Im not sure what I did but I know it isn't right

[adanymous]

I bought a new NOE mold a few weeks ago, I can't recall the model, but its a 4 cavity 358 hp mold that beagle accidentally sold me on with his tempting pics. Anyhow it sticks bullets something fierce. I have ran my hotplate all the way to the top preheating it. Run my lee pot on high, smoked the cavities etc etc, but you have to beat the bullets out of it and half of them come out with jacked up driving bands from how they come out of the mold canted. They also end up with out of round HPs from being stuck in the cavity when I open the mold and the pin trying to pry the bullet out of the cavity which is what is messing up the driving bands too. Ive been trying to open the mold just enough for the bullet to fall out but it still happens

I use an old plastic rem 870 stock to whack the nut on the handles, I noticed today that I was whacking too much and actually bent the handles a bit. But if you don't whack it, the bullets don't budge. I also cracked that stock.

I know I'm whacking it too hard at this point, but what else can be done to make this thing drop bullets?

[sawzall]

Does the boolit have square cut lube grooves? If so, there can be a problem with the grooves actually being wider at the bottom of the groove than the top, effectively locking the boolits into the cavities. I've never had the problem, and I doubt that a mold from NOE would have that problem, but they sure sound like they are sticking something fierce if they are stretching the hollow point cavities when opening. Contact Al at NOE maybe he can offer some insight.

[nagantguy]

Never had one stick that bad, have had luck with a propane touch to get a mold up toheat that was reluctant to release boolits. The following state is blasphemy; avert your eyes to save your self; before I knew better I used a release agent on my one and only mold at the time, seem to remember a heavy sulfur smell and and a cold chill in my spine but it worked.

[mannyCA]

I know what you mean about using mold release. I usually smoke problem molds for a while, say 20 minutes, constantly using strike any wheres till I get a heavy coating.

[adanymous]

I might have to pester Al in the morning about it, I thought to today but figured it was something stupid I was doing and I could resolve it here without having to bother him. It has been that way every time I tried it. Ive probably run 1000 or so through it trying different methods. Got my best 400 today but still lost a huge number of bullets to damage coming out of the mold.

[RickinTN]

Sounds like to me you are opening the mold too soon, before the bullet has cooled sufficiently to release. This could be why it's tearing the bands and stretching the HP. As hot as you are running the mold and the melt it will take a pretty good while for it to cool enough to release good bullets. Try casting at about 725 degrees.
Rick

[adanymous]

Im giving a pretty solid 6 count before I cut the sprue. I don't have a thermometer yet. Also Im getting a nice clean cut on the sprue, no tearing. Which to my understanding indicates cool enough lead. Im no expert, just explaining my methods.

[SwedeNelson]

adanymous

It sure sounds like we have a problem mould!
If you would like to send it back will check it out.

We will fix, replace or get you a refund - no problem

Sorry for the inconvenience
Bullet maker, maker
Al Nelson

[35 shooter]

Not sure if this helps, but i cast without a themometer and my NOE moulds rain boolits....but, if they get too hot they or any of my moulds stick and i have to wait longer to open the mould.
If i start out counting to 6 or 7 and open, after a while the mould gets hotter and i have to wait to 9 or ten to open.
When that happens i turn the temp down on the pot or let the mould cool a minute or two or touch the mould bottom to a wet sponge for a few seconds to keep the right temp and boolit release going.
Anyway when the temps right they drop when i open the mould and i've noticed those boolits will always weigh within + or= .5 gr. or better.

[1johnlb]

adanymous

It sure sounds like we have a problem mould!
If you would like to send it back will check it out.

We will fix, replace or get you a refund - no problem

Sorry for the inconvenience
Bullet maker, maker
Al Nelson

Now that's just plain out good service, right there!
NOE gets my business.

[ShooterAZ]

Running the hotplate on max high & having the pot cranked on max high = WAY too hot. Using an 870 stock to beat the boolits out? That is where you need to stop, and figure things out. A bigger hammer won't help. Swede is going to take care of you, thankfully. You more than likely ruined the mold, and possibly the handles too. You really need to get a thermometer. The NOE HP molds are not your run of the mill molds. I don't recommend them for beginner casters. Having said that, mine gave me a little bit of frustration until I figured out the temperature mine like to be run...then the boolits truly do just rain out of them. The pins gently tilt them out, and they just fall off with just a slight shake. I have never ran my HP molds over 700 degrees.

