Dual pane windows, can they be vented?

[JSnover]

I have some with failed seals, so they're fogging inside between the panes. Replacement is out of the question at the moment. Hiring someone to drill/clean/treat them is not what I would call cheap. I know there are kits you can buy to DIY but the ones I've seen so far cost about $150 from some company in England.
I have some 2mm diamond drills. If I put a small hole in one bottom corner of the inside pane and another in one top corner of the same pane, would the window be able to breathe well enough to reduce the problem until spring?

[starnbar]

I think you will find they will fog anyway once the humidity in the house gets in the air space between the panes.

[Plate plinker]

I have some rocks you could borrow.

Just kidding I don't know but would imagine that would help a lot.
What brand and type of window are they?

[Handloader109]

I've had just replace mine in the past.

[JSnover]

Not sure what brand, they were installed about 15 years ago by the previous owner.

[JSnover]

I'm sure venting wouldn't be perfect but at this point the condensation is dribbling down the insides, looks like hell. I may try it anyway since there isn't much to lose.

[Sweetpea]

That doesn't fix anything, it just makes it look better.

You will be left with water spots in between the panes.

What brand of windows? Any chance they are under warranty?

[fishhawk]

I think what i would try is this. Take window apart enough to get at the seals on the side and use silicon calk and reseal all around. Then on a upper corner drill a small hole and if you have one of the CO2 dischargeres for a muzzle loader fill the inside with CO2 and seal the hole.

[Sweetpea]

I think what i would try is this. Take window apart enough to get at the seals on the side and use silicon calk and reseal all around. Then on a upper corner drill a small hole and if you have one of the CO2 dischargeres for a muzzle loader fill the inside with CO2 and seal the hole.

A decent idea, but the silicone won't stick to the butyl, and the chances are that it won't stick to the edges of the glass.

The best bet is to replace the glass unit, anything else is putting lipstick on a pig.

[JSnover]

I kinda figured as much...

[Sweetpea]

Somewhere on the inside of the window, (unless it's been removed), there should be an AAMA sticker (silver or gold).

It will have a code for the window manufacturer, which you can look up.

Sometimes the window manufacturers will do a one-time warranty service, even if the windows are out of warranty.

Doesn't hurt to check.

[6bg6ga]

Try Lexel it sticks to about everything.

[JSnover]

Somewhere on the inside of the window, (unless it's been removed), there should be an AAMA sticker (silver or gold).

It will have a code for the window manufacturer, which you can look up.

Sometimes the window manufacturers will do a one-time warranty service, even if the windows are out of warranty.

Doesn't hurt to check.
Certainly worth a phone call!

[Petrol & Powder]

I like the idea of replacing the damp air between the panes with something dry, like CO2. Not sure how to go about doing that.

[JSnover]

At my last job I could have brought an argon bottle home, purged them and plugged the holes. Of course, since they already leak it wouldn't last long.

[Plate plinker]

Vinyl or wood windows? Maybe a photo would be nice.

[Plate plinker]

I have a place around the corner that sells double payne glass minus the sash if needed.

[shooter93]

Look down in the corners of the glass panes for the manufactures name. If it's Anderson you're still under warranty and they will ship the new ones right to your house. Easy to change. When I built I had some of the first argon filled windows and many have gone bad. happened right after warranty but Anderson has been very good about getting me replacements this coming Spring.

[William Yanda]

jSnover
What have you got to loose? The thing is, it is next to impossible to reestablish the seal. If you drill holes and attempt to seal them, the original leak still exists. If you make more or larger holes at the top you will encourage airflow from the bottom to the top. Try it and see if that doesn't dry it out. Or, working on a dry day, seal them with tape which you can peel off.

[bullet maker 57]

How about putting up plastic on the inside to stop moist air from getting to the glass. Creates a dead air space.

[Ehaver]

If they are not under warranty, dont mess with it until you can buy some new ones.


What if are drilling you break both panes?

[paul h]

I like the idea of replacing the damp air between the panes with something dry, like CO2. Not sure how to go about doing that.

I'd be real cautious about putting a pressurized gas between the panes, too much pressure too soon and kapow!

I'd just live with it until you can afford to replace them. I'm all for DIY repairs, but some things just need to be done in a factory with proper equipment, I'd put sealed dual pain windows in that department.

Also having replaced original wood pained windows with vinyl, we found the new windows much less drafty and in time they'll pay for themselves in savings in the heating bill. Make sure you squirt foam insulation around the window frame opening when you've finished mounting the new window.

[bushboy]

If you use spray/squirt foam around the window frame, make sure it is the NON-expanding type otherwise you'll probably never be able to open those windows again. I've seen it too many times from people who don't know the difference.

[Sweetpea]

If you use spray/squirt foam around the window frame, make sure it is the NON-expanding type otherwise you'll probably never be able to open those windows again. I've seen it too many times from people who don't know the difference.

Yep, I come from a background in insulation, and now specialize in windows and doors.

The junk you can buy at the hardware store is just that, JUNK!

[dragon813gt]

How old are they and what brand. You can replace just the sashes if they are somewhat new. If they're double hung it's a five minute job at most.

[geargnasher]

Install drapes until you can replace the windows.

Gear

[CastingFool]

+ on this. I have some Andersen windows in my house, that were installed by the previous owner. One of them started fogging up, and I contacted Andersen. they sent me a brand new sash at no cost to me. All I had to do was install it.




Somewhere on the inside of the window, (unless it's been removed), there should be an AAMA sticker (silver or gold).

It will have a code for the window manufacturer, which you can look up.

