Winchester 1873 in 38-40

[CopperniX]

Okay I have a Winchester 73 chambered for 38-40. Since ammo is getting hard to find I am going to get into casting mainly for this caliber alone or at least for starters. I am curious if anyone here has cast and reloaded this caliber as any and all help will be appreciated. I am sorry if this is in the wrong section.

[bob208]

you can use the same bullets as the .40 s&w. in a 73 keep to starting loads don't try to make a mag. out of it use only cast bullets as the jacketed will ware the barrel quickly.

[pworley1]

I use the Lyman 40143 over 10 grains of Unique in my original Winchester 1873. Enjoy your rifle.

[TXGunNut]

38-40 is a great reason to get into casting and black powder. Nice cartridge & rifle. I've seen some factory ammo for some pretty silly prices, can't imagine actually paying that.

[Le Loup Solitaire]

I've been loading and shooting a 73 in 38-40 for a long time, using Lyman 40143. Lyman says that it is the original bullet...maybe so, but it is designed for use with black powder that fills the case. With smokeless you run into the prob of where to crimp...if you do it behind the front band then your OAL is to long to allow it to feed through the cartridge carrier. I used a Lee FCD die for a while but it is hard on case mouths/necks...and 38-40 brass (WW) necks are pretty thin to start with. I trimmed some brass back enough to allow crimping behind the front band...It works but I don't really like the extra work, nor the fact that the shortened brass is not right for using in my Ruger BH revolver. So I just feed them one at a time in the 73. A possible solution is to find a different design of bullet in the 175-180 grain weight range and use that. The 73 works well with velocities in the 1200-1300 fps range as that is what is/was designed for. The links/action is not a strong one and pushing it is not advisable. Definitely stay away from HV ammo that was made for the 92. 73's are all old rifles and a process that I recommend regardless of caliber is to pull the exterior end cap on the tubular magazine, take out the spring and clean and oil it it...then run a few oily patches inside the length of the mag...get the rust and cobwebs out and put it all back in place. Also keep the brass cartridge carrier oiled as brass wears more quickly than steel. Its a great rifle and caliber. Good shooting, LLS

[Harry O]

Solitaire has it right about the bullet problem. I have about 5 different moulds for the 38-40 and only one of them works in an 1873 replica I have been using for CAS shooting. The 40143 bullet occasionally slipped down into the case, causing all kinds of problems. Thinning the neck expander did not help. An NEI mould had a crimping groove, but it was too long. A 401452 was also too long. The 1873 is VERY intolerant of overlength cartridges. The RCBS mould I bought somewhere bullet did not have a crimping groove.

The only bullet I found that would work properly and had a crimping groove in the right place was made from a Magma mould. Many of the places that sell bullets use that mould because it is made for semi-auto casting machines. I bought them and used them for several years. Last year, during the worst of the Obama panic, I could not get them. I went to Magma and they had one of the moulds on the shelf and they could make it for regular handles. I bought it and have used it since. That is the bullet you should look to using, either bought or cast, for the 1873.

I use Trail Boss in mine. Works great and is mild, which would be best for an original.

[runfiverun]

magma mold user here too.
the lube groove is a bit skimpy, but the overall design is correct and the crimp groove is in the right place.
the only other thing to watch is where the size die places the shoulder compared to where your rifles chamber has it.

[Harry O]

magma mold user here too.
the only other thing to watch is where the size die places the shoulder compared to where your rifles chamber has it.

runfiverun has this one right, too. I took approx. 1/16" off the bottom of my 38-40 sizing die in order to get the transition back far enough to fit all of my 38-40's. They have different chambers (mainly the length of the neck back to the transition) and a resized case from one gun was sometimes sticky in another gun. The shorter sizing die took care of that.

If you are only shooting the cases out of one gun, though, you might not need to do this. It would be like neck sizing a case for that particular gun.

[Speedo66]

I use this 180g. bullet from Missouri Bullets, works well in my gun, and seems to be in the right place to crimp with the Lee Factory Crimp Die. http://www.missouribullet.com/details.php?prodId=190&category=5&secondary=22&keywords=

They offer a discount to members of this board, forget what the code is though at the moment.

I place it over a very mild load of 5.5-6 grains of Trailboss in my original '73.

[w30wcf]

Probably the best commercial .38-40 bullet (8-9 bhn).....
http://www.cowboybullets.com/38-40-cal-180-grain_p_16.html

w30wcf

[KirkD]

I use RCBS .40-180-CM over 13.5 grains of 2400 for 1,320 fps in my original Model 1873. With a rough bore, I still got five shot groups at 100 yards of 3 & 1/4". In my opinion, this is good for a rough bore and a plain base, soft cast bullet (pure clip on wheel weights). Crimped in the groove, this bullet fed through two different 38-40 Model 1873's with no problems ever.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v497/3855Win/38-40-bullets.jpg

[ajjohns]

13.5 grs. of 2400. Any filler used?

[KirkD]

13.5 grs. of 2400. Any filler used?

No filler. Extreme spread was around 50 fps. Another load was 17.5 grains of IMR SR4759 under the same bullet for 1,313 fps but a higher E.S. of 77 fps (over 10 shots)

[ajjohns]

THank you, good info as always.

[bobby65]

Thank you all for some great info, I am just getting back into reloading after a 30 year stop so I am needing to read all this to get it going again.

[SgtDog0311]

Probably the best commercial .38-40 bullet (8-9 bhn).....
http://www.cowboybullets.com/38-40-cal-180-grain_p_16.html

w30wcf

i cast everything I own but recently bought a Uberti 44-40 so no mold as yet. I ordered the first bullets I've ordered in a long time from this outfit and was impressed.

[SgtDog0311]

I've got a couple molds (32-40 and 32-20 from Veral) with no crimp groove. Have had good luck crimping with both roll crimp and LFC (separate steps) in both.


Planning to shoot some IMR 4227 and SR 4759 tomorrow in the 44-40 (I know close but not exact match). Hoping 17gr of each doesn't send me over 1300fps.

[KirkD]

I'll look forward to a range report

[SgtDog0311]

Sent you some data Kirk. Didn't find accuracy here but satisfied myself on velocities.