Ideal Mould Identification

[14tharmored]

Hello,

I came into some old Ideal moulds. There is one in particular that I am unable to identify. I was hoping that perhaps someone out there could give me some info. Here are some pics. The number on the side is 303B170. The bullet measures .314. I think its for .303 brit. I'd like to know what it dates to and what the value would be. Thanks!!

115156

115158

115159

115156

115161

115163

115165

[Gtek]

Solid block/handle set ups were by the information I have can be from the 1880's to mid/late 1920's. I could not find that number in my list. Nice looking old mold, wonder if it shoots?

[texassako]

I think it was cut down and possibly recut. One side of the block looks shorter than the other. Number looks to be stamped a bit uneven with individual punches as well, instead of a nice neat line.

[Artful]

I'm thinking more 303 savage mold
http://www.oldammo.com/303SavPPL.JPG

[Gtek]

Could 303, loose Krag, Mosin, PP 32 something, etc.. Looks like somebody scratched vent lines in one side chasing a cold pin. I think I would be getting after that rust in nose/exterior. Stamping looks real to me, Monday morning or Friday afternoon stamp. Still a really cool old mold.

[Green Frog]

I'm going to side with those saying its a custom mould, recut. Is anybody besides me noticing the strangely deep base for a gas check? It almost looks like it was made for an external lubed heel bullet(?) On further consideration, could it have been made for a Martini Cadet 310??

Froggie

[14tharmored]

Thanks for the info Guys. The block in real life isn't uneven. I think its just the perspective of the photos. When I look at it in my hand all is flush. I'm brand new to casting bullets so I'm just learning. The scratches I think are just scratches as opposed to vents. They're not "furrowed" to the edges. I'll post close ups of the block if you guys are interested in looking. Any ideas on what it might be worth?

[MtGun44]

I think the .303 Savage is a likely candidate, but the GC looks strange and I am not
really sure when GCs came into the game. Buckshot can make you a new HP pin
and then start casting and if necessary, go and buy a Savage .303 to match your
mold. Sometimes, sacrifices have to be made!

:bigsmyl2:

Bill

[jrmartin1964]

Gas check entered the game in Ideal Handbook No.17. John Barlow filed his application for a patent on January 22, 1906, and U.S. Patent No.847,149 was granted on March 12, 1907.

What does the cast slug weigh? Is something in the vicinity of 170 grains (as suggested by the number on the blocks)?

Jim

[TXGunNut]

I'm going to side with those saying its a custom mould, recut. Is anybody besides me noticing the strangely deep base for a gas check? It almost looks like it was made for an external lubed heel bullet(?) On further consideration, could it have been made for a Martini Cadet 310??

Froggie


Now that you mention it, wonder if ir was some early design before GC's were standardized.

[Bent Ramrod]

Ideal held the patent on gas checks for some years, so they were "standardized" from the get go. A relatively deep gas check shank shows up on some cavities so the forward edge of the gas check is the start of an extra lube groove on the boolit.

All the attached handle Ideal hollow point moulds (and woodcut representations in catalogs) I've seen (before this one) simply pinch the hollow point pin between the blocks. This is the first one I've seen that has the screw in the bottom that holds the lug to keep the HP pin from falling out. That attachment did not show up in the catalogs until the later, detached blocks were offered. To me, this is additional evidence that this is a later rework of the mould. Very well done, though.

[John Boy]

115391303B170 = 303caliber B=British - 170gr bullet

[14tharmored]

So what does it mean to "rework" a mold? Why would someone need/want to do that?

[14tharmored]

By the way thanks for all the excellent info.

[Bent Ramrod]

A lot of moulds have been recut (or "recherried") over the years. The mould manufacturers even offered blank mould blocks to those who wanted to make custom moulds. The quality of such work varies according to the abilities of the mechanic. I understand the recently retired Paul Jones bought his mould blocks from SAECO and reworked them on a surface grinder before lathe-boring the cavities.

Cutting and shaping a pair of mould blocks and pinning and fitting them together requires a milling machine and an accurate drilling setup, with taps, reamers, counterbores and so forth. The sprue cutter needs machinery for efficient fabrication as well. However, once the blocks are made, the only tooling needed to cut the cavity is a cherry, a double acting vise and a drill press. If the mechanic has sufficient skill, the cavity can be cut with the drill press by squeezing the mould blocks in their handles together by hand around the rotating cherry. Henry Beverage made his moulds in this way, using guide rods through the locating pin holes, and centering the cavity by "feel." If there already is a cavity in the mould, the cherry naturally has to be large enough to clean up the earlier cavity.

[jrmartin1964]

The unusually long GC shank, while not common, is not unknown. For example, No.311413 (aka "the Squibb", for its designer, Mr. Sam Squibb)

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/asset.php?fid=103949&uid=32631&d=1409869952

Jim

[GP100man]

Here`s a pic of my 311413s it has the long GC shank .
& plus 1 for Buckshots work on molds !

http://i746.photobucket.com/albums/xx110/GP100man/102_0324.jpg (http://s746.photobucket.com/user/GP100man/media/102_0324.jpg.html)

[14tharmored]

So I looked further into the box of stuff and I found an Ideal No 10 reloading tool marked .303 savage. So I think this mold is .303 savage. thanks for all the help guys!!