RCBS bench mounted priming tool question - high primers?

[jeff423]

Tonight I was starting to load some .41 mag cartridges. After priming five I noticed that the primers were not fully seated. They were just little high. I seated them again with a different priming tool to the proper depth. I was using a Lee shell holder because I don't currently have an RCBS #30 shell holder. Is that the reason? I have used this tool a lot but this is my first time with .41 mag and with high primers.

Jeff

[Sweetpea]

It shouldn't make a difference...

BUT it wouldn't hurt to check!

[bear67]

Jeff
I use the RCBS bench priming tool for all rifle and orphan pistol calibers (those not loaded on the progressives) and have never seen this problem. I have RCBS, Lyman, Lee, Herters, CH, Pacific and some orphan shell holders and I usually just grab one off of the shell holder rack and go to priming.
Could it be that these primer pockets have a little "carbon trash" in the edges? Good luck on finding the problem and correcting it. What brand primer were you using for these .41s.

[texassako]

I have the RCBS bench priming tool. A high primer almost always means I have an issue with the primer pocket, primer pocket is fouled, or I did not lean on the handle enough. What brand of brass? I have noticed there is a distinct feel for each brand of brass, and try to separate brands when priming. A couple of cases into a job and you get a feel for how much pressure the handle needs. I am in the habit of running my finger across the base of each case after priming, and I can usually tell when I am going to feel a high primer before removing a case from the tool.

[jeff423]

Starline brass, CCI primers. I cleaned the primer pockets - same problem, but I could still seat them with my Co-Ax press. I tried some Winchester LP primers and they seated fine. But I think I may have found the problem. The CCI primers are 0.00695" taller than the Winchester. I wonder if the CCI are Large Rifle primers? This is possible because I mostly use the bench priming tool for .308 and the primers were already in the tube.

[jeff423]

Starline brass, CCI primers. I cleaned the primer pockets - same problem, but I could still seat them with my Co-Ax press. I tried some Winchester LP primers and they seated fine. But I think I may have found the problem. The CCI primers are 0.00695" taller than the Winchester. I wonder if the CCI are Large Rifle primers? This is possible because I mostly use the bench priming tool for .308 and the primers were already in the tube.
I just checked a new box of Winchester LR primers and they are the same height as the CCI so that must be the problem.

[Sweetpea]

Nope...

LP and LR primers are the same size.

SP and SR primers are different heights.

[jeff423]

According to this: http://ballistictools.com/articles/primer-pocket-depth-and-diameter.php

LR & LP are different (LR being taller) and SP & SR are the same

[blikseme300]

According to this: http://ballistictools.com/articles/primer-pocket-depth-and-diameter.php

LR & LP are different (LR being taller) and SP & SR are the same

Yep, LR & LP are different.

I use the RCBS unit myself and it is the bees knees for seating as the tactile feed-back is excellent.

[joesig]

I have found that CCI pistol primers sit a little taller than other manufacturers. I noticed this more with their Small Pistol Magnum but is there with large pistol as well. I save the CCIs for rifles and use another for revolver.

[Sweetpea]

Gentlemen, I stand corrected...

[Minerat]

. . . . I wonder if the CCI are Large Rifle primers? This is possible because I mostly use the bench priming tool for .308 and the primers were already in the tube. . . .

Look at the color of the primer compound. CCI rifle primers a a light yellow color (both large regular & magnum). Large pistol primers are an orange color. I know this as I was priming some 41 mag this last week and almost mixed up rifle and pistol (stupid red boxes) primers. I hand prime with an old RCBS hand primer that you have to place one primer at at time in the seater just for this reason. When I changed boxes I notice on the first one that it was not orange. I can't help with other makers primers as I only use CCI (loyalty thing, my mother used to make them) but some one else might be able to help with that.

[jeff423]

I tell the difference because they are the only chrome plated primers I use.

[EDG]

The height of the Lee shell holder might be different - in this case the height below the shell head.

[beagle]

On my RCBS bench mounted priming tool, the seating plungers can be adjusted a little by unscrewing the primer seater. You might look at that. Normally the first thing I do is tighten everything when I get it but after checking my primer depth, I often have to back off on the seater to get them below the case rim. After long use, the bottoms of the plungers will wear but these are available as sets of large and small through RCBS Customer Service if that is the case. Nice little devices. I have two. One is the newer model that uses tubes and the older one is patterened after the old Lachmiller primer tool. Both very easy to use but the older model gets most of the use as it's easier to change between calibers by just a little./beagle

[jeff423]

Thanks for all the replies. It turned out that the problem was that I was trying to seat Large Rifle primers. When I switched to Large Pistol primers everything was fine. I even shot a couple of the rounds loaded with LR primers in my Model 57 and could not tell any difference from the LP primers.
It's a great tool - when the owner doesn't get in the way. I've stopped using any of my handheld priming tools.

Jeff

[bear67]

Glad you found the solution Jeff. Little problems are challenges that are add salt and pepper to life.

[spotsboss]

Thanks for all the replies. It turned out that the problem was that I was trying to seat Large Rifle primers. When I switched to Large Pistol primers everything was fine. I even shot a couple of the rounds loaded with LR primers in my Model 57 and could not tell any difference from the LP primers.
It's a great tool - when the owner doesn't get in the way. I've stopped using any of my handheld priming tools.

Jeff
Jeff,
I just got the tool and I can't get CCI 34 (mil spec) primers to seat fully. Even have tried a new set of seater stems sent to me from RCBS. Loading new Win brass, 30-06, for M1 Garand. The primers will seat fully using the hand primer, so the problem is not the primers themselves or the brass.
Do you have any thoughts that might solve this for me? Thanks!

[dudel]

I find Lee shell holders among the loosest out there. I think it's because Lee makes less of a variety of shell holders to fit the maximum number of cases. As a result, there is more vertical play than with others. If your priming tool has max out it's vertical lift, and the shell holder has allowed the brass to rise, that could lead to the primer situation you describe. Does the RCBS priming tool have an adjustment for depth?

[runfiverun]

not really,, you seat by feel.
I'd about bet that the shell holder is just letting the case raise up too much.
you might be able to unscrew the seat part [inside the hood] a little to make up the difference.

[Hardcast416taylor]

I had a similar problem when doing a large amount of .223 brass. I was using a LEE shell holder and after closely watching a case being primed I saw the vertical slop in it. I bought a new RCBS shell holder the next day and there was no more slop or oddly seated primers.Robert

[spotsboss]

Jeff,
I just got the tool and I can't get CCI 34 (mil spec) primers to seat fully. Even have tried a new set of seater stems sent to me from RCBS. Loading new Win brass, 30-06, for M1 Garand. The primers will seat fully using the hand primer, so the problem is not the primers themselves or the brass.
Do you have any thoughts that might solve this for me? Thanks!

Update: I think I've solved the mystery. I'm using CCI 34 (Mil Spec) primers. They are made extra tough to avoid slam fires in M-1 Garands. During the last few thousands of a primer's trip to its final seat, a slight crushing of the primer takes place. For ideal ignition, the anvil must compress slightly into the priming pellet. The primer should end up .002-.005 below the case head.

My auto prime tool evidently does not have enough leverage to do the crush job. I'm pushing on this live primer as hard as I care to. No go. To prove this theory, I used my RCBS hand primer to seat the 34s - - no problem - -.002-.003 below the case head every time. I then went back to the auto primer and tried to seat some WinLP primers in 45 auto cases. No problem. .003 the first time.

I put a wing bolt on the hand primer and just squeeze until it stops. Works well.
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