Lee Factory crimp die

[shooterbob]

Can anyone she'd some light on whether this really works as stated is it a gimmick. I have a hard time.letting go of my tried and true trimming but this sounds good, especially for expensive brass.

[bangerjim]

I use FCD's on my 9mm, 40 S&W, and 45 ACP's to get them to pass the "plop" test in the guns. Without it, most rounds I loaded with the standard crimp Lee dies would not go in and chamber.

After trying the FCD, EVERYTHING cycles perfectly!

It adds another step, but I feel it is worth it to get ammo that is 100% reliaable.

Semi's are "finicky" from what I have read and encountered with my guns. The FCD makes loading and shooting them a pleasure rather than a carp-shoot!

I have never trimmed pistol brass unless it is REALLY off. I do trim rifle brass.

I am sure there will be others that will trash the FCD (always is), but in my book, it is a good tool to have around when you need it. And it is cheap!

bangerjim

[Garyshome]

I use them for everything I reload [pistol].

[Bzcraig]

Only been reloading a few years but have always used one.

[dh2]

for rifles where there is a reason like my .375 H&H where bullets may shift under recoil and My Marlin 45/70 with a tubular magazine they are very worth it.

[shaggybull]

I use the FCD on all my straight wall brass

[beex215]

the seating die can be set to crimp and seat. it can be done without shaving lead. if you want to seat and then crimp with the seating die, you could do that as well.

[Mk42gunner]

shooterbob,

There are two very different styles of Lee Factory Crimp Dies. The Rifle style uses a collet to apply a user variable crimp at a set distance from the shell holder. The pistol style uses a carbide ring to squeeze the cartridge and bullet to a fixed dimension, (as I understand it).

I own a couple of rifle style dies, but the only time I have used one was when I made a .38-55 dummy round. It can apply a very deep, hard crimp, that sometimes doesn't completely iron out upon firing, at least that is what some of the pictures I have seen on the internet show.

I have never used a pistol style FCD.

Truth is all of the rifle calibers I have loaded that needed crimping, (mostly for lever actions) I have used the roll crimp shoulder in RCBS seating dies; which work just fine when adjusted right. I do have other makes of dies, it just worked out that way.

For handguns, I learned how to size the brass and projectile, then hoe to adjust the seating and crimp dies so my rounds freely chamber in my guns. I use either the roll crimp for revolvers or taper crimp for the bottom feeders.

Crimped brass doesn't really hold the bullet in place upon firing, neck tension does that. What a crimp will do, is keep said bullet from seating deeper while feeding.

The only honest recommendation I can make is to keep an open mind and try them if you think you really need them; but billions of rounds were loaded before they ever came to market.

Robert

[altheating]

I use the Lee FCD on all of my 22 hornets, K hornets and 222's and it helps a bunch with accuracy. I tried it on ammo for a 357 mag rifle and my accuracy went away, so I went back to crimping with the RCBS die. I'm not sure why it affected accuracy as much as it did, but it was not worth messing with any more.

[jcwit]

I use them for bottle neck rifle calibers.

I'm of the camp that believes and in my experience they post since a lead bullet after seating. I'm able to adjust my handgun dies using a taper crimp or a roll crimp.

[pworley1]

I use them on all my pistol rounds.

[bedbugbilly]

I use FCD on my 38/357 and my 9mm - i really like them - all I load is "cast". I find the FCD especially helpful in the 9mm loading - after running through the FCD, they all slide in to my 9mm cartridge gauge.

[TCFAN]

I use the Lee Factory Crimp Die for any bottle neck cartridge that requires a expander die such as a Lyman M die.On some I just take the flair out and on others I use it to crimp the boolit.Cast or jacketed.
I use the Lee Carbide Factory Crimp die for any straight wall cartridge that will use a boolit that is the same diameter as a jacketed bullet such as a 45ACP and some 38 specials. ......Terry

[1lonewolf75]

It came with my .30-30 die set so I use it. I would probably wind up havin the extra step as I would seat then crimp anyway so... Yes billions have been loaded without and still are and nothin wrong with that. Use what works fer you I say. I have heard bout the reliability of crimped semi auto rounds not bein satisfactory. In fact I have a friend who wont load fer semis at all cept fer his .50 desert eagle because of it, maybe ill tell him bout the FCD fixin the reliability accordin to many people.

