My Economical-Reloadable 22LR Substitute

[762 shooter]

Although I have plenty of 22LR, I do not know when I may be able to replenish my stores. I wanted to find out if there was a viable alternative to 22LR that I could cast for and reload cheap or cheaper than 22LR rimfire.

My first step was to decide on a caliber. 223 jumped out for many reasons. More cast boolits per pound, less powder, and a readily available supply of brass. I looked around for a good economical 223 bolt gun. The three that were entry level arms were the Savage Axis, the Mossberg MVP, and the Ruger American.

The Savage Axis is chambered in 223 Remington and can be had on Gunbroker for about $320.00 plus shipping.

The Mossberg MVP is chambered in 5.56/223 and can be had for about $580 plus shipping.

The Ruger American chambered in 223 can be had for $319 shipped.

Being chambered in 5.56 was not important to me in that all of the rounds being shot out of my rifle were to be cast and reloaded.

Since I like rifles that are American made and I am apparently a Ruger fanboy, ( my last 5 firearm purchases were Rugers) I ordered a Ruger American in 223.

I ordered a Lee 6 cavity Bator mold with no handles and a Lee push thru sizer in 224 from Midsouth to get started. I washed and lubed the mold according to site stickies and was casting good boolits tout de suite. My boolits were dropping at 52 grains + or - .2 grains. I am looking for a minute of squirrel head at 20 yards so anal weight sorting was not part of my regimen.

I hand rubbed Ben's Red onto my cast boolits before push sizing them. My Lee 224 sizer sizes my boolits to 225.

I loaded 2.0 grains of Bullseye behind the cast boolits. I first thought of the Goon character in the Popeye cartoons as the rounds have a small head for the body size.

http://i58.tinypic.com/2djnbk2.jpg

Shot these for chrono readings of 1030, 1070, 1051,1070,1041,1045. At ten yards the unchecked boolits went into a .25 group. Low report and of course no recoil.

Three cents for the primer. (Primers are the monkey)
1/2 cent for the powder. ($160/for 8 pounds)
0.8 cents for the lead at a dollar a pound. (not that I paid that)
4.3 cents per round.
$21.50 per brick.

I have a Nikon BDC coming for the Ruger RAR so I can shoot full power loads and drop down to my 22LR loads when ever I damn well please.

That's my story and I am sticking to it.

762

[tazman]

I love this. Really excellent work.

[geargnasher]

Instant "sticky" material there, thanks for sharing. I've done similar with an NEF and RCBS 55-grain. A half-grain tuft of Dacron seems to help accuracy at 50 yards and beyond, without the check. Keeping them subsonic is a huge bonus, and the extra weight vs. .22 LR more than makes up for the slightly slower than "HV" .22 velocity.

Gear

[Sgtonory]

Nice job.

[Garyshome]

Great plan!

[chsparkman]

Very nice. Last summer I did something very similar for my Ruger #3 in .223. Got my first squirrels with it back in October. Who needs 22lr!

[jaysouth]

I have been doing this with a .357 MAX hundi rifle and a 9mm 1911 for over a year. I am teaching a grandson to shoot.

Learning with a .357 and a 9mm have a lot more bragging rights than a .22 rf for a 12 year old!

I have a couple of thousand 45 gr jhps that were given to me. I might try to work up a subsonic load for my .223 Handi rifle with a 1:12 barrel. I will do a search and find some of Jims old posts on subsonic .223s.

[Russ M]

Yup, good job. Doing the same thing here except I already had a Savage 340 in .222. Using the Bator mold, unchecked, and Promo powder, similar results and for the same reason-have a bunch of .22 ammo, but until I can replace it I'm avoiding using it. Quiet, cheap, and a reason for casting more bullets-what's not to like? Nice cost breakdown also.

Jim's posts on his work with the .223 are great, that stuff should have been stickied. There are several other threads with good info on subsonic .222/.223 loads.

Russ

[Blammer]

7gr of unique and a 55 gr bullet or boolit makes a nice load too. :)

[Whitespider]

Nice.

I haven't used a rim-fire for near on 5 years now... but I built my replacement on the .22 Hornet using the Lyman #225438.

Oh... 11.5 grains Accurate 1680 and an honest 2300 FPS makes it a 75 yard small game and varmint load.

[TCFAN]

I am working on the same thing. My cartridge is the 218 Bee in a 22 inch T/C Encore.I have the full power load worked out using the Hornady 40gr. V-Max. Still working on the cast using the 225438 for a 22RF substitute and the 225415HP for a 22 Mag. load. ............Terry

[Iowa Fox]

We're the lucky ones being able to cast and reload. I think a lot of us old guys already had a selection of 22 cal molds and 22 centerfire rifles we picked up years ago, long before shortages. When I used to go to the range 10 to 15 years ago late in the afternoon you had to sweep the floor with a broom to keep from slipping on the empty brass and brought it home by the bucket full. It used to make me madder than heck having to clean up the mess all the time but now I'm glad I have it. If I don't factor my time into the cost I can run out 500 rounds of 223 on the Dillon in short order for 5.00 bucks with my old component inventory. I still shoot the rimfires but without knowing when I can replentish the ammo inventory I have cut way back. Its a fun change of pace to give the Rem 700s and Contender a good work out. Sure don't find the brass laying around like I used to.

