Ideal Antique 1881 mols and reloading tool

[retread]

Friend of mine asked if I wanted this old reloading tool he had. What a nice piece.

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One side says Ideal Mfg, Co. New Haven, Conn. The other side says Pat. Feb. 1, 1881 and Pat. Dec. 29, 1881

Cast, deprime, size, prime and seat. What a neat tool for the field.

[Janoosh]

What caliber.??
I have one in .38 special and have used it at the range. Obviously not the casting part, just the reloading part.

[retread]

44-40

[bedbugbilly]

Nice! I have an Ideal for 38 spl. (minus the mold but fixed seating chamber, primer, sizer). I use it once in a while just for fun and it does a decent job. Since mines the model that doesn't have the attached mold, I mold my boolits for it from an old Winchester 38 spl. mold. I was able to get my Ideal loader and that's what mainly got me interested in the 310 tools.

It's nice to do things "the old way" - every time I use mine I wonder how many others used it before I came to own it and what they were loading for.

Enjoy and thanks for sharing! Have a happy and safe holiday!

[MrWolf]

Just got this for 32l.
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Finding brass is gonna be the hard part.

[mac266]

Wasn't Ideal the forerunner of Lyman? Or bought by Lyman? Or something like that?

[Outpost75]

If you would like to sell the. 44-40 tool, pls. PM me.

[NoZombies]

I've got one for .32 Colt's New Police cartridge (.32 S&W long with a flat nose bullet) that I've used from time to time. Either the old guys were a lot tougher than me (entirely possible) or they wore some thick gloves when casting.

I've got a few others as well, but the one for the .32 NP is the nicest one in my collection, and also the one I've used the most.

[MrWolf]

Turns out mine is not for the 32 long colt but the 32 Ideal which is used for a Stevens44 and 44 1/2. Now I am going to have to get another rifle to use this mould with!

[Green Frog]

Wasn't Ideal the forerunner of Lyman? Or bought by Lyman? Or something like that?

Yes. Ideal was started by a man named Barlow who had worked for Winchester. After his passing, the company went through a couple of owners before being bought by Lyman, who up until that time had specialized in gunsights, especially target and high quality hunting sights. The Ideal name was still used on many of the reloading tools until well into the '50s or even later.

Froggie

[catskinner]

I've used the old Ideal tools with the attached mold and even wrapping the handles with leather and wearing gloves it is still a very hot job. Glad I did it though because it gives a real appreciation for how the old timers did it. I especially like the Winchester tools. I have a couple of Winchester 1894 tools and I feel they are easier to use than the Ideal.

[Green Frog]

I've used the old Ideal tools with the attached mold and even wrapping the handles with leather and wearing gloves it is still a very hot job. Glad I did it though because it gives a real appreciation for how the old timers did it. I especially like the Winchester tools. I have a couple of Winchester 1894 tools and I feel they are easier to use than the Ideal.

And those old timers had some really tough, calloused hands! ;) I've never tried it, but I've been told a good pair of welder's gloves will handle them pretty well, and if you know a racer, Nomex™ is some good stuff. :D

I've got both the mould and loading tool from Winchester ca 1894, and the loader is slow, but full length sizes. I don't notice that much difference in the moulds, all else being equal.

Froggie

[mold maker]

It should also be noted that the original users weren't producing thousands of bullets at a sitting.
These tools were also meant for field use, and I doubt carrying large volumes of lead was practical.

[cajun shooter]

If your loader is the 44WCF model, it's missing the decapper piece which is very common. As you can see these tools came with a nickel finish. The decapper piece is a small piece that looks like a football with a pin in one end. It's hard to find these pieces and they are expensive when you do. I found one for my tool about 5 years ago and paid $50 for it. You can at times see them on E-Bay in the antique tool section. My 44WCF loader has about 65% of the nickel left on the surface and the decapper is stored in the expanding piece. It has a screw holding the pin so that it may be replaced. My states it was made in 1884. Later David

[slumlord44]

Turns out mine is not for the 32 long colt but the 32 Ideal which is used for a Stevens44 and 44 1/2. Now I am going to have to get another rifle to use this mould with!
I already have the rifle if you want to part with itl

[.22-10-45]

I use a nickled Ideal tong tool marked .25-25-21 for bullet seating a .25-25 Stevens using bullets from Ideal moulds. This tool would also work with the shorter .25-21 Stevens ctg. Speaking of shorter...I needed to crimp some .38 long-colt ctgs., but a regular .38 spec. 3 die set will not work...unles you shorten die body. I found with the .38 Spec. Ideal/Lyman tong tools..since there is no shellholder in the way..you can run seating/crimping die down & crimp the shorter long/short colt.

[bedbugbilly]

2210-45 . . . . I load quite a few 38 Short and 38 Long as well . . . the "short" was the problem for me with the 310 but I was able to accumulate some different individual dies - a couple were shortened with the appearance for being used with the 38 Colt short.

In regards to loading those on a press with standard dies - I finally broke down and bought a set of Lee 38 Colt Short Long dies and set them up on their own turret plate for my Lee 4 hole classic. One thing you might consider if you are loading the short and long (although you have the long figured out for the crimp) . . . I taper crimp the short and the long. Yea, I know, straight walled is supposed to be roll crimped. Right now, I'm using a 120ish RN out of a Ideal 358242 mold - as cast. I'm using a 9 mm taper crimp die to put the crimp on them. I'm not shooting "hot" loads - just plinking loads and these work well in my Ruger NV and my Uberti Bisley - the taper crimp is enough to hold the slug - no "jump" from other chambers being fired. And, while it may be just me, I'm thinking the wear and tear on the case mouth is less than the roll crimp so am hoping the casings last a few rounds more than usual.

Prior to getting the Lee Short/Long die set . . I used a 38 FL die, a 9mm expander die with the expander switched out and the 9mm seating & crimp. I have to admit thought that loading any of the 38 cartridges is much more rewarding for me to do in the 310 set and the old Ideal steel tongs I have - whether it be smokeless or black. A '72 "open top" Uberti is on the want list and for that, I'm really looking forward to using the old tongs tools as much as I can. Yea . . it may be slower but it sure is relaxing and fun . . and it makes you appreciate the basic type of equipment our grandfather's used.

[.22-10-45]

That 72' open top sounds like fun! I installed a Kirst .38 colt conversion cyl. in my 1972 era Colt 1851 navy .36 percussion. Couldn't bring myself to cut into that beautiful case hardening..so cyl' is removed for reloading. I do have to use hollow-base or heeled bullets. I had Old West make up a heeled hollow-base..haven't yet tried them out yet.