A ? for you 22 cal centerfire shooters - can you educate me?

[bedbugbilly]

I've been cleaning and straightening my reloading area and today, I ran across a couple of casings that I had picked up somewhere (probably at a range) that I threw in my container of odd brass that I use for making powder dippers, etc. From the measurements of it, I think the two casings are 222 Remington.

Anyway . . . I got to looking at them and they are such a neat little cartridge. My only experience with loading bottleneck rifle cartridges is the 8mm Mauser I'm playing with in getting a good "cat sneeze" load with a cast boolit. So, I just got to wondering . . . .

I know nothing about nor have I shot such 22 CF rifles as the 22 Hornet, 218 Bee, and 223 Remington. In looking in my Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook - 3rd edition - I see that the bullets are pretty lightweight, most appear to be gas check design and they are leaving the barrel at a pretty good clip.

So my question is this, can these cartridges be "loaded down" to "cat sneeze" loads and still be accurate for shooting/plinking at 50 to 100 yards? I'm talking strictly "cast boolit" loads. Can the be loaded down to where they don't need a gas check with a lower FPS or does the lighter weight boolit require the higher velocity in order to be accurate?

My thinking is telling me that if a 22 high velocity plain base lead bullet or a 22 Mag can be fired at the higher velocity without a problem with leading, etc. that these 22 caliber center fires should be able to be loaded for slower velocities but as I said, I have no experience with them or what problems might occur with the type of rifling the rifles have for these cartridges.

With the lower boolit weight, is there a "give and take"? i.e. - dropping the powder charge to "cat sneeze" loads equals less accuracy with such a light boolit?

I know these cartridges are designed for varmints and for that, you need the speed. I think these smaller bottlenecks would be fun to load and play with for shorter range plinking or would it be better to stick to a larger case cartridge / bigger bore / heavier boolit such as say a 30/30 or larger? I know I'm getting good results with cast boolits/cat sneeze loads in my GEW98 8mm Mauser but would consider one of these 22s if it's feasible to do the light weight charges in them.

Thanks for any info / education you can give me on it - greatly appreciated!

[Larry Gibson]

So my question is this, can these cartridges be "loaded down" to "cat sneeze" loads and still be accurate for shooting/plinking at 50 to 100 yards? I'm talking strictly "cast boolit" loads. Can the be loaded down to where they don't need a gas check with a lower FPS or does the lighter weight boolit require the higher velocity in order to be accurate?

Yes, done all the time by many.

Larry Gibson

[bedbugbilly]

Thanks Larry - appreciate the answer. Of course this means a whole other "thing" to play - different molds, dies, and the usual "must haves"! :-) For some reason,the smaller cartridges are intriguing to me and look like they'd be a lot of fun. Keeping my eye out for a rifle in one of these calibers though will give me something to do to keep busy. Thanks!

[birch]

They will keep you busy--you will need many sizing dies (boolit) powders, seating depths, powders, and crimps and also experimenting with case sizing.

[aspangler]

I load the 225646 w/o GC over 5.5 gr ACC #9. Great in my Vangard 223. 1/2" to 5/8" groups at 50 yrds and estimated at 1300FPS. Works for me.

[gpidaho]

I shoot cast 55gr. Bators in a 22-250 with good results. Just looking at it it probably wouldn't be a mans first choice for cast boolit shooting but I have two 22-250s and three 223s that shoot real well (rifles from my J world days) I've been shooting the Bators cast from Linotype seated as long as I can over 6gr Tight Group for the mid 1700s out of the 22-250 GP

[1johnlb]

Just for kicks I loaded a 22 pellet in a 223 case and just the primer was enough for about 10 yds, got it up to about 2 grs titegroup for about 30 yds.
It wasn't very accurate, but I think that was because of the 1in7 twist.

