Cream Of Wheat

[oadad]

Is cream of wheat a good filler for use with 5010? I'm loading the 8mm with a Lee 175 bullet, mag primer and 48gr of 5010. Can't find the polly filler around here so I thought I'd use 3cc of cream of wheat

[runfiverun]

you will need to weigh that c.o.w. and figure it as part of your bullet weight
back off powder weight a grain or two and start over on your load
you should be able to order that puff-lon on the net

[Maven]

oadad, C.O.W. is a bit too heavy for me. Instead, I used Quaker brand bran that I run through an electric coffee mill. In the 8mm Mau. with 48gr. IMR 5010, use a MAG. primer and 0.3cc of powdered bran. This should improve the efficiency of 5010 and give you standard deviations in the neighborhood of 25fps - 30fps.

[oadad]

Maven , I agree about the weight of C O W but I (we) have a bunch of it so would it be safe to use?

[Maven]

oaded, Yes, it's safe enough and it does raise pressure (which is the point of using it), but I don't know how much it weighs/cc or how much to use. I think I'd drop the charge to 46gr. and experiment with 0.3cc - 0.7cc (Lee plastic dippers) of it, fired over a chronograph of course. Try not to overly compress the COW since it will form a hard plug over time: Load them & fire them within say 1 or 2 weeks. Btw, Ken Mollohan has written extensively about COW loads in "The Fouling Shot" (Cast Bullet Assoc.), but not with milsurp powders.

[oadad]

Well, I loaded both. Mag primer, C O W - 3cc, lee 175gr bullet & 47gr 5010. Shot great (yugo 24/47) :-D. I wish I had a camera, but my 15yr old got 1/2" groups from the bench at 50 yrds. No high pressure signs and no black on the cases, not even the neck. Next I loaded a box with Standard WLR primers and dryer lint, everything else the same. The boy got 1 - 11/2" groups with black necks

[jrgift]

I have been using the shotgun buffer from Ballistic Products.Other buffers work as well.Don't smell like breakfast though.

[softpoint]

Yup, straight bran ought to keep the process moving along real smooth...............:mrgreen:

[blysmelter]

Have to ask-just what is COW. Some kind of porridge-mix? And does it really clean out a barrel? Cant get COW overe here, so what can I substitute with-oatmeal or any non-sugar cereal?

[Scrounger]

Have to ask-just what is COW. Some kind of porridge-mix? And does it really clean out a barrel? Cant get COW overe here, so what can I substitute with-oatmeal or any non-sugar cereal?

Sometimes called "farina".

[shooting on a shoestring]

I've used Cream of Wheat to good affect is several instances. I've heard some use corn meal, one guy posted on this board using coffee. It'd be interesting to see a list of ingredients that have been shot.

[OhioCruffler]

Have to ask-just what is COW. Some kind of porridge-mix? And does it really clean out a barrel? Cant get COW overe here, so what can I substitute with-oatmeal or any non-sugar cereal?

Wheaten porridge, yes.
Actually, the crushed grain used to make a gruel.

I use cornmeal (coarse-ground maize) for the same purpose.
Rolled Oats would likely be too large a particle for bottle-neck cases, I would imagine.

[OhioCruffler]

I've used Cream of Wheat to good affect is several instances. I've heard some use corn meal, one guy posted on this board using coffee. It'd be interesting to see a list of ingredients that have been shot.

Now there is a cheap-skate idea; save and dry used coffee grounds!

[dukers65]

i used cow back when i used fillers for some 4 mag loads and 45/70,i did notice the barrels
were a lot easier to clean. i've got to give it a shot again. i usually just shoot a
jacketede loads to blow things out. dan

[Bullshop junior x2]

Try useing packing popcorn.
Tony

[Molly]

Hi fellows,

Nice thread, but I do have one comment: it was noted above "Try not to overly compress the COW since it will form a hard plug over time: Load them & fire them within say 1 or 2 weeks."

Interesting comment, and one that I'd like to explore a bit further. I have seen no evidence of this in my own shooting, and I've shot ammo that was loaded from one year to the next. I wonder if this really occurs. First of all, has anyone broken down old ammo and actually seen any evidence of this? And secondly, even if it occurs I suspect the pressures involved in firing would negate any congealing, and break it up in mighty short order, and squirt it right down into the bore.

That being said, I should acknowledge that the COW _will_ form a pretty hard wad in the bore during the firing process. This pressure compaction seems to be how the COW prevents any gas from leaking past to cause etching and leading. Also, while I have no way to actually measue this, I have a distinct impression that preventing gas escape past the bullet is the _primary_ reason pressure is somewhat higher with COW loads. After all, nobody worries about the increased ejecta weight when they raise a powder charge from say 40 grains to 45 grains.

Hope someone can comment.

Regrds,
Molly

[waksupi]

Hi fellows,

Nice thread, but I do have one comment: it was noted above "Try not to overly compress the COW since it will form a hard plug over time: Load them & fire them within say 1 or 2 weeks."

Interesting comment, and one that I'd like to explore a bit further. I have seen no evidence of this in my own shooting, and I've shot ammo that was loaded from one year to the next. I wonder if this really occurs. First of all, has anyone broken down old ammo and actually seen any evidence of this? And secondly, even if it occurs I suspect the pressures involved in firing would negate any congealing, and break it up in mighty short order, and squirt it right down into the bore.

