Can I apply stain after BLO??

[RustyReel]

Have a fairly plain Mauser Viscount stock that I am refinishing. The original finish had turned a bit orange as these tend to do, so I stripped it off. I knew at the time the wood did not have much color to it but I thought the BLO would darken it up a bit. After four coats of BLO the wood is still quite white. Is it possible to stain a stock between applications of BLO??

If so, oil based or water based stain??

I assume there is no way of stripping the current coats of BLO off and starting from scratch...or is there??

Thanks for your help!

[CastingFool]

I once refinished the stock on an old double barrel shotgun. After stripping the finish, the pistol grip was very dark compared to the rest of the stock, due to overzealous lubrication over the years. I was able to "bleach" it out by wiping it with alcohol repeatedly. I would wipe it down and let it dry, then repeat. I used up a pint or so of alcohol if memory serves me right. I have never applied stain over BLO, so I'm not sure how it would turn out. I think I would try oil based stain in a small spot to see how it works, but that won't give you a true indication how it would look on the whole stock. It may be splotchy, due to uneven penetration.

[GhostHawk]

Doubt you'll get any result your happy with trying to stain after its already sealed with BLO.

I have been using "Old English Oil, Dark" as a darkening oil finish additive. At this point it isn't going to hurt to try it.
Cause if you don't like the way it comes out you will be stripping back to bare wood anyway.

I have used it in moderation directly with True oil but get far better results by applying it until it is just almost a touch dark and steel wool until I'm happy with the color and feel. Then BLO or True Oil.

[gnoahhh]

You don't mention what species of wood the stock is made of. That will have a bearing on the how well it'll take a stain. Generally, walnut stocks don't need staining, unless one wants to put a red tinge to it. I'm guessing you have a birch/beech/maple stock since you remark about its whiteness?

Typical hardware store stains are simply oils with fine color pigments mixed in and probably will fit right into your BLO regimen. Give it a try, can't hurt. (Best stains are actually dyes, and do need to go on before the finish.) Heck, you might even try mixing some of your stain in with some BLO for some more coats.

Be forewarned though, that if it is any of the woods I mentioned your results may be a bit blotchy regardless of whether the stain goes on before or after. Such woods need to be conditioned first to guarantee even-ness of color. (Minwax Conditioner works pretty good. You can even mix a very very dilute mixture of Elmer's Glue and water, and paint it on, let dry, stain.)

Sometimes it's better to ask these questions before rushing into the unknown!

[RustyReel]

Sometimes it's better to ask these questions before rushing into the unknown!

I think that is what I just did, didn't I?? Anyway, did a lot of web searches and also saw references to adding stain to the BLO. Sounds reasonable. I'm going to give that a shot when it warms up a bit.

The wood is supposedly a lower grade walnut. Looks like it has a lot of sap wood in it, which is what I'm calling the white....one complete side of the forestock from the trigger forward. Rest of the stock has sort of a mild walnut color.

Don't think I have too much to lose. I may not like the results but I don't like the way it is now, so will just have something different to dislike.

Thanks for all the advice everyone!!

[gnoahhh]

I think that is what I just did, didn't I??

My statement didn't come out right. I intended it to compliment you on asking before going off half cocked!

I would try the stain on just the sap wood, so as to blend it in. By applying stain over the whole stock you will probably end up with a two tone brown stock.

[Mk42gunner]

In my experience, you are going to have to strip the BLO off before you have any chance of matching the sapwood to the rest of the stock. I had a lot of trouble getting a sapwood streak to match on the replacement stock for my Grandpa's Remington Model 41 that one of my nephews broke.

The good news is that BLO comes off or out pretty easily with acetone.

Robert

[22cf45]

I always stain over finish, never on raw wood. It is too easy to lose control on what's happening when I've stained raw wood, some areas soak up more than others then you've got a mess. I don't know what BLO is but I assume its some kind of sealer. It order to do this, I use Laurel Mountain stains which are alcohol based. I found it fairly easy to match sap wood streaks to the rest of the stock when needed. Normally, I use their Walnut and/or American Walnut stains. I apply the stain when the stock is nearly finished, needing only a coat or two to finish it up.
Phil

[nekshot]

if you have some white wood that won't darken take a sharpie black or dark brown and put a little on (a dap) and dip your finger in stain and gently rub on sharpie mark. If you don't like it use your stain to wipe it off. The longer you wait after magic marker applied the deeper and harder the stain will spread, its kinda like art and fun once you get the hang of it.