[runfiverun]

yep try running things cooler.
I found with many of the new style molds such as my new NOE, and newer accurates I can run them from cold up into the zone.
if I go much hotter, the boolit quality suffers and I can't just shake them from the mold anymore.
as soon as I need to tap the handles I need to turn things down and slow up a bit..

smoke? no way, if I need to add a coating of insulation I need to free the mold up with a little polishing or I need to find the problem. [burr]

[Beagle333]

Was that the 360 160 WFN? That one can be a little bit "sticky" due to the square grooves, but it shouldn't require a spanking. A little tapping maybe. When you get it back and running, perhaps you should try a little mold release of some sort until you get the "feel" for when to drop them. That particular one is my favorite boolit, but it does seem to have a narrow "happy zone" when it will just rain boolits without any effort. It will do it.... but it must be learned. Keep at it and try to recognize exactly when you find the happy zone and keep it there as long as you can while casting.
I don't know if it can be done without a thermometer and watching it closely.... but it can be done. :mrgreen:
http://i613.photobucket.com/albums/tt214/shutupandjump/cast%20boolits/DSC03545_zps0200aa70.jpg

http://i613.photobucket.com/albums/tt214/shutupandjump/cast%20boolits/jan30002_zps3895f27a.jpg

[fastfire]

Deburr the mold?

[Bzcraig]

Sounds to me like Al gave you the best answer.

[waco]

Was that the 360 160 WFN? That one can be a little bit "sticky" due to the square grooves, but it shouldn't require a spanking. A little tapping maybe. When you get it back and running, perhaps you should try a little mold release of some sort until you get the "feel" for when to drop them. That particular one is my favorite boolit, but it does seem to have a narrow "happy zone" when it will just rain boolits without any effort. It will do it.... but it must be learned. Keep at it and try to recognize exactly when you find the happy zone and keep it there as long as you can while casting.
I don't know if it can be done without a thermometer and watching it closely.... but it can be done. :mrgreen:
http://i613.photobucket.com/albums/tt214/shutupandjump/cast%20boolits/DSC03545_zps0200aa70.jpg

http://i613.photobucket.com/albums/tt214/shutupandjump/cast%20boolits/jan30002_zps3895f27a.jpg

Interesting. I have this same RG2 brass mold. I have the same problem. I have seen this window before. Your right. It works well when all is right. If it's not though , ugh. What a pain. Man. I need a thermometer.

[Magana559]

I have the same problem with the 180 gr WFN 358 rg mold. I just thought that was the nature of the beast. Already cracked two mold handles. Once they released they just slide off the pins

[adanymous]

I have been trying to get a thermometer for a few weeks. But it seems like every time I make a buck I spend 2 lately. The gun business has slowed WAY down so Ive been spend conscious all summer.

When I say Im running the hot plate and the pot on hot I mean I have been from med to hot trying to find the sweet spot. I didn't start there. I just haven't found that spot yet.

Im not sure its a problem mold I may just be messing it up. It is my first experience with this type of mold.

The plastic 870 stock isn't a bigger hammer solution, it just happened to be layin around one day when I started casting some bullets. I couldn't find a stick to use so I grabbed it. Im sorry its cracked as Ive grown to like the way it fits my hand and it provides a nice thud to the handles with little effort. I never thought it would bend the handles. The mold has not been damaged in any way that is obvious to me. But the handles have bent a bit at the bolt.

[SharpsShooter]

Well it looks like NOE has discovered just the guy to do their endurance testing.:kidding: Seriously though, it does sound as a heating problem, in this case too much heat. Also, you mentioned waiting a count of six or seven before opening the mold. That is perhaps a bit too soon. Get a clock with a second hand, then try without hurrying to run one cycle every 15 seconds.

Cool it down and slow it down and you may be okay.

SS

[nhrifle]

NOE moulds are first rate, but like any manufactured product, occasionally one or two problems may make it to the marketplace. I have no doubt Al will make it right.

Now I must hang my head in shame...I confess to the use of release agent in my past as well. It was a long time ago!

[mdi]

I think if I tried heating the mold and running the melt hot, and it didn't work, I'd try something different. Do the opposite. Drop the temperature of both the mold and the melt and see what happens. While some casters with a lot of experience will give you an answer, just try it yourself then report back to us.

From reading Swede's post, I think my next mold just might be an NOE...

