Thinking of shooting cast in one of my 303 Brits.

[303Guy]

As much as I like paper patching, I have more rifles than I need for that ans plain cast are a lot easier and quicker to make, so I've been thinking of a dedicated cast boolit shooter. I happen to have a Long Branch No4 five groove with not the finest bore ever produced but the bore does seem uniform all the way. One land has a small groove running all the way down it and there is some rust damage. I'm sure a bit of fire-lapping or maybe hand lapping will smooth out the rough edges enough to allow decent velocity with cast. The appeal of this rifle is that it has the ladder sight although it lacks a windage adjustment (I'll likely make a front sight with windage). I do have another cast only candidate which would actually make more sense since that rifle cannot be fired with even near full power loads (it should really be scrapped as only one locking lug bears).

Anyway, I would probably start with a heavy boolit that fits the throat profile and likely only shoot single shot (unless the appropriate boolit load is short enough for the magazine but for range shooting single shot is fine).

It would be great to hear of your 303 Brit loads and results.:drinks:

[pdgh59]

I have had good success with a CBE 195 grain mould and 11 grains of Unique in a worn but tidy barrel on a 1908 No.1 MkIII. Projectile was sized to .313. My supply of Unique is running out so I will have to change over to ADI powders.

[cdngunner]

Steve is knowledgable, you can always drop him a line. He has forgotten more about the .303 then most people will ever learn

http://www.303british.com/id16.html

[longbow]

I've been having fun with a variety of boolits but mostly the NOE 316299 sized to 0.315" and the Mihec 316410 HP which is a lot of fun on water jugs.

I know you like heavy boolits so the 316299 would be hard to beat. It weighs 200+ grs. and I load over 18 to 22 grs. IMR4227 with good results. I also almost always load over COW filler (semolina). I have also loaded over Unique at up to 13 grs., 4198 and 4895 all with good results.

The 316410 is 130 gr. and scoots along very nicely and so far giving me quite decent accuracy.

I neck size only using a Lee collet die and mandrel to give me 0.313" inside of the neck after sizing. I found that my RCBS dies were definitely on the small size which not only worked brass a lot but left me with a very tight neck that was swaging boolits down at seating. Not at all suitable fo ra sloppy old milsurp. initially I made a larger expander button so that solved the swaged boolits issue but brass was still being overworked. The Lee collet die solved that.

I am sure CBE will have a mould to suit your needs as well.

Longbow

[tomme boy]

The one that has a rusty bore, have you shot paper patch in it already? I thought that would clean the bore up?

[303Guy]

Thanks for the thoughts.


The one that has a rusty bore, have you shot paper patch in it already? I thought that would clean the bore up?I have fired a few rounds through both candidates but not only that I've fired a few fire-lapping rounds through them. I have just been having a look and I like the 1896 rifle for the task - it's much lighter than the other but has no sights. I discovered I have two other rifles that would fit the bill. One has sights and the other not but I have the sights for it. I would fit a scope though if I chose that one. The muzzle would need to be cut back a bit to get to full rifling. Making and fitting a scope mount would take some time so maybe I should opt for the one with sights (that one does not need its muzzle cut back).

[303Guy]

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo327/303Guy/1902LEMkI003.jpg (http://s388.photobucket.com/user/303Guy/media/1902LEMkI003.jpg.html)

I might just try this rifle although I was planning on shooting paper patch in it. It has had some 500 rounds of cordite machine gun ammo through it in one session which polished the first half of the bore and visibly rounded the rifling edges near the chamber. This is the rifle that shot 1¼ MOA with jacketeds and with a small string of heavy cast (220gr).

[303Guy]

I've been looking through my records and I see I have shot 245gr paper patched boolits. I've even fired some 265gr boolits! Neither at targets but they both tracked nose first and expanded well in the catch medium. I should cast some up and test them for stability at a range.

I found photo's of 144gr patched boolits that had been inserted into the chamber using a test case with a stop in it and it engaged the rifling. It may be too fat for good accuracy. I will have to range test them. They were accurate in my pig gun but that has a huge bore from rust.

I also remembered that my 1896 LE I* has a reverse taper bore. That one may not shoot well with cast.

How does Trail Boss perform in the Brit? What boolit weights?

[longbow]

I have loaded up to 225 gr. smooth/knurled boolits from home made moulds. You make smooth moulds. Just make one up about 0.002" to 0.003" undersize then knurl the boolits then tumble lube. Knurling takes mine up about 0.003".

My best shooting boolit to date from my scoped No. 5 and sporterized No. 4 is a 215 gr. smooth knurled boolit that turns in 1" to 1 1/2" groups at 50 yards. Beats my NOE 316299 and Mihec 316410 moulds so far. Certainly not bench rest or varmint quality but it satisfies me when shot from an old and untuned milsurp and is minute of water jug with those 316410 HP's... SPLAT!

Longbow

[303Guy]

Thanks longbow. What powder and charge were you using? I have some W748 that seems to burn quite well at 28grs (about 60% load density) with Dacron filler. I also have some W780 which takes a nearly full case but may produce too much velocity for plain cast. I also have H4227, H4350 and Clays (for its bulk).

I'm thinking of lubing in molten lube which will set firm. I had been working on some before D-Day plus I have my old reliable 'waxy-lube' that I used in the hornet with jacketeds (to 'glue' the bullets in unsized case necks). I'm thinking of 'gluing' the cast boolits too. Actually, I used this stuff in my first smooth side cast boolit test in the gun above which produced very encouraging results. The 'waxy-lube' actually supported the undersize nose section of the boolit in the throat. I had the idea that it would provide dynamic fluid support for the boolit until it was fully support by the bore. It seemed to work. I didn't knurl them at that stage but I have test tube fired knurled boolits and the results look promising so I think that is what I will try first.

