Auto conversation for the Star

[hunter74]

I've read many treads on the forum about this topic and I'm impressed with the knowledge presented. Since I'm, as many other, not a machinist or otherwise capable of building something as complicated as many of these projects I'm sure many people wish they hade an automated Star. My guess is that many of them also are willing to pay what it'll cost to get one made for them. I sure am.

So.... Im thinking... If someone have spare time and are able to build a "plug'n play" package of an automated package for the star it would be great.

What do you think..... Strange that some companies in the business haven't done this when the price for Magmas lubmaster is well..... Stiff. It's out of most people's price range.

Thaughts? Anyone willing to take on a project like this?

[HATCH]

Send a pm to Wyman for the pneumatic side. Electronic side is easy.

[hunter74]

Thanks! What do you recomend? Pneumatic vs electronic? I'm thinking building cost and what's best in the long run. I have grounded 220v in the house since I live in Europe

Hatch, if the electronic side is easy, what's the downside? Cost?

[HATCH]

What I was talking about is pneumatic conversion with electronic controls.
There is several ways to automate the star sizer.

Wyman and my self use a pneumatic cylinder to operate it with a electronic relay to control the air valve.

Look at these


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XlPcBvGsDTY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QaR6un4vkos
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YyLPVWREGR8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=piNj5i00TbM

[wymanwinn]

go here... http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?151658-Air-Assisted-Star-Sizer&highlight=

post 20 for the parts list....;)

wyman

[hunter74]

go here... http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?151658-Air-Assisted-Star-Sizer&highlight=

post 20 for the parts list....;)

wyman
I'm afraid that partlist don't help me much. 😁

What I'm asking I guess is if someone could make me a working package and send it to me here in Norway ☺. It may be bold but asking don't cost much, right?

Is this possible and would you consider it and at what price?

Thanks

Knut Egil Bakke

[Tom_Highway]

Hello!

Look that: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R0Az76D1JKI&list=UUXswTt9fhKU3ZkgLgJgrCQw
This system had not seen it until today. I find it interesting.
:-)

[HATCH]

A complete working package with sizer?

And Tom, thats a neat setup.
I am afraid to know what the gear reduction motor cost though....

[wymanwinn]

Hello!

Look that: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R0Az76D1JKI&list=UUXswTt9fhKU3ZkgLgJgrCQw
This system had not seen it until today. I find it interesting.
:-)

does it have a clutch....?

[hunter74]

Parden my previous post, it was ment to be a pm.

The dream sollution for me would be a complete package without the sizer and feedee but with all the other parts and installation manual

[HATCH]

The pneumatic side is $200
The relays I use for for control are $70 each and I use two of them. I want to say that air valve is around $40 I think. You need a enclosure too, and a few little parts.
So parts alone its almost $400
A entire "kit" would be around $600 or so.
Not to even mention shipping cost to ship the "kit" to you.

[Tazza]

That motor driven version is very slick. We all need access to used motors like that for our builds. New the price would be insane.

I wonder how well a windscreen wiper motor would go in a situation like this.

[HATCH]

I don't know if that would have enough torque when it comes to sizing

[jmorris]

The motor I used on mine is something like 1/15th hp. For a clutch I just made the lever arm clamp the shaft with no key way so it can slip if it gets too heavy of a load.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=01zbImsdkbg

[Tazza]

They are kind of small, so i can understand that.

Jmorris - that is very fancy, i wish i could come up with the ideas you do to automate things.

[chloe123]

Hunter, there's was a member who was soliciting interest in selling exactly what you wanted.

I remember posting a comment on his thread and I may have sent a PM requesting a vid when he first described the Star he automated .

....the link is posted below. Kind of unique to be in a situation where you could purchase a customized unit. The biggest challenge may be reaching the OP as I don't think he updated the thread

Link:

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?253445-thinking-about-selling-my-automated-star-!


also, I completely empathize with your interest in enjoying the tech-savvy modifications

my original post was akin to yours but related to (automation of) the Master Caster. I bombarded both the design creators as well as those who, per the forum, succesfully modified their MCs.

