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View Full Version : Getting the UMC 300 blackout subs to actually be subs.



kawasakifreak77
09-12-2014, 02:38 AM
Dun dun dun!

Okay, seriously.

So it's relatively well known that the above ammunition (stuff in the white box) is not really subsonic, even in some gas guns which of course most blackout guys are running.

As some of you know, I'm a died in the wool blackout freak job & think this is the best daw gone thing since mini skirts & micro breweries...

In my rifle (AAC Micro 7, YHM Phanton always attached) they go supersonic, making an annoying crack like a high velocity .22

Hey if I bought subs, I want 'em to be sub!

So I started breaking down the rounds to make a truely subsonic load using whatever magical unicorn fart powder Remington puts in there.

I found several interesting things.

First off there appears to be two distinct loads I have. I thought they were all from the same run, as all boxes say 24122?

Regardless. The first few boxes I had bought have a slightly nicer looking bullet with a light crimp. The bullets in the boxes I had bought later on have odd looking teardrop shaped 'dents' near the tip & a HEAVY crimp.

Pulling them apart, the 'later' bullets are on average .050" longer than the 'early' bullets. 1.450" vs 1.500" respectively. Early bullets are cosmetically much nicer & later bullets have a 'waist' just below the cannalure averaging a whopping .295" from the crazy crimp job. I do really like the design of the bullet. It's a flatbase with a much longer ogive than the 220 SMK. Hopefully if this caliber keeps gaining steam like it has been, a bullet of similar construction will be released to the public for reloading.

Sorting the boxes, I have mostly early ones, so those went to the side & I'm burning up the late bullets first cause they're ugly.

Powder: it's a small grained stick powder. Charges are anywhere from 9.9 grains to 10.8 grains. Right about where I had guessed it would be. Seems pretty strange that the charge varies so much though. This is the first time I've tore down factory loads so maybe this is within spec? The early loads powder is ever so slighly glossier. I didn't notice it at first & I have very keen eyes.

Brass: relatively uniform. Shortest being 1.358" & longest being 1.364" so far. Most wind up between 1.359" & 1.362"

So I pull down a few boxes, load up my powder trickler & set up a ladder test at 9.0, 9.5 & 10.0 grains. OAL was set at 2.350" since I'm not restricted by magazine limitations as on ARs.

Temperature around 80° elevation 1550'

10.0 grains:

1112 fps
1136
1093
1112
1080

A bit too fast. Some just BARELY made a crack so I knew I was close. But in this warmer weather I know they'll crack come wintertime.

9.5 grains:

1058
1055
1021
1046
1038

Now we're making progress! 1043fps average with a 38fps ES. Not shabby I feel for a first go round. Reading articles by JD himself I noticed his
pattern of building sub loads to a 1040fps average, so that's what I've tailored my loads to. I figure he knows a lot more about this than I do!

I went ahead & fired off the last group since I didn't feel like pulling anymore ugly bullets.

9.0 grains:

987
949
979
940
938

I know some dudes say they like to go under 1000fps for maximum suppression. I honestly couldn't tell a difference. Both the 9.5 & 9.0 loads were air rifle quiet! Just what I want. :)

So I've pulled down a few more boxes of the later stuff & have loaded a full box at 9.5 grains for a more thorough test. Will chrony another 5 rounds then shoot for groups. If that all goes well wet telephone books will start getting punched next!

Will advise.

300blk
09-12-2014, 03:51 AM
Nice write up.
that amount of powder deviation is par for the course. I've pulled down m2 ball from the. Same box and found +- 2.5 grains.
not sure what powder that is, almost certainly canister.
If looking for a suppressed sub powder look no further than AA1680. I've had Some luck in boltguns with lilgun subs, but 1680 held a more consistent ES over a wider temperature range for me.
My host gun now is a 9inch AR platform and it's easier to stay subsonic, but cycling becomes an issue.

petroid
09-12-2014, 06:27 AM
I would think that if they are right on the verge os supersonic in summer, there will be no problems in the winter. Warmer temps can increase chamber pressure and therefore velocity, and also the warm air is less dense which will also give higher velocity. The cold, dense air, will transmit sound better, but the velocity will be slightly lower down range. Muzzle velocity will be unchanged by air temperature/density except in that it also affects chamber pressure.

