223 cast load for targets in bolt rifle

[ncmn]

Just started casting the Lee Bator bullet in 55gr for my savage axis in 1x9 twist. I have started at the low end with 5744 from Lyman cast bullet handbook. Started at 35 yards to get scope on and moved out to 100 yds. I am using gas checks from a Freechex III that I bought from Charlie. Great tool I might add, my lead I am guessing is around 13 bhn. Have not tested it, as I have yet to get a hardness tester. My first loads were 12gr and around 2 inches. I have done a little work on the trigger and loaded more at 12.5 to test tomorrow. I am wondering if anyone else is using 5744 and how fast you can push the little fellas with aluminum gas checks. Only shooting paper and looking for the best accuracy from the little savage. I have never tested my cast bullets before but I plan to only shoot cast now. I also have varget, blc2, IMR4895 and lilgun for powders. Any help would greatly be appreciated.
Thanks
NCMN

[Jack Stanley]

The best accuracy help for my Axis was to throw the stock in the trash and put a laminated stock on the rifle . It went from being I rile to sell at the next show to a rifle I use much more . The only two powders I've gotten good results with so far have been 2400 and 700-X .

I can't help with Bator info , my bullets are the RCBS 22-55-SP and the Lyman 225462 .

Jack

[bangerjim]

I load the Bator for subsonic. I use the published data for TightGroup at 85-90% load with Dacron fluff and have been seeing, with the PC coating, groupings of 1-1.25" at 45-50 yards. It's a slower end boolit load but really fun to shoot. It is my 22LR replacment! If I want FAST, I use published loads for FMJ's or shoot commercial 5.56.

But I am happy with the performance of the PC'd Bator 223. No GC since the loads are subsonic.

Shooting a Mossy bolt action rifle.

bangerjim

[DeanWinchester]

Don't remember the charge but Greendot was awesome in my CZ527. Got the load data from Jim. Sure miss that ole bird, wish he'd come around again.

[ncmn]

Yes, I agree about the stock, it is junk. I cannot afford to replace it right now but I will for sure. I started this as a 22lr replacement also, but now kinda of looking for something to plink with up to 300 yards. I am not looking for jacketed speeds just thinking that a little faster is the key. Since I am so new to testing loads, I really have no idea. Just getting around to doing some serious work on loads since I started casting. The 223 may need a little larger bullet, been looking at the NOE 70gr but a little afraid the 9 twist will not handle it. I am shooting tomorrow so and update is coming with the increased loads.

[chsparkman]

Green Dot is very accurate in my Ruger #3 with a 45 gr boolit, also inspired by Jim.

[spfd1903]

I get 1" to 1 1/2" groups with the Bator and approx. 14 grains of 5744 at 100 yds. Use a Lyman # 2 alloy, TL with Alox, and Hornady gas checks. Sized to .224. I have a Howa 20" bolt action with 1 in 12 twist. The POI is about 2" below where the jacketed slugs hit with the same scope setting. No chronograph, so velocity is unknown.

[ncmn]

I get 1" to 1 1/2" groups with the Bator and approx. 14 grains of 5744 at 100 yds. Use a Lyman # 2 alloy, TL with Alox, and Hornady gas checks. Sized to .224. I have a Howa 20" bolt action with 1 in 12 twist. The POI is about 2" below where the jacketed slugs hit with the same scope setting. No chronograph, so velocity is unknown. Thats exactly what I am planning on working to 14 gr and stopping. Hope to find the best tomorrow, the 5744 is dirty powder but I am not giving up on it yet. Lyman brags about it in alot of the loads for several cast bullets. Thanks for the information.

[spfd1903]

I got lucky with the combination. I only tried 5744 and got on to the ideal charge with only a few steps. Was really surprised with the results. I am not near my notes, but I believe I found 5744 to be the best powder in my Mosin M44 with Lyman 314299's. Just found a load with 5744 referenced for .45 Colt and 250 grain boolits. Have to see how that works in the next few weeks. Good luck!

[Jack Stanley]

I haven't tried plinking loads at three hundred yards yet , but I think I have a load using the RCBS 22-55-SP might work . It Works well in the Stevens two hundred rifle but I need to try it out in the Axis .

Jack

[floydboy]

I have recently started working a load up on my 223. It is a savage M110 with a 1-14 twist Shaw barrel on it. I use a Lyman 225462 GC'd boolit sized to .225. I have only used IMR4198 so far. Started at 14 gr and at 16 got three shots at 7/8" at 100 yds. Went up to 16.5 grs and had the same results. Will be trying 17 the next evening the wind has died down. I don't expect to get much higher than 17-17.5 grs before accuracy goes south. I estimate velocity is close but under 2600fps. If I can consistently keep MOA in this powder range I'll be happy for now. I'll concentrate on length and fine tuning powder charge.