[Echo]

+1 on Too Hot. I'll bet the sprue runs off the plate like water - right? It should pile up to a nice level on top of the plate, but should also show a dimple over each cavity to show that the boolit, in shrinking as it sets, sucks additional alloy into the cavity. When the sprue runs off the plate like water, I cool the plate down by turning the mold upside down onto a wet cloth and let it steam for a few seconds.

[nagantguy]

Now that's just plain out good service, right there!
NOE gets my business.

100% right, a man who stands by his products and delivers on his word is welcome at my fire any day. Swedenelson my next mold will be from you. Have heard nothing but good things and I believe you to be a straight shooter!! That was a classy post.

[cstrickland]

I have been trying to get a thermometer for a few weeks. But it seems like every time I make a buck I spend 2 lately. The gun business has slowed WAY down so Ive been spend conscious all summer.

. . But the handles have bent a bit at the bolt.

wow for you to have bent the handle with a plastic stock you must have beat the hell out of that thing. tell ya what PM me. I have a few extra industrial thermometers. ( I work for a gauge and temp manufacturer) We should be able to work out a trade if you would like. I hate to see a person have such a hard time. I know when its tight on my end it sucks.

charlie

[Harter66]

Now that's the castboolits board I joined right there.

[ShooterAZ]

Hats off to cstrickland and Al Nelson. Both stand up guys. Between the two of them, you should be back in business soon. Keep the temp down, and the whacks light! (and your powder dry:-P)

[62chevy]

I learned a couple of things reading this thread. 1) there are a bunch of great guys on this forum 2) my mold has been to hot. Next time I'll try to get the temp under 700 for COWW, it's been about 725 - 750. That worked great the first few times but the last two took a beating to get them out.

[adanymous]

[QUOTE=mdi;2936142]I think if I tried heating the mold and running the melt hot, and it didn't work, I'd try something different. Do the opposite. Drop the temperature of both the mold and the melt and see what happens.

As stated previously I started at medium heat levels and moved up incrementally until I maxed everything out.

[adanymous]

It seems the consensus is I am running it hot. And an experienced consensus tends to be right in my experience. So if I am running it too hot it sticks in the blocks, if I run it too cool it sticks on the pins. I guess like beagle said, there is a sweet spot somewhere where this thing will be perfect. I guess Ill have to find that spot next time I go to cast with it.

As to Al Nelson, that guy has never been anything but top notch to me. This isn't my first NOE and sure won't be my last. Like I said Im sure its my fault and not his, the mold appears to be perfect to the naked eye.

Cstrickland, I appreciate the offer. Ill PM you on that. Very generous, thanks!

[ShooterAZ]

One more comment...each mold I own seems to have it's own "personality" if you will. In other words they all have their own "sweet spots" as to casting temperature. And that can change with different alloys. I keep a notebook and make notes of all of this, so I can reference it next time I use that particular mold. It has helped me a lot by doing this.

[adanymous]

One more comment...each mold I own seems to have it's own "personality" if you will. In other words they all have their own "sweet spots" as to casting temperature. And that can change with different alloys. I keep a notebook and make notes of all of this, so I can reference it next time I use that particular mold. It has helped me a lot by doing this.

Thats a great idea, Im not sure why I didn't think of it. I do that for my reloads, and I have a dope book for my long range gun. Seems like it should be common sense... Guess Im lacking

[cstrickland]

I have a lee 311-155 mold. two cavity and I run my lead at about 725° F ( COWW with an extra 1% tin) , and heat the mold by dipping it in the lead. Now I am just beginning, but I have had some great bullets drop with that combo. I do get some sticking, but a single light tap on the nut and they drop. I think I just need to clean it a little more, or let it cool an additional few seconds

I also own a .225 - 70 gr NOE mold, that I have not really used yet, but damn that thing is light years ahead of the lee. The ones I did cast just fell out. the only issue with that mold is me right now.

adanymous. I got your PM and shot you one back. I have access to a wide varitey of instrument grade bimetals. I just need to know what you would like. I personally use a 3" dial with a 4" adjustable stem . the head actually bends 90° and that thing is great. I would not go back to a lyman or rcbs after this one. very industrial . we will get you set up man !!

[adanymous]

I got the thermometer from Charlie. That thing looks amazing. I don't think you could hurt it with
a hammer. Thanks Charlie!

