Any Differences Between Shell Holders?

[alamogunr]

For many years now I have been using Lee shell holders for most of my reloading. This kit was thrown in when I bought the RCBS outfit. The only exceptions are those cartridges(EX. .475 L) that the Lee holder kit doesn't include. Occasionally, I've had cases that were difficult to insert into the holder. When this happened, I have attempted to scrape or file a little at the opening.

Other times there seems to be more play in the fit. I'm not overly worried when loading handgun cartridges but have wondered about rifle cartridges. Opinions, anyone?

[nicholst55]

Yes, there definitely are differences between different makes! For instance, with the (expletive deleted) Hornady hand priming tool, they include two primer trays - one for use with Hornady shellholders, and one for use with RCBS shellholders. I don't know exactly what the differences are, but they do exist. I have also adopted the practice of buying a dedicated shellholder for each set of rifle dies. That way, once I set the sizing die up with that specific shellholder, I know that the cartridge headspace isn't likely to change.

One thing I have noticed is that Lee uses the same shellholder for .44 Mag and .45 Colt. It seems to me that neither case fits their shellholder particularly well.

[jameslovesjammie]

One thing I have noticed is that Lee uses the same shellholder for .44 Mag and .45 Colt. It seems to me that neither case fits their shellholder particularly well.

Same with Lee's .40/9mm shellholder.

[fourarmed]

I have a friend who shoots benchrest - yeah, I know - and he insists that the shellholder should be the same brand as the dies. The idea is that if you set the dies according to the instructions, that guarantees correct headspace. The only thing I would worry about would be a combination that did not set the shoulder of a bottleneck case back far enough.

[novalty]

I normally buy RCBS. The only time I have heard of a difference was when my father-in-law bought a Hornady, and tried using it in his RCBS Automatic Bench Primer, and because the Hornady has such a large radius taken out of the front of it-the brass would try and push up and out of the shellholder. He threw the Hornady in a parts bin, and bought a RCBS shellholder--which encompasses more of the rim.

[MarkP]

Yes, there definitely are differences between different makes! For instance, with the (expletive delleted) Hornady hand priming tool, they include two primer trays - one for use with Hornady shellholders, and one for use with RCBS shellholders. I don't know exactly what the differences are, but they do exist. I have also adopted the practice of buying a dedicated shellholder for each set of rifle dies. That way, once I set the sizing die up with that specific shellholder, I know that the cartridge headspace isn't likely to change.

One thing I have noticed is that Lee uses the same shellholder for .44 Mag and .45 Colt. It seems to me that neither case fits their shellholder particularly well.

The thru holes are different diameters, the older Hornady hand held priming tools had small flanged bushings for use with RCBS shell holders.

[alamogunr]

Thanks! This is the information I was looking for. I wish I had thought to ask before I made my last big order to Graf's.

[country gent]

Shell holders can and do vary from brand to brand each manufacturer has what they think is the ideal desighn for it concerning rim groove thickness dia. lead in to rim groove. Diameters of said shell holder. Even with shell holder of the same manufacturer and same number there are diffrences due to manufacturing tolerences of the equipment used to make them. A dedicated shell holder for a die set is a good idea for repetive consistent set-ups. I believe redding made up shellholders in a set that were progessivly thicker allowing for headspace adjustment and die still touching shell holder.

[462]

Because of the differences, even within the same brand, I use dedicated shell holders, with each press and each caliber having its own.

[David2011]

Sounds like your question has been answered but I ran into a situation where the brass was the issue rather than the shell holders. The Swedish Mauser 6.5x55 casehead is close enough to the .308/.30-'06 to work with a standard boltface but it is, if correct, larger than the standard. Nominally the .308 sized casehead is .473" and the 6.5x55 is .479". The rub is if you use American brass. Some manufacturers use the .473" casehead for 6.5x55 so the rim is both smaller in diameter and thinner than the 6.5x55 spec. A correct 6.5x55 case won't fit the RCSB #3 and similar shell holders but a Remington or Winchester case will.

