Sucess with PP with Browning BPCR, well sort of perhaps!

[LynC2]

[smilie=s:

Well, I finally got my PP "Money" mold in from Boomer's molds (http://www.boomersmoulds.com/)
and managed to try 2 different loads with it today. I think it shows potential if I work with it a bit more.
http://i659.photobucket.com/albums/uu312/LynC2/shooting026_zpsaf69d013.jpg (http://s659.photobucket.com/user/LynC2/media/shooting026_zpsaf69d013.jpg.html)

[Don McDowell]

Drop the grease cookie, and one of the ldpe wads. Then wipe between shots pushing a damp patch on a nylon brush thru the bore and then a dry, and if necessary another wet and dry, and see if those groups don't tighten up some.

[LynC2]

Drop the grease cookie, and one of the ldpe wads. Then wipe between shots pushing a damp patch on a nylon brush thru the bore and then a dry, and if necessary another wet and dry, and see if those groups don't tighten up some.

No cookie? I thought I needed it for keeping the fouling soft. I was blow tubing between shots on this attempt. However I will give that combination a try based upon your experience.

[Don McDowell]

I use a dry lubed felt wad but not a cookie. I think the cookie is fine for hunting, but I've not found a load using a cookie that will equal the target accuracy of loads without it.
Jojoba oil on the exposed portion of the patched bullet also seems to work well for me in the 44's.
I have a couple of loads that work real well with blowtubing between shots, but they won't shoot as tight as the same loads wiped between shots.
I borrowed the 7 parts water and 3 parts NAPA water soluble machinining oil for a wiping solution from Kenny and others.

[Nobade]

Good work Lyn! I am glad to see you are getting it up and running.

The question as to cookies or not, also needs to remember if these will be used for silhouettes or paper. No time to wipe for shooting silo, but better accuracy if you do....

-Nobade

[LynC2]

I use a dry lubed felt wad but not a cookie. I think the cookie is fine for hunting, but I've not found a load using a cookie that will equal the target accuracy of loads without it.
Jojoba oil on the exposed portion of the patched bullet also seems to work well for me in the 44's.
I have a couple of loads that work real well with blowtubing between shots, but they won't shoot as tight as the same loads wiped between shots.

I borrowed the 7 parts water and 3 parts NAPA water soluble machinining oil for a wiping solution from Kenny and others.
Don, are you soaking the felt wad with some sort of lube? Also you mention some loads that shoot well with blow tubing but not as well as with wiping. What type of grouping difference are you seeing between the two?

I realize I still have a lot of load development and experimenting to hit the right combination, but that is half the fun (as long as one doesn't get frustrated). ;)
Thank you for your input,
Lyn

[LynC2]

Good work Lyn! I am glad to see you are getting it up and running.

The question as to cookies or not, also needs to remember if these will be used for silhouettes or paper. No time to wipe for shooting silo, but better accuracy if you do....


-Nobade

Nobade
I realize there is a time restraint, but I have to wonder if there might be a modified wiping routine that might work. Also with the amount of powder these things use and trying to find the right load, wiping or blow tubing routine I may well be ordering another 25 lb. lot of powder sooner than I anticipated!

BTW, I really liked how nicely the barrel cleaned up after shooting the PP. Only two damp patches and the third one was barely discolored. Heck, even the second one wasn't bad. Maybe one damp one followed by a dry one might work for silhouette?

[Don McDowell]

Lyn I buy those felt wads, they are the Muzzleloader original wads sold for cap and ball revolvers. Midway is where I get them from. I tried to get the manufacturer to start packaging those in bulk packages instead of the 100 per bag, but no joy..
With the blowtubed loads there will be more vertical as the number of shots increase than with the same load wiped between.
When a person gets everything lined out in usuable order , it takes no more time to wipe a damp and then a dry patch than it does running the blowtube properly.
That's one of the huge advantages I've seen with the Eysnford powder even in hot dry conditions 1 damp patch seems to clean the bore just as well as 2 with other powders.

[montana_charlie]

I think it shows potential
Under three inches is respectable for that distance.
If you're able to see that 3-inch target spot at 200 yards with iron sights, your eyes are a lot better than mine.

CM

[LynC2]

Under three inches is respectable for that distance.
If you're able to see that 3-inch target spot at 200 yards with iron sights, your eyes are a lot better than mine.

CM

MC,
No I cheated again and used a scope, besides the rear sight on my rifle left a lot to be desired. It has too much slop to be repeatable, so I have a LH Kelley LR Soule(and I thought Warner hi-power rifle sights were expensive ;)) on order.

Don,
Thanks for the info on the wads, I'll have to give them a try too along with a dozen other things.

[Don McDowell]

Lyn the really neat thing is you have that postel load to fall back on while you fine tune the paper patch.. what you have already is looking pretty good with the patched, and I still think for target use just dropping the grease cookie may make nice round groups.

