How does a lubrisizer work?

[kellyj00]

I've just finished casting my very first lot of bullets this weekend. Unfortunately, I got so excited about casting, that I forgot that I have to lube them.

I've investigated the options for lubrisizers, and it looks like there's a lot of very nice folks on this forum who are willing to sell me their old Lyman 45's to do the job. Thanks for all the offers!

My real question is, how do these beasts work? With the $12 Lee option from Midway, it looks like the size is simply a tube that threads into a press and you can just run the bullet through the tube and then tumble lube later in liquid alox. Let me know if this is incorrect.

With the other lubrisizers, they have these optional heating accessories and what not. That's where I get a little confused...does a Lyman sizer, for example, just have a tube that sizes the bullet, then you have to manually rub lube into the grooves of the bullet yourself, or is this done through some sort of automated deal? I'm struggling to see how to automate such a thing, especially with hot, liquid lube.

oh, by the way, Thanks for all of your help in getting me started so far! After reading so much on this forum, my first casting session went by better than I could have ever imagined without your help!

[VTDW]

I have a Lyman 4500. First I use the gas check tool to install my gas checks. Next I place the boolit base down on the sizing die and pull the lever. The sizing die has holes in it that disperse the lube around the boolit. When the lever is pulled it sizes the boolits as well as the lubing process starts. When the lever is raised back up more lube is dispersed where necessary as well as the boolit comes up out of the sizing die clean with no lube to wipe off other than the gas check on the bottom. Pretty simple really. I also use a lube heater as my lubes are sort of hard and need a bit of heat to work well.

On the Lee, I used mine a few times but personally do not like to tumble lube so I bought a 4500 here on this site for $70 well spent. Here is a link that Ranch Dog took pictures of his using his method of tumble lubing. It will pretty well lay out the steps to tumble lubing. He is adamnant about Lee Liquid Alox and sticks with that as he has experienced zero problems with it and shoots thousand of round a year thru his Marlins at high velocity. http://www.marlinowners.com/board/viewtopic.php?t=27079

That is about it.

Dave

[garandsrus]

kellyj00,

As was mentioned, lube/size dies in a Lyman, RCBS, STAR have holes in them that the lube passes through to the bullet.

The Lee size dies are exactly what you described. You have another option besides tumble lubing when using them. You can size the boolits with the Lee and then pan lube them, possibly re-sizing them again after lubing.

The Lyman and RCBS units are very similar and the lube inserts work with both machines. With these, there is also an inner "sleeve" that is depressed by the boolit as it is sized. As the sleeve is raised up, the sized and lubed boolit come out of the press. The purpose of the sleeve is to prevent lube from leaking out of the press when there isn't a boolit. You will need a different nose punch for each nose style (SWC, RN, etc). These work very well and are reasonable priced.

The Star sizer works very differently. There is no inner sleeve. The boolit is pushed completely through the die. The bottom of the handle stroke pressurizes the lube so that is the only time it flows into the boolit. This is a much faster way to lube boolits as you only need to handle them once instead of twice. The other advantage is that you size the boolits nose first which means that you are always pressing on the flat base of the bullet. One flat punch works with any nose style. The disadvantage is that the machine and size dies cost more than the Lyman/RCBS.

There is a lot written on this site about all the methods, so you can do a search on one that interests you...

John

[black44hawk]

If you're frugal and do not mind smearing lube onto your bullets by hand, consider the Lee bullet sizers. It is simply a die that you screw into your reloading press and send bullets in nose first (negating the need for a top punch). They're around 19 bucks and also apply gas checks. That's all I use.