I was lucky that Wyman Winn and Hatch responded and helped me. Out of fairness, "Hatch" did help by having thorough discussions regarding different approaches to automating, but he also made the "electronics" portion that controls the "pneumatics" that he described a little bit in your post.

though the master caster casting machine is made to cast boolits and the Star Sizer lubes and sizes, their(Wyman Winn /Hatch) approach to automate the machine is similar. On the surface, the Star design looks similar in that there's one dual acting cylinder(powered in both up/down directions), and in at least the designs I saw, use a "smart relay" to operate the complete cycle of the Star

I don't have a link handy, but "Hatch" has a video posted of a proof of concept test using these 2 relays

also, you can see the exact parts that are needed for the project (apart from the description) by viewing a video that W Winn published. (For some reason I think the one I saw is unique from the link posted above. In it, you'll see the flow restrictions, pressure regulator, the control of with the 2 relays, air lines coming in/out etc.--it's good)

My transition to automating the master caster, should have been re-titled "Idiots guide to Automating the Master Caster" as I didn't really know what I was doing, let alone understanding the concept behind it. For reference to my aptitude, I just learned that "green is for ground, and " black is lead" for changing electrical outlets (I graduated to changing dimmer switches and outlets, and became acquainted with a multi meter after the MC project)

The point of this is, if you're not successful in reaching the member on the above thread, you can tackle at least the pneumatic side of the project. W Winn detailed exact part numbers on the thread that Hatch referenced. This you accomplish, as I did. The obstacle would then be the electronics side.

As as you saw in the video there are other impressive designs that involve motors but that would require fabrication, motor, reduced gear drive etc.

if you have any questions that appear too dumb to ask, feel free to PM me. I'd be glad to share the experiences I had before, during and after automation. Good luck.

[HATCH]

Concerning the automation of the star, my setup and Wyman's setup is identical in every way.
Wyman's electronic side was provided by me and shown in the proof of concept.
Wyman cleaned up my sloppy mounting but other then that he used it as shown.

[Tazza]

Chlow123 - there are no dumb questions around here. No one here knows everything, yet some seem to be close :)

There is only one way to learn, asking questions and doing it on your own, just like you did. It feels better completing a job like this too rather than getting someone else to do it for you.

[HATCH]

I don't know everything and for the most part I try to share what I know to anyone that ask.
Its us reloaders vs "the man"

I have to admit that after speaking with Dino (Chloe123) on multiple calls that he was WAY out of his element when he took on the automation of the master caster.
Not saying that he is stupid or anything like that. Just says it was just something that he has never done before. He did a great job getting it up and running.
I even learned a couple things when I did his control panel.
Example - his panel has a toggle switch for heavy boolits. This allows you to run a second set of timers at the flip of a switch. I also made it change the range of the boolits you could cast.
What I didn't think of (only cause I don't cast single cavity) is that the large boolits are single cavity molds. So a mold for a 500 grain boolit takes the same amount of lead as the dual cavity molds I use for 250 grain boolits. I was thinking a 500 grain boolit would need to drop 1000 grains of lead (two boolits) when in reality its a single 500 grain boolit.


On my master caster setup, I had my brother Robert (no_1 on here) make the alum bar that the movement air cylinder is on. It was easier for him to do it and to be honest cheaper then me buying the parts and doing it myself. On the lead pour I use a bunch of 1/4 inch nuts to space out the lead pour air cylinder. Guess I should change that one day.

On the star, I got lucky. One day a package showed up from Wyman. Inside the package was all the pneumatic parts for the star. The metal rod was already bent to the correct angle.
I just had to assemble everything and then automate it. Wyman came up with the correct air valve and I did the electronic side.

