Crystal Alloy and colored plain

[RogerDat]

Started with a hot plate but that could barely hit 650 which was not getting the job done for plain lead scrap. Ingots were layered and top of melt was not staying melted. Got the fish fryer that folks on the forum mentioned. Re-melted and got temp up to 750 gave it some sawdust. Skimmed then bees wax and skimmed.

Got rid of the layers in the ingots, got one mold of ingots that are "ok" but keep getting colored skin on melt and ingots are shades of purple and gold. More rounds of sawdust?

Tried some 92.25/3.5/3.75 Pb/Sn/Sb that was coming out frosty and pitted (craters like the moon) in my muffin tin. Took that material up to 725 and the pits vanished but the material appears to have a surface of fused flakes now. Too hot?

Clearly my lack of having a clue is impacting my results. Any suggestions?

First picture is plain discolored, second is alloy with flake looking appearance.
105352
105355

[357maximum]

What's the problem? :confused:

Your ingots look perfectly normal for the alloys used.

[R.M.]

Until coated muffin tins are used a few times, they give off a gas that causes pitting.
Layered ingots don't matter spit. It's just like a cold boolit mold. Doesn't affect the quality of the ingot at all.
I'm guessing your melt is a soft alloy. Pure lead when it gets hot and oxidizes, giving those colors.
I'd say you aren't doing a thing wrong.

[Magana559]

That is indeed some hot lead! I never seen ingots that black/blue!

[RogerDat]

Thanks guys that is most reassuring. I have not melted anything less than 5-6 percent tin and that looked like a frosty bullet. These looked nothing like a nice boolit so I was a little concerned.

I am also seeing bits and chunks of what looks like gray ash rising to the top of the muffin ingots from the alloy. I skim everything in the pot but it's like more rises in the ingot as I scoop and pour.

Muffin tin is not coated but heavy aluminum, high tin came out of it smooth. Hot plate can handle melting pewter and high tin content but max temp. with a lid is 650 degrees and temp. drops significantly if stirred. That is pretty much plain lead and just won't stay melted on the hot plate.

[357maximum]

That is indeed some hot lead! I never seen ingots that black/blue!

PURE LEAD always has some blue/purple tint to it when freshly ignotized.....at least all the certified foundry pure I have ever dealt with has anyway, and I have done a ton or two.

[jsizemore]

Pure Pb melts at 620F. Stir and SCRAPE the pot to remove the dross. Purple and blue usually indicates pure Pb. The crystal looking surface is Sb/Sn mixed with the Pb. COWW lead melts at a lower temp depending on the amount of Sb/Sn, mine runs about 550F. Big pits is surface crud cooking off and doesn't hurt anything but your pride. They make good boolits.

[osteodoc08]

Purple and blue is oxidized lead. The goldish color is oxidized tin. All of this is "normal". The ingots are all fine and "normal" as well. All of the pock marks will disappear when you melt it down again. No worries. This is ingot making not boolit casting.

[62chevy]

The second picture looks like the COWW I got from Jetsfan but those were square not round.

[RogerDat]

Pure Pb melts at 620F. Stir and SCRAPE the pot to remove the dross. Purple and blue usually indicates pure Pb. The crystal looking surface is Sb/Sn mixed with the Pb. COWW lead melts at a lower temp depending on the amount of Sb/Sn, mine runs about 550F. Big pits is surface crud cooking off and doesn't hurt anything but your pride. They make good boolits.

Sounds like I was just a little lax in my stirring and scraping so I got a little dross rising to the top of each muffin. Have to work on that. At 550-620 melt point sounds like I can use a lyman dipper (just ordered) a small stainless pot and the hot plate once I use the fish fryer to get ingots of alloy ready for casting. I was stirring and scraping with a wood paint stir stick, which kept burning down, maybe I was feeding more dross in as I scraped?

As to pride I lost that a long time ago when I replaced the timing chain and gears on an Olds 350 engine, stepped back to admire the finished job and saw the cat plying with the timing cover gasket next to the car. ;-) Now I take pride in asking questions when I don't know and learning from the answers.



PURE LEAD always has some blue/purple tint to it when freshly ignotized.....at least all the certified foundry pure I have ever dealt with has anyway, and I have done a ton or two.

One of the great things about this forum is that it allows someone such as myself with no access to experienced casters/reloaders an opportunity to get the help and support that makes it possible to learn how. My first 10 lbs. of pure and I get advice from someone that has done tons. How cool is that?

[Defcon-One]

I have to agree:

"Your ingots look perfectly normal for the alloys used!"

Go have fun and quit worrying. Your just gonna melt them down later to make bullets!

[62chevy]

One of the great things about this forum is that it allows someone such as myself with no access to experienced casters/reloaders an opportunity to get the help and support that makes it possible to learn how. My first 10 lbs. of pure and I get advice from someone that has done tons. How cool is that?

Amen Rodger keep asking those questions and we will both learn.

[357maximum]

One of the great things about this forum is that it allows someone such as myself with no access to experienced casters/reloaders an opportunity to get the help and support that makes it possible to learn how. My first 10 lbs. of pure and I get advice from someone that has done tons. How cool is that?