[freedom475]

I suggest you buy an RCBS Lube-a-matic........use it with a soft lube (speed green, soft blue,ect.)so you don't need a heater. It's built sronger and it's useable with the lyman stuff. After reading some posts here it appears Lyman's aren't even totaly interchangeable with other lyman's:confused:

If you want the best you'll have to have a "star"

Hope this helps:Fire:

[kellyj00]

I don't like the idea of having to buy a new top punch for every type of bullet I want to cast. They're about $15 each, and I'm doing this on the cheap. Hell, I'm using lee molds that cost about the same. ;)

About this "smearing lube onto the bullets by hand"... What kind of lube would I use for that? I was under the impression that all lubes were hard like wax except Liquid Alox. Could someone clarify this for me?

Thanks!

[mroliver77]

Actually they are wax based but not near as hard as say a sheet of parafine. You will see Felix lube mentioned here alot. It is a brew "invented" by Felix of this site. While somewhat stiff it also is very workable and sticky. It can be rubbed into the grooves by hand if wanted. I would heat the lube and dip boolits into hot lube and when pulled out it leaves a nice coating on them. Then run through the sizer it compacts it into the grooves and shears off excess. Really though if you shoot any volume the lubsizers are the way to go in my humble opinion. J

[Scrounger]

With the Lee Bullet Sizer you can use liquid alox which admittedly can be a little messy, or you can pan lube and then run the bullets through the Lee Sizer. You can run a search here for pan lube techniques but basically it's just melting any lube in a flat bottomed pan and setting the bullets in it base down until the lube sets, then cutting them out with a "cookie cutter" if you can find the right size. An empty cartridge case of the same caliber will work to cut them out. Set fresh unlubed bullets in the empty holes, add a little heat to remelt lube and repeat cutting out process. Not messy at all. It'll get old if you're shooting 500 bullets a week but for some of us who don't shoot too much, it works very well. And it is cheap which is the greatest of virtues.

[VTDW]

kellyj00,

I commend you on asking a good question along with your explanation. :drinks: You are getting some great descriptions and explanations here no matter which way you decide to go. Have fun.

Dave

[kellyj00]

I think I am, once again, over thinking this subject.
After reading a few threads about using johnson's paste wax, I think I'll go ahead and use the method of rubbing it in to each bullet.

Just like swimming, I usually handload with a buddy for safety's sake (this isn't a middle school or Saturday night live's ambiguously gay duo... wipe the smile off your face) not too mention to keep the activity from growing dull. Maybe we can work out a setup of rubbing the JPW into a bullet while the other loads them on the turret press. Handloading... it's just one of those activities that's better with two fellas. again, wipe that smile off your face.

Thanks for the tips.

[Woodwrkr]

I've been experimenting with the JPW lube, and so far my favorite method is dipping the base of the boolits in melted JPW. It's faster than smearing by hand (by a long shot) and gives a more even consistent coat than tumble lubing with JPW. One hint about dipping, the cooler the melted wax, the thicker the coat on the boolit. But the others are correct about volume shooters. Lubing using any of the methods such as dipping, pan lubing, smearing gets old very quickly when you're trying to do a large volume. I'm already eyeballing those Magma Star Lube Sizers.

[STP]

kellyj00,

It certainly could be argued that starting off by running with a bench mounted lubesizer is the way to go, but by starting off by pan lubing first could be a good way to grasp the fundamentals.
The start-up cost beats making several mistakes with the wrong sizing die diameter, and nose punches that leave unsightly marks on the noses and ogives. Granted, the Lee pan boolit lubricating & resizing kits restrict you to a "one size fitz-all" in terms of sizing diameter, but you certainly will avoid the nose damage, as the sizer requires that you start them in nose first, and then drive them thru the sizer body.

The art of alloys and the proper sized diameters for your boomsticks is a bit down the road, eh?

What caliber(s) are you casting for?

[MT Gianni]

I don't like the idea of having to buy a new top punch for every type of bullet I want to cast. They're about $15 each, and I'm doing this on the cheap. Hell, I'm using lee molds that cost about the same. ;)

About this "smearing lube onto the bullets by hand"... What kind of lube would I use for that? I was under the impression that all lubes were hard like wax except Liquid Alox. Could someone clarify this for me?

