single shot 25 acp rifle?

[psweigle]

:-? has anyone made one and if so,what platform was used?

[DeanWinchester]

Slightly less accurate but easier to reload for and pretty much the same ballistics.
http://i882.photobucket.com/albums/ac30/saalihgf/61cae03ae7a0475367fa2210L.jpg (http://media.photobucket.com/user/saalihgf/media/61cae03ae7a0475367fa2210L.jpg.html)

[texaswoodworker]

My question is why? It seems like its an odd choice for a rifle. .22 mag can shoot the same weight bullet about 1000 FPS faster.

You may be able to convert certain .22 LR rifles to .25 ACP if they are able to withstand the pressure. (.22 LR is 24,000 PSI. 25 ACP is 25,000 PSI.) You'd have to have the barrel rebored though. It may also be possible to convert some old .25 Stevens Rimfires to .25 ACP.

[Garyshome]

Why Bother?

[bruce drake]

Reloadable cases and enough pop to drop a squirrel or rabbit. Same function that a 22LR is used for. There were 25 caliber Rimfires made in the past before the 22LR overtook the market. Considering the number of pot-metal alloy 25ACP and 32ACP pistols that have been built, would see a quality made steel frame rifle could be a great light rifle.

I personally would think that a rifle chambered for 22 Hornet could be easily rebarreled for a 32ACP cartridge as the rim diameters for the two cartridges have only .008" difference between the two.

Me, I just choose to download one of my 223Rem rifles to 22LR velocities to allow me to shoot vermin without dealing with trying to find quality 22LR cartridges.

[1911cherry]

Cause we are all a little different,or we would be shooting jacketed bullets, from our modular rifles, in an orderly fashion.
I kinda like the idea of very small reloadable pistol case in a rifle.

[Bullshop]

I too like the idea of small reloadable cartridges for small game but using the 25 acp case greatly limit the usable boolit weight and design. Going to a very slightly larger case such as the 32 S&W long case necked to 25 would yield a far more flexible cartridge.
The 22 hornet case at 25 cal has also been with use for quite some time and is also a very much more flexible cartridge for rifle use than would be the 25 acp case.
If however you are determined and can be satisfied with perhaps a single boolit for your rifle then by all means pursue your desire.

[Blanco]

Kinda like a carbine in 9mm Luger.
Not really good for much, but a lot of fun to shoot

[bgmkithaca]

Waste of time and money , get a .22 or .22 mag .

[psweigle]

I have around 1000 cases that are VERY cheap and easy to load. the primer is the most expencive part. And I believe it to be a very fun and useful rifle round. I am planning to use the same cast boolits as I do in my pocket guns. thanks for all of the comments and please keep them coming.

[DeanWinchester]

I wonder if you're going to be able to get enough powder in there to deal with a 16" barrel??
Will the length of the barrel actually cause you to lose velocity? I don't know, I'm just thinking out loud here.
Someone out there knows how to calculate the optimum barrel length for the amount of powder you're going to be dealing with.

It it may be that you need a shorter than 16" barrel to get the greatest efficiency. Which is easy enough, you can either pin on a permanent extension or counter bore the barrel.

One thing about it, it oughta be a very quiet little booger!

[psweigle]

DeanWinchester, I REALLY hope it has enough snot to come out of the barrel! ballistics by the inch says it should.And yes, it should be very quiet.

[JeffinNZ]

I'm with Bruce. The idea of .25ACP is grand but more practical to load .32ACP/SW etc. Or .25 Hornet loaded light.

[Artful]

Why not a 25 ACP as a rook rifle, after all you can just use buckshot for the boolit.

Issue #189/Oct 1997 has an article by Richard Conrad in it. He used 50 gr Cast/FMJ boolits under 1.6 grs of Unique for a MV of 800-850 fps from Baby Browning/Beretta 950 pistols. This comes out to 4375 reloads from a pound of powder.

For the plinker load using buckshot...

Resize a case and ensure it does not exceed the maximum length of .610 inch. If it does, carefully use a very fine file to reduce its length. Few case trimmers can accommodate the tiny .25 ACP. Though Lee makes .25 ACP reloading dies, it does not make a case trimmer pilot for this Lilliputian case.

