Decoding those Japanese/English translations on a PID

[Mike W1]

I suppose I've nothing better to do as the little REX C100 works just fine and had no trouble wiring or setting it up. But you gotta love those instructions! 3 different ones available to me and wondering if I got the correct interpretation when I attempted to read em'?

Model is FK02VAN
F = inverse/reverse action (To me means temp rises and signal is sent to lower it????)
K = TC input for K type
02 = 0-400° C Display Range (What it will read???? Doesn't really matter, 400° C is way too hot.)
V = Voltage Pulse (SSR)
A = Alarm Deviation Upper Limit
N = No second Alarm (Mine doesn't have 2nd Alarm capability)

That look about right to you guru's on PID's?

[el34]

I found several forum discussions about the C100 and although I didn't see anything that clearly defined Reverse/Direct it seemed from context the F (reverse) type is for controlling heaters.

And there were references to 'hidden' menus, mucho mystery surrounding this controller. And that you can set it to F instead of C.

If you haven't found this manual, check out pg 6-

http://www.fmfranklin.com.au/products/data/rkc/c100set.pdf

[dikman]

Sorta looks right, Mike. Although one of the menus shows a setting to switch between *F and *C (SL 2), it doesn't actually do anything (from what I can tell C100 can only read *C). As for the temp, when you select K probe it lists the temp range as 0-1372 *C, but whether it will actually read above 400*C I don't know. I suppose I should crank the temp up next time it's on and see what happens.

[Mike W1]

I found several forum discussions about the C100 and although I didn't see anything that clearly defined Reverse/Direct it seemed from context the F (reverse) type is for controlling heaters.

And there were references to 'hidden' menus, mucho mystery surrounding this controller. And that you can set it to F instead of C.

If you haven't found this manual, check out pg 6-

http://www.fmfranklin.com.au/products/data/rkc/c100set.pdf
I had not run across that one before. Had another franklin one but I'll dig thru this one and see if I can learn a little more.

[Mike W1]

Sorta looks right, Mike. Although one of the menus shows a setting to switch between *F and *C (SL 2), it doesn't actually do anything (from what I can tell C100 can only read *C). As for the temp, when you select K probe it lists the temp range as 0-1372 *C, but whether it will actually read above 400*C I don't know. I suppose I should crank the temp up next time it's on and see what happens.
Doesn't need to read above 400° for anything I'll ever do for sure but think I'll do some more reading in the other manual mentioned above. I was thinking the "02" in the model number means 400° max but who knows.

[el34]

Doesn't need to read above 400° for anything I'll ever do for sure but think I'll do some more reading in the other manual mentioned above. I was thinking the "02" in the model number means 400° max but who knows.
400C = 752F. Pretty high but not grossly out of the park. I don't ever go that high.

The chart that says K 02 = K-type and 400C range looks conclusive. There may have been the assumption that the 400 limit can be changed based on the best-case specs that didn't spell out details.

It's safe to assume the firmware (software) inside all of them is the same regardless of specific model. From an engineering and manufacturing standpoint maintaining different versions of software is very undesirable. My guess is at the time of final manufacturing a simple final step "tells" the unit how to behave. This is a VERY common technique used in electrical/electronic products with optional extra-cost firmware features- all the capability is already there but something simple is needed to enable it.


An example is the alarms on PID controllers, the software is there to support all alarms but 1-alarm models have a few electronic components left off the circuit board. Adding those components is all that's needed to make the other alarm work, the software is already there.

Looking through what I could find on Bing there were 1-2 references to a 'hidden' menu. Most of this was on beer-brewing forums.

[dikman]

Mike/el, you're right and I'm wrong (sort of). Those instructions are slightly ambiguous (I have another instruction manual with the same ambiguity). On page 14 it says input type/K/0-1372*C, whereas on page 16 it lists several different ranges for a K probe depending on the code number, in this case 02, as you said Mike. So it appears that it's limited to 400*C/752*F which doesn't really matter as that's more than enough for my needs (although I'll still try cranking it up, out of curiosity).

And I agree el that all the Rex's are probably basically the same inside, electronically speaking, with either components left out or simple strapping to change the functions. It doesn't make sense to manufacture individual integrated ccts. for each model.

[Mike W1]

Another website with useful info about PID's.
http://ecmweb.com/content/what-know-about-pid-process-controllers

OB
Interesting reading, which I'll probably have to read a few times.

[el34]

Looking on eBay I ran across a listing that had a flowchart showing the programmable functions-

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dual-PID-F-C-400-C-Digital-Temperature-Control-Controller-Thermocouple-REX-C100-/390788107261?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_2&hash=item5afcc94bfd#ht_8391wt_926

A ways down it is the flowchart, I snagged it as a picture. If I was at a Win7 computer I'd use Snipping tool to get it but here's what I could get on this XP relic. The url shown in its properties is

http://i1058.photobucket.com/albums/t408/dingzaigu/1_.jpg

This view here is unusable but the link gets a reasonable picture.

120215

[dikman]

Like all the others, it shows SL2 as switching between *F and *C, but on both of mine that function doesn't actually do anything.

I decided to cast a few more boolits for my 44-40 today, so decided to use the Rex controller. I set the SV to 470 *C to see what would happen. When the PV reached 450*C/842*F, and still going up, I figured I'd proved that it will go over 400*C.

Not that it really matters, of course, as there's no need for that sort of temp when melting lead.

[Mike W1]

Looking on eBay I ran across a listing that had a flowchart showing the programmable functions-

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dual-PID-F-C-400-C-Digital-Temperature-Control-Controller-Thermocouple-REX-C100-/390788107261?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_2&hash=item5afcc94bfd#ht_8391wt_926

A ways down it is the flowchart, I snagged it as a picture. If I was at a Win7 computer I'd use Snipping tool to get it but here's what I could get on this XP relic. The url shown in its properties is

http://i1058.photobucket.com/albums/t408/dingzaigu/1_.jpg

This view here is unusable but the link gets a reasonable picture.

120215 Looks similar to the one I bought except that M in the model number indicates it's relay output, not SSR.

[el34]

That was the first time I have seen the programming flowchart. I don't have a Rex and can't see myself buying one now that I'm really familiar with Mypin, and I'd pop the $10-12 difference just to stick with what I know.

But it's fun trying to understand things or solve little mysteries.