450/400 (400 JEFFERY) Ruger No.1 with large cast boolits

[Mr Humble]

Picked this up from a fella who had just come back from Africa where it laid low 2 Cape Buffalos.

I can't imagine shooting full house loads in it as it weighs a pound less than my 400 Whelen, and they are Ballistic twins.

The bullet is a NEI #212 408 360 GC DD that was special ordered to cast @.412 and weighs in (wheelweight, GC,sized to .411 and lubed at around 407 gr) they shoot great in the Whelen and the 400 H&H as well.

Found a box of bullets I made up about 5 years ago and interpolated my way into a very mild load.
WW LR, 22.5 gr 4198 with 5cc if Ibearia COARSE cornmeal. Grains are large about #10 shot size.

Set up with a 4X Unertl Hawk @ 50 yds, shot one sighter and then these 5. I'm guessing the ballistics are about like a 454 Casull with a heavy bullet. Nothing fancy, just old wheelweight, SPG lube thru a SAECO with .416 gaschecks, powder thrown from an old Lyman measure and cornmeal scooped with 2 Lee 2.5 cc scoopfulls. Seated so the driving band almost touches the lands as a No. 1 has zero camming power.

As cheap to shoot as CCI mini mags and a lot more fun.

http://i1186.photobucket.com/albums/z377/rocketcity1/450-400group_zps8f905bcf.jpg (http://s1186.photobucket.com/user/rocketcity1/media/450-400group_zps8f905bcf.jpg.html)

[JeffinNZ]

That's fantastic. Can we see the rifle too please?

[Von Gruff]

Great looking cartridge and one that dosent get much play today but as its history on a couple of Buff attest, it is a real performer.

Yes do post some more on the rifle.

[Mr Humble]

We all know Ruger never made any Red Pad 450/400 and wood like this has not been seen on a No. 1 since Bill left us.

Along the years I acquired my second 458 Win that, underneath 57 layers of spar varnish actually had the 3X wood you see. It was a 1976 rifle. The 450/400 wood (maybe 2X) went on it, the 458 fore end was redone to match and down the road it went at a bargain price for a "working gun".

After days covered in paint remover wrapped with plastic (avoids evaporation), the 458 stock and 450/400 fore end were stripped, hot water washed, bleached, air dryed, hit lightly with 320 wet and stained with red root stain (Duane Wiebe 253-535-0066). Then many, many coats of Minwax gloss wipe on poly were applied. 600 wet every 4th coat. Do not rub it in . It flows out level by itsself. Then off to have the checkering recut and a final coat of poly toothbrushed in. After a year or so, I'll go over it with Brownell's 5F for that final English dull glow.

That's one of the last "white dot" 4X Unertl Hawks with click adjustments.

http://i1186.photobucket.com/albums/z377/rocketcity1/DSCN4554_zps5d9383eb.jpg (http://s1186.photobucket.com/user/rocketcity1/media/DSCN4554_zps5d9383eb.jpg.html)

http://i1186.photobucket.com/albums/z377/rocketcity1/DSCN4553_zps68cc7c48.jpg (http://s1186.photobucket.com/user/rocketcity1/media/DSCN4553_zps68cc7c48.jpg.html)

[ogre]

I envy you your acquisition. It is very nice indeed!

[Tatume]

Seated so the driving band almost touches the lands as a No. 1 has zero camming power.

Not sure what you mean by this. A No. 1 will force a cast bullet into the rifling, and will pull a heavily crimped case off of a cast bullet. Admittedly, if a hot round is fired and the case sticks in the chamber, the No. 1 rifle does not have the camming power of a bolt action rifle and likely will leave it in there. But it is nowhere near "zero camming power."