[762 shooter]

Thanks for the heads up guys. I just found Jim's thread.

A little more info.

22" barrel at 1 in 8.
Alloy was 50/50 1% Sn.
Mold and sizer was about $67 shipped.

My actual costs were:
Primer = 0.01
Powder = 0.003
Alloy = 0.00
1 brick = $6.50

There's something about being able to load 3,500 rounds out of 1 pound of powder that appeals to the old man in me.

762

[texassako]

Three cents for the primer. (Primers are the monkey)
1/2 cent for the powder. ($160/for 8 pounds)
0.8 cents for the lead at a dollar a pound. (not that I paid that)


That is about what I have found shooting .25 ACP, with the primer cost far above powder and lead. A little more lead and powder don't really add much to the cost. You make me wonder how a .25 ACP bullet would do in one of my .25 caliber rifles (drops big enough and smallest I cast).

[762 shooter]

That is about what I have found shooting .25 ACP, with the primer cost far above powder and lead. A little more lead and powder don't really add much to the cost. You make me wonder how a .25 ACP bullet would do in one of my .25 caliber rifles (drops big enough and smallest I cast).

I've put as little as 1.5 grains of Bullseye behind a 113 grain cast 308. I'm using a fast powder because general wisdom seems to be that low charges of slow powder may disperse and detonate instead of burn. I'm not sure if one could blow up a rifle with 2.0 grains of anything but I've been wrong before.

762

[Harter66]

I just bought an as new 36cal 58' Remington repro. I make my BP and obvously cast.
.015 Powder 15gr at $6 /lb
.05 cap ,I've them in the stash as low as 3.25/100
.01 ball presuming $1/lb

I gotta do somthing about cap costs I guess . I shot 3 days last week w/some BP guys I shot 100+each day ,25 yd squirles would have been in trouble by the end weekend, 3 pistols and a 50cal rifle I spent less than $25 on shooting I spent more than that for my Dad and I on dinner going home.
I can even back them down and stretch the powder farther, but at .05-.10 a shot why bother ? I didn't even start shooting BP in earnest until about 2 yr ago. I've cosidered for several yr the ability top shoot BP in 38/357.

[FredBuddy]

I'm working on the same thing in 30-30. When the weather stabilizes, I'll be able to finalize the process, but so far, so good.

[runfiverun]

if you use a 22 cal pellet and a sr mag primer it will clear the barrel [at about 800 fps] with a little bit of lube applied to the barrel it goes a little faster.

for 20-25 yd squirrel shooting it's all you need.

[frkelly74]

22 really really long rifle. My solution so far has ended up being a 9mm hi-point. so far I have killed a few clay pigeons with it out to about 30 yds.

[mdi]

Good report! I've been shooting my R.R. (rimfire replacement) for mebbe a year but with a few differences. I don't have a .22 cal. mold so I just bought some Beartooth 45 gr. LRN bullets. I don't count pennies for my hobby so I can't compare to my 22 lr ammo (besides I have bricks of .22 from 9 years ago and primers mebbe 6 years old, and can't remember what they cost!), but it sure is fun. I have a bunch of WC820 that I've been using and get some pretty accurate loads outta my Handi in .223, mebbe 1300-1400 fps...

[Harter66]

To be more on topic. I shoot 130 and 150s in a 7x6.8 Rem w/3.0gr Unique for 800fps w/150s about 900 w/130s.

[trixter]

Thanks for the heads up guys. I just found Jim's thread.

762


Please share with me where I can find 'Jim's" threads I would like more reading material on cast 223 stuff.

[Jailer]

I just started doing the same thing with my Axis 223. I'm using the only 22 mold I have the Mihec 62gr nato. Running them sans gas check tumble lubed with 3gr of titegroup seated deep so they chamber. Good accuracy out to 50 yards so far, haven't shot any further out than that.

[762 shooter]

Please share with me where I can find 'Jim's" threads I would like more reading material on cast 223 stuff.

Here is a custom search engine that someone here suggested awhile back that works pretty good. Just search for "Jim Subsonic" and stand back.


https://www.google.com/cse/home?cx=001951264366462437169:ggn3vg-bjum

R5R. That's a good idea on the 22 pellets. Next on my got to try list. I have gobs of WW from 30 years ago that I need to use for something though. And casting is fun.

I just spent the evening shooting these Goons in my garage. Loads of fun. I also had about a pound of an unknown shotgun powder that I have been playing with trying to figure out a good load for these squirrel loads.

Does anyone know if you can blow up a firearm with 2 grains of any kind of powder? I'm getting some very consistent velocities with this mystery powder.

More fun than a barrel of monkeys.