Friends helping friends

[Tazza]

That is the good thing about the forum, you help one person out and they are happy to help you out. Everyone is happy to share their experience, be it good or bad to help others not make the same mistakes they did.

[chloe123]

Per Boolits members musings, there's an alternative....

...the Mr. Bullet Feeder, right?

Either for automation or this collator, you'd probably want the Magma Bullet Feeder anyway.

It sounded asif this was successfully designed. Though it sounded like the caliber specific parts could end up being pricey, relatively speaking, it's not too bad. The other big makers explicitly state no cast boolits, just jacketed fodder.

I was just thinking how the repetitive stacking and orienting of boolits gets annoying and is time consuming--at least compared to how fast you can pull the handle.

This would be a valuable item for a group buy, imo

[Tazza]

I hope to one day build one, there are videos on youtube about people that have made bullet flippers so they all go down the tubes one way to feed to your sizer or casting machine. They look simple enough, but getting the time to do the job is the issue.

I wonder if they specify jacketed only is because they don't want to have to cater for all different cast projectile shapes and sizes.

[HATCH]

They say no cast boolits because the lube sticks up the machine.

I wish someone sold a bullet flipper.

[chloe123]

Wasn't it JMorris that not just created a collator but had an apparatus that was like a carousel to change the boolit orientation?

Add....I thought it was odd that the RCBS and Hornady feeders aren't designed for collating cast boolits. I felt it was due to eventual lube accumulation as opposed to cast boolit design, bit never really new for sure.

[6bg6ga]

Its very simple to make a bullet flipper. There are video's of them on youtube.

[Tazza]

Ahh the lube issue makes sense.

Jmorris did build one, looked very simple to do as well, but you did mention that you don't have the gear to tackle a lot of things like this, so ti makes it hard and more expensive :(

[HATCH]

Problem with bullet flippers is getting something that will work with every boolit I cast without making changes for each one.

Basically there is a hole that the boolit drops in that is the exact length is shorter then the boolit you use.
This way the next boolit doesn't jam the flipper.


I did think of a way that might work.
Basically you have a tube that has a switch in it. When a bullet hits the switch a pin blocks the tube so no more bullets can drop.
The tube would be two bullets long so it would still work if two bullets dropped before the blocker could block it.

[jmorris]

These are the two that I have made.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eANEMBS_V_0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Cc1hUj343w

The collators are from 6" PVC and 1/2" UHMW plastic. Yes, you have to change parts out for different caliber bullets.

This is a video Rick (owner of mrbulletfeeder) sent me of a nose down converted " old style" mr bullet feeder.
http://vid664.photobucket.com/albums/vv5/qvideo/01PtDwnDAA_zps7a02454c.mp4

The reason I use the external flipper is because the collators were built for my reloading presses and the bullets need to be base down for them and I am too lazy to build another set for my sizing machines when all I have to do is drill a single hole in a plastic bar to flip them.

The part that inverts the bullet is easy to make, much more time in the collator itself.

[6bg6ga]

Sir, you are by no means lazy. What you are employing is work simplification or working smart. No need to build yet more machines when you can use your head and adapt what you have to work. My hat is off to you sir. I wish I could buy one of your units and I could be assured it would work unlike what is on the market now.

[Tazza]

That is what i want to make too. I already have some 6" PVC that i have cut down and have made bases out of MDF that i have glued into the PVC as a base. I still have to make the rotating disc, not 100% sure how i'm going to do that yet.

I hope to power it with an electric motor from a microwave oven. They are rated to do 5RPM, but if the rotating part has say 20 holes in it, that is 100 projectiles flipped every minute, i believe that is more than enough.

The other issue, is how to mount the motor to drive the disc, so many things that need to be worked out, but i'm sure it can be.

