My Crockett seems to have soured... not really, just whining.

[SPRINGFIELDM141972]

I have been having a heck of a time getting my .32 Crockett dialed in this year.

When I purchased this rifle eight years ago, I purchased a Lee .311 RB mold and scrounged up some tight weave cotton from my ragbag and with 20gr of FFF I was able to get reasonable accuracy at 30 yards. (1.25").

I shot the rifle quite a bit every year, during squirrel season and all was good. Well I ran out of my ragbag patch material and purchased some pillow ticking. Since this change, all has gone south. My 40 yard target looks like it what shot by a shotgun.

I've up the charge, I've dropped the charge to no avail. I don't have a clue what the previous material was, but it sure worked better than this pillow ticking.

Anyone using anything other than pillow ticking in their .32?

[fishhawk]

.010 ox-yoke precut with Crisco as a lube

[mooman76]

Pillow ticking comes in different thicknesses and qualities. Try another one. I haven't tried it yet but another board has been talking allot about pocket drill or drill material. Its cheaper than pillow ticking and as good or better. Problem is some people go to a cloth store and allot of the people there no little to nothing about the products they sell. They are just there to sell. Pocket drill or drill cloth is made heavy and strong because it is used to make pockets in pants and won't last long if it isn't strong. A thin denim will also work good as it is strong and I had some military BDU material where I cut the sleeves short. It is also very strong but make sure it is all cotton, not cotton blend.

[johnson1942]

take your precut patches and work in some alox lube by lee. when it is completly dry work in some thompson bore butter or utter lube avail at a farm store. it may cure your gun. also wipe between shots so the bore is semi clean.

[fouronesix]

It may or may not be the patching material. Did you measure the thickness of the old material? Do you have an idea about how it was woven and how thick the thread was and how tight the weave was? Was there a diagonal pattern to the weave?. etc. With some of that knowledge you can go to most any fabric shop, even wallyworld, and try to match what the old was.

[Boogieman]

.012 linen with moose milk for lub. for range use or a soft mix of bees wax & olive oil for hunting. old napkins or table clothes from yard sales work good.

[johnson1942]

boogieman is right. linen cant be beat. i got some linen cloth off of the internet. it is so tough that you could reuse the patches if you lubed them again as they stay very intact.

[JeffinNZ]

My money is on the change in patching material.

[Fly]

Do you cast your own balls?If so are you using pure lead?Some little something like that for sure.

Fly

[Boogieman]

Do you cast your own balls?If so are you using pure lead?Some little something like that for sure.

FlyFly is right . hard lead, like wheel weights, will cut patches when loading. check your fired patches if they are damaged your groups will open up. the ball& patch fit is the biggest factor in accuracy followed by powder charge ,& patch lub is last.

[dondiego]

I never cut patches when I load WW balls.

[SPRINGFIELDM141972]

I inspected the pillow ticking patches and found no cutting or burning through.
Fly- Yes, I am using the Lee .311 mold. I am casting in pure lead.
Fouronesix- I didn't measure it or pay much attention to it. I grabbed it out of the rag bag because it looked right and it worked so I never paid any mind to the details. I figured I would take it into a material store when I needed more. Well, I lost it in my move from Alaska back to the lower 48.
Boogieman- I'll dig up some linen and give it a shot. When I'm able to get back to the house.

[Fly]

If you are using the same lube, powder, & balls but lost the patch materal I would
think that must be it.Sounds like ever thing is the same but your patches.


Let us know when you get it right Fly

[SPRINGFIELDM141972]

I will post the results.

[waksupi]

Something I haven't seen mentioned. If it is a caplock, change the nipple. If the flash hole has enlarged, it will not shoot well.

[SPRINGFIELDM141972]

Waksupi,

That had not crossed my mind. I'll give it a try and see if it makes a difference. It will be a bit before I get home, I'm working out of state trying to get a sunk boat off the bottom.

:groner:

[bedbugbilly]

If you have a piece of your old patching material - measure the thickness with a micrometer. The take the piece and your micrometer to the fabric store. Check the various pillow ticking, cotton denim and lined until you find several that look like they might work and buy a 1/4 yard of each. Then try them in the same manner that you used your old patching. Keep track of what you are buying - have the clerk write down what each piece of materials and the bolt number. If you find something that works - they go back and buy a quantity of it.

Changing lubes, etc. in mid-stream only "changes things" and throws another problem in to the equation. Stick with what you were using as far as lube, etc. and work on the patching material. It may take a little work but you'll run across something that will work. Over the years, I've had to do the same thing with a couple of rifles that were finicky on patching. I learned a long time ago that when I found a patching material that works, buy a number of yards of it. If you sell the rifle, the material can always be used for cleaning patches. Good luck!

[Hanshi]

My Crockett gave splendid accuracy years ago when I used old cotton t-shirts. Later, using .015" pillow ticking, the accuracy remained just as good. The .311" Lee ball is perfect for that little rifle. The nipple problem does seem plausible.

[SPRINGFIELDM141972]

Well, I burned a half of a pound of powder yesterday to no great improvement.

A few things I found that helped but didn't completely correct the problem.