762

[dverna]

I did not want to cast those itty bitty bullets. Also, for me, a replacement for .22 means lots of rounds downrange - so a straight wall pistol caliber made more sense for faster reloading and less bulk. I use a Marlin 1894 with .38 Spl cases. Less than $2.50 a box using Tula primers. No gas checks or Dacron and 1" groups at 30 yards. What's not to like? Plus lever actions are fun.

Don Verna

[waco]

Trying to find the time to work up a load with the Bator in my Fireball.

[runfiverun]

if it's a shotgun powder for sure the type of load would dictate the actual burn rate of the powder.
it could be about any where from red-dot down to blue-dot speed.
the red-dot/clay's area would be 1 to 1-1/8oz target type 12ga shells, 1-18oz handicap target shells would use powder in the green-dot/pb area, the slower stuff would be used for heavy 12ga field loads [unique/800-x area]
12ga steel shot would be in the 800-x blue-dot range, or 20ga type [unique/800-x again] target/light field loads.

[too many things]

I am with runfiverun a RWS superpoint 5.5mm will do a good job with just a primer. I have used 1gr bullseye and didnt have any problem but I went to 2gr and did . dont know where the pellet went. the mag pellet would be better but that was what I had at the time.
didnt shoot enough to try lube. they dont in air rifle so didnt see the need

[freebullet]

Very interesting. Thanks for sharing.

[Catshooter]

7.62,

I had some mystery powder also. I started with a 94 Winchester in 45 Colt. Two grains under a 250 grain boolit was my starting load. Boolit went about eight inches down the bore. I knew that two grains of anything was safe.

It ended up that my powder was 4831.

Nice work with the 223. Thanks for the work up.


Cat

[762 shooter]

Thanks for the nice words and info. When I started I was expecting to have keyhole issues with the light boolit and fast twist combo. None so far. Nice round holes. Zero leading.

The Ruger likes the 69 grain SMK's with full power loads. Really likes them.

The itty bitty boolits cast fast and nice with the Lee 6 Cavity. I loaded some wrinkled culls with my keepers and did not notice much difference at ten yards, velocity or accuracy. I am going to stretch my yardage out to a whopping 30 yards and see what happens.

I worked on some cat sneeze loads with my 308, but wanted to see how low I could get my per round cost. Mouse fart 308 loads seem to be louder than 223.

Anyway I can shoot these in my garage into a rubber mulch backstop all day and no one is the wiser. End product is I'm casting more and getting trigger time. I will also be ready for any squirrel or rabbit or possum attack.

762

[Muskyhunter1]

I got me a 22 Lyman mold somewhere around here, a 223 Encore Pro Hunter and some beavers living in my dock at camp. Sounds like a challenge.

The only issue is I think my mold is 70 grain and I have been told my twist is 1:12. I guess I will have to see if it stabilizes those slugs.

[Silver Eagle]

Have seen a few references to people shooting .22 cal pellets. As air guns use the skirt to seal the bore (basically the skirt expands a bit and seals.) One would need to be cautious not to "blow the skirt" pushing the pellet too fast. There have been cases of the skirt being left in the bore. Suggest using a rather heavy pellet with a thick skirt to prevent this.
There are a few brands of pellets that are more like solids then pellets, these might be worth a try.
Also, pellets prefer to stay subsonic and can be wildly inaccurate when pushed too fast. Generally 800 to 1000 FPS is the sweet spot.

[Shiloh]

Good post. May have to purchase a .224 mold.

Shiloh

[CWME]

The lyman 225107 plain base from NOE is a good boolit for these types of loads. Pinch of BE and a pistol primer and you have a quiet little load. The pellets work good in the 22 hornet with just the primer too.

[hickfu]

those are really cool.... Some one needs to make a 25caliber long rifle case and rifle. I came across a 25 Cal case mixed in with some range brass and thought it would be a great round if it was a little bit longer and I had a rifle that would accept it... SPP, some powder and some home cast boolits and I would be good to go.


Doc

[bangerjim]

I have been loading 223's for 22LR subs for some time now. Excellent choice. Put a bit of Dacron fluff in there to keep the powder back against the flash hole and you will gain power and accuracy!

I PC all my 223's and the shoot very clean and accurate in Mossy bolt.

I do the same thing with 30-06's. Light loads are fun!


banger

[bangerjim]

Have seen a few references to people shooting .22 cal pellets. As air guns use the skirt to seal the bore (basically the skirt expands a bit and seals.) One would need to be cautious not to "blow the skirt" pushing the pellet too fast. There have been cases of the skirt being left in the bore. Suggest using a rather heavy pellet with a thick skirt to prevent this.
There are a few brands of pellets that are more like solids then pellets, these might be worth a try.
Also, pellets prefer to stay subsonic and can be wildly inaccurate when pushed too fast. Generally 800 to 1000 FPS is the sweet spot.

I tried that with the 22 air rifle pellets. They fired down range.............. but left the skirt in the barrel!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Talk about mining lead. No more for me!

banger

[Camba]

102523
102522
This is my 22LR/22Mag cast boolit favorite low cost loading cartridge (edited: for my 5.7x28 FN Thompson Center G2 Contender Rifle only).
Camba