[HATCH]

My Star Sizer is set on a 2 second cycle time.
That is 1800 a hr
I would think a hockey puck with 4 holes in it spinning at 5 RPM would almost do it.
That would be 20 boolits a minute and you could set the sizer on 3 second per boolit.
Also you are not factoring gearing.
You can play around with the diameter of the pulley that is on the hockey puck vs the diameter on the motor shaft.
You can speed up or slow down based on the size ratio.

The problem you will run into is the capacity of the collator. I guess they only hold 200 to 250 boolits depending on weight.
Even at a 3 second cycle time per boolit, you would have to replenish the collator every 10 to 15 minutes.

[Tazza]

That is what i was thinking too, the larger the disc, the more i can flip.

Filling the drum more often isn't a big deal for me, as if it's doing it's thing i can be doing something else close by, a lot like the automated MC.

[HATCH]

But the question would be how fast is your machine running??

If you are going with a electric motor to do the flipping then you would use two small limit switches (micro switches).
One before the flipper and one after.
The one before the flipper is for the collator control. You have it about 3 inches above the flipper.
This will allow boolits to be stacked up waiting to be flipped.
One would be after the flipper.
This is for flipper control. This insures that the flipper is only running when you need boolits.
This prevents it from binding up. Now your gonna ask how could it bind up.
Simple. If the tube under the flipper is full but there is enough space for the boolit to partially drop out of the flipper then it will bind the flipper up when it tries to spin.
On the Star setup, you would use the factory metal tube. Have the limit switch above it then have a inch gap between the switch and the flipper.
You want at least two boolit lengths so you don't bind the flipper (see above explanation)

Just some thoughts...

[Tazza]

All good points.

I was going to make it so there was some room so it didn't bind up as it fills.

My sizing setup currently is a lee classic C i think it is, with a bullet feeder mounted to it, it works pretty well, but i think the design will change to the star style with nose down projectiles and an air cylinder to push them through.

I guess it depends on if i need fully automatic or if i can get by with pulling a handle but having the the projectiles filling a tube automatically.

[jmorris]

I still have to make the rotating disc, not 100% sure how i'm going to do that yet...

The other issue, is how to mount the motor to drive the disc...

I made simple fixtures to make the hole pattern, and mill the slot. The slot could be formed with a saw and belt sander though.

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/reloading/bullet%20feeder/DSC01472.jpg

I have used the same concept for "sprockets" too large to turn in my lathe, like the one around the 2:00 mark in this video.
http://vid121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/sorterhopper.mp4

I drilled a center hole and rough cut the circle and finished the OD with a wood router and did the same "drill/ index" of the small wheels.

The motor is mounted to the bottom 1/2" plate and the shaft has an 1/8" roll pin in it that engages a slot in the bottom of the "sprocket" looking feed wheel.

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/reloading/bullet%20feeder/DSC01537.jpg

You want the "inverter" to be 1:1 with the sizing machine or you will need to add an extra switch to keep them from jamming up.

[jmorris]

They were not my first collators, When I first needed one MA Systems was the only place to get one they cost over $1000 dollars back then and they claimed a fail rate of 1/1000 for "square" bullets like a 230g 45 acp. So I built my own and added a failsafe device that would cull any inverted bullet.

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/feeder4.jpg

If the bullet was base down it would just drop in and pass by the whisker switch and fall out into the feed tube for the feeder.

If the base was up it would hit the switch and open a trap door, culling the inverted bullet from the wheel. This system did have two different switches, one for the collator and another for the culler.

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/feeder2.jpg


I don't have any videos of it working with bullets but made one of the same device culling 380 from 9mm by length some years later (never throw anything away, right) so you can see how it works.

http://vid121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/reloading/brass/9mm380.mp4

[Tazza]

Very nice and easy way of doing it. The issue is, i would need to some how calculate the spacing of the holes to make the jig. I just know that i'd get to the last one and it would have an odd space.

I do have an indexing head for my mill that i have yet to actually use, it may be time to get it out of the box and cut some "gears".