[Mr Humble]

This bullet (as all my NEIs) is equipped with a front driving band called a DD design by NEI. In a comprehensive test with a 308 40X the same exact load w and w/o DDs were tried. The DD design made smaller groups. If you seat any DD or land diameter bullet into a No. 1 or and falling block rifle to contact the lands more than about the rim's thickness, it will not cam it in. If the front of the bullet is an undersized "bore rider" you can push it home with your thumb. My limited experience extends to No. 1s in 30-40, 300 H&H, 375 H&H, 450/400, 458 Win, 450 3&1/2 Nitro and High walls in 300 H&H and 45-70.
Any of my bolt guns will seat a cast bullet well into the leade, even blunt ones.
There was a reason the old timers who shot breech loading falling blocks had breech seaters for their bullets that were loaded first. It was to increase accuracy by ensuring the boolit was well seated into the leade as then, as now, a falling block rifle cannot do it with fixed ammo. It terms of accuracy fixed ammo is #3, breech seated bullets are #2 and bullets seated with a false muzzle are #1.
BTW no properly sized boolit loaded with good tools should ever be crimped when shot from a single shot rifle. Crimps deform boolits and are only needed in magazine or double rifles to avoid bullet (jkt or cast) setback or pullout due to recoil forces.
A link worth your review:
http://www.assra.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?num=1091212612
Good photo of a homemade breech seater (at Top), a twin to several I have made.
http://s554.photobucket.com/user/xtimberman/media/DSCN0984.jpg.html

[gordie]

hello mr. humble,

maybe you could start a thread on your .400W... w/ pics..

i have an old one, on a springfield action, can't get it to fire.

[Mr Humble]

There are so many reasons an old springfield will not fire....... Have you taken it to a qualified gunsmith to make sure the action is complete (missing firing pin ?) and functions correctly ? The headspace should be checked as there were many half assed 400 Ws built that do not follow the dimensions of the correct Griffin and Howe Chamber.

If the mechanics of the rifle function, a cerrosafe chamber cast sholud be made and compared to the G&H dimensions in the folllowing book.
You should buy this book: http://www.amazon.com/Wildcat-Cartridges-Fred-Zeglin/dp/B003TT5OBO
as it has a whole chapter on the 400 W by the late Mike Pertrov.

The firing problem with most 400 Ws is that some "gunsmith" just ran in a .41 something throater after a 30-06 finish reamer. That leaves the rest of the chamber 30-06 dimensions.
(WRONG). Who made it and when ?

Once you address all those questions, fixing will be easy. Generally setting the barrel back one full turn and rechambering with a correct reamer will fix it.

Would help if you told me what the symptoms of "not firing are" and where the ammo came from. Who made the dies etc etc. Wildcats are really pretty easy if the rifle function as well as a new M 70 and the case, dies and chamber are made to the same dimensions.

Mine has well over 1000 rounds down my tube after I bought it (it was made in the mid 30s). mostly big cast bullets. It always goes bang and will shoot 1-2 MOA out to 200 yards (it's design envelope).
lemme know.

It kills things even when stretched a bit (250 yards, 350 Old X that poked a 40 caliber hole through both lungs) He took 3 steps and fell over DOA. Bullet is still flying across Idaho.

http://i1186.photobucket.com/albums/z377/rocketcity1/file-114.jpg (http://s1186.photobucket.com/user/rocketcity1/media/file-114.jpg.html)

http://i1186.photobucket.com/albums/z377/rocketcity1/file-113.jpg (http://s1186.photobucket.com/user/rocketcity1/media/file-113.jpg.html)

http://i1186.photobucket.com/albums/z377/rocketcity1/tororeelmower18/fb2b6f96.jpg (http://s1186.photobucket.com/user/rocketcity1/media/tororeelmower18/fb2b6f96.jpg.html)

[209jones]

I expect you will have a lot of fun with that 450/400. I have been using 320gr cast in mine, an LBT WFN-GC with AA5744. It is pretty sweet to shoot with that load, and it is the same velocity as the factory 400gr. I have 210-400gr J-bullets in the cupboard, have not had the need to try loading them yet. Also have a 400gr LBT LFN-GC mould, only loaded them once so far, they are a step up in recoil at only 1850fps. Still bearable for 40 rds though.
The factory rds are a tad rough on the constitution in that gun, decent recoil pad helped immensely, but I am only really good for 20 rds with those.
Nice to see Ruger putting these guns out, had a lot of fun with it so far.