 1-14 but again a 1-12 to 1-14 would serve you well. For cast bullets I did not even contemplate the 1-16 twist as I felt I might use the 280Gr 358009. But I have not as of yet. The only problem you may have is that your other calibers may collect lots of dust lol.

[starmac]

The only reason I could come up with against rebarreling your existing rifle, is if you just went and purchased a 358, you would have two instead of one. lol

To date I have not owned a 358, but consider it to be about as close to the optimum cartridge in the 35 caliber as a guy can get for cast shooting.

[GabbyM]

I'd be inclined to ask Jes if he can cut a 12 or 14" twist rate in a 338 Fed. Could probably run a 225 grain boolit 2,200 fps.

[TXGunNut]

Can't think of a single reason why not, that's exactly what I'd do if had a rifle like that. I'd go with 1:14 and the 3 groove but that's just me.

[dragon813gt]

I'd be inclined to ask Jes if he can cut a 12 or 14" twist rate in a 338 Fed. Could probably run a 225 grain boolit 2,200 fps.

Now you got me thinking I should convert my 336 to 338 Federal. I know Marlin made them but they were ugly. And the action will feed converted 308 brass......decisions decisions :)


Can't think of a single reason why not, that's exactly what I'd do if had a rifle like that. I'd go with 1:14 and the 3 groove but that's just me.

I think someone else said the same thing ;)
If I convert the 336 to 356 Winchester that will be the specs. There's something about those wide lands and grooves that are appealing.

[TXGunNut]

I think someone else said the same thing ;)
If I convert the 336 to 356 Winchester that will be the specs. There's something about those wide lands and grooves that are appealing.

I spent a little time on the JES site and called him to ask about it. Told him what I was looking for and he told me the 3-groove would be just fine for my 35 Whelen. He was right, of course.

[Ben]

My Whelen Ack Imp is a 3 groove done by JES, it is a shooter also.

Ben

[turmech]

When I called JES about boring a Remington 700 to 358 win (formally a 243) and asked what he recommended. He said 3 groove (and honestly with out looking I don't recall what twist he did). I figured I leave it up to him and I am glad I did. I have been more than happy.
Unless you have something specific you want to do in mind I would go with his suggestions.

[Ben]

Good advice ! !

Ditto ! !

[Spruce]

Ben, that No. 1 is a fine looking firearm. Great looking wood, fit and finish. 358Win. in a No.1, wow. Now you have me thinking, and that will cost money!

[Ben]

Yes, to duplicate that again would cost some major bucks ! !

Many thanks for your kind remarks.

Ben

[starmac]

Now you got me thinking I should convert my 336 to 338 Federal. I know Marlin made them but they were ugly. And the action will feed converted 308 brass......decisions decisions :)



I think someone else said the same thing ;)
If I convert the 336 to 356 Winchester that will be the specs. There's something about those wide lands and grooves that are appealing.

I was not aware of marlin ever makeing a 338 federal, when was this, and what was ugly about them.

[dragon813gt]

Technically they came in 338 Marlin Express and it was in the XLR. Ugly laminate stocks and I'm not a fan of stainless lever actions. In factory ammo the 338MX and 338 Federal are loaded to different levels. W/ reloading they are pretty much equals.

[starmac]

Gotcha, yea I new about the 338MX, infact would like to find one. I don't think they were all the xlr version. I have a 308 MX that is walnut and blue, I like the looks of (not as well as a 94) and I have seen at least one wood and blue 338 MX. I maybe should have bought it, but it was at an auction, and they tend to bring top dollar or more at local auctions here.

[JesterGrin_1]

Yep Ben likes to show that No.1 now and then to see how many people kill there keyboard with Drool lol. :bigsmyl2:

As for .338 VS .358 I think as far as I know there are not that many bullets designed for its speed range VS the .358. And I am pretty darn positive that there are not nearly as many boolit designs as one can pick for the .358. I mean heck for the .358 you can pick from pistol bullets both jacketed and cast up to and probably beyond the 280Gr 358009.

A little reading. http://www.leverguns.com/articles/paco/358_wcf.htm

[ballistim]

I haven't called JES about this yet but figured I'd ask if anyone here could answer my question. I have a Remington Model 7 in 7mm/08 that has never been accurate with any load tried and is very short throated. Question is this; does JES rechamber/rebore 7mm/08 to .358 Winchester & I'd so is there enough steel left in the barrel on a Model 7 after rebore to .358? I don't see 7mm/08 as one of the calibers that JES lists as one of the options for a rechamber.