You don't have issues with the plate slipping off or up over the roll pin? that was my only concern with it was that it would not hold the plate in place. I guess there is no real reason why i can't make more than one so each projectile has it's own collator. I really only cast one size and shape.

The nylon i have i think is 1/2" or close to it, hopefully it will do the job.

[dragon813gt]

Hello!

Look that: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R0Az76D1JKI&list=UUXswTt9fhKU3ZkgLgJgrCQw
This system had not seen it until today. I find it interesting.
:-)

So for the layman like me what all does this setup entail? And any idea of cost? I'm not afraid to spend money and I like the compactness of this setup over pneumatics. How much of it would have to be made versus bought? No lathe or mills in my shop currently. Thanks for any information.

[Tazza]

I believe people on youtube have made them without a lathe or mill. A lathe and mill just makes things easier and more precise is all.

I too like that setup, very compact.

[jmorris]

... i would need to some how calculate the spacing of the holes to make the jig. I just know that i'd get to the last one and it would have an odd space.

You don't have issues with the plate slipping off or up over the roll pin?

That is just math. Pick the CL diameter X 3.1459/ number of "slots". You can even lay it out with a set of dividers.

I used visegrips or small C clamps to hold the disk to the fixture.

[Tazza]

I didn't think it through, work out the circumference then divide it by X slots to get the spacing.... It just shows how different people tackle jobs like this. I seem to go the difficult route, you go the logical way :)

[jmorris]

Just the simple way. Many ways to do things, more often than not my solutions are the ones that are what I can do with what I have, cheap and as little work as I can get by with.

[Tazza]

I like your thinking. Ill cut up some plastic and spin it in the lathe to get it round then work out the spacing.

[HATCH]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gw0VdRcZrpA

[jmorris]

I have seen that one, I remember being curious how he collated them hollow base up.

If you have a bunch of different length/diameter bullets you might want to invert, that is more work and material, for each one.

On the drum style you could drill the drum oversize and just make bullet specific "bushings" that drop in and once inserted into the flipper housing could not fall out.

Something like below, except you wouldn't need a shoulder even. Drill out the drum to say 3/4" and that would be wide enough that it is always riding inside the hole that it rotates in, no way to get hung up on the in/out holes for the bullets.

[Tazza]

From what i remember on youtube, there was a setup where the projectiles were collated on their side, not standing up. There was a pin on the "sprocket" that made it so they could only sit in the slots one way, if they were the other way around they would sit high and the rejecting plate knocked them off.

There are so many different ways people are using that all seem to work. I was going to do mine years ago by machining the disc do it had the shape of the projectile i was casting so it would only ever sit flush if it was the correct way around and any others would be knocked out with a rejecting plate or pin. I like the flipping way better though, it seems more reliable as you don't need to rely on the rejecting plates to knock them out, they simply roll over if needed.

[jmorris]

I think that is the concept GSI is/was using for their collators and the only time I messed with one it was not working correctly. Much more time/equipment involved in making something ogive specific and much more temperamental.

[Tazza]

I would think the flipper style would be more reliable, you aren't as reliant on rejectors being set just right for them to work properly. Most flippers that i have seen don't have any, they just rotate and flip them over as required, simple yet very effective.

Hopefully i will get some time to myself to play on the weekend.

[HATCH]

In have a hornady collator that I want to use. Just need time to mess with it.

[Tazza]

Sadly not a lot to report. I got a paying job that took priority, so that got done over the bullet flipper.

I roughed the circles out of some nylon sheet with a jigsaw, mounted them in the lathe and made them round, that went far better than i expected actually. Now to work out angles and make a jig and drill them. I figured it would take the same time to do one as it would 5, so i did a bunch of them so i can do different profiles later for different projectile sizes.

The only issue i have is, just how much room should there be between the housing and the inner part of the disc? Nothing i have seen shows a set figure for this.

