Dan Wesson revolver barrel intended for lead bullets?

[oley55]

I have been concentrating on resolving some leading issues with my 80's version 44mag Ruger Redhawk but am on hold waiting for sizing dies and etc.

In the mean time, last night I decided to slug the cylinder throats and original 80's vintage barrels (ported stainless and plain steel presumed to be chrome moly steel), of my 8", Blued Dan Wesson Model 44.

the cylinders pin gauged and slugged at .4299". two cylinders would not allow the pin to pass all the way thru the throat. some light lapping with 1200 grit paper on a dowel fixed that.

the ported SS barrel slugged at: .4276, .4276, .4277, .4278.
the non-ported steel barrel slugged at: .4296, .4296, .4298, .4299.

By chance or intentionally , these barrels seem to be specifically sized for jacketed and lead bullets. Also, per my original instructions, they warn against using lead bullets in the ported SS barrel due to lead flowing into the ports. (And I suspect ultimately soldering the barrel to the shroud.)

I have on hand 450+ of SNS Casting's Hi-Tek coated 240 gr RNFP bullets sized to .430". These SNS bullets are 92/6/2 alloy with a Brinell of 16-17. I successfully passed these bullets thru all six cylinders. They required a little pushing but all passed without any scraping or removal of coating.

I gotta say I'm pretty excited about being able to start blasting away with these cheaper than jacketed bullets. I shoot 44mag hand cannons because I just like it, and do not want to load/shoot sissy loads. I am hoping to be able to push these coated bullets up to 1500fps.

Based on numbers of rounds fired, the non-vented barrel is essentially brand new as I had hardly used it over these many years. Although there are no constrictions in the barrel, I'm thinking I should fire lap/polish it with some fine 800 grit lapping compound before I even start playing with loads. I'm also thinking the super fine 1200 grit is too fine and will likely create a leading problem rather than prevent it.

thoughts or recommendations?

[rockrat]

Didn't have any leading with my 357max or 445sm DW barrels.

[runfiverun]

none of my DW's have a problem with lead alloy's.
I have the usual suspects like 357 and 357 max, 44, and 445 super, 375 etc.
I do use a gas check in the ported barrels.
normal sizing works just fine [shrug]

[missionary5155]

Greetings
Another DW shooter since 1978. DW's were made right... generally. There are a few that got out and were lemons. But I have shot my own cast all those years and it is hard to beat a DW . Remember to do the basics in setting that barrel up right and you will wear out your smiler.
Sadly I cannot have one down here with me. But at least when up north there they are waiting in storage to see light and powder again.
Mike in Peru

[Big Boomer]

I have had a number of revolvers and pistols over the years and the only revolvers that did not have a barrel constriction were the Dan Wessons. However, as a matter of course, I always check the cylinder (chamber) throats for size, honing them out if necessary, and use LBT's compound to firelap all my pistols and revolvers regardless. They just shoot better, more accurately afterward. Follow Veral's instructions to the letter and you will do well. A smooth barrel is a superior barrel, providing excellent accuracy, assuming cylinder alignment is up to snuff and that chambers are straight with the barrel. Too, by so smoothing the barrel, fewer "break-in" rounds are required. In years gone by, old timers used to attempt this by shooting a lot of jacketed stuff but is not now necessary by simply, carefully firelapping the revolver or pistol. Use unsized brass that is slightly belled to accept unsized boolits larger than your lands/groove dimensions that have been rolled in the lap material on a steel or glass plate to take the lap material embedded into the sides of the boolits. Seat the lapped, soft (10-12 BHN), unsized boolits as far as you can seat them in the case by hand with a piece of dowel rod over light charges of a fast (read Bullseye, W231, etc.) powder - just enough to get the lapped boolit out the end of the barrel is all that is necessary. Make sure each round actually exits the barrel. After two complete rounds of the cylinder, thoroughly clean the cylinder and barrel (or 10-12 rounds through the barrel in the case of a semi-auto) to make sure no lead is in the barrel and repeat until finished, checking to see how much change the lap is effecting after each shooting session with the lapped boolits. Remember that a lap works better early, less well later, so a properly lapped barrel will have a choke-bore, meaning slightly larger dimensions at the cylinder/forcing cone/chamber area and slightly smaller dimensions as you move toward the muzzle, which is most desirable. The other way around is a disaster. I would not hesitate to shoot the PC boolits in a DW. You will simply be ahead to lap it first. If you have trouble getting the shroud off the barrel due to lead buildup using non powder-coated boolits in a vented barrel, just remove the front barrel nut and carefully shoot a few rounds to yank the shroud off the barrel via recoil. I did write carefully, meaning with calculation and hanging onto the shroud to keep it from going airborne. Stainless steel revolver and pistol barrels require a larger number of lapping boolits because stainless steel is simply tougher, more difficult to lap. Big Boomer

[Mohillbilly]

DW has a leg up on other guns that have a choke in the bore , where they screw the barrel to the frame . Mostly DW needs a smoothed bore and a slight taper breech to muzzle . If the throats are correct and the boolits the proper size , and the lube adequate , DW s shoot like a house afire .

