Suggestions Needed, Hardcast BBWC for .38/.357

[PBSmith]

Recently I purchased some Dardas hardcast wadcutter bullets for .38/357. This is an old H&G design, solid base, possibly the #50. I bought three different sizes, ranging from 0.357-0.359.

When I loaded and shot the first batch with the old favorite Bullseye formula (2.7 grains) that works very well for swaged HBWC bullets, I was sorely disappointed in the results from four different revolvers (Colt I frames and S&W28-2)

Any suggestions for a more accurate load for these solid, hard wadcutters? Not looking for a screamer, accuracy is foremost. My powder supply includes Bullseye, Red and Green Dot, Unique, W231, Herco and 2400. I'd prefer to stick with Bullseye.

I am familiar with the concept of each gun to its own when reloading, but wonder if the harder WC's generally require a similar adjustment in load. Will boosting the charge likely improve accuracy?

For the moment, I'd like to get these rounds shooting well in a 4-inch Colt Trooper .357 revolver. This is an early Trooper, not a Mark Series.

Thanks.

[texassako]

I use a bit more Bullseye with my Lyman 35891 148 gr BBWC than with a hollow base. 3.4 gr got me the best accuracy in my particular gun while 2.7 is the load for swaged HBWC's.

[gwpercle]

Hardcast is sometimes not your friend when it comes to 38 special, 2.7 grains of bullseye loads. Rember how well the swaged HBWC worked? They were soft and thus worked well. For the longest time I cast wadcutters out of straight wheelweights , when I started mixing WW's with lead 50/50 to stretch my dwindling supply, accuracy in my 38 loads improved...the boolits were softer and thus more accurate for the speed.. Light loads = softer boolits. Faster loads = harder boolits. Try bumping the speed up to make them work.

Gary

[fecmech]

The H&G #50(crimped in the groove lightly) likes 3.1-3.4 better IMO. Also if your WC's have all lube grooves filled that's a minus. Many years ago when I owned a Ransom Rest I determined for my K-38 that 3.1-3.2/ BE with 1 groove lubed gave best results at 50 yds.

[Char-Gar]

I cringe when I see the words "hardcast" and "38 wadcutter" in the same sentence. It should be a Federal offense to make and sell such things.

In your old model Colt Trooper use your .359 over 3.5 grains of Bulleye. Don't go over 3.5 grains! This load will give you he best chance for happiness. In your Smith and Wesson .358 would be the best choice with the same powder charge.

The above is for 38 Special cases.

The bullet are too hard to be pushed as slow as you want. Just shoot them up or melt them down and don't repeat the mistake. If a fellow doesn't repeat the same mistake twice and lives long enough, he just might run out of mistakes to make.

[PBSmith]

Thanks all for your valuable input. I'll crank a few up to 3.4-3.5 and see what happens.

As long as there are experts here reading, I'll ask a few additional questions related to the original post.

1. Can a solid wadcutter such as the H&G 50 or the Lyman 35891 (when cast soft) ever be expected to shoot as accurately as a swaged HBWC? I notice in the old NRA Reloading Handbook that all the ace shooters of the day were using the H&G50 in their match work. Maybe they didn't have the swaged HBWC in those days (1950's)?

2. In the third edition of Lyman's Cast Bullet Handbook, all the .38Special loads reported are with linotype bullets. Any explanation for that? Don't most .38 shooters load fairly low on the velocity scale to achieve best accuracy?

3. Are there smaller cast bullet companies out there who specialize in soft cast bullets? Names and contact information would be great.

Thanks again.
PBSmith

[Outpost75]

Read the articles by Ed Harris on the Hensley & Gibbs website on loading .38 wadcutters.

[PBSmith]

Outpost, thanks for that suggestion. I read and profited much from Mr. Harris's articles.

[PBSmith]

I tried the hardcast solid wadcutters in my old .357 Colt Trooper, loaded with 3.1 grains W231 and also with 3.5 grains Bullseye, in .38 Special cases. The accuracy wasn't too awful, though nothing approaching what I get with the soft HBWC.

Is there any sense in trying heavier charges with hardcast solid wadcutters in .357 magnum cases, or does accuracy deterioriate when the soup cans are pushed too fast?

After reading comments in this thread, I won't be purchasing any more hardcast wadcutters, but enjoy doing the best I can with the remaining supply.

Thanks.

[bobthenailer]

the best accuracy ive gotten with a cast 148gr WC was loaded in a 357 mag case with 4.0grs of Bullseye powder about 800-850 fps , i tried 38 cases but the 357 case & load was the best accuracy wise from my 357 mags.