Bell the .25 ACP case mouth to avoid shaving the lead ball when it's seated. If your dies do not bell, insert a .223 case into the .25 ACP case mouth and tap the .223 case lightly with a hammer a few times. The shoulder of the .223 case will easily bell the mouth of the .25 ACP case.

Prime a resized case with a standard small pistol primer. There is no need to use a magnum primer :lol:.

Charge with powder, for the powder charge, start with 1.0 (one) grain of Bullseye and increase the charge 0.1 (one-tenth of a grain).
Stop when reliable functioning is attained. Most guns will operate well with 1.3 grains of Bullseye.
Be very careful when charging the .25 Auto with powder, as only small powder charges are used and a double-charge can be easily overlooked.
Look down into each charged case with a good light to check for any double charges.
A double charge of Bullseye would likely damage the pistol, and may injure the shooter.

Seat a #3 Buckshot lead ball up to its midpoint into the case.
The typical No. 3 buckshot ball weighs about 23 grains and is .250 to .251 inch in diameter.
This is a good fit in the .25 Auto bore, which is nominally .251 inch.

Firmly crimp the case around the seated ball.

Turn the loaded cartridge over and dip the ball, up to the case mouth, in Lee Liquid Alox.
If the lubricant is too stiff, add a drop or two of Mineral Spirits and mix well with a toothpick to thin it.

The seated lead ball now lubricated, stand the cartridge on its base in the open air and allow the lubricant to dry overnight.

This load is mild, functions most pistols, shoots to about the same point of aim as the 50-grain factory load and is accurate.
Not much power to it, but it’s no toy. It will penetrate both sides of a can at 20 feet.

This was a surprisingly accurate load.

This No. 3 buckshot load is fun. It is strictly for plinking and practice and should never be carried for self defense.

There are about 300 #3 buckshot lead balls to a pound. Buckshot is usually sold in 5-pound containers.

This was concocted for my friend Steve's PP pistol, it was accurate at close range, but a real pain to handle with my big fingers.
I wound up using some wooden tweezer's to handle stuff - now a days I'd use medical clamp/hemostat.

And in the back of my head I remember someone had made a miniature Thompson Sub-machine gun in 25 ACP (including the drum!)
that was a blast according to the magazine article.

[Artful]

http://www.waynedriskillminiatures.com/id15.html
http://www.waynedriskillminiatures.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/de-la-Garrigue-M1-Thompson-9222-1.JPG


This is a 1/2 scale M-1 Thompson by the legendary Edmund de la Garrigue. 16" long overall with a 5 1/4" rifled barrel of .25 caliber. Parkerized finished steel except for the magazine and some small parts which are high polished blue. Oiled finished walnut stocks. This is a non-firing model. Some of these were registered class III fully automatic firing weapons. There is a firing pin bump on the bolt face, but there is no chamber cut, no extractor, and no ejector. The magazine is a solid block of steel with a more correct thin profile, and the magazine release spring is there, which is unusual as it is nearly always missing on these. The sides of the receiver properly and deeply roll stamped. Marked on the left bottom of the trigger guard "EDMUND H. de la GARRIGUE" in two lines. The left side of the receiver marked with the serial number 9222. Excellent near mint condition showing only very minor handling wear and a few small freckles to the finish. The front sight turning a gray/brown patina. There is a small hairline crack in the buttstock where it meets with the receiver at the right rear top. There are a lot of stories about Mr. de la Garrigue, but he is most famously known as the inventor of the Grizzly single action army revolver. There is an out of print book about Mr. de la Garrigue called "Artistry in Single Action" by Halton Henderson. Only 450 copies were printed, so they are very rare, expensive, and difficult to find. The book documents these miniature Thompsons as well as several other miniatures made by Mr. de la Garrigue. This example is complete with the original walnut de la Garrigue display stand. The magazine is screwed to the stand by a threaded hole in it's bottom, then the miniature fitted to the magazine. The front of the stand with a black over white laminated plaque reading "THOMPSON SMG, MODEL M1A1 CAL 45, OCT. 27, 1942" in three lines.

