Wet tumbleing with SS pins leaveing brown spots

[Northboy]

I've been Tumbleing with SS pins, lemishine and armor all wash and wax. worked great on a couple tumbles but the others left brown spots on the brass. Anyone else had this, or have a cure???

[blikseme300]

Do you have a water treatment unit on your house? Once I used water in the tumbler shortly after the unit had flushed and the brass was all brown. I use Armor All during the rinse process in a media separator and the brass stays shiny for a long time.

[Bayou52]

I've been Tumbleing with SS pins, lemishine and armor all wash and wax. worked great on a couple tumbles but the others left brown spots on the brass. Anyone else had this, or have a cure???

I haven't had any brown spots or discoloration, in my experience. About how much Lemi-Shine are you using per batch? No more than 1/4 teaspoon per batch is called for. Much more actually causes discoloration in the brass.

[rodok]

Also another problem I have had is make sure the inside liner of the drum is clean after several cleanings I can get a buildup of residue on the inside of the drum, just wipe it down and it works fine.

[Beesdad]

I haven't had any brown spots or discoloration, in my experience. About how much Lemi-Shine are you using per batch? No more than 1/4 teaspoon per batch is called for. Much more actually causes discoloration in the brass.

My expense also ... More than 1/4 teaspoon of Lemi-Shine will cause problems... Not sure about the Armor All car wash... I only use dish detergent the a few sprays of car detailing wax after the brass is dry. The shine will last for months.

[C. Latch]

How are you drying your brass? Mine sparkle when they come out of the tumbler, but will develop water spots if I let them slowly air-dry.

[mold maker]

I have city water that is great. I've had no water spots. I gave a friend some citric acid to use, and his well water and citric acid made a real mess. The brass came out dark and no shine. I brought it home and re- cleaned it quick, and a short tumble in cob with NuFinish, looked better than new.
The difference has to be the water.

[shredder]

I vote water too. I always use distilled or rainwater from the barrel outside.

[Bonz]

+1 on only 1/4 teaspoon. In fact, I use only 1/4 teaspoon per 2 gallons of water in my tumbler. I also use the Armor All Wash & Wax but I truly believe that Dawn dish soap get the brass a lot cleaner.

[Bayou52]

+1 on only 1/4 teaspoon. In fact, I use only 1/4 teaspoon per 2 gallons of water in my tumbler. I also use the Armor All Wash & Wax but I truly believe that Dawn dish soap get the brass a lot cleaner.

Bonz -

How's your brass on re-tarnishing with the use of Dawn? Any problem with that in your experience?

[geargnasher]

I also use ONLY rainwater for my tumbling. I'd use distilled if I didn't have access to rainwater.

The instructions from STI are rather odd I think, they say to use only 1/4 teaspoon of Lemi-shine but 2-3 TABLESPOONS of dish detergent? That's crazy IMO. I put a heaping teaspoon of Lemishine in the 17-lb tumbler and one squirt of detergent to work as a surfacant, it's the citric acid that does the real work anyway.

Also, I rinse in a bath of citric acid/water. The citric acid passivates the brass and helps retard oxidation, particularly on the inside of the case and inside the primer pocket where I don't want things to corrode later. I get blindingly bright brass in short order and it stays that way after drying on a towel, no spots at all. Using too much detergent screws up the pH of the solution and makes it harder for the citric acid to do its work, but using "too much" citric acid only wastes a bit and harms nothing, and it's cheap so I don't worry too much about it. Having used citric acid to clean brass for several years (even before getting an SS pin tumbler), I'm very skeptical of the mention that using too much will cause spots. I think it's excessive detergent that does that, or a combination of what's in the water with the citric acid and the detergent.

Gear

[Bonz]

Bonz -

How's your brass on re-tarnishing with the use of Dawn? Any problem with that in your experience?