[Jack Stanley]

Oh ! Billy !!!! you got a road full of woe staring you right in the face !! Before you embark on such a perilous journey , consider the horrors of haveing a rifle like the CZ 527 chambered in .223 Remington . further , know the trials and tribulations of having an old Lyman 225462 mould and the tragedy of casting those tiny slugs . Then imagine the problems associated with this beast of a rifle/cartridge that cuts into your stash of 700-X to feed it's own lust for range time ...... which it will get with is ways of beguiling you ! Be warned that your supply of gas checks will sit on the shelf alone ... whimpering at the lack of use as the bullets fly at nearly fifteen hundred feet per second and accuracy that your rimfire rifles will form a union and force thee to take them to the range !! Yea! and verily I say unto thee the problems you will encounter are unbearable for mankind and thou shouldest cease and desist with such thoughts of near blasphemy !* Perhaps thou couldest search for the mystical "Panama" load to remove thy thoughts from the perils ahead . Yea! continue to buy bullets by the case from Midsouth for they are worthy of your cash . Turn away! turn away! before it's to late ! thou hast been warned !

Jack


* I think somebody has had a bit to much coffee this morning ;-) insert rolling eyes icon here !

[TCFAN]

I like 22 cal. cast boolits. Right now I am playing with a 218 Bee using a NOE 225107 mold that throws a 37 gr. boolit.Using 2.5 grs. of Bullseye it is going 1300fps from my 22 inch barrel. This make a fine squirrel load out to 100 yards using a gas check.
I shoot cast in the 22 Hornet 223 222 and 22-250. I have several different molds to play with..........

http://i755.photobucket.com/albums/xx200/TCintheOzarks/Cast%20Boolits/22calibercastboolits-1.jpg (http://s755.photobucket.com/user/TCintheOzarks/media/Cast%20Boolits/22calibercastboolits-1.jpg.html)

[quilbilly]

My Hornet and 222 both shoot cast very well but I haven't done cat sneeze loads instead favoring loads similar to 22 mag loads. My 223 has been the real challenge and is still a work in progress. All are TC's in carbines and/or pistols.

[osteodoc08]

If you're wanting strictly a CB moderate velocity shooter, nothing wrong with the 223. Plenty of cheap components and more rifles than you can shake a stick at.

22 Hornet et al also have their fans. Those can really be downloaded to car sneeze loads.

[telebasher]

They will keep you busy--you will need many sizing dies (boolit) powders, seating depths, powders, and crimps and also experimenting with case sizing.
It's like a disease, the more you learn the more you realize you don't know. Need more moulds and dies to experiment with, it never ends LOL !

[floydboy]

Bedbug,

All of the above advice is very good. Even if given in fun. I embarked on this madness of 22 cast boolits 2-3 years ago when 22RF got hard to find and expensive when available. I figured if I could get one to shoot I could do it as cheap as 22RF and have better distance and accuracy and get to use a better gun and scope. Until then I was happy with shooting cast in pistol and my 30-06. I had a 22-250 but it is a dedicated J-word long range rifle. I was starting from scratch to. With advice from Larry Gibson and others on here I built a 222 on a pawnshop savage. Success didn't come easy but finally I got what I was after and it is a blast. I can shoot MOA and 100 YDS is plenty far for this gun. It has taken over my rifle/pistol shooting time. Is it fun yes it is but it is also a very useful gun to have in cast. When I wanted a Browning A5 I sold a 223 to finance the project and kept the 222. That's how much I think of the gun. Good luck and don't expect it to be easy but it can be done.

Floyd

[gnoahhh]

Venturing into .22 cast bullet shooting will certainly suck you further down the rabbit hole- and a fun trip it will be! I consider rimfire performance out of a .22 centerfire shooting cast to be the best "bang for the buck", or should I say the most bangs for the buck. A bit more of a challenge than bigger bores? Well, yeah, somewhat. But not the bugabear that some would have you believe. Tons of good advice/info right here in these hallowed halls- do your due diligence and research the archives before shelling out for the tools with which to sling 50 grains of lead at .22LR velocities.

[starmac]

Don't discount the 222 either, you can still use cheap 223 brass if you want to, if the idea is saving pennies.