[Col4570]

Potassium Permanganate crystals in water can sometimes overcome impregnated finishes.it might be worth trying.It gives a nice dark red colour and then followed by your finishing oil.Keep it clear of clothing and furniture,it will not come off.If you get it on your hands use household bleach.to remove it.The pott permang will not harm your hands.It was used as pink water for troops with trench foot.Usualy stocked at Pharmacies.

[paul h]

At this point your option is to add a die to your linseed oil and apply additional coats. (I assume BLO is boiled linseed oil). You can either mix in some oil based paint to your oil, or add an analine die to the oil. It won't be as dramatic as staining bare wood, but you should be able to get the color you're after with some testing. You'll probably have to go with a darker pigment than you'd expect to get the affect you're after.

[nekshot]

Potassium Permanganate crystals in water can sometimes overcome impregnated finishes.it might be worth trying.It gives a nice dark red colour and then followed by your finishing oil.Keep it clear of clothing and furniture,it will not come off.If you get it on your hands use household bleach.to remove it.The pott permang will not harm your hands.It was used as pink water for troops with trench foot.Usualy stocked at Pharmacies.
I am gonna try that for sure! any thing that takes wood the direction of red is a God sent!

[RustyReel]

This is the fourth gunstock I have done with Boiled Linseed Oil (aka BLO). The other three went well as the wood was a better quality. All the other gunstock finishing/refinishing I have done was done with Tru-Oil. I like the look of the old classic sporters so thought I would give the BLO a try on the last few stocks. This one started out with quite a bit of sap wood and I overestimated the darkening effect the BLO would have.

I've been doing a lot of interweb research on BLO and there apparently seems to be a bit of confusion. I've seen it stated several times that BLO offers no moisture protection and a BLO finished stock will soak up water like a sponge. Hummmm And other references said you could mix water based stain with the BLO. (Guess I was sleeping during that 6th grade Science class). Another Hummmm

The only stain I currently have is what is remaining of an old, and well loved, bottle of G96 water bases Red Maple stain. I think this came from an old muzzleloader kit. I really like the color and the stain has been extended (and weakened) over time as I add a little water now and then.

Soooo, if a BLO treated stock will soak up water seems to me it should soak up a water based stain. Right? Gave it a try....beaded up and ran off like water off a ducks back. So much for that soak up water thing. Next I tired mixing some of this stain into the BLO. It actually seemed to work in the cup as mixing it seemed to incorporate the two. When I put it on the stock it seems all the stain stayed on the patch I was using and only the BLO went on the stock. This morning the stain and oil were separated.

So, gotta pick up some oil based stain and give that a try. I don't want to sand the stock so worst case I'll live with it. Should be easy to find in the deep dark recesses of a gunsafe.

[Col4570]

Raw Linseed Oil after staining puddled on the Timber with some Terebin Paint Driers is my favourite finish.Allow to soak in for 10 minutes,wipe off most of the mixture then palm the surface in a circular motion.This will give an oiled finish that can be revived at any time should the surface look sad.Varnishes look good but are on the surface and scratch easily so I go for the oil finish where you can actualy feel the penetrated wood.A little White Spirit added will assist the penetration.

[dikman]

One of the old traditional finishes, I've read, is equal parts BLO, pure gum turpentine and beeswax (just thought you might be interested). I've been experimenting with rubbing (polishing) the stock using one of those oscillating multi-tools with a lambswool pad, as the hand-rubbing bit was hard on my hand, plus I'm not keen on getting that stuff on my skin. Seems to be working. I started with the mix I mentioned, which didn't look too bad, but then I had to buy some pure Tung oil to treat a wooden seat, so thought I'd try it over the mix. I wiped the stock with turps first, then applied the Tung oil, let it soak for 15 minutes and then rubbed the stock with 1200 grit wet and dry paper, using the oil on the wood as a lubricant. It makes a very fine slurry which fills the pores of the wood. Wipe it off, then start buffing. Apply a light coat of oil overnight, wipe off and buff. Apply more oil, wipe off and buff. The stock feels like glass, is getting a nice satin sheen and has a slight glow to it. I'm quite impressed with my new-found skills :lol:.

Perhaps this may be of some use to you, even though it doesn't answer your question about staining.

[fouronesix]

If the original wood has had any number or types of finishes applied and likely some of them have penetrated, most any water or alcohol based stain will continue to bleed out over time when followed with oil finish like BLO. The oil simply carries some of the stain to the surface as the stain will never completely bind to the wood because of the previous finishes that have penetrated the wood. Even if you can get an oil based stain to penetrate, it too will migrate to some degree carried by the finish oil to the surface. Of course, as the oil finish continues to age, dry and "polymerize", aided by continual periodic rub down, the migration of stain will become less and less over time.