[MarkP]

I can not speak for JES procedure's; but others would most likely: re-bore your 7 mm to .350" cut your grooves to .358" and use the existing chamber body and shoulder (7-08) and just re-cut the neck and throat/leade to make a 358 Win chamber. Basically the sights and roll marks & stampings will be indexed in the same position as the headspace will not change as they will not re-cut the shoulder just the neck.

Yes there will be enough mat'l for a 358 re-bore using a factory model SEVEN bbl. The top rifle in my Avatar is a SS Rem M SEVEN in .416, and lower 2 are M SEVEN KS's in 350 Rem Mag. Re-boring a REM 673 to .416 was too thin at the tapped holes for fastening the vent rib to the bbl. The shops wanted a minimum wall thickness of .100".

[ballistim]

I can not speak for JES procedure's; but others would most likely: re-bore your 7 mm to .350" cut your grooves to .358" and use the existing chamber body and shoulder (7-08) and just re-cut the neck and throat/leade to make a 358 Win chamber. Basically the sights and roll marks & stampings will be indexed in the same position as the headspace will not change as they will not re-cut the shoulder just the neck.

Yes there will be enough mat'l for a 358 re-bore using a factory model SEVEN bbl. The top rifle in my Avatar is a SS Rem M SEVEN in .416, and lower 2 are M SEVEN KS's in 350 Rem Mag. Re-boring a REM 673 to .416 was too thin at the tapped holes for fastening the vent rib to the bbl. The shops wanted a minimum wall thickness of .100".

Thanks for the information here, I will definitely investigate this further and appreciate everything you've explained here.

[MarkP]

I just double checked muzzle diameters on my 7's; .560 ish on my 18.5" FS in 7-08, .600" KS in 350 REM (the 350's have sights), .650" SS 300 SAUM, & .650 on my custom .416. The muzzle on my Kimber 84 Montana was .550" I am fairly certain they offered these in a 358 Win & 338 Federal.

[ballistim]

I just double checked muzzle diameters on my 7's; .560 ish on my 18.5" FS in 7-08, .600" KS in 350 REM (the 350's have sights), .650" SS 300 SAUM, & .650 on my custom .416. The muzzle on my Kimber 84 Montana was .550" I am fairly certain they offered these in a 358 Win & 338 Federal.

Good information! What caliber is the Kimber 84 Montana you have?

[TXGunNut]

Technically they came in 338 Marlin Express and it was in the XLR. Ugly laminate stocks and I'm not a fan of stainless lever actions. In factory ammo the 338MX and 338 Federal are loaded to different levels. W/ reloading they are pretty much equals.

As much as I like my Marlins I couldn't warm up to that grey laminate look and stainless. I don't feel it's ugly, just can't take it home.

[GabbyM]

Yep Ben likes to show that No.1 now and then to see how many people kill there keyboard with Drool lol. :bigsmyl2:

As for .338 VS .358 I think as far as I know there are not that many bullets designed for its speed range VS the .358. And I am pretty darn positive that there are not nearly as many boolit designs as one can pick for the .358. I mean heck for the .358 you can pick from pistol bullets both jacketed and cast up to and probably beyond the 280Gr 358009.

A little reading. http://www.leverguns.com/articles/paco/358_wcf.htm

That's all very accurate with regard to bullet selection. But how many do you need? NOE has a 201 grain FN that fits the 338 Fed neck. Lee has a nice 220gr. bullet. IMHO it's the 1:10" twist in the standard 338 Federal rifles that hold the cartridge back as a cast boolit shooter. Even at that most who have one as is sure don't feel under gunned. After all a 220 grain Lee running 1950 fps is a lot of gun and I'd imagine feels like it. Downside would be the slower twist rate in the 338 Fed is jumping into untested waters and basically wildcatting.

[JesterGrin_1]

That's all very accurate with regard to bullet selection. But how many do you need? NOE has a 201 grain FN that fits the 338 Fed neck. Lee has a nice 220gr. bullet. IMHO it's the 1:10" twist in the standard 338 Federal rifles that hold the cartridge back as a cast boolit shooter. Even at that most who have one as is sure don't feel under gunned. After all a 220 grain Lee running 1950 fps is a lot of gun and I'd imagine feels like it. Downside would be the slower twist rate in the 338 Fed is jumping into untested waters and basically wildcatting.