[robg]

work well on my .223 & .308,especialy with my lead loads inthe .308

[Wayne Smith]

With the pistol FCD it is a big if. If your bore will accept a boolit that is the size resulting from the FCD without leading it works great. If your barrel needs a larger boolit than the FCD carbide ring it won't produce for you. You will be looking at leading and wondering why and condemning the die.

[mdi]

I own two Lee FCD collet style dies and use them nearly every time I reload those calibers. I had a Lee FCD die for straight sided cases for mebbe 8.5 days (it now resides in a landfill in Southern Oregon). I have found no need for a handgun FCD as there has never been a time I could not get my handgun ammo to chamber easily with merely adjusting my dies correctly (oversize cast, jacketed bullets, revolver and semi-auto). I am not a Lee Hater, which accusations usually comes after I state my reasons for not using an FCD for handguns...

[Bayou52]

Can anyone she'd some light on whether this really works as stated is it a gimmick. I have a hard time.letting go of my tried and true trimming but this sounds good, especially for expensive brass.

Make no bones about it, these dies work and work well. I've got one for each caliber I load.

Here's a snap of some 44 mags that have been run through the FCD.

Bayou52

[jmort]

Yes indeed. That is why they are the highest rated dies.

[jcwit]

Wonder how all those billions of cast/jacketed rounds were reloaded with little to no problems before this die was invented?

All those who bash Lee, but then the LFCD is the greatest thing since sliced bread.

[Bayou52]

Wonder how all those billions of cast/jacketed rounds were reloaded with little to no problems before this die was invented?

All those who bash Lee, but then the LFCD is the greatest thing since sliced bread.

If it's a good product, you just gotta say it's a good product. If it's a bad product, you just gotta say it's a bad product.

No matter whose name is on it......

Lee FCDs are good products that work well. I'm sold on them.......


Bayou52

[dragon813gt]

I've heard the Lee Pistol FCD described as an answer to a question no one asked. I have them but don't use them. I do use the collet FCDs. They are a great product. I see no need for the pistol version.

[MT Chambers]

The FCD are the most misunderstood dies made, some people actually believe they are good for something. A regular die set does all the crimping necessary and then some, anything else will just damage(size) the bullet in the case neck.

[jcwit]

If it's a good product, you just gotta say it's a good product. If it's a bad product, you just gotta say it's a bad product.

No matter whose name is on it......

Lee FCDs are good products that work well. I'm sold on them.......


Bayou52

And you are entitled to that opinion.

To think that a crimping a lead bullet already seated in a case with a FCD shrinking the size to a smaller diameter is just plain folly.

[jmort]

"... some people actually believe they are good for something."

Most, not some people. There is a tiny minority that dislikes them. There is good reason the are the highest rated dies. If you use over SAAMI spec lead bullets, the handgun FCD can swage the bullet. Otherwise, they promote uniformity and concentricity.

[jcwit]

"... some people actually believe they are good for something."

Most, not some people. There is a tiny minority that dislikes them. There is good reason the are the highest rated dies. If you use over SAAMI spec lead bullets, the handgun FCD can swage the bullet. Otherwise, they promote uniformity and concentricity.

Are not cast lead bullets almost always over SAAMI specs, so as to prevent leading?

And you claim "most"? You have access to actual polls and sales records and the actual number of those who bought them and really do use them?

Quite a statement you made there.

Please post links as to just where these LFCD are rated as the highest.

Inquiring minds want to know.

[jcwit]

"... some people actually believe they are good for something."

Most, not some people. There is a tiny minority that dislikes them. There is good reason the are the highest rated dies. If you use over SAAMI spec lead bullets, the handgun FCD can swage the bullet. Otherwise, they promote uniformity and concentricity.



