Size is king

[ombesb]

A little history then a question. In both a 44 mag S&W and a 45acp S&W they have come out the cleanest shooting swaged lead bullets. Just a light brush and all new. Obviously soft lead, slugs up straight away and seals the throat, then on to the barrel. No leading in the throats, forcing cone , or barrel. Not so shooting any kind of hard cast. Lead in all those places. So my thought is we down size the bullet going into the barrel, why not give it a light down size right at the throats. Take my 625, throats have been match honed to .452. , barrel is just a tick over .4505. Would it present a major problem of any sort to size my bullets at .453, then seat them close to or touching the taper from chamber to throat? It seems that upon firing the throat would be sealed straight away with a sizing from .453 down to .452, then business as usual. I know this goes against the old golden rule of a finger push snug fit in the throat. I don't care about stepping on traditions toes but I wonder if I am missing anything important. I would down load just a bit just like j bullets jammed into the lands in a rifle. Anything else I am missing??

[gray wolf]

you may have a problem seating bullets in the chamber if you get some lube fowling in the taper.
Also any bullets seated just a tad long will not enter the chamber and be high at the back end of the cylinder.
You had leading from hard cast ? you need to define hard cast. Also how did they fit in the throats.
Leading in the throats ( you shouldn't have it ) Barrel ( you shouldn't have it )
forcing cone ( a little is passable for some pistols, A little
Sounds like your bullets were not a match for you pistols. Some folks over size for the throats but a snug fit does it fine for many people, and some do fine .001 under throats.

[Stonecrusher]

Both of my 625's have .4525" throats. With straight wheel weight boolits RCBS 45-230 RN sized .452" I would get a little(tiny bit) of lead flash in the forcing cone. I have shot some Lyman 454190's sized to .454" and they shot very well and no lead at all in the forcing cone. I don't see where it would hurt the gun at all as long as they drop into the cylinder. Lube was Javelina 50/50 on all boolits and Unique or Universal. When I use 50/50 ww/Pb I don't get any leading with these bullets or MP 452-200. I guess the softer bullets slug up just enough to keep the gas cutting away.

[ombesb]

Grey wolf,
By hard cast I mean the industry standard of 2-6-92 off the shelve bullets. I have no set up to cast. Some of the latest I have tried are pretty close at .452. I got some supposed to be softer ones with an advertised hardness of 11~12 bhn. They came in at almost exactly .4515. So the .452's push through with a little firmness. The smaller pretty much slide on through other than lube dragging a bit. With the 2-6-92 bullets I once tried moving the charge up to see if they would slug up and behave, I got all the way to flattened primers and obviously quit on that. That is why I am trying to make size work for me.

[RobS]

If they chamber going .001 over the cylinder throat diameter then this can be done and many do as such. Simply start at the minimum powder charge weight of whatever powder you are using and adjust the powder while using a chronograph (if you have one) to compare velocities. Obviously don't push over published high velocities for max charges and more than likely you will have much better accuracy before you reach the top end anyway.

[mdi]

For my lead bullet shooting, I size my bullets the same diameter as the cylinder throats. I load my bullets to the "standard" OAL (I seat the bullets to the crimp groove) and have little problems. I wouldn't think you'd have to get the bullet right up against the throat lead-in to get a seal as I believe the bullet starts to obturate as it leaves the case...

I don't use "push through" or "tight squeeze", or "light pressure" cause they mean little to me, and I'm sure my definations are different than what someone else means. I used pin gauges and soft slugs to measure my cylinder throats, so if my cylinder throats measure .430", I can size my bullets to .430", without a guesstamate.

[DrCaveman]

Grey wolf,
By hard cast I mean the industry standard of 2-6-92 off the shelve bullets. I have no set up to cast. Some of the latest I have tried are pretty close at .452. I got some supposed to be softer ones with an advertised hardness of 11~12 bhn. They came in at almost exactly .4515. So the .452's push through with a little firmness. The smaller pretty much slide on through other than lube dragging a bit. With the 2-6-92 bullets I once tried moving the charge up to see if they would slug up and behave, I got all the way to flattened primers and obviously quit on that. That is why I am trying to make size work for me.

Well if "size" is gonna work, then it shouldnt have to be a full thousandth over cylinder diam. Seems as though your boolits are gonna leave the cylinder at .452" or less no matter their initial size, then be worked by the forcing cone etc. Obviously you want .452" or greater

Instead of buying a box of 250 hard cast boolits for $30, save up a few and buy a bottom pour furnace. Or, just some propane and a cast iron skillet. Make em how you need em