Thanks!

A 1/4" bolt with the flats turned off to a shape that will fit in your die will size almost any fp boolit. Gianni

[montana_charlie]

Handloading... it's just one of those activities that's better with two fellas.
You are welcome to see it that way you like, but...

I've never had the opportunity to 'socialize' while casting, but I think my technique would suffer because chit-chat and swapping stories is something I dearly love...so much so that I will not do it while reloading.

Since I DO use a lubrisizer, and lube bullets that go straight into cases, lubing is part of reloading, for me.
When I AM reloading (that activity which involves the explosives), the last thing I want is somebody else around to keep things from getting dull.
CM

[wmitty]

kellyj00

One thing I've realized during the time I've spent reading on this forum is that there are two kinds of bullet casters and their thoughts on equipment vary 180 degrees.

The group you and I fall in is the " get it done at the least cost" group. We have a very limited portion of our budget we can devote to this hobby, regardless of how much we enjoy participating in it.

The group we don't fall in is the " buy a Star and be done with it" bunch. This crew is blind to the way of thinking required by those in the 1st group. They can't grasp why anyone would buy any piece of equipment that isn't the very best; regardless of cost.

I suggest purchasing the Lee push thru dies first, and tumble lubing. This allows seating the gas checks; if you're shooting plain base simply tumble lube and shoot.

I'd then consider a Lyman 45 ( they are built heavier than the 450 and rcbs sizers)

The advantage of the lubesizer is mainly a convenient form of placing lubricant on the boolet; size in the push thru die and lube with the sizer. This will save the sizer from damage incurred while trying to size down an oversize boolet.

[Wayne Smith]

To give you some idea of my values, after years of casting I'm still using the Coleman stove and the stainless one quart kitchen pot I started with. Actually, I like dipping, and with some of the boolits I cast (458125 - 520gr) I need to dip. I started with pan lubing and shooting unsized which worked somewhat. I now have a Lyman 450 and an RCBS Lubesizer, one set up with a BP/pistol lube and one set up with Speed Green. Changing the lubes is the bitch, not the dies. I bought both off eBay, and I only bid cheap. (Ask Buckshot - he fixed one of the molds I bought - said never to send him another like that!)

I have sized with the Lee dies and like the process, but you still have to lube and pan lubing works but is messy. Getting the boolit out with the grooves filled, without the lube sticking to the lube and pulling out of the grooves, or getting lots of lube smeared on the boolit which needs to be cleaned off, either off the boolit or off the Lee die, is messy. I prefer the lubesizer.

[cbrick]

the last thing I want is somebody else around to keep things from getting dull. CM

I couldn't agree more, my loading room isn't the family den or social hour. The only time someone else is in my loading room is when I'm teaching a newbie reloading and not even then if its me doing the reloading.

Rick

[VTDW]

This clip is using a Lyman 4500 Lubrisizer to size and lube the .30 cal. boolits. Sorry, but I couldn't get a better angle and the camera will not let me zoom during filming.


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v354/vtdw1/Casting%20Lubing/th_HPIM0175.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v354/vtdw1/Casting%20Lubing/?action=view&current=HPIM0175.flv)

[TAWILDCATT]

KELLY00:get the Lee and they give you a tube of lube.
what you do is get plastic butter tub and put some bullets in it then squit some lube on shake tub and put bullets on wax paper,let set over night.lube hardens and size then load.I have two Lyman 45 and many dies.but use what I need and I use lee sizer. aparently some cant read as you said you are on a budget.and sizers are new $180 and used $70?.I am on fixed income to and it is SS.[smilie=1:
:coffee:---:Fire:

[Bret4207]

Dipping and pan lubing are ok, but the tumble lube really is the easiest, most efficient method I've found. For low and mid range velocity it works just as well as the lubrisizer, for me anyway. Hand lubing.... I've done it, I still do on occasion, I don't enjoy it. The Lee push through system works fine for most designs.