I think one of these was converted to live fire if I'm remembering correctly.

[Artful]

Kinda like a carbine in 9mm Luger.
Not really good for much, but a lot of fun to shoot

Hmm, lots of 9mm SMG & Carbine's made - for real world defensive shooting....

[slughammer]

Over in wheel guns, pistols and hand cannons is this thread about just such a project.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?229052-25-ACP-rifle-what-powder

[Chev. William]

DeanWinchester, I REALLY hope it has enough snot to come out of the barrel! ballistics by the inch says it should.And yes, it should be very quiet.

'Psweigle',
Yes, the .25ACP DOES have enough "Snot" to come out of a Rifle Barrel, typically at around 1000fps to 1100fps with Factory Loads (50 grain FMJ bullet).

The "Stevens 1915 Favorite" Action with a Stevens ".25 Stevens" chambered barrel WILL take the Cartridge but you will need to convert the Breech block from Rim Fire to Center Fire to actually fire the round, which is similar in length and slightly more powerful than the .25 Stevens Short RF cartridges.

There are 50 grain nominal weight Cast Lead Alloy bullets, designed to shoot accurately from modern Taurus pistols but can be sized to .253" for the Stevens. (Carolina Cast Bullets list it as the Ranch Dog .25ACP bullet.)
NOTE: there are two 'threads' on "Cast Boolits" Shooting Forums that talk about the.25ACP and one has drawings of the "Ranch Dog" bullet designs.
Also the thread ".25 ACP rifle, what powder?" on this Forum site also talks about it.

Yes, the .25ACP has a suitable Rim , at .302" nominal diameter, that will work in the Stevens Chamber, which is set for a nominal .333" diameter RF rim. Chamber diameters at the rim end are about the same for both cartridges, AND the .25ACP is specified by SAMMI as head spacing from the RIM. CIP lists the .25ACP at a pressure of 17,400psi (Piezio.), I think the other poster was quoting the old CUP Pressure rating.

Nominal Rim Thicknesses are the same, but if you use the 100 year old Stevens chamber as is the .25ACP round will sit a few thousandths forward of the Breech Face due to wear in the Chamber to Rim Rebate junction.

Having the Rebate remachined and the head space adjusted should be a simple task for a gunsmith and would make the chamber better fit original Stevens rounds also.

Go for the Project! You will gather a crowd at he range when they see you firing it.

Best Regards,
Chev. William

[psweigle]

Chev. William,
That is what I'm looking for. I was kinda hoping someone may be in here that has done this. Or maybe a Rebarrel on an H&R or NEF single shot. I was hoping to hear how their project went. I thank you kindly for all of your input .
psweigl

[Outpost75]

The .32 ACP or .32 S&W Long are viable options. I've had light, single-shot rifles in the 4.5 pound range done in both. The S&W Long was done using a normal .30 Cal. rifle barrel and with 10" twist can handle bullets up to 150 grains with the lightest charge which will exit the barrel, about 1 grain of Bullsye or TitleGroup. Little louder than an air rifle in a 26" barrel.

[psweigle]

The .32 ACP or .32 S&W Long are viable options. I've had light, single-shot rifles in the 4.5 pound range done in both. The S&W Long was done using a normal .30 Cal. rifle barrel and with 10" twist can handle bullets up to 150 grains with the lightest charge which will exit the barrel, about 1 grain of Bullsye or TitleGroup. Little louder than an air rifle in a 26" barrel.
I thought about that one too, but I really want to do the 25acp first. thank you, and when I get to that one, I will be looking you up!

[psweigle]

Outpost75,
I want one of those as well. It is much easier to find a doner barrel for it. If the 25 acp goes smoothly, and im sure it will, I already have most of what I need to do a 32 mag. minus the reamer. Thanks for the post.

[koehlerrk]

Hmmm... interesting project. A small, light, break open single shot with a long-ish (20-24 inch) barrel wouldn't make any more noise than a BB gun, but launching #3 buckshot would be a lot more effective on garden pests. And, it wouldn't bother the neighbors. Would also be a nice squirrel rifle.