BK7saum
09-12-2014, 08:58 AM
Yes but the speed of sound varies with temperature. At 90 degrees Fahrenheit the speed of sound is 1149fps. At 40 degrees Fahrenheit the speed of sound is 1095 feet per second. So subsonic loads worked up in the summer time can have a sonic crack in the fall and winter as weather cools off.

kawasakifreak77
09-12-2014, 11:39 AM
Okay that's what I was thinking!

JeffinNZ
09-12-2014, 06:57 PM
In my .32-20 Martini equipped with a suppressor I limit my subsonic loads to an average velocity of 1040fps just to be on the safe side of the sonic barrier. Nice work.

petroid
09-12-2014, 10:56 PM
I just keep all my sub loads under 1080fps sovi know they will always be subsonic. Some loads for short barrels will be super in a longer barrel especially if slower powders are used. Reloader 7 comes to mind

Artful
09-14-2014, 10:10 PM
Good Job! - I shoot (pun) for 1050 fps average with no more than 40 fps faster in any condition (hot day, tilt barrel up or down etc).
I'd be curious to see pic's of the pulled bullets

Jupiter7
09-15-2014, 07:44 AM
Funny, I've chrono'd some Remington subs and they were subsonic in my 10" barrelled AR pistol. As above, if cycling an action AA1680 is the powder. My bolt gun liked Unique. I'm over the subsonic aspect of this caliber, no suppressor, so no need. I usually run my heavies around 1250fps.

kawasakifreak77
09-15-2014, 08:27 AM
In a ten inch gas gun, especially without a can, I would imagine they would stay under the speed of sound.

& yeah. My boltgun likes Unique! :) I just wish it metered better..

So I take the twenty rounds out that I had loaded & head to the range. I got my target up but other dudes started firing before I could set my chrony up downrange. So I shot off two, five round groups & waited until I could go mark ny target. I get down to check & both groups were under 2 inches! Now I know that's not match grade by no means but I had my rifle fitted with iron sights so at 100 meters, I felt that was a solid shooting load!

webradbury
09-19-2014, 07:00 AM
I want one! I have been planning on building an integrally suppressed bolt action for this round. Have to find a rifle and of course, need to send uncle Sam my permission money. I'm actually thinking about rebarrelling a savage axis for the build. I just want something quiet to plink with..nothing fancy.

kawasakifreak77
09-24-2014, 04:52 AM
I'd love an integral but the money is just crazy. Crazier than a detachable can.

It's honestly the funnest & most useful gun related purchase I've ever made. Worth every penny spent& minute waited! For plinking there's nothing quite like banging steel at 150 meters.

poof..........CLANG!

Even that far away it sounds like someone is hitting it with an 8lb sledge right next to ya! Anything past 150 meters with iron sights is about impossible for me between the plumetting bullet & the suppressor covering the target.

Davidk
10-05-2014, 06:13 AM
thanks for the info. Thats a lot of work. Anyone tried the subsonic from Gemtech?

Davidk
10-05-2014, 06:14 AM
I'd love an integral but the money is just crazy. Crazier than a detachable can.

It's honestly the funnest & most useful gun related purchase I've ever made. Worth every penny spent& minute waited! For plinking there's nothing quite like banging steel at 150 meters.

poof..........CLANG!

Even that far away it sounds like someone is hitting it with an 8lb sledge right next to ya! Anything past 150 meters with iron sights is about impossible for me between the plumetting bullet & the suppressor covering the target.

I saw a couple rifles with integral suppressors. Sweet, but I am too cheap to dedicate a suppressor to a single gun.

kawasakifreak77
10-06-2014, 05:29 AM
thanks for the info. Thats a lot of work. Anyone tried the subsonic from Gemtech?

It is a lot of work but I'm very picky. The reward is worth it to me. I like a flatbase projectile for sub use & that's why I had originally bought them. Everything else in that weight range is a boat tail.

As for the Gemtechs, yes I just happened to get a couple boxes. Accuracy wise it's the best sub I've come across yet. I shot two consecutive 1 & 1/4" three shot groups from 100 meters. Very pleased although in my boltgun a couple went super & cracked so I won't be buying anymore. In a gas gun, I bet they're perfect.

kawasakifreak77
10-06-2014, 05:39 AM
Maybe someday I'll pop for an integral, it'd be sick to have a hollywood quiet gun.

I have wetted my Phantom down with a 1/2 cap of canteen water a couple times now, with no ill effects. It gets you hollywood quiet for a few shots, it's astonishing, really.

I have recently just started playing with Lehigh Defence 174 Fracturing, 194 Expanding & USGI M2AP pulls. Already have some very promising data if anyone is interested.