To be honest I have no idea what twist rate would be needed for a .338 Federal cartridge. But I would be pretty confident that JESS could probably cut any twist one should desire.

And Gabby I am sure you are correct that the bullet selection for the .338 Federal may not be a downside for its use. But then again it all depends on what each individual feels is important to them.

For myself and bullet selection for the .358 Winchester I will probably only use a few different types. the .360-225 Gr which is close to the RCBS 200 exept a bit heavier,The 358009. And jacketed the Hornady 200 Gr FTX,Hornady 200Gr SP,Speer 250 Gr Grand Slam ( Hot-Core ).

But it is nice to know that should the need arise I can pick from many different Pistol bullets as well as rifle both in Cast and Jacketed.

With all that aside and after all of the reading I have done I am pretty darn positive that the .338 Federal is a fine hunting cartridge.

[MarkP]

Good information! What caliber is the Kimber 84 Montana you have?

243 Win It is my Daughter's rifle, she got her first deer with it in November.

[ballistim]

243 Win It is my Daughter's rifle, she got her first deer with it in November.

Thanks, and nice to get that first deer with such a nice gun, congrats to your Daughter.

[NoAngel]

Per your request in the title; Here's a list of reasons you should NOT build a .358 Win.

>1
>2
>3


Well dang....I got nothing.
Build it! The only thing you're gonna be mad about is all the time you wasted on all the other useless cartridges (by comparison) out there.

[MarkP]

Thanks, and nice to get that first deer with such a nice gun, congrats to your Daughter.

Thanks -- I got it for a terrific price. I had just dropped my Son off at a birthday party during a snow storm; since traffic was really slow I decided to stay in the area. To kill time, I did the logical thing and went to the gun store. I saw it in the rack and picked it up thinking it was a Model SEVEN stainless from the custom shop. I shouldered it and realized it had a short stock. About that time the salesperson came over and said he could make me a heck of a deal on it………. the wheels started turning. I got it for $670 including tax.

[ballistim]

Always have to appreciate those "right place, right time deals"!

[Smoke4320]

So All you guys with the JES rebores using 3 grooves in 358 Win Are you able to get a 200 Gr Bullet to 2200-2400 FPS accurately ? What Barrel length are you using to get that velocity

[turmech]

So All you guys with the JES rebores using 3 grooves in 358 Win Are you able to get a 200 Gr Bullet to 2200-2400 FPS accurately ? What Barrel length are you using to get that velocity
JES did a 3 groove re bore on my Remington 700 with a 22” barrel (243 in its past life). I worked up a load with 4064 to around 2350 fps with the RCBS 35-200. It did excellent this summer. Life got in the way and I did not shoot it much again until hunting season. I did geta flyer or two in the cold weather. I did not shoot it enough to really see if it was the gun, me, change in temp, my non annealed converted brass or what. It was sufficient for the ranges I was hunting and I left well enough alone. I have not got a chance on any game with it yet however. I still have a short late season coming so maybe I'll get lucky on that end.

[Smoke4320]

Turmech
Thanks for that response .. I am hoping to get 2400 FPS out of a 24" barrel accurately and have a Point Blank Range for 220 to 240 yds

Right now I have A NOE SC359-190 That will throw a 181-182 GR HP or a 190 FN .. If that will not group well I will get a RCBS 35-200 (for the second time) Like a real dumb@@@ I sold the RCBS mold to get the NOE for my 357 herrett..Which shoots the NOE VERY VERY well

[dragon813gt]

Buy the NOE clone of the RCBS mold. You won't be disappointed at it will drop them larger which is needed w/ the JES rebore.

[Smoke4320]

dragon813gt
Thanks for That tip
What are you sizing the bullets in the JES 358 rebore to ?

[JesterGrin_1]

I would think that if one is going to have JESS rebore a rifle you could request the bore dimensions.

Say .348-.358.

[waksupi]

So All you guys with the JES rebores using 3 grooves in 358 Win Are you able to get a 200 Gr Bullet to 2200-2400 FPS accurately ? What Barrel length are you using to get that velocity

Smoke, the .35 bores really like something in the 260+ gr. range. Burns powder more efficiently, and most stable bullet length, in my opinion.
I shoot them at around 2170 fps, have point blank to 225 yards.

[dragon813gt]

I would think that if one is going to have JESS rebore a rifle you could request the bore dimensions.

