Comparison of LC Match and Lapua .308 brass

[fastfire]

Today I happened into 100 once fired LC Match .308 brass.
Been thinking about getting 2-300 Lapua.
Does anyone have experience with both brands and your thoughts?
I have been using LC 13 (have 400+)for a few months and am on the 4th loading.
I anneal before each sizing also length trim each time.

[Bigslug]

The Lapua was ready to rock out of the box as far as case weight. We sorted and the LC LR brass and it was not as consistent in weight as a box of Lapua brass. However; after sorting by weight, FL sizing, and trimming, the groups out from 600 yds out to 1,000 were actually pretty dang close.


And there you have it. Personally, I'd rather pay for Lapua and not fritter away my life on case prep. My Highpower days were spent mostly with IMI brass, which was good stuff, but it got weight segregated and primer pocket uniformed. The Lapua I just unbox and shoot.

[Scharfschuetze]

I like both and find little difference between them for accuracy or case life. The LC Match cases (prior to M118 Special Ball and M118LR) did not have a crimped in primer and thus were/are easier to match prep.

I once brought a foot locker full of once fired Lapua brass back from a deployment in Asia. I gave most of it away to fellow NM shooters, but I've still got what is probably a lifetime supply of the stuff.

[fastfire]

LC 66 Match, on the head stamp and red primer sealant, no crimp primer.

[Bigslug]

In 1966, they probably hadn't even THOUGHT of a lot of the case prep issues Benchrest shooters now apply as a matter of course, let alone manufactured the cases with those issues in mind.

I'm not saying it's junk - I'd happily use it - but it's not likely to be on the same plane of existence as the new Scandinavian stuff.

[Larry Gibson]

I to have been using LC Match cases (M118, M852 and M72) w/o any real "match prep needing done. I've used some Lapua also and have found little difference in performance in consistency, accuracy or case life. I inside neck ream all the cases anyway (Lee target loader). Anyone want to give me any LC Match cases (new or once fired) I'll pay the shipping...........if that answers the question.

Larry Gibson

[tygar]

FWIW when working up loads for one of my 1k guns in 6.5-284, I did a comparison on Lapua, Norma, Nosler.

The Norma were the closest in weight, Nosler a close 2nd but ES was less. Lapua was 3rd in all.

I use LCM in military rifles 308/06. I have found that with large batches of same year brass I can easily get large groups in 1/2 gr groups & easily keep 80+% in the top of the Bell curve(1.5gr).

I use LC in same cals for cast shooting in bolts & spraying & praying in military, also weighed & they aren't as consistent but still group well in same year groups.

I use different brass in different rifles. I find what it likes & use that. e.g. F class 308 (also 1k) I use Remington. Yes Rem! 1.5-2" at 500, works for me. 6.5-284 F/1k Norma (this was the test batch) 300WSM & 300Win 1K, Nosler, 6.5-06 LR hunter, 2" @500, Rem. All necks turned.
ALL ARs use LC.

Win brass for 2 375H&H, Fed for another. etc. etc.

In general, I find that a lot of cheaper brass is very good & accurate at a fraction of Lapua & that Lapua out of the box is beaten by Nosler & Norma for consistency. I tested all 3 above & the Lapua shot in third place even after match weighing & loading. (have some for sale if you like it).

As said FWIW most decent brass can be match grade accurate. I have not found Lapua to be worth it. If I were to pick 1 for accuracy I'd go with Nosler.

[Old Caster]

I on the other hand would use only Lapua. I won the F class competition in Missouri in 2010 using Lapua brass. They were by far the most consistent when checking neck thickness. Probably the most important thing is to anneal them at least every other time with a system that is consistent and use a Sinclair system to reload. I used Berger 155 and seated them .005 off the lands with Varget powder with a Kimber Tactical Rifle. I didn't count how many times I reloaded the cases but they all had an equal # of loadings. I am going to guess that I shot them around 12 times each so far.

[Old School Big Bore]

When I was doing a lot of shooting with a jewel of an M24, I ran a lot of handloads through it (don't tell the Guard) and the match-marked M852 brass, once year/weight segregated, neck & pocket uniformed, were as good as any. My favorite aspect of that rifle was that my deer load shot as tight as the match loads, and tracked on the BDC, albeit in yards instead of meters...in other words its zero was the 100M mark at 100 yds, with my basic M118LR zero on the gun, ditto out to 400Y/M. I just had to be in the yards mindset. Meat on the table.

[tygar]

I on the other hand would use only Lapua. I won the F class competition in Missouri in 2010 using Lapua brass. .

Yep, that's why the make Chevys & Fords.