Are not cast lead bullets almost always over SAAMI specs, so as to prevent leading?
And you claim "most"? You have access to actual polls and sales records and the actual number of those who bought them and really do use them?
Quite a statement you made there.
Please post links as to just where these LFCD are rated as the highest.
Inquiring minds want to know.
Example, 9mm luger SAAMI spec calls for bullet dia. .3555, in my reloads I either size .357 or .358 depending of the slug dia. plus 1 or 2 thousands. This same holds true for other calibers.

[jcwit]

Wonder why I can never edit a post any longer?

[dragon813gt]

If they are designed to SAAMI spec then why aren't they consistent? I don't think most reloaders use or want them. And I'm no Lee basher. Almost all of my dies are Lee. One of the statements you hear about pistol FCDs and lead bullets is "try your's because you never know if it's going to post size the bullet or not." I don't think any of mine are to SAAMI spec, most run over.

Answer this question. If you load a jacketed round w/out a pistol FCD and have zero to let's say .002 runout, what will a FCD then do?

[Bayou52]

I can see where there are a lot of differing opinions on the Lee FCD - from positive to negative and in between.

In my personal experience, these dies apply nice collett style crimps in both rifle and straight walled
pistol cases. For straight walled pistol cases, the crimp ring in the seater dies did a good job for me for decades.

My experience with some rifle cases was different. Particularly, the smaller rifle cases like the 223s, for example. In these type of smaller necked cases, the problem I had with crimping with the seater die was that a slight difference in trim length resulted, from time to time, in buckled case necks. Not as much with stauncher larger caliber rifle cases.

The collett style Lee FCD eliminates the risk of buckled necks in these smaller rifle cases where there's a slight difference in trim lengths.

I don't apply heavy crimps in any cartridge other than tubular fed cases, like 30-30, and some magnum pistol calibers like 357 and 44 mag. Otherwise, only a slight crimp is applied using the Lee FCD.

BTW, I'm not a "Lee" guy but rather a RCBS "green" guy.

Bayou52

[ourflat]

use both Lee and RCBS dies. Each to his/her own but I did have a problem with my Lee dies when reforming 5.56 cases to 300 Blackout. Problem was solved using my RCBS dies. I don't factory crimp my reloads with this gun because I don't want the higher pressure blowing out my primers from the case in this gun.

Frank

[jmort]

"You have access to actual polls and sales records and the actual number of those who bought them and really do use them?"

The poll on this site is 2/3 for and 1/3 against. On Midway USA the reviews are uniformly pro handgun FCD, making them the highest rated dies.

"Are not cast lead bullets almost always over SAAMI specs, so as to prevent leading?"
No. The SAAMI spec for lead bullets is .359" and most commercial cast bullets are .358" Jacketed bullet spec is .358" and most commercial jacketed bullets are .357."

Love the "logic" about how many rounds were loaded prior to the invention of the handgun FCDs. Using that same "logic," we all should be driving a car/truck with a carburetor and points. People should use what they want, but keep it real. Amazing.

[bangerjim]

Here we go again!

We should be loadnig and shooting.....not arguing on here!

banger...............out shooting!

[jmort]

Thank you Mr. Ghandi. How can one disagree with that.? I know in the last year you have been here, you have been in a couple/few "discussions." But, discussion is useful. In semi-auto pistols, the FCD makes sense with jacketed bullets and can make sense with cast bullets.

[mdi]

Discussions about the Lee FCD for straight walled cartridges are useless. Either one is a fan, or one is logical and does not use it. It is a very simple tool that has unfortunately been elevated to "necessity" status for reasons unknown to me. My dies have been making ammo that will fit in my chambers for prolly 30 years and the time I did use an FCD, it ruined my lovingly assembled handloads...

I normally try to stay out of these discussions as nuttin' positive comes out of most "discssions" other than "I use an FCD and..." and "I don't use an FCD because...". So, I'll leave this one alone from now on...:coffee:

[RobS]

With the pistol FCD it is a big if. If your bore will accept a boolit that is the size resulting from the FCD without leading it works great. If your barrel needs a larger boolit than the FCD carbide ring it won't produce for you. You will be looking at leading and wondering why and condemning the die.