[tomme boy]

Be careful of the 748. I have had a lot of problems with ignition with it. Even at 95% fill it needed a mag primer. I feel it may have been because of a long throat.

[longbow]

I generally load over IMR4227 at somewhere between 18 and 22 grs. I have also had good results with 4198 and Unique. I tend to use 4227 because I usually have it on hand for loading my .44 mag as well. A slower powder will give more velocity in the .303 but for the shooting I have been doing it works very well for me.

One day I will chronograph the loads but so far I have not. the 4227 seems to work very well for lighter boolits too and has given good results under my Mihec 316410 which is devastating to water jugs.

Longbow

[Le Loup Solitaire]

In the book titled, "The Art of Bullet Casting" which is still available through Wolfe Publishing, Jim Carmichael former editor of Field And Stream, wrote an elaborate article on loading the 303 Brits/SMLE rifles with cast bullets. Many molds are discussed and powders suggested.
The rest of the book is devoted to many calibers and facets of bullet casting and loading. Other authors of various credentials are included. It is a valuable and informative text. LLS

[303Guy]

Thanks. I'm surprised at W748 being difficult to ignite. I've tried it in low charges (10gr) using the lowest intensity primer Federal LR) with no problem. I did use a filler and the boolit was heavy (194gr).

I wonder if that book is available electronically?

[Scharfschuetze]

The whole series should still be available on DVD from either Wolf Publishing or Amazon.

[303Guy]

So today I pulled out hither to unfired (by me) 1940 SHTLE III. It is ready for shooting as is. Oh, I did fire lap it into my 'test tube' so the bore is ready (it had some fluffy rust which has left no visible signs), so strictly speaking I have fired it. I grabbed a selection of cast boolits lying in a container and found one that fits! Woo hoo! The bore at the muzzle measures .305 (at the muzzle) and the rifling is good. No doubt there is more roughness than what can be seen but ii will be fine pitting which is actually good since it holds lube but might limit max velocity. The boolit measures .318 /.312 which may actually be too large at the base (it fits the throat to the correct depth for seating to the neck base) and weighs 183grs. My concern is the the large diameter may result in trailing edge feathering which will destroy accuracy but I'll pop one through the bore with a cat sneeze load and see what it looks like. I have a lube I made up last year which seems to work with knurled boolits. It actually prevents metal to metal contact at low speeds so I'll start with it and see. Now to select a powder and charge for the first test runs. I have H4227 and W748 to choose from. The W748 produces real low pressure for a half decent velocity but the bore might not handle too much velocity. So I shall go and play with the old girl. Oh, it's a 'sporterized' gun, not badly done either for a cut down military fore-end. I knew there was a reason I was buying it! :roll: Actually, it was destined to be a gift to a mate. Was.[smilie=1: :mrgreen:

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo327/303Guy/1940SHTLEIII002_zps2d97328a.jpg (http://s388.photobucket.com/user/303Guy/media/1940SHTLEIII002_zps2d97328a.jpg.html)

[NYBushBro]

So today I pulled out hither to unfired (by me) 1940 SHTLE III. It is ready for shooting as is. Oh, I did fire lap it into my 'test tube' so the bore is ready (it had some fluffy rust which has left no visible signs), so strictly speaking I have fired it. I grabbed a selection of cast boolits lying in a container and found one that fits! Woo hoo! The bore at the muzzle measures .305 (at the muzzle) and the rifling is good. No doubt there is more roughness than what can be seen but ii will be fine pitting which is actually good since it holds lube but might limit max velocity. The boolit measures .318 /.312 which may actually be too large at the base (it fits the throat to the correct depth for seating to the neck base) and weighs 183grs. My concern is the the large diameter may result in trailing edge feathering which will destroy accuracy but I'll pop one through the bore with a cat sneeze load and see what it looks like. I have a lube I made up last year which seems to work with knurled boolits. It actually prevents metal to metal contact at low speeds so I'll start with it and see. Now to select a powder and charge for the first test runs. I have H4227 and W748 to choose from. The W748 produces real low pressure for a half decent velocity but the bore might not handle too much velocity. So I shall go and play with the old girl. Oh, it's a 'sporterized' gun, not badly done either for a cut down military fore-end. I knew there was a reason I was buying it! :roll: Actually, it was destined to be a gift to a mate. Was.[smilie=1: :mrgreen:

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo327/303Guy/1940SHTLEIII002_zps2d97328a.jpg (http://s388.photobucket.com/user/303Guy/media/1940SHTLEIII002_zps2d97328a.jpg.html)

I like that schnabel fore-end...!

[303Guy]

Yeah. It's the most tastefully sporterized Lee Enfield fore-end I have seen. It makes the rifle a great sporter just like that. It's nicely balanced too.

On the week end I fitted sights to 1896 LE I with a SMLE barrel on it. This one has a .307 bore with a slightly tighter region in the middle of the barrel.

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo327/303Guy/1986LEI002_zps7dec67db.jpg (http://s388.photobucket.com/user/303Guy/media/1986LEI002_zps7dec67db.jpg.html)

The funny whatever below the rear sight is actually epoxy! One day I'll solder them on properly but for now it's just about getting it to the range. This rifle is really light and has a nice balance. So I've got three rifles to test. I'm hoping this last one will shoot light subsonic boolits for field use on bunnies and other small critters.

[Artful]

Geez, you got all the nice toys :mrgreen: