Next dumb idea: BP .45 Colt SHOTSHELLS! (?)

[JuliettDeltaGolf]

OK. I am tired of missing fast-moving rats at point-blank range. I'm absolutely overrun with the vermin. They chew up plastic and cardboard boxes, welder leads, and power cords in my outdoor welding shop (a temporary affair, in which I make my living). Most shots are at a range of 5 to 10 feet, with an occasional shot out to about 25'.
Was wondering if anyone has ever successfully loaded .45 shotshells with the holy black. I normally load exclusively FFFg in my normal cast boolit loads, but I have a can of Goex FFFFg laying around. I was thinking if was extremely limited in powder capacity in the case, I could use the 4f for a higher power-to-volume ratio. As to the actual construction of the cartridge, here's some idees I bin throwin' around:

I want a shotshell that is as effective as possible at the ranges mentioned earlier. A maximum load of shot, up to 250 grs. worth, with enough velocity to get the job done.

I don't know what size shot to get, but I like the idee of #11 or #12.

My gunsmith neighbor suggests a simple load of the heathen smokeless under a gas check, shot, and crimped over a second, inverted gas check. Sounds simple, leaves little room for powder, with a limited shot payload.

Speer shot capsules. Maybe. Sound like they can be a pain, backing out of the cases from recoil, breaking under a crimp that's the slightest bit heavy. Not sure how it would stand up to BP burn?

Here's the crazy idees:

Use .460 S&W brass, and at some point in loading, sizing the part that needs to go in the chamber throat in a smaller (.44?) sizing die, so as to fit in the throat.

Use as thin a wad between the powder and shot as possible. Wad must stand up to the BP burn, and not take up too much case room. It will also be squeezed thru the extra-small case-throat, and enter the bore smaller-ed. What about placing an inverted gas check over the powder charge? Seems like the the thin metal cup would act like the cup of a hollow-based bullet and would squeeze thru the throat, then instantly obturate to fit the bore. Put a thin card wad over the gas check, under the shot? Whaddyall think?

[JuliettDeltaGolf]

JIC someone gets the wrong idee, the 4F idee was just IF I couldn't get enough 3F in there to get the needed velocity.

[RPRNY]

Not crazy, in fact you've got the right ideas. The plastic shot cups you can buy and load like bullets are rubbish. They spin in the rifling and deliver wicked donut patterns at 10'. The key to getting something like a decent pattern is to avoid shot cup wads.

I think 460 brass is the way to go. 35 grs of BP with a good 1/8" oversized wad to give both a good gas seal and some cushion to the shot is key. Your issue will be shot. It's been ages since I've seen anything smaller than #9 shot. What you want is #11. 1/4 oz is probably all you can fit in but my guess is you will get decent patterns at 10 - 12 ft. A good over shot card sealed with some water glass is all you need to top it off.

If that doesn't do it for you, a cheapo single barrel .410 and some 444 Marlin cases loaded with BP and 1/2 oz of shot will do it.

[doc1876]

black powder is dangerous at 10 ft. If you just use blanks, you should barbeque the **** out of them. We used to use an aluminum can for demos to show the public what a blank can do. good luck

[wcp4570]

Check this video out. Taking care of rats with a pellet gun equipped with night vision scope. I've been wanting to set mine up with night vision just for this reason but have not gotten around to it yet.


http://youtu.be/J5FqeatJmxM

wcp

[Boogieman]

I had the same problem making 45ACP shot shells. I found OX Yoke's Wonder wads would compress going through the neck area & spring back in the case. they worked ok but I got better results by using a plastic .410 shot gun wad cut off short enough to allow a thin card over the shot & sealed with Elmer's glue. I used#8 shot, that's all I had. Don't get too hung up on HV patterns are more important.

[Bad Ass Wallace]

45 LC shotshells can be made for a Ruger blackhawk from shortened 444 Marlin brass. The length is adjusted to suit the full length of the cylinder including the throat for an O/A length of approx 1.4". 1/2 oz 8 shot over 20gns 4F with 2 card wads between and capped off with a 44cal gas check.

Resize the body of the case in a FL 45 LC die and the neck area with a 6.5x55mm FL die. I use these loads for vermin whilst working the tractor and it's very effective for 7-8 yards!

[smkummer]

I have original H&R 410 handi gun coming. Unfortunately its a NFA item and will take 10 months to get. It looks like a lot of fun though. I have a box of old plastic covered shot cups already sealed and ready to be loaded in 45 Colt, these appear better than the speer shot capsules. I could be talked out of these for some 30-40 Krag brass. I have not done testing with 45 Colt speer shot capsules but the 44 shot appeared killable at close to 15 feet and number 9 gave a better pattern than 7 1/2. So 45 Colt should be as good if not better. With a revolver and especially double action you would have follow up shots just in case. While less mobile than the 45 revolver or handi gun, the next best thing would be a 410 snake charmer.

[bangerjim]

Make your own 45LC brass shot shells!

Use standard 45LC primed brass, charge with 4-5gn fast powder (I use TightGroup), put a paper wadding "washer" cut with a HF gasket cutter set over the powder and tamp, fill with 160gn of bird shot (I use 4-7), cap off with an Al GC upside down sized thru your sizing die so it will fit inside the mouth the case. Very light roll crimp to keep everything in there.

They work GREAT for close range "scatter" gun targets! These will shoot out of other 45LC guns than the Judge series, which I have 2 of that shoot 45's and 410's. Lower power than 410's and MUCH cheaper!!!!!!

bangerjim

[bedbugbilly]

Rats! Hmmm . . . . About 45 years ago, they closed down a dump that was about a mile away from the farm we lived on. The state condemned it and made them cover everything up and put test wells down, etc. Anyways . . . it used to be a good place to go shoot rats with a 22. After it closed, a colony of rats moved from there and ended up in one of our barns - the barn was the old stone foundation, etc. and probably a 100 years old - all we used the basement for was to store some equipment and machinery in. Once the rats moved in, it was a nightmare. We kept DeCon out all the time but you could open the sliding door up and when you looked in, see the rats all over - on the manger, the top sill of the field stone walls, etc. We would open the door, rush in and with either a shovel or a heavy oak 2 X 2 that I had driven spike through at the end, smack and kill 'em. It was nothing to get 3 or 4 at a time until they disappeared. Shut the door, give 'em a few minutes and you could start all over again. We were building a new barn yard fence using railroad ties for the posts (he had a dairy herd) and many of them went in to the bottom of the post holes as their final resting place. Finally through DeCon, clubbing and shooting, we got rid of them. I still have dreams about that once in a while - and I HATE rats!

I can't help you much on your BP loads other than to say, if you don't hit 'em, maybe you can smoke 'em to death with the BP! Nasty little critters . . . keep at 'em and you'll either kill 'em all or drive 'em out. Looking back, I wished I had had a .38 or a .45 and reloaded - shot shells up close sounds like a good cure for 'em! Good luck! Let us know how it works out for you please. "-)

[Zymurgy50]

Wafarin.


AKA rat poison



EDIT: I was pondering this while at work today, I believe Dixie Gun Works used to sell a black powder mouse/rat trap. I dont think it would take much more than an old black powder pistol and some "bailin wire n bubble gum" to make a rat roastin' trap.

[Bonz]

Check this video out. Taking care of rats with a pellet gun equipped with night vision scope. I've been wanting to set mine up with night vision just for this reason but have not gotten around to it yet.


http://youtu.be/J5FqeatJmxM

wcp

I wish my hands were that steady, amazing shooting

[wcp4570]

This is a lady doing the night sniping on the rats and if she still uses the same setup, she could shoot from a low supported position. She attached a camcorder to the scope eye piece and used the LCD for aiming. If you noticed she only shoots either between the eyes or just behind the eye for a dead rat. There are many different types of setups for night vision air gun shooting on the web.

wcp