Bingo, and is a band aid for rounds not assembled correctly IMO. The Lee rifle collet FCD is a nice die though.

[Motor]

As Mk42gunner stated there are 2 very different FCDs. They should have given them 2 different names.

It looks like a lot of you are not going to like my post but that's just fine with me at least you would have read it.

Pistol FCD's have a carbide ring in them. This ring will "post size" anything that is larger than minimum chamber spec. This is great except to do that it has to be smaller than mimimum chamber spec.

This is no problem with jacketed bullets because they are tough enough not to be eaisly re-shaped.

BUT: With cast boolits that normally are larger in diameter and with plated bullets this "post sizing" can resize your boolit within the case itself. If this occures you will loose nearly 100% of your neck tension. Why? Because the brass springs back a little and the bullet does not.

[jcwit]

"You have access to actual polls and sales records and the actual number of those who bought them and really do use them?"

The poll on this site is 2/3 for and 1/3 against. On Midway USA the reviews are uniformly pro handgun FCD, making them the highest rated dies.







You are basing the acceptance of the LFCD on its use only on who like it here and on the Midway site?

Our total membership is 35,464.

I belong to 2 other firearm sites who's membership far exceeds that, one is 199,716, the other is 139, 442. Even this site is not infallible.

The site with 199,716 members pretty much refutes the acceptable use of the LFCD.

[jcwit]

"Are not cast lead bullets almost always over SAAMI specs, so as to prevent leading?"
No. The SAAMI spec for lead bullets is .359" and most commercial cast bullets are .358" Jacketed bullet spec is .358" and most commercial jacketed bullets are .357."






Alright, what does the cartridge mike after using a LFCD in the caliber you are referencing to?

Then take the case wall thickness X 2 and add the lead bullet diameter .358 or .359 and tell me it does not post size the lead bullet.

[waco]

Cast and size a boolit to .3585", load in a .38SPL case, run through said FCD, pull boolit, it measures .357"

I'll use them on jacketed bullets, NEVER with my cast. The RCBS cowboy crimp dies is money!

[jmort]

I agree. Works great with jacketed. I have a couple special run .357 collet style, aka Ranch Dog handgun FCDs for cast bullets. The pistol FCDs work well with jacketed bullets.

[dragon813gt]

Lee makes a rifle style collet FCD for straight wall pistol cartridges like 38/357 and 44 Magnum if you didn't know.

[jcwit]

Cast and size a boolit to .3585", load in a .38SPL case, run through said FCD, pull boolit, it measures .357"

I'll use them on jacketed bullets, NEVER with my cast. The RCBS cowboy crimp dies is money!

Correct! Jacketed OK! Lead???????????????????????????????????

[jcwit]

Lee makes a rifle style collet FCD for straight wall pistol cartridges like 38/357 and 44 Magnum if you didn't know.

Post a link, I can't find it.

[jmort]

I have two, in .357 mag.

http://leeprecision.com/custom-factory-crimp-die-over-runs/

If there no overstock then you go here

http://leeprecision.com/pistol-factory-crimp-die/

[jcwit]

Thanks.

[UNIQUEDOT]

Only problem I have with the pistol collet dies is I have NEVER been able to get either of them apart for cleaning! My rifle dies can be pulled apart by hand, but I gave up on getting the pistol die inserts out.

[r1kk1]

http://leeprecision.net/support/index.php?/Knowledgebase/Article/View/48/8/custom-factory-crimp-dies

There are limitations like no 50 AE and other cartridges.

I don't own a Pistol FCD. I have multiple semiauto's and revolvers including one 1911 with a kart barrel that is a match barrel. No problems. I shoot a few condom bullets. I can't comment on this as I can't see a need for this. I use dies from CH4D, RCBS, Hornady and Redding.