If I didn't already have a 22 Hornet, I'd be looking for something to build into one of these. My hornet, loaded with a piece of #4 buckshot on top of two grains of Bullseye with poke a hole through a 2x4 from across the yard. Loudest part is the ball hitting the wood, "Whack!" - sounds like someone hitting it with a hammer.

[Loudenboomer]

Need a performance edge on the 25 ACP ?? My 25-20 has been doing that of over a hundred years.

[Reg]

Not too sure if the Stevens action is the way to go, most of the older ones are really right on the edge as far as safety with even the HV .22 LR goes the NEF or H&R would be a far better choice.
Check with Track of the Wolf they one time offered the correct barrel liner by the inch and I do know there are other sources out there for liners and barrels .
This would be a fun project and with a bit of fore thought ( and a few bux !! ) you could have one heck of a neat bunny gun.

As a PS

As to why do such a project--- why not. If we go by some people's adage, why not down load a 25-20-- with that idea, why not down load a 250 Savage better yet, why not down load the 257 Roberts or even much better yet didn't Weatherby make some kind of 25 caliber weed burner-- ya, that would do it.
There would be nothing wrong at all coming up with such a super small 25 caliber, I think it would make one neat bunny gun.
Lead the way and I know others will follow and let us know how it is coming.

[Chev. William]

Just for "Giggles" the .25 Stevens RF (Long) fired a 67 grain bullet at around 950fps (smokeless powder loadings) to 1100fps (Black Powder loadings).
The .25ACP out of an 18" barrel yields around 970 fps to 1050fps using a 50 grain bullet (depends on the Manufacturer of the cartridges according to tests).
The Current .25ACP is listed as developing about 17,400psi (Piezeo Method) by CIP, the European Firearms regulating body.
Currently the only ratings I find for the .25 Stevens RF is around 23,000psi, possibly CUP instead of Piezeo method.
There is also a "25-10 Halsted" that is a Center Fire Replacement for the .25 Stevens except it uses 'rifle size' (.257") bullets instead of 'Pistol size' (250") bullets. Since it is based upon reforming the .22 Hornet Brass, it is probably capable of up to something near 40,000psi in a STRONG action. Loaded down to the nominal 1100fps of original .25 Stevens Cartridge should give the same, reported excellent, 'Pot Meat' getting capabilities without over stressing any action previously chambered in .25 Stevens RF.

Best Regards,
Chev. William

[jeepmann1]

Easiest and cheapest way would be to stub a H&R shot gun barrel to 25 ACP fit it to a receiver with a small firing pin and enjoy!
George

[minimotos95]

Good to see this thread back up. I also have plans to build a .25 auto rifle, I'm still undecided on what type of action to build but I have already made the D bit chamber reamer and am slowly collecting brass and reloading equipment. That project comes after building a steel .25 pistol so it will be awhile

In a solid platform you should be able to push 25 acp brass well past the 14-18k CUP factory loads and data, saami spec is 25k CUP and I've heard of people shoving as much bullseye as they could fit inside a case with no pressure signs. The cases are definitely overbuilt.
An interesting note is that 5.7x28 has a similar rim diameter.

[Chev. William]

Another "Giggle" point, the .25ACP can hold 4.5 Grains of 3Fg GOEX compressed so the bullet seats at .850" overall length and might hold slightly more if bullet seated to .900" overall length.

BP in a Semi Auto Pistol is not considered nice for Cleanup but think of the surprise at a Range when touched off in a single shot?

Best Regards,
Chev. William

[colt1960]

I had a thought along the same lines as the op but I picked the H&R handi-rifle single shot in 22 Hornet as the base cartridge. I reamed it to a 22 K-hornet becase the cases hold up for many more reloads than the standard hornet. It can be loaded to 22lr speeds with no problem. Rick!

