Need help with 45 ACP

[ncfyrfyter]

I have just started to load cast boolits. I loaded some .45 ACP using Longshot. I loaded 5 each at 5.5, 5.6 on up to 6.0 using the data from Hodgedon website. The website list 6.0 as the starting load for a 230 gr LRN. It seemed like each 5 round group left a lot of unburned powder in the barrel, and left places on the side of the brass that looked as if it had been annealed. I'll try to attach a pic of the brass. Any thoughts or ideas as to what occurred?103082

[Love Life]

Might need more juice since you only worked it up to the start load assuming you were loading 230 gr LRN

[DrCaveman]

You used data from hodgdon webpage, then you state the starting load for a 230 rn boolit. Since all the loads you said you used were at or below the "starting load", then i must assume you were using a different boolit and extrapolating?

What boolit?

Starting loads are where you are supposed to start, otherwise you get sooty cases and unburned powder due to incomplete ignition and insufficient pressure generated to seal the chamber

[ncfyrfyter]

You used data from hodgdon webpage, then you state the starting load for a 230 rn boolit. Since all the loads you said you used were at or below the "starting load", then i must assume you were using a different boolit and extrapolating?

What boolit?

Starting loads are where you are supposed to start, otherwise you get sooty cases and unburned powder due to incomplete ignition and insufficient pressure generated to seal the chamber

Ok, that makes sense. I was loading a 230 gr LRN. I guess I was a little too cautious on this one. I decided to start under, and work my way up to the starting load. I'll try this again, starting at 6.0, and see what happens.

[Love Life]

You'll see everything start to come together as you move up the load ladder.

[cabinetscreator]

Make sure before moving up in powder make sure you you have a good crimp on the bullets. A bad or good crimp changes your pressures a lot, a bad crimp will produce powder burns on the case like that when when the powder isn't contained,

[Slow Elk 45/70]

welcome to the madness...If you know the size of your bore, good, if not slug your bore , what does the boolit size at ? If your 6 gr load was smoking the brass IMHO you might start at 6.5-7.0 of Longshot and go up , there are lots of powders that do well with this 45 cal. pistol.
It also helps to know what mold you use or are these factory lead slugs, more information, better information for you , You might want to purchase a Lyman cast bullet handbook, good luck Jim

Go to the Threads and Stickys...and read , that will stop you from having to weed through some of the not so helpful information, there are questions that get answered every day that have been answered about anything about casting Boolits

When asking questions give all the info you have , it will help get you better answers

[Recluse]

Make sure before moving up in powder make sure you you have a good crimp on the bullets. A bad or good crimp changes your pressures a lot, a bad crimp will produce powder burns on the case like that when when the powder isn't contained,

You beat me to it. :)

Too weak of a charge and too soft of a crimp and you'll have the unburned powder for sure and often times the "dirty" brass. It can also cause ejection jams on occasion.

:coffee:

[Love Life]

I use a .469-.470 for crimp. Loaded boolits look like this.

[Recluse]

Did one of your kids put her fingernail polish on the boolits?

:coffee:

[Love Life]

I'm using a coating. It is highspeed, low drag.

[Recluse]

I'm using a coating. It is highspeed, low drag.

HAhahahahahahahaha!!! I needed that laugh! (Besides, it looks more "tacticool" to me than high speed/low drag.)

I'm gonna have to try that powder-coating at some point--probably this fall. We're already getting into the warmer days of Texas here along with the fact I have an already overflowing plate of things I'm either doing, gonna do, need to do, am putting off doing or just flat need to do. Chief among them is preparing for the arrival of our granddaughter, scheduled to debut in this world around the end of July/first of August.

Good looking ammo, Dick. Hope all is well out in your neck of the woods.

:coffee:

[Love Life]

I'm using the HI-TEK coating. It works really well for pistol and is easy peasy to apply. Use good ventilation though because it uses acetone as a carrier for the coating.

Congratulations on the arrival of your Graddaughter!!

Things are going well out here in the middle of nowhere. The windy season is here to play havoc on rifle shooting though.

You have a clear a little of your schedule off and go have fun!!

[Cmm_3940]

I'm using a coating. It is highspeed, low drag.

'Drag' is involved anyway, but not the kind you're thinking. Those look like lipsticks.

[Love Life]

Deadly lipstick...

[stubbicatt]

'Drag' is involved anyway, but not the kind you're thinking. Those look like lipsticks.

Oh lordy! :roll: I see what you did there...

[6bg6ga]

Ok, that makes sense. I was loading a 230 gr LRN. I guess I was a little too cautious on this one. I decided to start under, and work my way up to the starting load. I'll try this again, starting at 6.0, and see what happens.

One has to keep in mind that the starting load should be as listed and not below. Sometimes is you load UNDER the starting load you can build up pressures that aren't normal.

My suggestion is this.... don't worry about what the outside of the casing looks like or if there is residue left in the barrel. Start only at the minimum and not below and work up looking for accuracy. Also, check other reloading manuals because you WILL find differences between them.