I've been working with the Lee rifle FCD and the consistent crimp tool. I've noticed improvements with target group and chronograph readings but it can be over done. I have two cartridges I've been working with and these are shot in an Encore. I like it so far. I have a couple of wildcats for the 110 Savage I will try next. It's early yet but I believe the same thing can be accomplished with other crimp dies. I don't know yet.

Dave owned 4D die company before he bought CH. He made a post sizing crimp die for the 223 around 1970. I believe he did more dies for both pistol and rifle. He did talk me into a taper crimp die for my .44 mag loads. So far so good shooting 255 grain cast at 1570 fps with a 10" barrel and .003" cylinder gap. I may have him make one for the 500 Linebaugh. I used to use Redding Profile Crimp dies for the heavy hitters.

To each his own I guess.

Take care

r1kk1

[Motor]

Lee makes a rifle style collet FCD for straight wall pistol cartridges like 38/357 and 44 Magnum if you didn't know.

I have one for 45-70 and just love it. These do not post size, just crimp but with a collet. I did not about the 38/357 and 44 mag ones. Those would be perfect in a progressive press loading cast boolits.

[tazman]

And you are entitled to that opinion.

To think that a crimping a lead bullet already seated in a case with a FCD shrinking the size to a smaller diameter is just plain folly.

If you have a properly made FCD and are using normally sized boolits(no more than .002 over standard groove diameter), the FCD will not even touch the case on the way down let alone reduce the diameter of the boolit below spec.
I use this die specifically because my 9mm has a generous throat. I often use boolits as cast without sizing them.
If I somehow wasn't holding the mold just right or didn't get the mold quite closed and produced an oversize boolit, the fcd will make sure the round will chamber. I know, if I ran every boolit through a sizing die I wouldn't have to worry about that problem. Call me lazy if you wish. I call it efficiency.

I have pulled boolits that my FCD die reduced in size and the boolit measured nominal(for me that is .358 for my 9mm).
I also use it as the taper crimp in the fourth hole of my turret press as I final crimp after seating. This system works fine for me.

[tazman]

Cast and size a boolit to .3585", load in a .38SPL case, run through said FCD, pull boolit, it measures .357"

I'll use them on jacketed bullets, NEVER with my cast. The RCBS cowboy crimp dies is money!
I have loaded boolits in my 38 special brass(mixed) up to.359 and never had the FCD reduce the size of my boolits. If I load .360-.361 it will size them down to about .359.
Since I tumble lube my boolits this means I don't need to run them through a sizer before I load them. This eliminates one step since .358-.359 shoot beautifully in my revolver.

Your experience suggests that Lee doesn't make the FCD to perfectly consistent sizes. If, as in your case, you get one that is a little small you will have problems. Maybe I just got lucky with mine.

[jcwit]

I have loaded boolits in my 38 special brass(mixed) up to.359 and never had the FCD reduce the size of my boolits. If I load .360-.361 it will size them down to about .359.
Since I tumble lube my boolits this means I don't need to run them through a sizer before I load them. This eliminates one step since .358-.359 shoot beautifully in my revolver.

Your experience suggests that Lee doesn't make the FCD to perfectly consistent sizes. If, as in your case, you get one that is a little small you will have problems. Maybe I just got lucky with mine.

Problem being is not all barrels are consistant. That is why we slug the barrels.

But do as you wish if it works for you.

[ehsa]

i like them and use them on several calibers.john

[DougGuy]

Only problem I have with the pistol collet dies is I have NEVER been able to get either of them apart for cleaning! My rifle dies can be pulled apart by hand, but I gave up on getting the pistol die inserts out.

They come out quite easy. Find a socket or something round that fits fairly snug in the die body, stick it on top of a vise and let the bottom of the collet hang loosely between the jaws, put socket or other round item down inside the body against the top of the collet and hit it with a hammer, the collet will pop out the bottom.