Ken's original vision fullfilled :drinks: ......that was the origianl reason "WHY".... CASTBOOLITS was established afterall.

The hate mongering/cop bashing/keyboard commando-ing/trolling/self appointed gurus/ wives tale regurgitators/naysayers/agitatotors hiding in Mommies basement this place seems to attract was never part of the plan me-thinks. It is what it is, but we would all be better served if we remembered the original "WHY" behind CASTBOOLITS and the original intent of a "DOOD" named Ken and his "MINIONS".

[jsizemore]

Using the stick helps you to flux the melt. Stirring and scraping gets the carbon and dross to the surface so you can remove it. The weight of the melt will keep the dross/carbon trapped against the bottom and sides. Stirring and scrapping gives the dross/carbon an avenue to make it to the surface. Clean lead won't plug your bottom pour spout and give you consistent boolits.

[RogerDat]

I think I have the plain lead whipped. I took a tip mentioned in the forum and ground the end of a slotted spoon straight across. Seemed to work better for scraping. I also fluxed with sawdust twice before starting, then a small amount a couple of more times. Temp was a little lower too about 675.

The large muffins are 1.5 lbs. the Lee ingots are 1 and 1/2 lb. The mini muffins are 1/2 lb. 65 lbs. of sheet lead is now ingots. Even though you see a hot plate in the picture this was done using a HF dutch oven and walmart fish fryer.

106078

[jsizemore]

There's no avoiding the need to stir and scrape. You either got to get the lead to the sawdust or stick to the submerged lead. Thermometers do go bad or need calibrating so learn your smelting setup so you can see the slushy stage and then when it goes full liquid you know how much to cut your heat to keep it in your ingot pouring range, I use 675-725F depending on the alloy. Your ingots look great and your ingot molds are seasoned. The final test of your alloy is casting some boolits.

[leadman]

Unless you have done a really good job of sorting out any zinc wheelweights it is best to keep the temperature around 700 degrees or less so they don't melt. I am assuming you are melting COWW.
I also use candle wax after the sawdust to get more of the dross sorted out of the melt. Sometimes it takes beeswax depending on the dross. If you leave some dross in the melt this just means you need to flux more when the ingots are melted in your casting pot.

[62chevy]

I think I have the plain lead whipped. I took a tip mentioned in the forum and ground the end of a slotted spoon straight across. Seemed to work better for scraping. I also fluxed with sawdust twice before starting, then a small amount a couple of more times. Temp was a little lower too about 675.

The large muffins are 1.5 lbs. the Lee ingots are 1 and 1/2 lb. The mini muffins are 1/2 lb. 65 lbs. of sheet lead is now ingots. Even though you see a hot plate in the picture this was done using a HF dutch oven and walmart fish fryer.

106078


Looking real good RodgerDat but what are you using to smelt with, a stainless pan or cast iron.

[RogerDat]

Looking real good RodgerDat but what are you using to smelt with, a stainless pan or cast iron.

Cast Iron 6 Qt dutch oven. Have a couple of smaller stainless pots from Salvation Army store. One will be my casting pot, the other I have been using for smaller batches on a hot plate until I picked up the dutch oven and propane fish fryer. Based on advice here I gave the aluminum pot from the fish fryer to my wife.

I now have a mold (255 gr. RFN) for 45 LC. I now have to "leement" it. Have a Lyman dipper Went with daughter and grandson to Cabelas and picked up some large pistol primers. (grandson got kangaroo and buffalo jerky) Still need to pick up some JPW to make some 45/45/10 tumble lube. Yanking at the bit to get going but yard work and chores intervened.

Have not tried melting a batch of COWW yet. Working with scrap lead right now. Bought the thermometer so I would be able to keep the WW melt below zinc melting when I take a stab at that. But I figure it will be good for tracking what temp works or doesn't work for casting too.

If I manage to make so much as one bullet it will be because of all the information and advice on this forum. Better make more than one with the money spent so far. I think it will pay off because Cabelas had 158 gr. RN cast for 38 special $32 per 100 so I think this will be a better deal.... eventually.

[62chevy]

If I manage to make so much as one bullet it will be because of all the information and advice on this forum. Better make more than one with the money spent so far. I think it will pay off because Cabelas had 158 gr. RN cast for 38 special $32 per 100 so I think this will be a better deal.... eventually.

You sure will with just the lead cost alone that I got from jetsfan at $1.15 shipped I'm paying about 3.4 cents a boolit or $3.37 a hundred. Add tax and you are saving over 30 bucks a hundred and that should pay for your equipment in no time.

[RogerDat]

You sure will with just the lead cost alone that I got from jetsfan at $1.15 shipped I'm paying about 3.4 cents a boolit or $3.37 a hundred. Add tax and you are saving over 30 bucks a hundred and that should pay for your equipment in no time.

Yep that is what I keep telling my wife, it's gonna pay for itself. When is where I find myself short on specifics. But she is pretty good about the whole thing. Guess she figures I need a hobby and this one keeps me at home. Besides she likes the idea of lite loads for her practice :-)