Is it necessary to have a die to seat Gas Checks?

[AllOutdoors.22]

I am just wondering if it is necessary to have a die to seat Gas checks? I read something like they can also be seated when loading the bullet into the case? I am new to GC. Help...Thanks!

[Beagle333]

Get a die. A GC is bigger than the boolit diameter and even if you could get it started into the case, it'd just bulge it and leave the boolit loose. You could do some fancy flush-brass seating with a factory crimp die as you seated the boolit..... but that still involves a die, and one that isn't made for that. Lee push thru dies are cheap. 8-)

ps.... if you go with Lee, get some 800-1000 grit paper and slick the inside of that baby up good and it'll work like a dream.

[BNE]

What Beagle333 said.

[Artful]

I am just wondering if it is necessary to have a die to seat Gas checks? I read something like they can also be seated when loading the bullet into the case? I am new to GC. Help...Thanks!

the older lyman slip on GC could in a long neck (30-30 for instance) when the bullet didn't protrude into the powder area could be slip fit on and loaded, but it's much easier to just buy a lee push thru die and doesn't cost that much.

[bangerjim]

Dies......all the way.

banger

[georgerkahn]

I'm intrigued and curious, both! I've place fresh-cast boolits in the Lyman units I have (Model 450) with their little GC applier, pulled the handle down, and voila -- the (I use copper Hornady &/or Lyman checks) GC is applied. Perhaps I should be embarrassed, but I've never heard of a specialized die for this function. Then again, I never professed to be the sharpest knife in the drawer ;).

Might you please provide a model/skew # on the die you refer to? And, also , perhaps, more detailed instruction on HOW to use the fine (wet n' dry, I assume?) paper to "slick it up"?

At 66, I'm surely not too old to be learning "new" things; THANKS!!!

[dmize]

I'm intrigued and curious, both! I've place fresh-cast boolits in the Lyman units I have (Model 450) with their little GC applier, pulled the handle down, and voila -- the (I use copper Hornady &/or Lyman checks) GC is applied. Perhaps I should be embarrassed, but I've never heard of a specialized die for this function. Then again, I never professed to be the sharpest knife in the drawer ;).

Might you please provide a model/skew # on the die you refer to? And, also , perhaps, more detailed instruction on HOW to use the fine (wet n' dry, I assume?) paper to "slick it up"?

At 66, I'm surely not too old to be learning "new" things; THANKS!!!

There is nothing special about either dies.
I am assuming that the OP thought there was something special that needs to be done.
The reason the Lee dies are mentioned is because the are relatively inexpensive, they are push thru and they are the cats behind for installing GC's.
Also a lot of people here tumble lube their bullets and don't have a lubrisizer.

[Beagle333]

There's nothing special about it. You just get a Lee sizer die of whatever caliber you want and shove the thing through it. Lee dies are not always mirror smooth on the inside though, and if the OP is going to be trying out GCs, he'll surely also want to try some aluminum ones, and they are more sensitive to any die roughness (the aluminum will "grab" the sides and distort or stretch out, sometimes) and so it would just be a smoother operation if it were polished just a bit.
In my opinion, it's never a bad idea to lightly polish up a new sizing die, as long as you don't get wild and change the hole diameter. :D

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

I am just wondering if it is necessary to have a die to seat Gas checks? I read something like they can also be seated when loading the bullet into the case? I am new to GC. Help...Thanks!

Most of the time, a Gas Check can be "seated" with your fingers. But it must be sized, like the boolit must be sized. The exception for a boolit is, that if it already the correct size, it doesn't need to be sized...But many of us size them anyway, to lube them and take out any unconcentricities (is that a word?).

NOW, if a Gas Check is difficult to seat, there are those of us that have made tools and such to seat them squarely...but they still have to be sized.

If all this is kind of over your head...it's time to get the Lyman castbullet handbook out and read that chapter.
Good luck,
Jon

[AllOutdoors.22]

Jon, that is a great idea...I completely forgot I had that book in the back of my reloading cabinet. I will read over that chapter. I knew they could be hand seated but was unsure if they had to sized if the bullet's were the correct size. Thanks for all the info.

[W.R.Buchanan]

OK guys,,, the purpose of shoving the boolit with gas check on it thru a sizing die is to crimp the gas check onto the boolit.

This also usually sizes the boolit to the diameter you want, but if you don't size it afterwards then the gas check will come off, and it may come off anyway.

They can be hand seated and generally are, since you must put them onto the boolit before you size it. But they still must be crimped on and that is done by the sizing die.

Any cast boolit loading manual should cover this operation.

