I would like to get harder.

[xr650]

I am casting LEE C501-440-RF. These are 50 cal 440 gr. Gas check.
I would like a hard boolit.

About 3 weeks ago I cast some WW.
As cast are 7-8 Saeco (12 BHN).
Water dropped are 9-10 Saeco (19 BHN).

1 week ago I cast some 9 WW : 1 50/50
As cast are 7-8 Saeco.
Water dropped 7-8 Saeco.

The WW are from 2 different smelting lots.
The water I used to drop these was just above freezing.

I am cornfused. :veryconfu
Will the 9:1 get harder as they age?
Is there enough difference in the 2 lots of WW to esplain this?
Should I get some antimony to mix in?

Can you make the voices go away? [smilie=1:

[DLCTEX]

Maybe ******? Dale Seriously, ww composition can vary extremely from batch to batch, particularly if you bought ingots from someone who smelted them for sale. Besides the differences from manufacturer to maufacturer there may be stick-ons mixed in in varying amounts. My opinion is that your batch is close to pure lead. Tin will help fillout, but to properly harden you may have to and arsenic (most easily done by adding something with it alloyed in, like lead shot).

[randyrat]

Did you give them 48 hrs to age before you tested. Try testing again. Or you ended up with softer alloy.

[Adam10mm]

but to properly harden you may have to add arsenic (most easily done by adding something with it alloyed in, like lead shot).
I thought antimony was for hardness and the trace of arsenic was for heat treating?

[xr650]

Dale,
Will it make me go blind? :twisted:
Is all lead shot comparable in composition?
I smelted these myself. I hand picked the stick ons out.

Randy,
I cast these 3 weeks and 1 week ago respectively.
I hardness tested this evening.
Is 48 hrs. a standard for aging?

I appreciate any thoughts.

[Adam10mm]

Will it make me go blind?


It will probably fall off.

[felix]

Arsenic will harden lead, just like antimony. Antimony will make the boolit grow and arsenic will not. Arsenic is not required to make lead heat-treatable; unless the lead, antimony, tin combo is close to the zero slush stage like genuine lino. Impurities are required to knock the alloy off from the zero slush composition. ... felix

[DLCTEX]

My water dropped wheel weight boolits are harder immediately, and after a week are difficult to push through the sizer-lubricator. I dry and size-lube as quickly as possible. Dale

[Lloyd Smale]

as was said your 5050 will not make your bullets harder. If anything they will be softer as half of that mix is pure lead. If you need harder then what your getting you will need to oven temper your bullets.

[WKAYE]

By adding 10% 50/50 you've made your tin content higher than the antimony. This was the old formula Lyman gave for making #2 but it is about 30 years out of date. Back then WW's use to be around 6% antimony, now they're 2-3%. Now you know what happens to an alloy when tin content surpasses antimony. :(

[hunter64]

I did a little experiment my self when I bought my Lee hardness tester. One week before Christmas I made 4 different bullet compositions.
1. 1/2 WW and 1/2 PB air cooled
2. 9lbs WW and 1 lb 50/50 air cooled
3.same water cooled
4. same heat treated.

I tested these yesterday so almost exactly two months later.

1. was for a hollow point mold that I use in my .38/.357 snub nose that has worked great for me and I always wanted to know the bhn number. It came out as 8 bhn when I tested it 48 hours after pouring and stayed an 8 2 months later.

2. 48 hours was 10 bhn and 2 months it was 12 bhn
3. 48 hours was 14 bhn and 2 months later it was 19
4. 48 hours was 24 bhn and 2 months later it was 31

I always size and lube my bullets right after they are poured, the same day anyways.

[Freightman]

I size right after but my lube sizer is broke and it has been a month since I ordered the parts from Lyman, they say they will have the parts and ship next week. So I ordered some LEE sizersfor the sizes I need, I had cast some 500g 45 boolits amonth ago right before I broke the sizer ran them through the LEE sizer, I sit down to do this most of the time not this time had to stand to get enough leaverage to size.
Sure wish Lyman would actually ship my parts. No they haven't charged my debit card yet.

[xr650]

Thanks for all the help.
You all are a wealth of info.

I am going to try oven HT and cast some more with shot.

[xr650]

I tried a different alloy. The help and knowledge you folks empart is amazing.

Alloy) 7WW + 1-9:1 + 1 heaping serving spoon lead shot

Day of cast 02/16/08 As Cast: 7 Saeco Water Dropped: 8 Saeco

48 hrs. 02/18/08 As Cast: 7 Saeco Water Dropped: 10 Saeco(22 BHN)

I am happy with these results. If they will toughen up a'lil more with age, I will dance in the street.
Well OK, maybe in my garage. Let us knot get carried away. :)