[oley55]

frankly I remain amazed that two barrels manufactured at the same time (early to mid 80s) seem to be purposefully sized to accommodate jacketed or lead bullets. or just chance....

[DR Owl Creek]

I have a Dan Wesson 744VH Hunter Pack, with four barrels (4" compensated, 6", 8", and 8" with scope mounted). I've used cast lead bullets without gas checks in all but the 4" compensated barrel, and they were all dead-nuts accurate with no leading. I don't have any .44 moulds using gas checks, so I haven't tried cast in that one because of the expansion chamber with the recessed barrel nut.

Dave

[oley55]

Use unsized brass............". Seat the lapped, soft (10-12 BHN), unsized boolits as far as you can seat them in the case by hand with a piece of dowel rod over light charges of a fast (read Bullseye, W231, etc.) powder - just enough to get the lapped boolit out the end of the barrel is all that is necessary. Big Boomer

I may be getting confused but I thought I read some where you want to seat the bullet as far out as possible, as opposed to deeper in the case. Perhaps the longer seating method is for addressing the thread choke which is not an issue with DW's.

I have some NECO bullet lapping compounds in hand and have a lapping kit from beartooth on the way along with soft unsized lapping bullets. I assume the bullets will be about 250-260 grains, and that I should size them to .430 to match the cylinder throat's .4299"?


I will be using Titegroup (#9 on the Lyman burn chart) which is faster than W231 (#21) but slower than Bullseye (#4). Minimum starting load for Titegroup under a 255gr bullet is 8.1gr. So for fire lapping purposes where should I start, 4gr, 6gr or what? Standard or magnum primers?

Also I assume determining a suitable lapping load should be tested under unlapped bullets to insure they are clearing the barrel.



thanks in advance, Oley

[runfiverun]

4 grs of titegroup will poke a boolit out of my 41 mag at about 750 fps.

in this situation the efficiency will of course drop along with the speed, and that is what you want.
you just want enough speed when fire lapping to get the boolit out of the barrel.
a standard primer will be fine.

read the part about unsized brass again.
you are just poking the lapping compound coated boolit into the [unsized] case and [barely] shooting it out the end of the barrel.

fire a cylinder and clean everything up then do the next series.
I also wouldn't go any finer than 600 grit in the barrel.
and take a dowell along.

[oley55]

fire a cylinder and clean everything up then do the next series.
I also wouldn't go any finer than 600 grit in the barrel.
and take a dowell along.

my NECO compounds are 220, 400, 800, and 1200 grits. Beartooth is 320 grit. which do I go with and why is finer than 600 bad?

[runfiverun]

too slick..
the barrel needs to have a little roughness, if it's too polished it just loses it's edge.
they used to worry about roughing barrels back up [after the cloth patches smoothed them out] to shoot well again.

[sw282]

l have become quite fond of TiteGroup since great powder shortage of recent years.. 5.5gr propels a 215gr RCBS swc @ 1050fps from my Mod 657 quite nicely

[oley55]

too slick..
the barrel needs to have a little roughness, if it's too polished it just loses it's edge.
they used to worry about roughing barrels back up [after the cloth patches smoothed them out] to shoot well again.

since I have no access to 600 grit, I guess my plan looks like cleaning after each full cylinder and firing 12 rounds with 220, followed by 24 rounds with 400. then color it done? but I will wait until the Beartooth compound arrives to see what their instructions look like.

[runfiverun]

I'd look over their instructions for sure.
the grit breaks down as it goes down the barrel so you hopefully get a bit of a taper to the barrel.
I have seen several DW barrels that are already this way, but they have a parallel piece at the end or just a hint of a reverse taper for the last inch or so.
I assume it's for the porting system they use and all the barrels were cut this way even though they weren't ported.

[Big Boomer]

fiverunfive: could you explain that "reverse taper" ... never saw that. Big Boomer