Say .348-.358.

From his site and mine is exactly this:
35 Cal 349 Bore-359 groove

I size mine to .360. The NOE mold drops them at .361. I've never had any RCBS molds but a lot of production molds drop undersized bullets. This is why I brought it up.

[Smoke4320]

Dragon813gt
I did see the sizes on his site.. You also know how that sometimes goes.. so wanted some real world end users to chime in with what they actually got .. Thanks for the response

[turmech]

I'm sizing the RCBS with a Lee 357 sizing die that I opened up to. 3595. My mold drops large enough to have resistance when being sized with the alloy I used which was WW + about 1.5% tin. YMMV however.

[dragon813gt]

Dragon813gt
I did see the sizes on his site.. You also know how that sometimes goes.. so wanted some real world end users to chime in with what they actually got .. Thanks for the response

Yeah, I know how that goes. His work is impeccable. And it's dead nuts on spec. The bores are like mirrors when they come back. I really need to send my Marlin to him. This thread isn't helping any :)

[ballistim]

Update on my earlier post, measured the end of the barrel on my Model 7 in 7mm/08 & it is .565, measured end of barrel on my Ruger M77 (tang safety) in .358 & it's .554, I should have checked it earlier (duh) so looks like next step is to contact JES to see if he rebores 7mm/08 to .358 Winchester.

[Smoke4320]

ballistim
my conversation with Jess was to turn a Rem 700 in 7/08 into a 358 win and he said that would be just fine

So I was here trying to get an idea on what barrel length, twist rate and # of grooves I should get to achieve the desired 2400 FPS and 225-250 MPBR
have about decided on 3 groove, 1:14 and 24"

[ballistim]

ballistim
my conversation with Jess was to turn a Rem 700 in 7/08 into a 358 win and he said that would be just fine

So I was here trying to get an idea on what barrel length, twist rate and # of grooves I should get to achieve the desired 2400 FPS and 225-250 MPBR
have about decided on 3 groove, 1:14 and 24"

Thanks for answering my question, and I know others have had exactly what you've decided on & have been very pleased. I might do the same. I have a 1:16 twist in my other .358 so I wanted either 1:12 or 1:14 twist in this one in case I want to use boolits heavier than 250 grains & only plan on using cast in both rifles. I do wish the bore was .358 and not .359 in JES rebores as my M77 slugged at .3575 so I'll have to size differently for each rifle. GB for a 220 grain MiHec Hunting Boolit that I've been waiting on for a while is supposed to drop at .359 so probably won't work with the JES rebore, I also just bought a NOE 360 230gr. RF (RD) & haven't had time to cast but am sure they will drop at least .360.

[Smoke4320]

Your mihec 220 will work if you powdercoat them.. You will gain 1.5 to 3 thou
Just a thought for you

[ballistim]

Your mihec 220 will work if you powdercoat them.. You will gain 1.5 to 3 thou
Just a thought for you

Good suggestion, kind of avoided powder coating so far, I know it works out for a lot of people but I still like shooting naked lead boolits, I know, kinda old school & silly but it is what it is..

[JesterGrin_1]

It may say that on his site. But I am sure if you personally speak with him he can change those dimensions since he is the one cutting the bores.

And just as an FYI he will also cut and crown the barrel to your desired length. I forget the charge for this but it should not be bad at all.

[QUOTE=dragon813gt;3071221]From his site and mine is exactly this:
35 Cal 349 Bore-359 groove

I size mine to .360. The NOE mold drops them at .361. I've never had any RCBS molds but a lot of production molds drop undersized bullets. This is why I brought it up.[/QUOTE

On a side note. E.R.Shaw Barrels for the .358 Winchester and 35 Whelen only come in the Magnum contour of which means they are pretty heavy. So if you wished to have a lighter barrel you would have to find another barrel maker that would produce a lighter contour.

I bring this up because I have had a .358 Winchester and a 35 Whelen Ackley Improved built with the E.R.Shaw Barrels and while they are very accurate rifles they tend to be heavy. Knowing what I know now I would have probably opted to find a good doner rifle with the barrel contour I liked and had JESS rebore and cut,crown the barrel for a lighter hunting rifle.

[Smoke4320]

Good suggestion, kind of avoided powder coating so far, I know it works out for a lot of people but I still like shooting naked lead boolits, I know, kinda old school & silly but it is what it is..