[USSR]

Well, all I'll say is, I will trade you 2 LC Match for 1 Lapua for all you guys who are enamored with LC Match brass. When I was shooting competitively, I took once-fired LC Match brass, completed match-prepped it and then sorted it by weight, and it STILL would not shoot as good out of my match rifle as out-of-the-box Lapua. As stated above, the consistency of Lapua is something that LC Match simply does not have.

Don

[Old Caster]

If you are not shooting a gun that is of real match quality, you won't see the accuracy difference between the different brass. I was even surprised that the Kimber barrel was up to snuff and expected to have to put a Krieger barrel on it.

[Old Caster]

In F class, you had better not have many out of the 10 ring or you won't even be in the mentioned group. If you guys are so good at long range shooting with inferior brass; enter a match, shoot, write about your experiences.

[tygar]

Well, all I'll say is, I will trade you 2 LC Match for 1 Lapua Don

I don't need more LCM (could be talked into unfired 06)

But I will trade you 2/1 for Nosler in 6.5-284, 300WSM, 300WinMag.

I found I have 6.5-284 at least: 66 once or twice fired, 100 new + I know I had 3-400 so probably have more unless I sold it. I'd go 3/1 on 308.

Happy to trade.

[USSR]

tygar,

I will gladly trade you 2/1 once-fired, completely match-prepped LC M72 Match .30-06 brass for Lapua .30-06 brass.

Don

[tygar]

I said trade Nosler. I buy LCM

[USSR]

Sorry, but my offer to trade from beginning to end only involved Lapua.

Don

[tygar]

And I said I'd trade Lapua for Nosler

[EDG]

Is that all you have to harp on is brass superiority? Tell us about the bullets you use. Surely they are just as elite as Lapua brass or you would not touch them.


In F class, you had better not have many out of the 10 ring or you won't even be in the mentioned group. If you guys are so good at long range shooting with inferior brass; enter a match, shoot, write about your experiences.

[tygar]

Berger & Sierra, in that order. There are no others for me.

[USSR]

I shot both .30-06 and 6.5x55 in 1,000 yard F Class, and used only Lapua brass with both. I can't think of a guy on the firing line that used anything but Lapua. As for bullets, I tested the 185gr Berger and 190SMK in .30-06, and there simply wasn't enough difference to justify the high price of the Bergers. In 6.5x55, I used the 139gr Lapua Scenar and 142SMK. I found I got slightly better accuracy with the Scenars.

Don

[Old Caster]

Is that all you have to harp on is brass superiority? Tell us about the bullets you use. Surely they are just as elite as Lapua brass or you would not touch them.

If you had read my posts you would have found that they were 155 Bergers. I haven't shot this game since 2010 but have heard that the scenars as mentioned in post #24 by USSR are now considered the best. If you are too poor to get into a high price game, get a BB gun and go for it and quit crying because some people have worked hard, saved their money and can and will buy quality components.

[Lance Boyle]

As with any competition it often takes money as well as skill to be competitive. You don't see bargain setup cars in Nascar do you? That said it still takes an indian to drive the arrow.

[tygar]

Fastfire- I just received 3,000 virgin LC 95 match cases in the mail today. I will compare them against unfired Lapua in a couple very accurate 308 rifles before I move. I will PM you the results and I hope it helps you in your question.

I have a significant amount of money, and I don't waste my money on Lapua brass. QUOTE)

LOL yes me 2 +1 on the money. I also have those guns. I have the heavy gun that won the 1k Nationals back in the late 90s, re-barreled of course. 3 guns made by Jeff Walker & 1 by Clay Spencer. Let me tell you when you start with a Batt action & go from there, it gets spendy.

I try not to get into peeing contests but I did have to respond to top shooters using only Lapua.

Just for example a few friends I hang with Danny Brooks 1k National Champ uses Winchester, Jeff Walker 3rd in Nationals & gun maker to lots of top shooters uses Fed in his light gun & Norma in his Heavy, Bob Rosen, "shooter of the yr"(I'm not positive cause it's been quite a while, but we have exactly the same heavy guns made by Clay Spencer) uses Nosler I think.

Anyhow, guys use various brass, bullets, etc. etc., which works for them. If you like Lapua use it, if you like PMC use that.

What matters is the consistency of "your" brass, volume, neck consistency, exact wts in powder, brass, primers that work for your load, etc.

That's why I use different brass in different rifles. Exactly the same as why we use different powders & bullets in different rifles.

As for LCM vs Lapua; As I said I use my LC in military rifles & in sporter conversions of mil actions. I don't use it in my 308 Fclass sniper. That is the only one that would use 308/06 brass & it doesn't particularly like the LCM or LC; does OK but not the 2" 500yd I get with the box of 1000 Rem I have been using for 10 yrs. By the way it also shoots 9 ring + at 1k with several 10s. Again, this is with Rem brass.