That being said, I should acknowledge that the COW _will_ form a pretty hard wad in the bore during the firing process. This pressure compaction seems to be how the COW prevents any gas from leaking past to cause etching and leading. Also, while I have no way to actually measue this, I have a distinct impression that preventing gas escape past the bullet is the _primary_ reason pressure is somewhat higher with COW loads. After all, nobody worries about the increased ejecta weight when they raise a powder charge from say 40 grains to 45 grains.

Hope someone can comment.

Regrds,
Molly


I did give COW a try a year or so ago. All in bottle neck chamberings.
I found that many times I would have a solid ring of the COW compressed into the shoulder area of the cases, and was very hard to remove. If this should happen, and a person not notice it when reloading, I can imagine some serious pressure fluctuations, as the case interior capacity will have been reduced.
My curiosity has been satisfied, and I no longer use it. I suspect it had gathered a bit of moisture, allowing the compaction. I use the kapok or poly fillers now, when I feel they may be necessary.

[ktw]

I have tried it, to date only in straight sided cases (38-55).

The results varied quite a bit with the type of powder used. It really cleaned up the burned characteristics and significantly improved accuracy when used with IMR4227. It didn't help much with the 2400 loads in which I tried it (small increases in velocity, small improvements in accuracy).

I would need to do a lot more testing to come to any firm conclusions, but the best application I have run across for it to date is with lighter than normal charges of the midrange powders (slow pistol/fast rifle) in the larger cases.

-ktw

[Molly]

I did give COW a try a year or so ago. All in bottle neck chamberings.
I found that many times I would have a solid ring of the COW compressed into the shoulder area of the cases, and was very hard to remove. If this should happen, and a person not notice it when reloading, I can imagine some serious pressure fluctuations, as the case interior capacity will have been reduced.
My curiosity has been satisfied, and I no longer use it. I suspect it had gathered a bit of moisture, allowing the compaction. I use the kapok or poly fillers now, when I feel they may be necessary.

Ahh, now I understand where the comment came from. I have heard of one other 'firm' report of this nature, and a couple of others that weren't specific enough to be sure what was going on.

Frankly, I've never seen this myself, even in bottlenecked cases. But my experience has mostly been with cases that have reasonably normal (whatever that means) shoulder angles, such as 30-06 or 6.5x55. My guess would be that you were using COW in a case with a fairly steep, long shoulder and a small caliber, say a 243 or a 22-250, right? And that you were using a pretty substantial amount of COW.

My guess - and it's ONLY speculation - would be that when the round fired, the COW compacted before it could flow out the neck, and the pressure simply 'cut a hole' (so to speak) through the compacted COW. This let the pressure out, and left nothing to push the rest of the COW out of the case.

Now that I've opened mouth and inserted hoof, would you let me know how close I am? Do you remember the details of the load that gave you trouble? Caliber, case, bullet, alloy, charge, powder, primer, amount of COW, any filler (dacron, cotton, etc) and such might be very useful information.

Thanks for your help.

Molly

[oso]

Is cream of wheat a good filler for use with 5010? I'm loading the 8mm with a Lee 175 bullet, mag primer and 48gr of 5010. Can't find the polly filler around here so I thought I'd use 3cc of cream of wheat

I don't know where "around here" is but I get my filler from old stuffed dolls and toys. Golly, shooting farina seems a bad as using tortillas to make ethanol. Then again, another sip of ethanol sounds pretty good right now.

[bcp477]

I guess I may as well add my 2 cents here. I am new to cast bullet shooting, but not new to fillers. I have always avoided materials like Cream of Wheat, instant grits, etc.....because of the inherent danger in using them. Unlike something like dacron fiberfill or cotton wool, the cereal fillers are very sensitive to moisture content. So, it is quite possible, if the filler material is too moist (it doesn't take much) that it may form a "plug" in the shoulder/ neck area of bottle-neck rifle cartridges....and cause a wild pressure spike. The correct or safest way to use cereal fillers is to bake them in an oven before using, to get the moisture content as low as possible. It is possible, though probably not a great issue, that the filler can pick up moisture from the air, while inside the loaded cartridges. I doubt that this would be a problem in normal use, but I definitely wouldn't take any cereal-filled cartridges on a hunting trip, especially if the weather was less than perfect. Of course, one can certainly apply sealant to the finished cartridges (the necks and around the primers). This, as well as "baking" the cereal before use, should eliminate any possibility of moisture content change. However, none of this is an issue with dacron or cotton fiber filler.....so I prefer to simply use these. I especially like cotton wool, at this point, because dacron, teamed with some powders, produces an awful smell (2400, for example). Cotton wool just smells like burned cotton....not too objectionable.

Anyway, just FYI, if anyone cares.

[felix]

Excellent expose! Use the "cotton" accumulated in the clothes dryer screen. Store in a container with some calcium chloride, or any other water grabbing substance. Best stuff of all is the shotgun fillers because it offers maximum chemical consistency. ... felix

[Heavy]

Has anyone tryed the corn cob media for polishing brass. Bought some at the pet store that is quit abit larger in size. Polished the brass just fine but would stick in the primer pockets sometimes. Thought that it may work to blow out the barrel behind a lead slug.