Just use clear pc ..that way nobody knows but you. The plus is no lubing and your bullets will be like new (no corrosion) for many years
Plus you get a thin hardness coating of 22-28 bhn

[303carbine]

I really like the 358, my 358 Win in a Ruger Hawkeye was foolishly sold and I have a million brass sized for it.
I am seriously considering sending my Remington 660 in 308 into get it bored to 358 Win.
I say do it, and happy shooting.
The 338 Fed is just about dead and buried, long live the 358 Winchester.[smilie=s:

[GabbyM]

I really like the 358, my 358 Win in a Ruger Hawkeye was foolishly sold and I have a million brass sized for it.
I am seriously considering sending my Remington 660 in 308 into get it bored to 358 Win.
I say do it, and happy shooting.
The 338 Fed is just about dead and buried, long live the 358 Winchester.[smilie=s:

LOL May be said that most of the better cast boolit shooting cartridges were declared, by rocking chair commandos, to be dead and buried decades ago.
Similar to the dead and gone 222 Rem in a new rifle I purchased last year. Any expert knows the 223 is a "Superior" cartridge, right.

358 Win has a lot going for it. Just seams a big hole to bore in a thin light sporter barrel. Either caliber with a precision cut chamber and barrel will make a great cast bullet hunting rifle. For bears I'd myself also go with the 358 to utilize the really big 260+ grain boolits waksupi referenced in his post above. If a fellow is looking to shoot 200 to 220 grain bullets. IMHO the 338 bore makes a better B.C. and S.D. boolit at that weight. Enough so that I think it's worth some discussion.

[9.3X62AL]

Thanks -- I got it for a terrific price. I had just dropped my Son off at a birthday party during a snow storm; since traffic was really slow I decided to stay in the area. To kill time, I did the logical thing and went to the gun store. I saw it in the rack and picked it up thinking it was a Model SEVEN stainless from the custom shop. I shouldered it and realized it had a short stock. About that time the salesperson came over and said he could make me a heck of a deal on it………. the wheels started turning. I got it for $670 including tax.

Hijo la! You DID get a fine deal on that rifle.

If there is a down-side to the 243 Winchester caliber, it would be its relatively short service life as an accurate barrel. I have a Rem 788 so chambered, and most of its shooting life has been spent as a varmint rig, either using cast RCBS 6mm-95-SP or the Hornady 75 grain V-Max. The Hornadys won out over the Sierra 85 HP, since they have been easier to get locally and shoot just as well. Tracking the rifle's service life by Boxes Of Redcoats Consumed, I am at the (roughly) 2200-round count point, and its grouping is starting to fall off just a bit. Maybe it is time to freshen its bore up a bit. The wise heads say that 1500 rounds is about the expected accuracy life of a 6mm barrel with a 308-sized boiler room behind it; maybe they are correct.

[303carbine]

My last 358 was a BLR, I chrono'ed the 225 grain Sierra BT at 2450 fps, that's enough bullet and speed for anything that walks around here.

[MarkP]

Hijo la! You DID get a fine deal on that rifle.

If there is a down-side to the 243 Winchester caliber, it would be its relatively short service life as an accurate barrel. I have a Rem 788 so chambered, and most of its shooting life has been spent as a varmint rig, either using cast RCBS 6mm-95-SP or the Hornady 75 grain V-Max. The Hornadys won out over the Sierra 85 HP, since they have been easier to get locally and shoot just as well. Tracking the rifle's service life by Boxes Of Redcoats Consumed, I am at the (roughly) 2200-round count point, and its grouping is starting to fall off just a bit. Maybe it is time to freshen its bore up a bit. The wise heads say that 1500 rounds is about the expected accuracy life of a 6mm barrel with a 308-sized boiler room behind it; maybe they are correct.

That sounds about right; Most of the rounds have been with cast loads (RCBS 95 gr & NOE 75 gr) and Trailboss or 65 gr Vmax with Trailboss. My 6-284 was showing signs at 800 ish, I have 1,000 + rounds in a 22-6mm and it still shoots quite well but I usually do not fire more than 5 to 7 shots with out letting it cool down. I did greatly diminish the 6-284's life due to one occasion; I got carried away at a South Dakota dog town, it was a hot sticky day with no wind, which is very rare. I could not miss that day and shot several rounds in succession. I normally would rotate rifles and let them cool and clean every 10 shots but I only had that rifle that day.