It definitely tarnishes if I just wash them in Dawn. The last couple of batches I cleaned, I tried 2 hours wet tumbling with Dawn and Lemishine, de-prime and roll size (roll sizing scratches the @#% out of brass) and then 2 hours wet tumbling with Armor All Wash & Wax and Lemishine. The brass looks darker and runs thru the dies like they are dirty.

[dbosman]

In my experience, cement mixer & 1.25 tons of 9mm, its the soap suds that do the hard work work, not the detergent in solution. If the suds spill out or wear out from dirt contamination, cleaning stops.
If you over fill a sealed tumbler, the brass won't come out as clean as it will if there is air space for suds.

[geargnasher]

Mm, ok.

Gear

[John Boy]

but the others left brown spots on the brass.Indicative of iron in the burnishing solution

[Beesdad]

How are you drying your brass? Mine sparkle when they come out of the tumbler, but will develop water spots if I let them slowly air-dry.
I first give them a spin in a media separator removing the pins and most of the water-- then roll the brass on an old bath towel to remove the excess surface water -- then air dry.. No spots if I follow this process.

I have used a heat gun if I am in a rush also a dehydrator works well.

[Northboy]

Well let me put it this way. I used a 6lb tumbler Im running 2lb of pins 1-1.5 lb brass 1/8 tsp lemishine and about a TBLS of washand wax and I got brown spots I just tried a batch of with a squirt of dawn and 1/8 tsp lemishine in a first go around, rinsed and put them back in with just wash and wax and they came out beautiful. I don't really want to run them twice with such a small tumbler but maybe that's what I got to do. I'm going to try another batch like this tomorrow night.

[Bayou52]

101709

This is a pic of a typical batch wet tumbled in a recipe similar to northboy's. Perhaps the spotting y'all are seeing has something to do with rinsing. I rinse in cold water at least 4 times to assure all suds are removed from the drum.

I then separate the pins using more cold tap water in a rotary media separator.

I then remove 99% + of all moisture by spin drying 2 times in the media separator with a dry rag/towel thrown in. By this time, there are NO droplets or wet spots on the brasses at all. They are now substantially dry.

The wash & wax keeps the brasses having that high yellow bright appearance, as you can see from the pic.

In short, the moisture is immediately removed from the brasses right after tumbliing.
No wet spots remain on the brass.

Hope this helps.

[psychicrhino]

Shiny shiny brass there.

[geargnasher]

101709

This is a pic of a typical batch wet tumbled in a recipe similar to northboy's. Perhaps the spotting y'all are seeing has something to do with rinsing. I rinse in cold water at least 4 times to assure all suds are removed from the drum.

I then separate the pins using more cold tap water in a rotary media separator.

I then remove 99% + of all moisture by spin drying 2 times in the media separator with a dry rag/towel thrown in. By this time, there are NO droplets or wet spots on the brasses at all. They are now substantially dry.

The wash & wax keeps the brasses having that high yellow bright appearance, as you can see from the pic.

In short, the moisture is immediately removed from the brasses right after tumbliing.
No wetcspots remain on the brass.

Hope this helps.

Tumbling with a hand towel is a STELLAR idea, I'll have to try that. I've been sawing the brass pile back and forth in a folded towel hammock-style to dry the outside, but it doesn't do much for the primer pockets. I usually put them out on a tray in the sun for a couple of hours to finish things off, never have any spots.

Gear

[Bayou52]

Tumbling with a hand towel is a STELLAR idea

Gear - let me know how spin drying works for you. Tumbling in wash & wax, then rinsing real well and immediately removing remaining moisture seems to be the key to bright and spotless brass. I've got brasses laid open for months with no significant change in bright coloration.

[altheating]

I rinse in hot water, spin in media separator, dump the cases on a old towel and use the hammock method to get the small water droplets off. I do have a water system installed, maybe that's why I do not have any spots. The only thing I ever had happen was a batch of brass turned pink. I think it was due to to much lemi shine.

[geargnasher]

Gear - let me know how spin drying works for you. Tumbling in wash & wax, then rinsing real well and immediately removing remaining moisture seems to be the key to bright and spotless brass. I've got brasses laid open for months with no significant change in bright coloration.