[John Boy]

lyn - you can buy sheets of hard felt and punch your own ... http://www.durofelt.com/image_26.html
The owner, Ashia, did all of us C&B shooters a favor years ago with the 1/8" hard quality wool felt that melts at over 200 degrees.
Then buy a punch for all your BPCR calibers. You can lube them with your GG lube, pure lanolin or shoot them dry. And greased wool wads will not contaminate your powder column. I have reloads that are several years old and they shoot the same as if a day old

[LynC2]

John Boy,
Thanks for the link for the felt. I have a press mounted wad punch I got from Buffalo Arms that would make a pile of nice wads in short order.
Lyn

[LynC2]

It wasn't a great day to try out loads, but I gave it a try in spite of the wind. No luck getting any chronograph readings though as it was too windy. 70.0 grs of O.E. with a Rem. 9 1/2 primer, 525 gr. "Money" made of 1/2 COWW and pure lead with a bit of tin. .442 dia. wet wrapped to .4505. Dry, no lube on paper, no grease cookie, and no lube wads. Wad stack was .060 LDPE and a newspaper. 3.435 OAL
Since Don suggested trying an abbreviated wiping routine, I thought I would give it a try. (Just in case he might know what he was talking about. ;) Anyway I used one damp "moose milk" patch and dried the chamber only. Considering the conditions I was pleased with the results. Shot at 100 yds, now to try it at 200 or 300 yds.
http://i659.photobucket.com/albums/uu312/LynC2/IMG_0078_zpse99fc82a.jpg (http://s659.photobucket.com/user/LynC2/media/IMG_0078_zpse99fc82a.jpg.html)

[Don McDowell]

Lyn you are really getting this stuff dialed in. Keep up the good work.

[LynC2]

Don, I am amazed how little fouling the O.E. produces. One damp patch and it is almost clean. Well looking through the barrel it looks clean even though another patch produces more. I did try the same load using a blow tube as a reference, but it was a no go. I couldn't get the PP load to chamber due to the tight fit and extra fouling. A lube cookie or lube wad is most definitely needed for that technique!
Lyn

[Don McDowell]

The loads that I have that you can blow tube with use that dry lubed felt wad, and the patch is treated with jojoba oil.

[Rifle 57]

The loads that I have that you can blow tube with use that dry lubed felt wad, and the patch is treated with jojoba oil.
Don
Have you tried any of Harlan Sage's wads at www.sageoutfitters.com

[Don McDowell]

Yes I have tried those wads, gave the ones I didn't use away.

[montana_charlie]

80 grains with a lube cookie gave you 3 inches at 200 yards.
70 grains with no cookie did 1.5 inches at 100.

Interesting that there is 'no difference' on the target with two major changes in the load.
The rifle must be in love with that bullet ... or somethin'.

CM

[LynC2]

80 grains with a lube cookie gave you 3 inches at 200 yards.
70 grains with no cookie did 1.5 inches at 100.

Interesting that there is 'no difference' on the target with two major changes in the load.
The rifle must be in love with that bullet ... or somethin'.

CM
Yes, it seem a bit odd that both combinations with it shot very much the same. I have another PP mold that is more like the "Creedmoor" style, but haven't found a load that the rifle likes so far. It seems to love the Lyman Postell and hope I can get the PP Money to shoot that well. There are lots of things to still try to fine tune it though. :smile:

[Don McDowell]

There is a bit of difference in those groups. The first one is showing quite a bit of verticle, the second doesn't. I'm of the mind you shoot that second load at 2-300 yds and beyond you're not going to see the verticle of that first load.

[LynC2]

There is a bit of difference in those groups. The first one is showing quite a bit of verticle, the second doesn't. I'm of the mind you shoot that second load at 2-300 yds and beyond you're not going to see the verticle of that first load.

Don, that is a very astute observation that I didn't think about! Doing a bit of quick measuring I am getting the following:
1st group= 200yd group Vertical=2.157, horizontal=2.013. 2nd group=100 yd. group corrected to 200 yds. vertical=1.506", horizontal=2.278

I think I am going to need to fine tune the loads and try a 10 shot group at 2 or 300 yds to get a more detailed result.

[Don McDowell]

Lyn , looking at that 100 yd target, it looks to me like you actually shot 2 groups. The high left 2rounds, and the other 3 all touching. But not knowing the actual sequence those rounds were fired it's just a guess..

[Lead pot]

It wasn't a great day to try out loads, but I gave it a try in spite of the wind. No luck getting any chronograph readings though as it was too windy. 70.0 grs of O.E. with a Rem. 9 1/2 primer, 525 gr. "Money" made of 1/2 COWW and pure lead with a bit of tin. .442 dia. wet wrapped to .4505. Dry, no lube on paper, no grease cookie, and no lube wads. Wad stack was .060 LDPE and a newspaper. 3.435 OAL
Since Don suggested trying an abbreviated wiping routine, I thought I would give it a try. (Just in case he might know what he was talking about. ;) Anyway I used one damp "moose milk" patch and dried the chamber only. Considering the conditions I was pleased with the results. Shot at 100 yds, now to try it at 200 or 300 yds.
http://i659.photobucket.com/albums/uu312/LynC2/IMG_0078_zpse99fc82a.jpg (http://s659.photobucket.com/user/LynC2/media/IMG_0078_zpse99fc82a.jpg.html)

A double group like that is usually from anticipating recoil. An unconscious forward push of the shoulder or tightening the grip when setting off the shot. Or you lost your cheek weld.

[LynC2]

A double group like that is usually from anticipating recoil. An unconscious forward push of the shoulder or tightening the grip when setting off the shot. Or you lost your cheek weld.

You may well be right, or I might not be getting a consistent cheek weld, same pressure pulling the rifle into the shoulder or positioned exactly the same. Lots of variables to consider.