[jmorris]

I could measure some of the ones I have built but it is not that critical. Enough that the wheel doesn't rub the "housing". PVC is not a very precise material to work with. I will say that you should machine the base plate and install it into the PVC first. Deep enough that it makes the tubing round and you can get an ID measurement. If you just measure the ID relaxed (nothing to keep it round) you might wind up with more gap than you need, might not be a problem anyway.

The width of the notches would be somewhat more critical than the diameter of the wheel. An 1/8" gap between the wheel and housing (more than I have for sure) would not have as much adverse effects as an extra 1/8" width where the bullets could go sideways (or not) into the part that draws the nose out, and put them base down.

[Tazza]

I actually did just that. I found the PVC was not at all round. I did the same with some MDF, rough cut with a jigsaw then mounted in the lathe and turned it down to be a nice fit. Made a mess of my lathe......

There isn't a big gap between the PVC and the wheel, but there is enough so it does not touch. I will have to be mindful to not cut too deep as to allow bullets to lay on their side. From how i understand the concept, the idea is if it is the wrong way up, the nose is drawn out then flipped back on it's base.

I'm sure i will have some trial and error doing this, hopefully i will be victorious with it though!

[jmorris]

What caliber are you starting with?

Attached is a photo of one of the 45 feed wheels. You can see one of the top teeth is thinner than the rest, because I didn't make the jig perfect but it has no effect on function.

Looks like around .035-.045 between the teeth and ID of the PVC.

Looks like the photo didn't upload at the same resolution that I took it in. Send me a pm with your email address in it and I can send you one that you can read the calipers if you need it.

[Tazza]

Thanks, i'll pm you my e-mail address.

I'm casting 9mm projectiles. Sadly the government wanted my .45 more than i did.... :(

[jmorris]

I sent you photos of both.

[Tazza]

Thank you, i got them :)

Hopefully i will get time this afternoon to have a go at making a jig. I'm going to try working on 20 degrees. It will give about the right gap between slots, just a little more than yours, but i figured that would not be a real issue.

[Red Ork]

So if one were to attach a Mr. Bulletfeeer to a Star sizer, and was doing Hi-Tek boolits with no wax it seems all that would be left is a simple motor (or pneumatics) to crank the handle. Or am I missing something?
Sounds like a few grand less than buying a BC Mk V

[HATCH]

unless you got one of those prototype models that drop the boolit nose first, you would need a bullet flipper to flip them around.
But yes... you just need a way to automate it.
There is a thread done by wyman that shows how to do pneumatics

[jmorris]

The only part your missing is that the bullet collator is designed to put the bullets base down in a tube and you need them nose down.

That takes a device like the ones in post #28.

[HATCH]

Jim that was so 1 minute ago..... LOL

[jmorris]

Yeah but I had to go back and find the relevant post too;)

[Tazza]

Ok, so it's not pretty but it seems to work when spinning by hand.

The indexing for drilling the holes was close, but not quite right, the last hole was a little short. The drill bits must have wondered a little when making the jig so the angles were not spot on 20 degrees, but either way, it did the job and did it pretty well. I just need to work out a better way to square the sides of the drilled holes. I guessed and used a hack saw, they are not all consistent and the dags on the plastic catches on the projectiles some times. I just need to debur it all. I believe a nice rounded top edge on the plate would help with reliability as they some times catch on the lube grooves so they do not sit flat on the base.

Either way, here is what i have so far:
http://i903.photobucket.com/albums/ac233/tazza_/Collator/20141202_055027.jpg
http://i903.photobucket.com/albums/ac233/tazza_/Collator/20141203_055233.jpg
http://i903.photobucket.com/albums/ac233/tazza_/Collator/20141203_055223.jpg
http://i903.photobucket.com/albums/ac233/tazza_/Collator/20141203_055217.jpg

It's not pretty, but all i want is something to tell me that the sizing is right. I will then do more work to make it look pretty and make it a friend for the loading press.