Use what works, that's why I use different brass in different rifles. Just like powder & bullets, some rifles like some but not others.

Experiment, that's what makes this fun.

[USSR]

I have a significant amount of money, and I don't waste my money on Lapua brass. My rifle/scope combo is about $6,000.00.

The DTA is close to $11,000.00

No reason to act like a snob because of your love of Lapua brass.

:confused: You have a very unique way of calling other people "snobs".

Don

[Old Caster]

Love life why did you put a description of yourself at the bottom of your post. Control your immaturity.

[Wooserco]

When I bought my uncle's bolt action match rifle, he included 500 '69 LC Match cases. Once fired. He was saving them for when he might make it back to Camp Perry. I never did load them, so don't know how the were. When I was shooting High Power Rifle (shooting 5.56) I used virgin Winchester brass at my one time trip to Camp Perry. Shot my best scores ever, two classes above my rated classification. Paid for my trip there!

[fredj338]

I have only used LC in 223, good brass. Lapua is my fav for any caliber I can get it in. Both offer internal volume uniformity & seem to last longer than others. Least favorite, Fed GMM in any caliber.

[dondiego]

I have only used LC in 223, good brass. Lapua is my fav for any caliber I can get it in. Both offer internal volume uniformity & seem to last longer than others. Least favorite, Fed GMM in any caliber.

What is GMM here?

[country gent]

I did use Lapua brass in my 243 match rifle with great results ( across the coarse and long range). In my M14/M1a I used NM cases as they held up longer to the more violent extraction.I do know of many shooting 308 bolt guns that went to Lapua brass.
For me in the service rifles 168 hornady BTHP match performed at the upper end, 223 was 75 hornadies and 80 grn JLKs. In the 243 87 grn and 107 starke flat bases.
Federal brass was good and used but some of the newer batches seemed softer.
Wiuth my swift the only brass I could get at the time was Norma and it was very good brass.

[ioon44]

What is GMM here?


Gold Medal Match

[Rickf1985]

WOW! I came to this thread because the title was about LC brass, which I have a lot of in 06 and 223. What I learned in this thread is that F class shooters tend to really look down on us standard class shooters, in other words, us poor people!! Now that was all from 2014, the recent posts don't mention those issues.

I have shot LC match brass most of my life. Started out by winning my class in Junior class at Perry in 1968. Again in 69 and then got drafted and never shot there again. But I still to this day shoot match brass in my 03A3 and it is more accurate than I am anymore. I had another member of our club who was a sniper in the sandbox shoot my gun at 300 yards, longest I have available and he put 10 rounds pretty much in a raged hole in the center of the target. The gun still has it, I don't. I got them all in the black but only 4 X's. So I don't think there is any problem with LC match brass as long as you are not shooting a 10,000 dollar gun.

[charlie b]

My experience with brass is limited by my rifles and shooting and I do not compete. If I am shooting 1/2moa groups I see little difference between brands, match quality brass or not. I do sort the brass, but, it is based on the velocity and shot POI. If I get a flier or a vel out of 'norm' then I mark the case head. If it shoots out of 'norm' again I toss the case.

I started with Lapua because of my .223. All other brass I tried (Fed, LC, Win, Hornady, Rem) all had enlarged primer pockets after 4 or 5 reloads. The Lapua brass went more than 25 and can still be used (I don't shoot .223 currently).

The .308 has worked well with most of the brands. All of them shoot under 1/2MOA on a regular basis. The 6BR I use Lapua and Peterson (cause Lapua is hard to find). I can't tell the difference between the two. It is also consistently below 1/2MOA.

My limited research on the topic is that if you carefully sort and prep the cases, the brand is almost immaterial. Every brand will have some bad cases. Some brands have more bad ones than others.

[Larry Gibson]

"My limited research on the topic is that if you carefully sort and prep the cases, the brand is almost immaterial. Every brand will have some bad cases. Some brands have more bad ones than others."

My experience also......

[dale2242]

I had a custom varmint rifle built in 221 Fireball for shooting sage rats.
The only 221FB brass available at the time was Lapua.
I bought 300 new Lapua brass for $210. $.70 apiece.
I had never spent anywhere near that much for brass before.
The rifle will consistently shoot 1/4" - 3/8' groups at 100 yds.
I don`t do any fancy benchrest style prep to the brass except neck size with a Lee collet die.
I don`t know if the brass is a big factor in the small groups or not.
BTW, it is very good brass.

[MT Gianni]

If you reread the Houston Warehouse experiment you see that the prep is a major factor and the brand not as much if it is consistent.