[Zouave 58]

I have found that a product called Transtint sold for furniture makers works very well. Its an alcohol based aniline dye that comes in 20 or more tints and is intended to be thinned with denatured alcohol or water. Try the golden brown tint as it gives a nice warm tone to most gunstock woods. If you want to go over BLO ad 25% acetone to the denat to give some bite to the tint but be sure to test the mix on a inconspicuous area as it can "lift" a green finish. I've used transtint over existing finishes with excellent results.

[gnoahhh]

Soooo, if a BLO treated stock will soak up water seems to me it should soak up a water based stain. Right? Gave it a try....beaded up and ran off like water off a ducks back. So much for that soak up water thing.

So, had said stock ever been waxed in its life? Wouldn't be surprised. Also, how much of said water beaded up and ran off, and how much fenestrated? Was it a scientific test in which the water in question was accurately measured before and after applying to the wood to see how much stayed behind (or not)? You can sling a fistful of water against a piece of bare wood and most of it will roll right off.

[mac60]

Alcohol based stains will work through BLO. I use this stuff.

122674

I use a VERY small amount thinned with denatured alcohol. That bottle is several lifetime supplies for several people.

[gnoahhh]

I've been using Behlen's SolarLux dyes for the last two decades. They provide colors that "pop", and resist UV degradation nicely. Just another in a long list of products that work.

[Uncle Grinch]

One of the old traditional finishes, I've read, is equal parts BLO, pure gum turpentine and beeswax (just thought you might be interested). I've been experimenting with rubbing (polishing) the stock using one of those oscillating multi-tools with a lambswool pad, as the hand-rubbing bit was hard on my hand, plus I'm not keen on getting that stuff on my skin. Seems to be working. I started with the mix I mentioned, which didn't look too bad, but then I had to buy some pure Tung oil to treat a wooden seat, so thought I'd try it over the mix. I wiped the stock with turps first, then applied the Tung oil, let it soak for 15 minutes and then rubbed the stock with 1200 grit wet and dry paper, using the oil on the wood as a lubricant. It makes a very fine slurry which fills the pores of the wood. Wipe it off, then start buffing. Apply a light coat of oil overnight, wipe off and buff. Apply more oil, wipe off and buff. The stock feels like glass, is getting a nice satin sheen and has a slight glow to it. I'm quite impressed with my new-found skills :lol:.

Perhaps this may be of some use to you, even though it doesn't answer your question about staining.

This three part mixture is very popular with milsurp users. There are a few variations out there with some adding Spar Varnish in place mof the turpentine.
It makes a nice finish,

When working with varoius light colored woods, you can use a Min-Wax product, I believe is call Wood Conditioner. It is applied before staining and helps even out the stain on light or sapwood areas. I've had good success with it.

[terryt]

Hi:

Would someone please tell me what BLO stands for?

Thanks.

Terryt

[Col4570]

terryt Boiled Linseed Oil.I have problems deciphering the letters for the States in the USA.Then others shorten the name of Gun parts into a few letters and numbers.There is a lot of this on the Forum,I always write in full so that folks can understand me.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

I think you would need to physically strip the oil finish down to bare wood to stain it consistently. Steel wool will clog less than paper, and steel scrapers, razor blades or pieces of broken glass might help on heavily crusted wood. But doing it in this order has its advantages. When the surface of the wood is bare, the pores will still be filled with old oil residue, and the stain won't cause them to become black speckling as stain on new wood can do.

For most oil work my preference is to at least start with red oil, in which plenty of alkanet root chips have either been left for weeks or kept at close to boiling point for a shorter period. You can buy the alkanet on eBay, but be sure to get the right kind, known as dyer's bugloss, as other alkanets are used as food additives etc. I've also eliminated a streak of sapwood with commercial wood stain, but in my experience you end up having to make the whole thing dark, as old guns often are, to avoid showing the contrast. Fortunately it was on an old gun.

[leftiye]

Brownell's has stains that will penetrate oil finishes.

[Chill Wills]

Oh my mac60. If that picture is any example of how orderly your shop is I need to take lessons from you!



Alcohol based stains will work through BLO. I use this stuff.

122674

I use a VERY small amount thinned with denatured alcohol. That bottle is several lifetime supplies for several people.

[mac60]

Oh my mac60. If that picture is any example of how orderly your shop is I need to take lessons from you!

That's my reloading room inside the house. My shop is the same way. A place for everything and everything in it's place. Maybe it's my upbringing - maybe it's my military service. All I know is I can't tolerate clutter.