I use the collet style FCD on straight walled cases with heavy boolits. They make an even crimp that even under the heaviest recoil, the boolits do not move at all. Case life is somewhat less as to be expected, but if you want a crimp that provides even pressure from round to round, this one does it. I like to modify mine to prevent sizing down of the driving band which the unmodified die will do. This die will also crimp a smooth sided boolit either cast or j-worded where there is no cannelure or crimp groove. It does things no roll crimp or cowboy crimp or profile crimp or taper crimp can do. These are still stocked by Lee, but they are an uncatalogued item and hard to find on their site. If you enter a basic search, they won't be found. If you search specifically by sku# you will find them.

Here is a pic thread showing how I modify my collet style FCD for use with .45 Colt loads, I do the same for .44 Magnum: http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?201449-Question-about-type-of-crimp-required&p=2239315&viewfull=1#post2239315


As far as the other style of FCD for handgun rounds, the ones with the carbide ring in the bottom of the die, several things need to be mentioned. First, many people don't really understand how these work because if they did, there wouldn't be all these misleading stories and half truths circulating about them. IF you are using factory style boolits, as in SAAMI spec for the bore, not oversized like many of us use, the carbide ring in the FCD will basically do nothing to the boolit diameter. A .357" boolit will stay .357" after running a loaded round through the FCD's carbide ring. Same with a .451" boolit in a .45 ACP. The downsizing becomes an issue as boolit diameter is increased, and if you load a .359" boolit in a .357 Magnum case and run it through the carbide ring of the FCD, it will NOT BE .359" when it comes back out, it will be swaged down smaller by the carbide ring. Same with a .452" or larger in a .45 ACP case, it will size down any boolit over .451" diameter.

Bottom line, if you are using boolits that are .001" or .002" over what the factory loaded rounds for that caliber would use, then don't use the carbide ring style FCD for handgun ammo as it will downsize the boolits in the loaded ammo you use it on. If you are using same diameter as factory loaded ammo would use, the FCD will do nothing to downsize the boolits in your loaded ammo.

Another interesting thing about these dies with the carbide ring, rumor has it they are made from scraps of carbide that Lee would ordinarily have no use for, and they are NOT CREATED EQUAL! Some of these carbide rings are larger than others, some will downsize even factory diameter boolits, some will not, depending on the luck of the draw as to what the final diameter of loaded ammo will be.

Meaning that if you got a .45 ACP FCD and you use .452" cast boolits in your 1911, and you process a loaded round with the FCD and then pull the boolit, if it still measures .452" after pulling, consider yourself VERY lucky as most will not have the same results. The majority of boolits pulled after using this die, will be smaller than they were before using it.

[gsdelong]

I was able to get 357 41mag 44 mag 45lc and 460 s&w in the ranch dog version out of the close out section. Love these no carbide ring collet style.

[UNIQUEDOT]

Doug I tried that, but was using wooden dowels. I had them installed in a classic cast whilst doing the hammering and I never could get the collets to pop out of either one. Maybe I was using too small diameter dowels? Next time I try it I'll try something larger, but I'm pretty sure I also tried a small socket in the 45 die.

[DougGuy]

Doug I tried that, but was using wooden dowels. I had them installed in a classic cast whilst doing the hammering and I never could get the collets to pop out of either one. Maybe I was using too small diameter dowels? Next time I try it I'll try something larger, but I'm pretty sure I also tried a small socket in the 45 die.

You gotta get one that pretty much fills the die body snugly as this will allow it to push down on the top of the collet fingers and not damage the thinner more fragile crimping ring. Classic Cast is plenty enough to hold the die body while you knock it out.

[Fox Pass]

Problem being is not all barrels are consistant. That is why we slug the barrels.

But do as you wish if it works for you.

Wow this guy is not going to give this up.
Trying to get .454 for a fat running smith barrel the FCD post sized back to standard, switched back to dillon crimp also post sized, finally had to cut a long colt back to crimp 45 ACP at .454.

Project worked gun gained 2 inches accuracy at 50 yards but now had a wildcat 45 ACP cartridge that didn't fit any other gun. Sold the gun scrape the project but learned and enjoyed the process.