[44man]

Only a few things make them stick, wrong heat is just one, another is a burr, Rub edges of the cavity on a COLD mold with Scotch-Brite.
Next is cavities not dead center. Rare as hens teeth with a quality mold. I make my own molds with a cherry and even a burr I can't detect will do that. Scotch-Brite has worked fine.
I used a lot of Rapine mold prep but no longer need it. Stuff was great and only a micron thick. I can paint the entire mold with it, even air vents, prevents rust on steel molds too.
Too bad Ray retired.

[62chevy]

Only a few things make them stick, wrong heat is just one, another is a burr, Rub edges of the cavity on a COLD mold with Scotch-Brite.
Next is cavities not dead center. Rare as hens teeth with a quality mold. I make my own molds with a cherry and even a burr I can't detect will do that. Scotch-Brite has worked fine.
I used a lot of Rapine mold prep but no longer need it. Stuff was great and only a micron thick. I can paint the entire mold with it, even air vents, prevents rust on steel molds too.
Too bad Ray retired.


Didn't know about the Scotch Bright for burs so will give that a try. Didn't like the sharp knife idea so never used it.

[1_Ogre]

I had a Lyman mould like that once, when the mould was machined at the factory the cavities were 0.020" OFF CENTET, hence the reason for the boolits not dropping. The only remedy was send it back and HOPE fir the best

[cstrickland]

I got the thermometer from Charlie. That thing looks amazing. I don't think you could hurt it with
a hammer. Thanks Charlie!
Not a problem Dan I am gad you liked it. Yeah when you compare that one to the RCBS or Lyman it makes them look like a toy. I really like the ability to angle the head at 90° . I also like that it has a 3" dial face versus the 1.5" on the others, it makes reading everything a little easier .

keep us posted on how things work out

charlie

[RED333]

Man this forum is great!!!

[blackthorn]

cstrickland---I don't want to hi-jack this thread, but I would be really interested in more information on just what types/makes of thermometers are transferable from industry to casting. Is that information readily available (website or?)? I guess what I would really like to see is a thread discussing thermometer interchangeability and where one can acquire these thermometers.

[cstrickland]

cstrickland---I don't want to hi-jack this thread, but I would be really interested in more information on just what types/makes of thermometers are transferable from industry to casting. Is that information readily available (website or?)? I guess what I would really like to see is a thread discussing thermometer interchangeability and where one can acquire these thermometers.

technically you can use any thermometer that will measure in the 0°F - say 1000°F range for casting ( give or take) , the questions are 1- is it constructed of quality materials that will last. 2- does it exhibit repeatability and 3- what is the accuracy. Most of the offshore cheapos do not exhibit these qualities and may work for a short while but usually fail . The one I like and use is an industrial / instrument class BIMETAL thermometer and they are typically use in labs or harsh environments. the measuring element is just what is says a bimetal ( two different metals ) helix . The units are very repeatable and usually accurate to +/-1% full scale, so on a 1000°F scale it is accurate to 10°F. You can also use an RTD based devices like they use when making the PID controllers and they are more accurate depending on the class rating , but usually cost more and need a digital readout. I like the bimetals as they are rugged and simple. I can toss it on the floor and it still works. I do not need to assemble anything and best is NO batteries or powder needed. I am more then fine with my pot varying by 10°F

There is more to it than that but this is the basic jest of it. you can google bimetal thermometer and look at all of the companies that sell them to get a good feeling for what is out there, if you have any questions just shoot me a PM and I will try to help.

[blackthorn]

Thanks! Awhile back I got hold of a thermometer with a probe designed to be placed into a stove pipe and I have not had time to try it in my pot yet. Based on what you tell me, it should work.

[cstrickland]

Thanks! Awhile back I got hold of a thermometer with a probe designed to be placed into a stove pipe and I have not had time to try it in my pot yet. Based on what you tell me, it should work.

yes theoretically it should, but I would need to see the model as there could be issues.

1- how long is the probe.
2- I do not think it will be accurate , but to about +/- say 20% - 25% of the full scale. maybe even less.
3- is the head sealed

you can be off by 50- 75 or so degrees in a flue pipe and it not be a big deal , but for casting I would suggest something way more accurate for repeatability . As stated over a 1000° I fell comfortable with a 10° ( 1% ) variance, but any more ???? If you need one shoot me a PM and we can work something out.

also most of the flue thermometers I see are not sealed at the head, so it could cause temp fluctuations with a draft or off readings if something gets in there . A good bimetal is hermetically sealed

[blackthorn]

I do have a "lead" thermometer as well so when time allows I can fire up the rendering pot and do a comparison. Won't be till after hunting season though. Priorities you know!