Randy

[DeanWinchester]

Once out of desperation while loading for 7,62x54R I needed a .315 boolit and had a mold that dropped right at that. I pushed the gas checks on by hand and used a factory crimp die (308 win I think) to crimp it on from the top of the die. It was a PITA and I really shouldn't have been squeezing that collet so much.

Get the sizer and do it right. You'll thank us later.

[Wayne Smith]

Most of the time, a Gas Check can be "seated" with your fingers. But it must be sized, like the boolit must be sized. The exception for a boolit is, that if it already the correct size, it doesn't need to be sized...But many of us size them anyway, to lube them and take out any unconcentricities (is that a word?).
NOW, if a Gas Check is difficult to seat, there are those of us that have made tools and such to seat them squarely...but they still have to be sized.

If all this is kind of over your head...it's time to get the Lyman castbullet handbook out and read that chapter.
Good luck,
Jon
Jon, I think that one negates with a "non".

[ROGER4314]

I worked for a custom bullet maker in Tulsa. The man was a wizard with lead, casting, sizing and lubes so he taught me a lot! We always used an RCBS sizing die in a Lubrisizer to crimp the GC on the base. To answer the question in the OP............ No, a sizing die is not necessary to use on the GC's unless you want them to actually stay on the bullet....snicker.

Flash

[gwpercle]

My Lyman 450 lube sizer seats the gas check during the size/lube operation with the standard sizer die. If you don't run it through the check will not be crimped on and fall off. Literally. I don't use the Lyman special check seating die with it. Not sure what the exact purpose of the check seating die is , except to sell us more do-dahs.

Gary

[GhostHawk]

I've tried what Dean Winchester was talking about, and I agree, it is a PITA. I used a foam plug to keep the bullet from falling through so it only crimped the GC.

A whole lot easier to get a lee push through sizer in the size you want to end up and use that to crimp on the gas check.

They don't seem to make a .312 (and custom's cost a lot more) so I'm using a .311 and it hardly touch's the bullet.
Normally just a couple of shiny spots on the driving bands. I am considering a custom sized .312 sizing die, maybe next year.

[John Boy]

Is use nothing but the Lee Lube/Sizer with sizing dies the diameter of the base of the bullet. Have never had a GC that has been crimped hard and squarely on the bullet heel

[Moonie]

I tried loading 300gr Lee .452 boolits with checks just placed on and not crimped, the loaded 45 Colt rounds would not chamber in my NMBH.

[trapper9260]

When I first got my 450 new years ago and there was the seating tool that is use for gas checks and I always used it and the GC stay on the boolit better for what I see I use Lyman and Hornaday and gator also.After i run out of Lyman i will stick with the Gator after use up the hornady because they cost less.but the tool that came with the 450 make it easyer for me to get the check on good.it is really a spacer that you put under the sizen die and over the threads of the bottom of the ram and the adjustment for the dept for the boolit to go in the sizen die and to be lube also.i do not TL only the lube sizer.

[runfiverun]

if the boolit is just being scuffed up by a 311 a 312 will just allow it to fall through.
you gotta make the boolit bigger and size down.

now the good news if you do a search here you'll find out how easy it is to open a 311 sizer to 312 yourself for about 5 bucks.

[Tackleberry41]

I tried doing it without a sizer. Just mangled a case, you could watch the gas check wallow out the neck. Annealed ones might not do it. It was $20 for a lee sizer. Tho like alot of Lee stuff does need some work to do a good job. Out of the box it tends to put gas checks on crooked if you get in a hurry.

[kweidner]

I've tried what Dean Winchester was talking about, and I agree, it is a PITA. I used a foam plug to keep the bullet from falling through so it only crimped the GC.

A whole lot easier to get a lee push through sizer in the size you want to end up and use that to crimp on the gas check.

They don't seem to make a .312 (and custom's cost a lot more) so I'm using a .311 and it hardly touch's the bullet.
Normally just a couple of shiny spots on the driving bands. I am considering a custom sized .312 sizing die, maybe next year.


Real easy to make a .311 a .312. Get you some 400 grit wet dry sandpaper, a split wood dowel 5" long and chuck it up in a hand drill. The longest part of the process will be cutting sandpaper the right length to just fit in die when wrapped around the dowel rod. Spray paper with something like rem oil. Chuck die in vise held with your casting glove. Drill on medium speed with an in and out motion. The entire process may take ten minutes. Go slow and size one after about 5 laps in and out. Repeat until your boolit sizes the diameter you want. I purposley order my lees .001 under and lap to diameter I want. They are much smoother this way.

[26Charlie]

You may need both. For the 8x56 Hungarian, I cast, gas checked, sized and lubed .338 Lee bullets, then ran them though a Lee custom .330 push through die. Lee now makes a .332 die for this caliber, but then it was a custom item.