The one thing i did notice is that the part that you need to grind out to make the nose of the projectile follow to lay flat before flipping should be square. I used a rounded cutter and found it didn't "grab" the nose very well to lay it down, the squared edge i tried later worked much better.

The next big test will be if the motor i have in mind for this will work. It is a microwave turntable motor, slow spinning (5rpm), but i would hope it has enough torque being geared down so much. I wonder how long it will last doing this too..... With 17 slots, that is a 85/minute, that should be more than fast enough to keep up with anything i will be doing.

If the motor doesn't work, ebay has heaps of other slow turning options.

[Tazza]

Ok, so a microwave turn table motor will not do the job.....

There is no way to know what direction it will turn when you apply power. Apparently this style of motor will switch direction if it stalls, so if you setup a ratchet it will only go in the direction you want but that is a lot more work than should be needed. I may need to go for a DC motor, then direction is not an issue. There are a few 240v ones that have three wires, so those should allow me to run it the direction i want every time.

Got a few more things to fiddle with to get the collator working flipping the projectiles. It's not reliable enough yet, needs fine tuning. I took a little too much out of the part that directs the nose out to flip, so the ones that are the right way round wobble and a few fall over, so that has been glued up just needs to set and i will grind it out again, hopefully not too much this time!

[jmorris]

Didn't know they used AC motors but I did know that you could start some AC motors and they would go the wrong direction. Generally that indicates a capacitor start is bad or removed from the circuit.

AC/DC motors, shaded pole AC motors, cap start AC motors, 3 ph AC motors, all act different from one another. Different fixes for every design.

[Tazza]

I never knew how they got around the issue on induction motors. Up untill a few days ago I had no idea what a shaded pole was. I thought swapping wires like dc motors would work but no. It doesn't matter what connection the hot wire goes to it is all dependent on the ac cycle AND the position of the magnetic core. I never knew they were just that complicated.

[Red Ork]

On the Mr. Bulletfeeder website for the new revised model it says nose up or nose down options available. I mention this because it is several hundred less than the MA systems collators sold with either the Magma or BC machines as an add on option.

[Tom_Highway]

Bello Red Ork!,

Can you put the link where it says that?. I can not find it.
Can I buy from Europe Mr. Bulletfeeder with nose down system?

Thank you very much!
:-)

[HATCH]

In Europe - http://www.doublealpha.biz/bulletfeeder.htm
I looked at both us sellers and the euro site and no where did I read it was both base up and base down

[Tom_Highway]

Thanks HATCH,

I too have been reviewing the webs (manufacturers and 2 authorized dealers) and can not find it. I have done simulations of purchase and does not appear the "nose down" option.

Now I have a Mr. Bulletfeeder (old model) and am interested in buying another with the option "nose down".
:-)

[6bg6ga]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gw0VdRcZrpA

Simple bullet flipper. Anyone can make this.

[Tom_Highway]

Yes possibly be the cheapest option (bullet flipper). Although it seems a bit noisy. Anyone who manufactures?.

But I insist on knowing whether it is possible to buy Mr. Bulletfeeder with option "nose down". Thank you!.
:-)

[jmorris]

We are going in circles, Hatch posted the link to that video last month in #44. Even less work to make the style that are the first two links of #28.

If you want it part of the collating process you either have to wait for one to come out or build one like the third link in post #28.

[chloe123]

After phoning Rick, the," Mr Bullet Feeder", I received a video via email showcasing the reliability of the top-down feeding.

I contacted him sometime after the OP of this thread. Nice chat with a friendly guy. Oddly, the e-mail reply I sent to him re. whether his model was simply intended as a prototype demonstration--and pricing inquiry--got kicked back by my e-mail server. I didn't follow up. Then, work and holiday plans got in the way.

Tom, I'd suggest just phoning him. Fwiw, I called after typical business hours expecting to get his voice mail...


Bello Red Ork!,

Can you put the link where it says that?. I can not find it.
Can I buy from Europe Mr. Bulletfeeder with nose down system?

