A few results with some alternative pistol powders.

[tazman]

Pistol powders are hard to come by in this area. I haven't seen a bottle of bullseye or 231 in months. Because of this I needed to work with some alternative powders for pistol use.
I was able to acquire some Winchester super handicap and some Titewad, so I worked up a few loads with them. I get good accuracy(for me) with all these loads.
I got access to a chronograph today and tested 6 loads, 3 for the 38special and 3 for the 9mm.
These are the results. USE AT YOUR OWN RISK.

Conditions- Partly cloudy- temp 78F distance to chrono=5ft

38 special- mixed brass- winchester primers- Taurus tracker stainless 6inch ported barrel- Chrony chronograph.
Lee 358-158-rf 3.9 grains wsh 854fps average for 7 shots
Lee tl358-148-wc 3.2 grains titewad 772fps average for 7 shots This one is seated long- crimped into the third grease groove.OAL 1.345
Lyman 358429 3.9 grains wsh 852fps average for 7 shots

9mm- mixed brass- CCI primers- Taurus pt92 afs stainless with 4.9 Beretta barrel- Chrony chronograph
Lee 356-120-tc 4.2 grains wsh 1142fps average for 10 shots
Lee 356-95-rf 3.8 grains titewad 1152fps average for 10 shots
NOE 358-135-fn 4.2 grains wsh 1075fps average for 10 shots

I was able to chrono one other load for the 9mm. I have been playing with a Lee 153 grain boolit for a few weeks now and chronoed my pet load for it. While not an unusual pistol powder I found the results interesting.
Lee 356-153-2r 5.5 grains AA7 885fps average for 10 shots This result was pretty much dead on the listing for a 147 grain lead boolit from the Accurate arms data site.

[35 Whelen]

Good work.

35W

[dtknowles]

Agreed, good work, I don't have or use those powders but you never know maybe some day I might.

Tim

[GREENCOUNTYPETE]

EXACTLY what i was looking for someone to confirm my numbers on tightwad for the 38spl I have been thinking 3.4gr under a 356-120tc was the place to work up to , your 3.2 under a heavier boolit makes me think that is right in the range i am looking for

[tazman]

EXACTLY what i was looking for someone to confirm my numbers on tightwad for the 38spl I have been thinking 3.4gr under a 356-120tc was the place to work up to , your 3.2 under a heavier boolit makes me think that is right in the range i am looking for

Please remember I am using these in a 357 magnum revolver. I don't know if they will be safe in a 38 special with a non +P rated frame and cylinder.

[Lonegun1894]

I've loaded .38 Spl with match heads instead of powder. I did not have a chronograph available, but the point of impact with a Lee 158RNFP was 2 inches higher at 25yds than with my standard loads that go 950fps fired out of my Ruger Security Six 4" .357 Mag. I don't know how much slower they had to be going to raise POI that 2", but 2" at 25yds isn't that much of a difference in my book, and still makes for a very useable load. Word of caution though. I used strike anywhere matches, so you can imagine the pucker factor when I loaded the cases fully with match head material and then seated the bullets into the cases, compressing the match heads in the process, and praying that the next pull of the lever wouldn't ignite the match heads and cause a detonation. So I only loaded 6 of these, just to test the theory and make sure it would work. Well, I'm satisfied that it will, but have no intention of loading any more unless absolutely necessary. And the group was the usual 1.75" wide, but just 2" above my normal POI.

[Forrest r]

I haven't tried ww super handicap in any pistols/revolvers but it does an excellent job in the 308 with plinking bullets/loads. Some cramer #50 sp's that have been pc'd & loaded in mixed brass with 10.0g of ww super handicap, shot @50yds that chronographed @ 1700fps for a 10-shot group.

http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t242/forrestr-photo/50ampflier_zpsaadf309a.jpg (http://s162.photobucket.com/user/forrestr-photo/media/50ampflier_zpsaadf309a.jpg.html)

The lyman 311291 that has been pc'd & loaded with 9.0g of ww super handicap & mixed brass shot @ 50yds. A 10-shot group that chronographed @ 1391fps.

http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t242/forrestr-photo/pc311291_zpsea11d496.jpg (http://s162.photobucket.com/user/forrestr-photo/media/pc311291_zpsea11d496.jpg.html)

[tazman]

Lonegun--- I had never even heard or thought of being able to use match heads for a powder replacement. Interesting........