[Chev. William]

Received my Tax Refund last week (Yes, I filed with an Extension, on Oct. 14th) and placed orders with three suppliers: "Track of the Wolfe" for a .25ACP liner 25 inches long; and "Lothar Walther" for a 6.35 Browning/.25ACP Barrel Blank, which made their October Shipment lists so should be coming soon; and "Pacific Tool and Guage" for two finish chamber reamers (.25ACP 'Match Grade' and .32 LongRF/.32 Long Colt CF) and two 'Go' Head space Gauges to match the reamers.

The Liner is listed as being 7/16" diameter so should allow good fitting for accuracy in an old barrel. Liner manufacturing tolerances are NOT Given so I will need to measure it carefully upon receipt.
The New Blank is listed as 26mm OD, or about 1.02" diameter, and 605mm long, or about 23.8" long. Sadly LW does not make custom longer blanks in the 6.35mm groove diameter, so the final barrel will not be my desired 24 inches; however they do have a tight tolerance on internal diameters +/- .00078" so I know my bullets in it would need to be between .250" to .252" to fit.

The Match Grade Reamer should make a tight fitting chamber to improve overall accuracy of the LW barrel Blank when it is finish fitted to my Rifle Action.

Now I am eagerly awaiting the Shipments to come.

Best Regards,
Chev. William

[John Taylor]

If you decide on a barrel liner, go to T.J.'s (859-635-5560). That's where Track gets their liners. They have both the 25 ACP and .257 liner. The 25 ACP has been necked down to .10 and .14 caliber called the dart. Don't know where you would find a barrel for one. Max pressure for the 25 ACP is listed at 25,000, a little high for a Stevens favorite action but should work on a 44. If I were doing one I would go with the H&R / NEF action, much easier to find one at a good price. I have done several from 32 ACP up to 45 ACP. The hardest part is the extractor for the auto rounds.

[Multigunner]

A European company once marketed a .32 ACP autoloading small game rifle, and many years later another compamy marketed a small handgun along with a barrel and stock assembly that you could plug the pistol into to make a small game rifle, similar to some conversion units made for the Glock and 1911 pistols. Not sure if the latter pistol/rifle outfit was in .22 RF or in .25 ACP.

A centerfire version of the .22 LR cartridge was developed for use in custom small bore target pistols, more to allow experimentation with various bullets and powder charges than anything else. The inventor had a row with rules committees but pointed out that the rules did not state that .22 pistols had to be rimfire. The platform was a modified Colt Woodsman target model.

A .25 ACP rifle for small game sounds fine to me. I would not have made one for myself since I never cared for the .25 ACP as a pistol cartridge but to each his own.
I'd like to hear how this effort turns out.

[DCM]

Hmm, lots of 9mm SMG & Carbine's made - for real world defensive shooting....

Not sure I remember right but what did they crack bin ladins' melon with?
Was it an MP5?

[Chev. William]

Received my Tax Refund last week (Yes, I filed with an Extension, on Oct. 14th) and placed orders with three suppliers: "Track of the Wolfe" for a .25ACP liner 25 inches long; and "Lothar Walther" for a 6.35 Browning/.25ACP Barrel Blank, which made their October Shipment lists so should be coming soon; and "Pacific Tool and Guage" for two finish chamber reamers (.25ACP 'Match Grade' and .32 LongRF/.32 Long Colt CF) and two 'Go' Head space Gauges to match the reamers.

The Liner is listed as being 7/16" diameter so should allow good fitting for accuracy in an old barrel. Liner manufacturing tolerances are NOT Given so I will need to measure it carefully upon receipt.
The New Blank is listed as 26mm OD, or about 1.02" diameter, and 605mm long, or about 23.8" long. Sadly LW does not make custom longer blanks in the 6.35mm groove diameter, so the final barrel will not be my desired 24 inches; however they do have a tight tolerance on internal diameters +/- .00078" so I know my bullets in it would need to be between .250" to .252" to fit.

The Match Grade Reamer should make a tight fitting chamber to improve overall accuracy of the LW barrel Blank when it is finish fitted to my Rifle Action.

Now I am eagerly awaiting the Shipments to come.

Best Regards,
Chev. William

Both the Liner and the Lothar Walther Barrel Blank have arrived but I still have 'weeks to wait' for the Reamer.

