Gas Checks for Century-old Winchesters?

[FromTheWoods]

It feels as if my world is beginning to shift toward a new axis; I might be gas checking bullets soon.

I'm ignorant regarding the process of seating gas checks, their performance from old rifles, and their benefits.

I know the check helps to seal the bore to diminish leading.

I'm loading for the .32-40, .32WS, and .30WCF: all original Winchester '94's, 26" octagons--five rifles total.

.32-40= I use a filler between the powder and the plain-based lead bullet; otherwise, its groups are not groups. Shoots jacketed fine.

=.32WS doesn't really need the filler, but I use it to just pull the groups in a bit tighter.

=.30WCF I have yet to load for.

The bores in most of these are dandy.

So far, I've used Laser-Cast and Meister bullets. Beartooth won't feed properly in the .32-40. The crimp groove is in the wrong place. For a reason I can't recall, they would not fit the chamber? of the .32WS.

Would you people recommend that I scrap the filler and use gas checked bullets in these rifles?

Should I just experiment and try to find a plain-based slug that will perform well?

Do gas checks aid for better accuracy over plain-base?

Answers/opinions I neglected to address?

[Wayne Smith]

Plain based or paper patched pure lead are fine for those caliber/velocities. Many of Lyman's molds were designed for those calibers when they were originally loaded, except for the 30WCF, with BP. Several members here are likely to post specific mold numbers for you.

In answer to your general question, you need to either start casting or buy bullets from Bullshop. Tell him what you are shooting and he will have a mold for it.

[Leftoverdj]

From, GCs are helpful if you want velocities higher than about 1400 fps. There are people report good accuracy with plain base bullets at higher velocities but they are better at this than I am.

Get with Bullshop. He can supply you what you really need, rather than what he feels like making as most commercial suppliers do. Cast bullets are too finicky for the one-size-fits-all approach.

[racepres]

From, GCs are helpful if you want velocities higher than about 1400 fps. There are people report good accuracy with plain base bullets at higher velocities but they are better at this than I am.

Get with Bullshop. He can supply you what you really need, rather than what he feels like making as most commercial suppliers do. Cast bullets are too finicky for the one-size-fits-all approach.
Well spoken!!! Errr... Typed.. MV

[eka]

I use a gas check on my 84 year old Winchester in .38-55. Just starting to play around with it, but it looks promising. If the weather would give me a break, I would get down to bidness. Can't say I've had any experience with plain base boolets and really don't have any plans to in the near future. From what I gather, getting plain based boolets to shoot in a rifle with any real velocity is tough.

Keith

[FromTheWoods]

I talked with a fellow today, well--more like--I listened. He said that gas checks would serve me well. That they would prevent leading of the barrel when compared with the leading from plain based slugs.

Thank you for recommending The Bull Shop. I'll call him to see about getting set up to gas check.

[mroliver77]

FTW, You should be able to shoot these rounds with plain base with NO leading if fit properly to your individual guns. Gaschecks do make it easier most times but proper fitting is the key.

[FromTheWoods]

By "fitting" do you mean keeping the pressure/velocity low enough to not cause leading?

Do you think a bit of Original Shot Buffer (polyethylene) would help?

[Wayne Smith]

By "fitting" do you mean keeping the pressure/velocity low enough to not cause leading?

Do you think a bit of Original Shot Buffer (polyethylene) would help?

No, fitting is slugging your throat/barrel and having a boolit that fits your geometry. This prevents blow-by and leading from that cause. It allows harder boolits because you don't rely on the boolit slugging up to fit.

[9.3X62AL]

Get with Bullshop. He can supply you what you really need, rather than what he feels like making as most commercial suppliers do. Cast bullets are too finicky for the one-size-fits-all approach.

+1 to that. DJ's last sentence sums up the boolit casting hobby succinctly.

Casters often go to great lengths to blend THE ALLOY--to find THE BOOLIT LUBE--and shoot THE BOOLIT DESIGN for their firearms. All this is wasted motion if the boolit does not fit the throat and grooves well. "Nominal" diameters given in loading manuals or gunmaker specs may or may not be what your firearm's dimensions actually are. An older firearm or a foreign-made firearm is more likely to vary from nominal than is a modern-made platform, but you won't know what you have until you slug & mic or do a chamber cast.

1400 FPS is a good general guideline for the upper velocity limit possible in rifle barrels with plain-based boolits, although velocity is an indirect measure of the actual limiting factor--pressure intensity. The gas check "covers a power of sins", as Mark Twain would say--things like faster twist rates, bore smoothness/roughness, as well as the above-mentioned boolit characteristics push that velocity limit around in both directions, too.

[crowbeaner]

With the soft steel in those early Winchesters you may want to anneal or soften the gaschecks to avoid preliminary irreversible bore wear however. I shot some RCBS 30-180-FPs in grandpas 30 WCF by doing this. They worked just fine.

[mroliver77]

Do we have a post on slugging, chamber casts/impressions and boolit fitting that would make a nice sticky?