Thank you very much!
:-)

[Red Ork]

Don't remember whre I read it. But it was in a list of changes between versions, I can't find it now.

But a little of the old Google-fu led me to a thread on the Brian Enos forms, then that lead to this video....
http://s664.photobucket.com/user/qvideo/media/01PtDwnDAA_zps7a02454c.mp4.html

Also this: http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?232791-Mr-Bullet-feeder-for-star

[jmorris]

Are you guys messing with me?

That is the third video in post #28 of this thread.

[wymanwinn]

THIS has my attention...:)

[HATCH]

Until I see a web site with it for sale it might as well be one of those Lyman mag 25s that have the pid built in.
Until you can buy it it doesn't matter

[Tom_Highway]

Thanks chloe123, but it would be impossible to talk to Rick, I do not speak English well and we could not understand. It would be complicated. hehe. Thanks for the information.

Thanks for the info, Red Ork. :-)

Yes, JMorris, we go in circles. Hehehe. What happens is that I was excited to think I could buy it.

I'll have to make it, but I'm not a handyman. Sure I burn the house trying to do. LOL

[HATCH]

Looks like I spoke too soon on the Mag 25 -> http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?261929-Lyman-mag25-arrived-today

I will do a search tonight for info on the nose down collator

[HATCH]

I have looked at the video that Rick did and its pretty clear how he is doing it.
Its the same deal he uses for nose up.
You cut a channel for the base to ride in to the side ramp that flips it.
Then on the bullet drop you make a rounded triangle (upside down) if it makes any sense..

If I had Jim's ability to machine and rig stuff it would be built already as its pretty easy.

[Tazza]

That's what I thought too. Looked so simple, yet in practice I bet not so easy to get the angles right so they flip reliably.

Every time i see them running, i swear it's like sorcery as they all flip over to the right way up :)

They are so simple in concept, but someone needed to think of it in the first place. Not sure it's something i could have come up with. My idea was to make exact projectile shapes in the wheel, so they can only go in one way then hopefully fall the same way each time.

[HATCH]

watch this video this -> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GdLAGoyvlGs#t=196
See the little ledge.
He is explaining how the "ledge" prevents base down bullets from being flipped.

Basically you have a hole in the nose guide that will drop the bullets.
Base down bullets will pass the hole because of the ledge. Nose down would drop.
You then have a channel after the hole that would push the base out to the ramp to be flipped.


I need to win the lottery so I can quit work and have time to make stuff.
I have way too many projects that I am dealing with.

[jmorris]

That is the new style (double alpha) with the sliding nose guide, I think he has only made the nose down collators for the old style (KISS) round nose guide collators.

Instead of the normal base down exit at 2:00. He covered up that exit and turned the nose guide into the exit at 11:30. Then just flipped any bullet that remained after that.

This is similar to what the old versions look like for base down.
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/reloading/bullet%20feeder/DSC01537.jpg

The new one is a different design.

[HATCH]

The vid I posted was just to show what I was talking about.
I will build one this summer once I get 100% done with my current project (mc)

[Tazza]

I hear ya Hatch, so many projects, not enough hours in the day!

I'm getting closer to having mine completed. Just a few bits and pieces to be done to increase it's reliability. I have found the projectiles do not always sit in the same spot of the rotating disc so i have added a paddle to push them into the same place. Hopefully the electric motor to drive it will be here shortly, but with X-mas so close, it may be a little later.....

How much more do you have to do on your MC?

[jmorris]

The vid I posted was just to show what I was talking about.



Post 11 in this thread http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?232791-Mr-Bullet-feeder-for-star has close up shots of the "nose guide" that draws the nose out normally. This is where he just added a hole for them to fall out.

[gunoil]

Fast till i get more money, need a dang mrbulletfeeder.biz collator.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UozyDZ-44Q4

Iam working on a pedal system for my above star sizer. Just set and pedal. 2 free hands.