Forrest r-------Those are superb results. Nice to know WSH works in a rifle as well.

[nagantguy]

Nice work up, good info havent run out of my favorite pistol powders yet but its getting down to where i almost hate to use it. This is the inventive no nonsense approach to solving problems and breaking new ground. Well done sir.

[GREENCOUNTYPETE]

my smallest bushing drops 2.3 gr I plan to start there , as that is what I use in some other very light plinking rounds , actually working very well with a 312-90swc in a 30-30 for a plinker

i also found this thread http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?190243-Whoops-it-s-TITEWAD&highlight=titewad I may be done right at 2.3 as this user found 2.4 was about 717fps with very mild recoil in a 38

apparently there are some 32 fans of tightwad also from the info in this thread

I won't put down a 32 but 38 guns and brass are just so much more available

[Lonegun1894]

Lonegun--- I had never even heard or thought of being able to use match heads for a powder replacement. Interesting.......



All I did was cut off the sulphur mix off of the matches so all I was putting in the case was the matchhead mix and not any of the wood off the stick, but be warned cause it took quite a few matches to load a .38Spl case, and it took some time. I see this as a last ditch kind of process, because I really don't think it is safe since I later crushed the same matchheads I had put in the case when I seated the bullets into the cases, and I used strike anywhere matches. Anyway, it worked, and shot well, but please be careful cause I have some serious doubts as to how safe this was, even if I got away with it. I have tried thee same experiment with a .30-30 lever-action, and a .308 bolt action, and they both gave decent performance ( 1.25" @50yds for the .30-30 with irons and .75" for the scoped .308 at 50yds), so it works ok in rifles, even though I doubt either load hit 2000 fps, so I wouldn't want either loaded this way for long shots, but at fairly short ranges, it works. Took a hog with the .30-30 loaded this way at 75yds, hit just behind the shoulder and it made it 15yds before dropping.

[I'll Make Mine]

I like the idea of expanding the range of powders usable in handgun cartridges. The bigger ones, .357 Magnum and on up, seem to tolerate slower powders pretty well and with a burn rate chart in hand you could probably find something that will work (assuming you can determine a starting load) for anything at least as fast as 2400 or H-110 (IIRC, I used to use a slightly compressed load of H-110 under a 160 grain JSP in my Dan Wesson -- but it was MAX for that gun).

For smaller cases, faster powders are required, but there are a lot of shotgun powders out there that should work well in the Bullseye to Unique part of the spectrum. Again, find a burn rate chart and see what's in that fast end of the list -- I've had people tell me Solo 1000 is a shotgun powder only, but with a burn rate similar to Bullseye, it now seems to work pretty well in small cases or for cat-sneeze rifle loads.

I think I'd avoid match heads. Not only are traditional strike-anywhere matches no longer available (they finally fell afoul of shipping hazard over-regulation), but they were never anything like safe to process into propellant; nor would the result be consistent enough for good accuracy. The white tip mix contains phosphorus, sulfur, and chlorate, and as such is a very hazardous primary explosive (made more or less safe for match head use by inclusion of a bunch of gelatine-based "hide glue"); the colored part is still based on sulfur and chlorate and would be considered a "death mix" by a pyrotechnician. Even if you manage to load ammunition without blowing yourself up, the result is low performance compared even to homemade black powder (which is MUCH safer both to make and to use), and due to the chlorate content is corrosive (chloride salts in your bore after firing, to the tune of hundreds or thousands of times as much as from corrosive primers). A lot of (nerve-wracking) work for a significantly inferior result, IMO.