In the mean time, I received my 'modified' Stevens 1915 Favorite Action back from my gunsmith fitted with my Stevens '.25 Stevens' Barrel properly head spaced and with a touched up Crown. As received it was fitted with a reproduction 1894 Stevens Favorite Extractor cut to fit the .25ACP rim, along with three others in .22RF, .25 Stevens, and .32 Long/.32 Long Colt sizes, all to fit this particular Action which has larger than normal pivots for the Breech Block and Lever. I have now stamped the Cartridge size on each and also the Action Serial Number on all four fo the Extractors and the original to the Action .22 Rf Extractor/Ejector.
This Rifle is basically still 'In the White' with the barrel still showing the 'distress dings' of long use in the field.
Wood is not from the gun originally, was purchased off Ebay auctions over time, but fits and looks reasonable.
I have fitted the Barrel with a reproduction 'western' German silver Blade sight. presently the rear sight (small) dovetail is empty. I have temporarily mounted an old Lyman Tang Peep sight with integral two peep hole sizes (the small hole 'flips' down to uncover the large hole) but it may be too tall for short range work as the sight line at its lowest position is much higher than that of the typical Stevens fixed height rear sight.

Overall I am pleased with how this rifle is coming together out of used and new parts as available. It will be a happy time when I get it speaking again, even though it will only be at paper targets. My body no longer tolerates long hilly hikes and my County has a "No Hunting" Ordnance, except for Farmers who may shoot pests and Varmints in their Crops.

Best Regards,
Chev. William

[flint45]

sounds like a enteresting project a good little varmint gun for around the old homested.

[Chev. William]

sounds like a enteresting project a good little varmint gun for around the old homested.
Yes the old Stevens Favorites were good "Varmint" guns and used to take "Pot Meat" by many a youth; But as I said, my county has a "no hunting" Ordnance and in addition my City has a "no discharge of firearms" Ordnance so my homestead's Varmints are safe from my Favorite, but not from Traps and protected poison Bate Stations.

I need to go to a Commercial Range on the border of Angeles National Forest near here to shoot at Targets Legally, so the trips are dependent on my "Disposable Funds".

Best Regards,
Chev. William

[arjacobson]

Yes the old Stevens Favorites were good "Varmint" guns and sued to take "Pot Meat" by many a youth; But as I said, my county has a "no hunting" Ordnance and in addition my City has a "no discharge of firearms" Ordnance so my homestead's Varmints are safe from my Favorite, but not from Traps and protected poison Bate Stations.

I need to go to a Commercial Range on the border of Angeles National Forest near here to shoot at Targets Legally, so the trips are dependent on my "Disposable Funds".

Best Regards,
Chev. William
You really need to check out weapons guild.. I know a forum member there built a 25acp single shot. Something on the lines of a chicopee??

[Chev. William]

The Weapons Guild is indeed an interesting site and I did register with them. It seems many are involved with machining their own firearm and the posts are very interesting and informative.

I learned that there are reports of Barrel failures in M1 Carbines converted to .45 Win. Mag. but my computer won't show me them when I try to "Google" the subject, maximum I get is a mostly advertizements listing and 8 actual site referrals. No second pages either.

Best Regards,
Chev. William

[Chev. William]

It is April 14th and my 'Disposable funds' have been Very Lean this winter, with unexpected Bills needing attention so I have not yet taken myself off to the Commercial Shooting range. Hopefully later in the Year things will become less 'Tight' for me.
I have found and fitted a 'slot blank' in the Rear Dovetail so the little rifle now looks nearly finished. I will not be doing any refinishing on it until I have test fired it and am happy with its shooting condition.