An example is Lymans lists HS-6 with a 225gr r n bullet with a start load of 6.2-8.6gr and Hodgdons lists 7.0-8.0 so there are differences between loading data. Which is correct? This is where experience comes to play in looking at the cases and primers for signs of excessive pressure or ruptures.

[captaint]

Isn't anybody gonna say a little faster powder might be a better idea ?? Guess I'm similar to everybody else. If Longshot is all I had, I would find published loads, like the OP, and go to town.
However, I think it should be mentioned that there are MANY faster, better powders for 45ACP.
Again, use what you've got, but if one has a choice, use the more appropriate propellant !!
Not ragging, just sayin....... Mike

[Pb2au]

Isn't anybody gonna say a little faster powder might be a better idea ?? Guess I'm similar to everybody else. If Longshot is all I had, I would find published loads, like the OP, and go to town.
However, I think it should be mentioned that there are MANY faster, better powders for 45ACP.
Again, use what you've got, but if one has a choice, use the more appropriate propellant !!
Not ragging, just sayin....... Mike

It is a good point, but I'll bet that the OP is just using what is available in the area.
when I clean up the last of my Unique, I will probably switch to 4064 for my 45ACP loads.....

[Love Life]

AA#7 is doing quite well in the 45 acp...

[gray wolf]

Long shot is an excellent powder in that it will allow high velocity with lower pressure.
My finding are it does not like the low end of the scale if a clean burn and no soot on the cases is what you want.

That said your loads were to light, plain and simple, not unsafe, just not the best and that is evident from what you have seen. Hodgons list 6 grains as a start load and 6.8 as a max with 16,800 as a CUP.
and 875 for the speed, 875 is somewhat over standard military ball ammo.
I use 6.5 of long shot and it's a clean burn but a little snappy for extended shooting at close range for just paper targets. Tight group and bulls eye are much better if you just want a target load, I understand that powders are a little difficult to come by now.

As for crimp ? my finding are it depends a lot on neck tension, with crimp being about 10% of bullet hold.
Then again Alloy must be look at, a soft allow will suffer as to the bullet being reduced when seated with to small an expander, and a hard allow will not have enough hold with a big expander.
Enter the delicate balance. The crimp on a 45 ACP should not be much more that what is needed to remove the case flare, yes sometimes a little more is needed for rounds to function in certain pistols allowing for barrel and feed ramp tolerances.
Short answer: bump up your load, don't go over max and don't over do the crimp.

[ncfyrfyter]

I apologize for not giving enough info in the original post. I'll see if I can remember everything.
The bullets are sized .452 and are purchased from a local company that makes them. I have grabbed random handfuls and checked them, and all of them have been .452.
I do not know what mold they are made from. They are 230 gr LRN with a single lube ring. I don't know what lube is used on them, but it is green and waxy :confused:
The bullets have a brinnell hardness of 16 and are cast from recycled lead.
I have not slugged the barrel. I'm shooting them in a Sig C3 with the factory barrel.
Yes, Longshot is all that I could find.
I put a slight taper crimp on the bullets with the seater die. The owner of the company where I got the bullets from, cautioned me about over-crimping so I crimped them just enough to pass the plunk test. He told me that using the Lee factory crimp die wasn't a good idea because it would size the bullet down too far and cause leading issues. Which brings me to a question, is it safe to taper crimp it enough to where the bell is completely gone? So if I placed the calipers on it, they would touch the brass all the way down the length of the bullet.
The reason for starting with a reduced load was due to a question I asked at the store where I got the bullets. They said that i should reduce a starting load by 10% and work up.
The reasons that you all have given for the appearance of the cases make perfect sense! I'm going to load some up tomorrow starting a 6.0, and work up in .1 increments until I find a sweet spot. After I figure this one out, I will start on my 40 S&W. I have 180 gr. LRNFP for it :veryconfu

I appreciate all the info you all have posted on here. There is a wealth of knowledge here and I enjoy reading and learning. Loading cast boolits is all very new to me. I have loaded j-bullets and rifle ammo for 12 years, but I think that I am enjoying this endeavor more than I have any other! I don't know if I will ever venture down the road to casting my own boolits, but who knows!!!!

[tomme boy]

Longshot works, but it is really slow for the acp.

[Love Life]

Crimp .468-.470 and call it good.

[Pb2au]

^ Yup, same here. .468-.470 will put you right in the wheel house.
Just keep your ear to the ground and scout for powder locally, and or hit the interwebz.
I keep a cheat sheet I made up with me when I hit the gun shops. So for a given cartridge, I will make notes of the different powders that I know will play nicely and just scan the shelves.

[Love Life]

All of my pistol powers load all of my pistol rds. Some aren't optimal, but they get the bullet out of the barrel without exploding.

[MtGun44]

You are using a powder which is too slow for that cartridge. Try W231, Bullseye, Titegroup or
Unique. That slow a powder never develops enough pressure to burn
properly.

Bill

[Land Owner]

The reason for starting with a reduced load was due to a question I asked at the store where I got the bullets. They said that i should reduce a starting load by 10% and work up.


I am certain that your reloading reading will alert you that reducing a MAXIMUM load by 10% is one place to start.