David

[alamogunr]

Sounds like your question has been answered but I ran into a situation where the brass was the issue rather than the shell holders. The Swedish Mauser 6.5x55 casehead is close enough to the .308/.30-'06 to work with a standard boltface but it is, if correct, larger than the standard. Nominally the .308 sized casehead is .473" and the 6.5x55 is .479". The rub is if you use American brass. Some manufacturers use the .473" casehead for 6.5x55 so the rim is both smaller in diameter and thinner than the 6.5x55 spec. A correct 6.5x55 case won't fit the RCSB #3 and similar shell holders but a Remington or Winchester case will.

David

I'll have to check that. I have some new Lapua 6.5X55 brass that I put back several years ago to save for the time that I felt comfortable casting and reloading for that cartridge. I still don't feel good enough about my reloads and am still waiting for the GB Cruise Missile mold. I think I set that brass aside about the time that GB started.

Most of my dies are RCBS so I guess I'll have to start saving my shekels for some more shell holders.

[Garyshome]

I use Lee's and sometimes have fitting issues, then I have to check and make sure it is the right one. LOL

[Mike W1]

I've always used Lyman dies and shellholders. One time years ago had a problem and it turned out to be the shellholder was the culprit. Think they sent me a new one but it was long ago.

[Artful]

Occasionally, I've had cases that were difficult to insert into the holder. When this happened, I have attempted to scrape or file a little at the opening.
Other times there seems to be more play in the fit. I'm not overly worried when loading handgun cartridges but have wondered about rifle cartridges. Opinions, anyone?

Shellholders from different makers are not identical - Even shell holders that are said to fit a particular cartridge don't always fit due to manufacturing tolerances. I have LEE, RCBS, Lyman, Redding and the most always seem to work well - of course my favorite solution to a trouble some cartridge is to move to my Co-Ax press which works with a different system than shell holders.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XLH7u1quo18

Nice cross reference chart of shell holders.
http://www.handloads.com/misc/shellholders.asp

and for Dillon users
(http://www.handloads.com/misc/shellholders.asp)http://brianenos.com/pages/dillon/cal.conv.chart.html

[alamogunr]

Nice cross reference chart of shell holders.
http://www.handloads.com/misc/shellholders.asp
(http://www.handloads.com/misc/shellholders.asp)


I copied that chart last winter. I remember because I got bored one day and added a column for Redding shell holders. Not sure why since I only have 2 or 3 Redding die sets.

[GoodOlBoy]

I agree that different brands of shell holders are very different. However, I have to throw out that I have never had an issue with Lee shell holders. Maybe it is because I tend to be on the large size of the range (IE I load 45LC, but not 44 so I wouldn't know if there was a 44 issue with the lee shell holder). I can tell you this. The RCBS shell holder #19 for 30 remington (not AR) didn't fit and cost me $7.99 plus S&H. It just plain let the case move where it wanted resulting in me popping a second hole in at least one priming pocket with my lee universal decapping die. I saved it back because it wasn't worth the cost of shipping it off, and who knows someday it MAY fit something. The Lee shell holder #21 for 30 remington (not AR) fit perfectly and cost me $3.99 plus S&H. I was disappointed in RCBS as this is the first issue I have had with their shell holders (and the matching dies if you read another one of my posts). With Lyman I have a handed down die set for 357 mag with a matching shell holder. The cheap chrome is CONSTANTLY flaking off of the shell holder making for fun little sharp surprises when you put your hand in the wrong place on the bench. I even tumbled the thing (which helped btw) but still I get little sharp glitter like flecks of chrome off of it now and then. Same thing with the matching dies. I have noticed that every newer Lyman dies/shell holders I have seen don't appear to have this el cheapo chrome on it, but my old set certainly does.