On another Front, some friends are looking at my 1942 GPW Body/MB engined WW2 "Jeep" to use as a 'Service Vehicle' at air shows where they are doing the Pyrotechnics. They helped me get the tires pumped back up and looked it over for the work involved in running it again as it has not moved in about 5 years, due to needing a new battery and a priming fuel pump addition.
When it is running it is fun to drive for local Errand trips but is not suitable for long Freeway Travel due to its Original Gearing. 45MPH is a nice Cruse Speed although it is capable of 60MPH for moderate lengths of time, but such speeds shorten its service life before Overhaul.
Best Regards,
Chev. William

[Hooker53]

Very interesting thread, since this is what I had in mind with a Stevens 44 action. Any reports? Chev. Did you Finnish your 25 ACP project? As John stated my only concern was the extractor prob the little 25 ACP was going to present. I guess if you want to u dertake a project like this, it would be no thing for me to make a shell picking tool to pull the case out of the chamber. Ha.

Roy
Hooker53

[Traffer]

Yay for you. Build that sucker. People think I am stoopid for reloading 22lr. Hah, they are jealous. There is a youtube guy by the name of Cryptic Cricket who built a 9mm single shot break open rifle. That would be a good design for your 25. I was just thinking (as I handled some 25acp cases) that it is too bad that there is not a 25long acp. If they would make the cartridge longer it would be a darn nice little round. 25x20acp? I would want one of those. I could see that round become popular in semi auto's. Maybe 1700fps with a 45 grain bullet. Double stack magazine holding say 40 rounds. Hmmm. Maybe even a belt fed semi-auto handgun. Or a multi-barreled semi auto like that dual 45 out there. Lots of possibilities.

[Earlwb]

I think it is pretty neat. Setting up a rifle to shoot the .25 ACP cartridge. I could see someone getting a rifle conversion barrel liner for a single shot shotgun. It ought to be fairly quiet with a 18 inch rifled barrel liner in a 12 gauge shotgun. It would make for a nice vermin shooter.

[Chev. William]

Very interesting thread, since this is what I had in mind with a Stevens 44 action. Any reports? Chev. Did you Finnish your 25 ACP project? As John stated my only concern was the extractor prob the little 25 ACP was going to present. I guess if you want to u dertake a project like this, it would be no thing for me to make a shell picking tool to pull the case out of the chamber. Ha.

Roy
Hooker53

The 1915 Favorite is still in the debugging stage due to low funds and overload of work by my gunsmith. The converted firing pin seems to 'drag' on both opening and closing the action, causing hang ups on the case rim or a bent tip. Tuning the firing pin is a ticklish job as if it is shortened too far it ceases to fire cartridges, and we need to make another new one. i still have not done anything to finish it from its "White" condition.

My Model 44 project is still in the hands of my Gunsmith with a "Low Cost" priority. So far it has two barrels fitted (a .25 Stevens and a re-purposed .300 WM for .32 Long Colt use) and has the Firing Pin 'nearly converted' as the tip is relocated but the overall pin is not finished yet.

My gunsmith is busy with 'more Lucrative' work to pay his bills so I am being patient about the delays. He did convert my Ruger Single Eight project in only about 6 months though.

The Model 44 project is more complicated it seems.

Best Regards,
Chev. William

[Chev. William]

Yay for you. Build that sucker. People think I am stoopid for reloading 22lr. Hah, they are jealous. There is a youtube guy by the name of Cryptic Cricket who built a 9mm single shot break open rifle. That would be a good design for your 25. I was just thinking (as I handled some 25acp cases) that it is too bad that there is not a 25long acp. If they would make the cartridge longer it would be a darn nice little round. 25x20acp? I would want one of those. I could see that round become popular in semi auto's. Maybe 1700fps with a 45 grain bullet. Double stack magazine holding say 40 rounds. Hmmm. Maybe even a belt fed semi-auto handgun. Or a multi-barreled semi auto like that dual 45 out there. Lots of possibilities.

Have you noticed the Threads on:
"6.35x26mmSR" which has a potential case length of between 1.020" to 1,056"?
"6.35x28.6mmSR" which has a nominal case length of 1.125"?
"6.35x32mmSr" which has a range of case lengths possible for m 1.220" to 1.260"?

Or the other versions discussed under ".250/.257 Cartridges to .25ACP/.25 Stevens Diameters from 5.7x28mm once fired brass."?