1. Changed the nipple.

2. Tried a different patch material and spit patched it. Things got better, but the patches were being torn up, so I spit patched the pillow ticking and accuracy stayed improved (3-1/2" @ 40 yards)

3. Found my powder horn had 2F in it, changed to 3F.

Here's what puzzles me more than the over all accuracy. I get 4 to 6 shots that will stack next to one another, let say at 10 o'clock then I get 3 or 4 that print at 5 o'clock, then 2 that will print at 6 o'clock.

I started wiping between shots, thinking it could be a product of fouling but it changed nothing.

It's driving me mad...

Any suggestions would be welcome.

[mooman76]

Guys on a Traditional board have been recommending lately something called drill cloth or pocket drill. This cloth is used for making pockets and is made tougher because pockets need to be tough for obvious reasons. If you are tearing or cutting patches you won't like get good accuracy so that needs to be solved. If you developed a rough spot more shooting will eventually smooth it out of you could us something like JB bore paste or other method to smooth the bore.
I recently purchased a 36 cal rifle. It's in good shape but first time out just destroyed patched. Nothing but shreds left. Lighter charges helped but not much. I got a stronger patch material and it helped allot. Patches held together but were cut at the lands. I think even though it is an older gun, I don't think it was ever shot enough to be broke in, possibly because it didn't shoot good to start with. I don't have a good bore light for it but of what I could see, the bore looked smooth for the most part but I could see some machine marks in the rifling. I was using(in the end) some old cotton BDU material. It is very strong and kind of like a not so thick denim.

[Maven]

"Here's what puzzles me more than the over all accuracy. I get 4 to 6 shots that will stack next to one another, let say at 10 o'clock then I get 3 or 4 that print at 5 o'clock, then 2 that will print at 6 o'clock." ...Springfield....

Springfield...., Any chance there's a ding on the crown? Also, aside from drill cloth, consider cotton duck, denim, whatever 100% cotton material drop cloths are made of, but make sure you take a micrometer with you to measure their thickness. Lastly, and this may be the easiest to try, as you can use the same patch material you now use, why not try an over powder patch? They do prevent "blown" or torn patches, but they also boost pressure & velocity, so you may want to drop your powder charge. Just some food for thought.

[SPRINGFIELDM141972]

I checked the crown and there is no signs of damage.
I'm loading 22-1/2 grains so it isn't overloading and anything less opens the pattern up farther.
I just don't understand why it is printing close groups all over the target. I have am being extremely careful to load exactly the same every time. I'm beginning to wonder if the ball weights are not consistent and that is giving me fits. I'm willing to look at anything at this point.

[Maven]

Glad to learn there's no crown damage, Springfield....! Try the OP patch, but reduce the charge by 10% - 15% Btw, black powder and Pyrodex aren't nearly as efficient [propellants] as smokeless powder, so 1/2 gr. - 2gr. differences in volume are fairly meaningless.

[fouronesix]

Small calibers tend to be finicky- the smaller, the more finicky. If it has a patent breech those can get fouled and require special cleaning. Very small changes in bore condition, patch, the roundball used, etc. affect small calibers in greater proportion than similar small changes in larger calibers.

Cleaning technique? Any chance for some corrosion starting to eat the bore's surface especially down in the bowels near the breech? A tight oiled patched jag run down a clean bore can reveal unevenness of friction or rough spots.

At this point- just grasping for straws.

[SPRINGFIELDM141972]

Maven - I give the OP wad a shot and see what happens.
fouronesix - I am borderline OCD when it comes to cleaning my blackpowder bores. I have not felt any rough spots in the bore.

[fouronesix]

OCD- me too when it comes to cleaning my firearms. I believe that's a good thing.

For sure give the over-powder wad a try. Sometimes I've had improvement using a dense felt wad under a patched roundball.

Since nothing is off the table, you might even try a swaged ball. I think Hornady makes makes them for 32cal.

[Squeeze]

.311 is a smaller size for that gun, I bet the problem is you need a thicker patch. try going to .018, or even .020+ I have molds in .310, .311, .315. (theres also .319 and 1-1/2 buck available) each will shoot well, its just a matter of finding the right patch thickness for the bore

[SPRINGFIELDM141972]

Update.

I have gone through all the suggestions one by one, and then tried combinations of the suggestions. I wasn't having success. I was down trodden to say the least. Then through sheer frustration, I loaded the rifle with 25 grains of FFF, loaded a leather OP wad lubed with beeswax and Crisco, grabbed a cotton T-shirt cleaning patch (dry) and loaded it under a .315 RB and fired it at the target. I hit 3/4" left of the bull at 11 o'clock. The next round 3/8" right of the previous. For the next five rounds everything grouped in a 3/4" cluster, then a flier through it out to an 1-1/2". I ran a spit patch down the bore and the next five rounds fell right back in place.

I never would have thought to try T-shirt material, but I ain't arguing with what works.

Regards,
Everett

[Maven]

Glad the gun is shooting better, Everett! Isn't odd how stuff that's not supposed to work, e.g., T-shirt patching, sometimes does?

[SPRINGFIELDM141972]

Maven - I kinda thought all along that the ball/patch fit was tight. Seemed awfully hard to start and seat the previous combinations but the measurements added up to what I was attempting to use.