Good luck....Floyd

[Larry Gibson]

Thats exactly what I am planning on working to 14 gr and stopping. Hope to find the best tomorrow, the 5744 is dirty powder but I am not giving up on it yet. Lyman brags about it in alot of the loads for several cast bullets. Thanks for the information.

You have a 9" twist and that is working against you finding the same accuracy with 14 gr of 5744. Yes 5744 is "dirty" as it needs a psi to burn clean that will give a velocity well above where you will find target accuracy at with your barrel and that soft of a cast bullet. If you really don't want to give up on 5744 with that cast bullet then I suggest you drop back to 10 gr and work up in 1/2 gr increments to 13 gr and use a 1/3 to 1/2 gr Dacron filler.

Larry Gibson

[ncmn]

Well guys just got back from the range and it was a little windy for the little bators. I took three loads to test, 12.0, 12.5 and 13.0 sized .225 with alum check, tumble lubed in white label 45-45-10 and the best load was 12.5. I had trouble with the wind, but I am going to clean the rifle and check for leading. At least I got something to work with now. I did not see any unburned powder today?? So maybe its close to where I need to be. Thanks for all the help. I got more work to do before pleased, but I know it will shoot 1 to 1.5" at 100yds at 12.5gr. I may like this bullet casting thing after all, sure is more fun than jacketed. I may be hooked for sure now.

[ncmn]

You have a 9" twist and that is working against you finding the same accuracy with 14 gr of 5744. Yes 5744 is "dirty" as it needs a psi to burn clean that will give a velocity well above where you will find target accuracy at with your barrel and that soft of a cast bullet. If you really don't want to give up on 5744 with that cast bullet then I suggest you drop back to 10 gr and work up in 1/2 gr increments to 13 gr and use a 1/3 to 1/2 gr Dacron filler.

Larry Gibson

Larry I have just started shooting cast and have done nothing with Dacron and do not have it at the moment to test. Have read about it for sure, but I am learning more every time I shoot. I will have to get some to try it as I have read folks use it in 45-70 also, and that is one of my next rounds to test. I am only shooting cast now as I can not afford the jacketed stuff, I have more time than money and enjoy the casting and reloading. Do not even mind putting those tiny checks on them. It is good stress relief from my day job.

[Larry Gibson]

ncmn

Looks like your learning fast and doing well. If you want to try the Dacron filler read http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?109280-The-proper-use-of-fillers and post #4 is where I explain how and when I use Dacron. I also use a Dacron filler with TD level 45-70 loads using 5744 powder. Be glad to answer any questions.

Larry Gibson

[Buzz64]

Little late into the game but just got my .223 CZ 527 (1 x 9 twist), put mounts and scope on and took it to the range today. Shooting NOE 70gr (mine are 72.6 +/- .2) (air dropped COWW w/ 2% tin) with carnuba red and hornady copper checks. Had two powders to try (after zeroing at 25 with 55gr V-max factory). Tried the following loads of IMR 4227;11.5gr - hit about 3 inches low at 75 w/ 3 inch group. Next was 12.0 with about a two inch group. Next was 12.5 with all holes touching but lateral spread of about 1.5 inches. Next was 13.0 with group back around 2.5. Was concerned about the low volume in the case but none (each weight was fired in 9 shot groups) seemed to have been powder position sensitive. Noticed no difference in sound or recoil - no crony.
Now for the surprise. I had H335 loads in 23.0; 23.5; 24.0 and 24.5 to try, also in 9 loads each. After the first shot nothing but a grey haze - like I was shooting black powder. Nothing on the target. Pulled the bolt and checked the barrel - nothing. Primer and case were fine, no pressure signs. Soooo, slid another in and same thing - light recoil but big grey haze, no hole in target. Pulled the bolt and checked everything again, nothing untoward. One more time, still in the 23.0 grain range, and same result. Brought the rest home and pulled the boolits and weights were all right on. H335 is still on the shelf for any jacketed 55 grainers but not in the mix anymore for cast - at least the 72gr NOE's. BTW, all the IMR 4227 made nice clean round holes and left no trace of leading - sized to .225 in a luber-sizer.

[Norbrat]

After the first shot nothing but a grey haze - like I was shooting black powder. Nothing on the target. Pulled the bolt and checked the barrel - nothing. Primer and case were fine, no pressure signs. Soooo, slid another in and same thing - light recoil but big grey haze, no hole in target.

Sounds like the centrifugal force due to the rotation of the bullet due to twist rate and speed is ripping it apart as soon as it leaves the muzzle.

Has also been known to happen with lightly jacketed bullets being driven too fast..