My advice? Heck I can't hardly give good advice on the topic since I have had poor products from every one of the companies every now and then. But hey, everybody has a bad day at work every once in awhile. Even machinists. I can tell you this. I have only had issues with 2 Lee products in the past, and Lee bent over backwards and then some to make it right. Same thing with Lyman on newer products of theirs (can't hardly ask them to replace a 20+ year old set of dies because of cheap chrome can I?). RCBS? Not so much. I usually get a "ship it to us you will get it back in 6-12 weeks" response and very little other help. And the one time I asked them about an issue with my OLD RCBS press (I honestly think the thing is as old as me or older. It was passed down to me by a friend when I started reloading and is still going strong) I was told that I could ship it to them to see what it would cost to repair. The next day I was doing a custom flaring tool order from Lee for a Lee Loader set (30-30 Winchester) and mentioned it to the customer rep on the phone while she was looking up information. She transferred me to one of their guys who immediately walked me through what the issue was on a press they never made! I mean 2 minutes and the issue was fixed! Then he transferred me back and she finished up my order! Can't hardly argue with THAT kind of customer service.

GoodOlBoy

[500MAG]

I use a mixture of different brands and never had an issue with any specific one. I did get tired of not having certain ones and picked up the Lee complete set just to have and you can't beat the price.

[EDG]

There are a number of shell holder cartridge cases advertised by the reloading tool companies that flat don't work.

Neither Lee nor RCBS make a shell holder that is sized exactly right for 6.5 Carcano. Hornady does make a good shell holder for the Carcano rounds.

Lee does not make a shell holder properly sized for the .35 Remington. Lee lists the standard 30-06 size and everyone knows the 35 Rem case is smaller than the 30-06 family.

The 7X57 and .257 Roberts vary depending on the source of the brass.
You can bend rims or pull the rims off of your cases if you do not use the tight fitting shell holder.
If you look carefully at an RCBS shell holder chart you will see that it recommends 3/11. The 3 is the standard .30/06 sized shell holder. If you use it with Norma 7X57 you will wind up with a lot of bent rims. Use the #11 shell holder instead.

[GoodOlBoy]

Hey you know this would probably make a pretty fair sticky if somebody wanted to compile a list of opinions on which shell holders work well and don't work well for which advertised calibers. Just a thought. I'm not organized enough to do it myself.

GoodOlBoy

[EDG]

I agree. It is really aggravating to have one of these little traps sprung on you.
There is another facet of this issue and that is the sizing die internal dimensions.
If you have a really tight die and a sloppy shell holder you will have a lot of damaged or pulled off rims and some of it is the fault of the die. I have found that Lyman dies are notoriously tight. They will often measure .004 smaller at the shoulder of a FL sized case than a RCBS, Lee or Redding die.
At one time I had a lot of Lyman dies but got rid of all of them except a carbide .357 set. It seemed like I was sizing over sized brass that had been fired in a machinegun in every Lyman sizer die. The dies I had were .25-06, .243, 6mm Rem, 7X57 and 30-06. The 7X57 coupled with the odd shell holder size caused me a lot of grief.


Hey you know this would probably make a pretty fair sticky if somebody wanted to compile a list of opinions on which shell holders work well and don't work well for which advertised calibers. Just a thought. I'm not organized enough to do it myself.

GoodOlBoy

[Green Frog]

This topic shows up periodically, so maybe a "sticky" would be in order. My experience is that there is no actual set of SAAMI specs for shell holders, so the various manufacturers set up their own specs to give a "good enough" fit for a range of case heads and rims. Obviously, "families" of cartridges can get effective shell holders... 30-36, .308, .270, .243 etc (along with 45 ACP) all fit the same shell holder (although some folks make a different one for the 45) but others, like 32 S&W and 22 Lovell might fit the same holder, or may not, depending on which manufacturer cut it. I look for a good fit for a specific caliber in a specific press with specific dies, then keep them together, but I also keep a Lee set for a good first approximation when developing a new caliber loading protocol.

