Lee 58 cal. REAL bullet in a 20 ga.?

[GrizzLeeBear]

I've been thinking about getting a slug gun for deer hunting in the shotgun zone here in MI and was looking at an H&R Ultra Slug gun. I do use a 54 flintlock, but the slug gun would be convient, too. The Midway catalog shows the Lee REAL 58 cal. bullet at .592 dia. and 440 grains. Could this be loaded in a wad in a 20 ga. shell like they do with their 12 ga. slug? The REAL bullet looks like it would be a lot better at 100+ yards than a roundball or a Foster type slug or even a sabot style slug like the Lyman.

[Mk42gunner]

I think it would be worth trying. One thing to keep in mind is the REAL bullet has a smaller base diameter, which might or might not work with your wads.

These measuremnts came from a REAL bullet I cast from wheelwieghts:

Base diameter .575"
second band- .581"
third band- .590"
Front band- .594"

Length .772"

Hope this helps,

Robert

[Blammer]

I think you will find that you're 58 cal with a dia of .592 will be too big to fit inside a wad and also too big to go down the bore.

I have done a lot of experimenting with slugs, wads and such for my NEF 20 ga. I cannot find any wad with a petal width that will work for a .592 dia bullet.

The nominal dia on a 20 ga is .625.

.625 minus .592 is .033. That .033 will need to be divided in half for .016 approximate petal thickness on one side. I have not found a wad with petals that thin.

The dia I am looking for for my slugs to fit in my 20ga with wads is approx .570.

[Blammer]

if you have a way to size it to .575 for all the bands that would be a great place to start.

[GrizzLeeBear]

OK, would a minie ball (like the Lee Improved Minie) work since they are .575 dia.? A bit heavier at 472 gr. though. Would the hollow base be a problem if they were cast out of WW or a 50/50 blend of WW and pure lead?
Also, Lyman has one that is shorter (575494) at 315 gr. with a SWC shape. If you could cast them without the core pin they might be what 425 gr. give or take? Might work.

[Baron von Trollwhack]

GrizzleeBear is right and A 575 minie' will fit in a regular winchester shotcup for the 20 ga. The forster slugs I measured were 580. My 2XX full choke for the 20 is 580 also. That's the place to start BTW the Lyman badmitton 20 ga. slug comes out @ 575/580 too. BvT******the 575494? mentioned loses stability at about 75 yards and accuracy goue south.

[Blammer]

if you can get rid of the core pin and make it a flat base instead of a hollow base I think it may work pretty good!

the problem I've had with that bullet and mould is that the skirt flairs out and pinches off the petals, unevenly and accuracy is horrible because of this.

I can't find a way to make it a flatbase.... otherwise I'd give that a go.

[Blammer]

the badmittin slug is ok to meaure .580 as it only has to size down .1 inch of slug....the narrow top band.

a 58 cal minnie is about an inch long and sizing down that much in the barrel is too much to ask and stay in safe pressures....

I'd want to start LOOSE with the minnie and then get tighter, watching pressures all the while...

[Baron von Trollwhack]

Try the standard minie'. Start with less powder! Actually the bearing syrface on the standard minie is not much. Certainly not as much as a Federal Foster type slug. The shot cup is soft and will squash. Lube the exterior of the sabot(shot cup). I could send you a few @ .5748 or .5758 BvT

[DLCTEX]

After reading about Federal (I think) using a plastic ball to fill the hollow base on a slug, I loaded some with soft lead balls in the base. The ball impacts in a different place( about an inch and a half away at 50 yds. I haven't experimented enough to know if accuracy improved. The design is to flare the skirt to fit the bore. I use some really thick Herters wads that I came by years ago. Dale

[GrizzLeeBear]

Here's another thought. MMP makes a .58 sabot for a .451-.452 bullet. Could you load a bullet like a Lee 452-300-RF in one of these and put it in a regular shot cup? Should make fairly light recoil since it would be like 3/4 of an ounce total.

[Blammer]

you can, and I have.

the problem is that the sabots are not hard enough, nor the shot cup.

In my trials I kept blowing out the sabot, from the bullet being set back into the sabot.

[Andy_P]

Now this is a little different, but not new. Get ahold of "The Fouling Shot" (put out by the Cast Bullet Association) issues #175, #176 and #177, and read John Alexander's articles on the "635 Nitro Express". He did just what you are trying - make up 20ga sabot rounds for his NEF Ultra Slug Gun.