Sometimes the window manufacturers will do a one-time warranty service, even if the windows are out of warranty.

Doesn't hurt to check.

[MaryB]

Friend used the high expanding foam around a door he replaced. He told me he had used it before and it worked just fine with no issues. Yeah right, door wouldn't open because it bowed the frame into the door. he had to cut and scrape out all that old foam, put in new screws and patch the holes where the first ones had sunk in to far from the foam pressure...

[JSnover]

No tags. They're vinyl. I'll poke around and see how easy it is to get inside them this weekend. Someone asked about the drills. I have some 2mm diamond bits from some artsy stuff I used to do. I know for a fact they will drill glass without breaking it.
Replacement is definitely the best option but it won't happen before spring

[GhostHawk]

I had the same problem as the OP several years back. Mine were built in such a way that when one got bad enough eventually I pulled it apart, separated the glass, cleaned totally inside and out. But the problem is once that seal goes there simply is no way to keep condensation from building up inside.

Best I could do was swap a couple from area's we don't use to the high traffic area's.

Eventually I was able to get a zero interest, zero payment loan from the city I live in that goes away after 10 years.

Essentially designed to bring older houses up to current code, and keep seniors living in their houses longer.

Windows all got replaced 1.5 years back, new doors, new steps, and a totally rebuilt bathroom with a walk in shower instead of tub.
It is truly flat, and incredibly solid, plus came with grab bars etc. I had to do a minor bit of replumbing afterwards. I had my old shower rigged with 2 shower heads and a valve to control the second. What can I say? I scrub her back and she scrubs mine!

All in all 22k of work (including some lead abatement)

Best part is the new windows came with lifetime replacement Guarantee on the glass.

One way or another, find a way to replace those windows. Cut our fuel bill in half having new energy efficient windows all around.

[Plate plinker]

Have you check the sides of the sash for a manufacturers mark? If the frames are in good shape you might get new sashes and be done with a small headache.

[JSnover]

The weather has been crappy, or I would have got down to business with them this week. Since they're eventually going to be replaced anyway, I decided a little careful tinkering would be interesting.

[Plate plinker]

Cool go for it.

[Sweetpea]

Be careful for sure.

I am an Installation Master ( a certification, not just what I call myself ), and still break glass and cut myself from time to time...

[freebullet]

If you can remove the pane from the sash you can fix them.

Don't drill the glass the risk vs reward is poor.

With the pane out you can simply cut the old sealant off seperate the pains and clean everything. You can use windshield urethane sealant around the edge. Most auto parts stores sell a low grade of it. If there are any auto glass shops near you they'd sell you a tube, but make sure you get a kind that doesn't require heat. That stuff don't wash of easily. Problem is most vinyl windows are welded together. You may have to cut the sash at 2 corners to slide the pane out. You could hollow out those 2 corners to fit a small wood block in so you can screw the sash back together.

I worked with glass for years and wouldn't see any reason to drill it. It might work without breaking the glass and that's a big maybe. It's unlikely 1 little hole is going to let all the humidity out. If you did get a bunch of holes it might could work but even then you can't clean between the panes and the resulting dry grunge is an ugly sight too. In addition it will let in more cold air.

Before I would drill it I would simply break the inside pane of glass out. Using pliers around the outside edge to make sure the sharp edges are gone. At least you could clean it and it wouldn't re-fog.

[Sweetpea]

I've yet to see a vinyl window that you had to hack apart to get the glass out.

Generally there will be vinyl strips on either the inside or the outside.

On the opposite side, the glass unit will be either wet set (silicone) or hopefully a foam tape. Use a putty knife to cut the seal, and then remove the plastic strips. Glass will be easily removed.

One thing, though...

If the glass has a LowE coating, it doesn't matter what you try to do to fix it, the coating will turn into a purple haze due to the moisture.

There is a dessicant in the spacer between the panes to keep this from happening, but it really only helps to dry the air that was sealed in at the factory.

[JSnover]

Thanks for all the info. I'm not expecting a permanent fix, just a way to temporarily clear them. These don't have divided panes, so it's not as if I can just take out one piece.

[jsizemore]

Instead of drilling the glass, drill the aluminum spreader between the panes. Drill it big enough you can pour some desicant into the space between the panes and seal with some caulk. Maybe it will buy you some time. It might take 2 or 3 times to remove the moisture. When the desicant turns pink, it's time to reapply. Maybe drill near the corner so draining it is easier. A new coat of butyl caulk around the edge may help too.

[lunicy]

I have experience in this:
What we have done for the management companies:
Remove the insulated unit from the sash.
Seal around the unit real good. Don't remember what caulk we used, but it's in the window isle at home depot. Dried pretty quick too.
Drilled two holes in the aluminum between the 2 windows
Run warm, dry air through one of the holes (removing any moisture)
run argon through the hole. If you drill the two holes on top, argon will fill the window (argon is heavier than air)
seal.

[JSnover]

Well, I did it. The missus couldn't stand the way they looked and the weather was still too cold to take them apart so I went with the simplest fix first: drilled a 2mm hole at the bottom left corner and another at the top right corner on the inside pane about a month ago. I ran the drill in a Dremel at low speed, gently, dipping the bit into an ice cube occasionally to cool it.
At first it made no difference. Last week when the weather warmed up the windows cleared. The holes are almost invisible.
One of these days they will be replaced but for now I'm satisfied. In the summer when the humidity is 90% and it rains cats and dogs, maybe they'll fog up again... In the meantime I can push that item to the bottom of the HoneyDo list.