Apropos of nothing, I also have the complication of using an All American and a Tru-Line Jr from Lyman and a Super U from Herters, so I like to use their proprietary shell holders where possible to avoid the complications of adaptors.

Froggie

[TXBRILL]

There is no doubt a difference between shell holders. I generally like Lee products but their shell holders can be a bit sloppy. You only really have to look at the range of calibers offered and the number of shell holders the manufactures offers to accommodate them. Lee has the least number of sizes available. What I like others mentioned is have a specific shell holder for each set of dies that little bit of extra preparation saves time in the long run.

[William Yanda]

I've been using a Lee #11 for 44 Magnum and find that it doesn't always hold the shell in alignment with the die. Anybody know of one which works better. I'd rather not have to buy three more only to find that none of them work any better.

[fguffey]

I use dedicated shell holders

I don't, the practice is not necessary, however if there was a difference between shell holders I could and can and do measure measure the difference between shell holders. I have three sets of RCBS, all have a deck height of .125" but by design all three sets are different. I have Herter shell holders, all of my Herter shell holders have a deck height of .125", there are things I can do with the Herters I can not do with RCBS shell holders. then there are Lee shell holders, when forming cases for short chambers Lee is my favorite.

F Guffey

[Weaponologist]

I use to think there was no difference so I bought what ever was on sale, However because I did that I found the difference. When it comes to presses they all fit and other than being a little thinker here and there the biggest problem is when you use a certain Accessory like say a RCBS hand primer. The Hornady wont have enough Chamfer on the bottom to fit the plastic primer dispenser however the Lee will but I've found it handy just to use the same brand shell holder as the Accessory your using. For me Lee is my back up shell holder if one I have is giving trouble. Lee's only issue is they have there own number system that doesn't match the others. But if you get a lee shell holder kit a diagram is added to the kit so you know say a #6 38/357 is a #1 in a Lee..

[alamogunr]

I don't, the practice is not necessary, however if there was a difference between shell holders I could and can and do measure measure the difference between shell holders. I have three sets of RCBS, all have a deck height of .125" but by design all three sets are different. I have Herter shell holders, all of my Herter shell holders have a deck height of .125", there are things I can do with the Herters I can not do with RCBS shell holders. then there are Lee shell holders, when forming cases for short chambers Lee is my favorite.

F Guffey

Just catching up here. In what way are the 3 RCBS set different?

[Shiloh]

There are not only differences in shell holders from various manufacturers, but also from the same company. Some wobble, some are tight. I have extra as some get tweaked from time to time for different dies. I have had a machinist trim some for me.

Shiloh

[alamogunr]

I can understand differences in manufacturing but F Guffey stated that his three RCBS shell holders differed by design. This would indicate that there was a reason they were different. I'm curious.

[William Yanda]

Weaponologist, you say Lee's number system doesn't match the others. Well looking at the chart, none of the others-RCBS, Lyman and Hornady match either. Who is Lee supposed to match?

[GhostHawk]

The only complaint I have about shell holders is when I bought the Lee complete set, it came missing the 1 of the 2 I bought the set for. There was another missing (By number) I have no idea what it fits. Luckily enough the Lee dies came with shell holder's for that size, but in some situations it would have been nice to have 2!

[Garyshome]

The lee Shell holders seem a bit loose sometimes.

[fguffey]

Just catching up here. In what way are the 3 RCBS set different? I have three different sets, the oldest and first set has a straight hole through the shell holder for primers to drop through when removed from the case. The next shell holder had a slight bevel to the bottom, the bevel/tapper was necessary when primers were installed through the shell holder. The last shell holder had a larger tapper in the bottom of the shell holder to accommodate the RCBS automatic hand primer.

I chuck the shell holders up in the lathe and grind the tapper, regardless of the make and model. I thought about modifying the automatic primer, problem, the modified auto primer would not work as designed with the new shell holders.

F. Guffey