I have found two ways to get longer cases of the diameters specified for .25ACP or .25 Stevens cases:
1. Reforming via swaging, .22 Hornet new PPU brass down to the top of the rim, then turning the rim to thickness and diameter. this can yield cases up to 1.380" long.
2. Reforming, by Swaging in multiple steps, 5.7x28mm FN Once Fired brass down to the Top of the rim, then dressing the 'burrs from Extractors off of the rims.

My yield from reforming new PPU .22 Hornet cases in a single pass is about 95% to date.

My yield from reforming Once fired 5.7x28mm brass via three steps is about 99.5% or better to date, but I am halted at the moment as my 'middle swaging die carbide ring shattered and Lee Precision is not "opening" the rings until at least November this year due to production schedules.

Best Regards,
Chev. William

[Chev. William]

I think it is pretty neat. Setting up a rifle to shoot the .25 ACP cartridge. I could see someone getting a rifle conversion barrel liner for a single shot shotgun. It ought to be fairly quiet with a 18 inch rifled barrel liner in a 12 gauge shotgun. It would make for a nice vermin shooter.

Why so much Mass as a 12 guage?
"Track of the Wolfe" sells 1:14 twist .25ACP liners of about 7/16" (~.437" or ~11.1mm)O.D. by the inch of overall length.
I would guess that such a Liner could be fitted to a smaller Guage Shot gun and make a more handy firearm of the result.
Best Regards,
Chev. William

[BAGTIC]

My own personal though brief experience with loading 25 ACP (for handgun) is that it is a P.I.T.A., at least with my fingers. A small .32 is much more practical. A .32 ACP or 32 S&W would probably be ideal for a 'rook gun' for small game. Either could use readily available round ball (45-50 gr.) or a 60-75 gr. conical. I load a 75 gr cast FN for my PP. In a carbine/rifle barrel it should sound like silenced. I know my .357 with RB sounds amazingly like an air rifle. I already have a .32 H&R otherwise I might give it a try.


I believe there is still a place for quiet guns that don't destroy all the meat while having inherently short range/danger space especially if one might be shooting upward toward tree tops.

[Hooker53]

Yup. Changing that breech block to CF is the only thing I have to think about on this. Project. It might seem easyer once I have it in my hand. It's due in this week. I do t think I will have to shift that pin but very little but, do t know if I will just need to do the tip of the channel or plug the whole thing and set it up in my mill. What would be even nicer, is to find someone that sells the CF blocks and just buy one. Ha. Keeps shooting folks.

Roy
Hooker53


The 1915 Favorite is still in the debugging stage due to low funds and overload of work by my gunsmith. The converted firing pin seems to 'drag' on both opening and closing the action, causing hang ups on the case rim or a bent tip. Tuning the firing pin is a ticklish job as if it is shortened too far it ceases to fire cartridges, and we need to make another new one. i still have not done anything to finish it from its "White" condition.

My Model 44 project is still in the hands of my Gunsmith with a "Low Cost" priority. So far it has two barrels fitted (a .25 Stevens and a re-purposed .300 WM for .32 Long Colt use) and has the Firing Pin 'nearly converted' as the tip is relocated but the overall pin is not finished yet.

My gunsmith is busy with 'more Lucrative' work to pay his bills so I am being patient about the delays. He did convert my Ruger Single Eight project in only about 6 months though.

The Model 44 project is more complicated it seems.

Best Regards,
Chev. William

[Chev. William]

In my experiences so far, the J. Stevens "favorites" all seem to have their firing pin holes bored at an 'upward angle from rear to front. The Hammer end sits very low and the tip end is aligned with the RF Rim.

Also, the 1896 and 1915 differ in the Breech Block "meat" left on the item. The Front Pivot holes have much more 'margin' around them in the 1915 BB and the top of the BB is 'flat' versus 'cutaway' of the1896 BB.
FYI, the Width of the BB also varies with the 'age" of the Model. The early Production ones are the Thinnest in Width (about .535"), with width increasing slightly as the Production continued. the 1915 BB is wider than the 1889 or 1896 ones. and one 1915 I have has a BB of .600" width.

Best Regards,
Chev. William