I have some Matera Paper shop towels that are tough as nails and lint free, I'm thinking of tossing a couple sheets of those (shop rag size) in the media separator and giving them a dry tumble using the separator bin lid for a rest. That ought to shake out a bit more water than the terry bath towel/hammock-tumble method.

Gear

[C. Latch]

I first give them a spin in a media separator removing the pins and most of the water-- then roll the brass on an old bath towel to remove the excess surface water -- then air dry.. No spots if I follow this process.

I have used a heat gun if I am in a rush also a dehydrator works well.

My wife's been wanting some new towels anyway.

[Bayou52]

I have some Matera Paper shop towels that are tough as nails and lint free, I'm thinking of tossing a couple sheets of those (shop rag size) in the media separator and giving them a dry tumble using the separator bin lid for a rest. That ought to shake out a bit more water than the terry bath towel/hammock-tumble method.

Gear

I know how spin drying cases in the media separator works for me, but I'm always interested in hearing how others do. Can you post a report after you give 'em a spin?

[geargnasher]

Will do, probably won't run another batch until this weekend though, but you never know....

Gear

[too many things]

those pins are NOT stainless . check with a magnet if you leave brass in the pins over night they will start to rust . True monel pins would be 10 times the price.
get them out and dry and you should be fine

[detox]

I first tumble cases in pins until primer pockets are nearly clean (about 3 hours). Next i seperate pins from cases then dry and polish in corn cob media. I usally clean about 100 cases at a time just after shooting.

[M-Tecs]

those pins are NOT stainless . check with a magnet if you leave brass in the pins over night they will start to rust . True monel pins would be 10 times the price.
get them out and dry and you should be fine

Most 300 series stainless steels are nonmagnetic. Most 400 series are magnetic. 400 series can be hardened more but they are less corrosion resistant.

http://www.physlink.com/Education/AskExperts/ae546.cfm

http://www.bosunsupplies.com/StainlessInfo2/

http://www.raytechmetalfinishing.com/finishing-media/raymf_fm_pins.php

[C. Latch]

I wish someone made some affordable magnetic, stainless pyramid-shaped pins to clean primer pockets faster. If it wasn't for the primer pockets I think 1.5-2 hours would be all the time you'd need to clean cases. Maybe less.

[Murphy]

I just ordered the Rebel 17 with pin's and Lemi-Shine. I won't get the chance to try it for 8-9 days. I needed a larger capacity case tumbler anyway and my Lyman 1200 has been holding up for a long, long time now.

If the primers pockets are such a worry to some? Why not chuck a primer pocket brush up in a drill press and get the vast majority of them clean before tumblings? Seems like to me it'd cut your time in half and save wear and tear on your tumbler.

Murphy

[M-Tecs]

I wish someone made some affordable magnetic, stainless pyramid-shaped pins to clean primer pockets faster. If it wasn't for the primer pockets I think 1.5-2 hours would be all the time you'd need to clean cases. Maybe less.

Carbon steel

http://www.contenti.com/products/tumbling/180-700.html

nonmagnetic

http://www.kingsleynorth.com/skshop/product.php?id=46590&catID=789

http://www.riogrande.com/Product/Stainless-Steel-Shot-Mixed/339097?***=2

https://www.etsy.com/search?q=Stainless+Steel+Shot+Jewelers+Mix

Same as you I haven’t been able to locate any magnetic stainless pyramid-shaped pins Thinking about trying the carbon but that would have to be dried to prevent rust.

[geargnasher]

I just ordered the Rebel 17 with pin's and Lemi-Shine. I won't get the chance to try it for 8-9 days. I needed a larger capacity case tumbler anyway and my Lyman 1200 has been holding up for a long, long time now.

If the primers pockets are such a worry to some? Why not chuck a primer pocket brush up in a drill press and get the vast majority of them clean before tumblings? Seems like to me it'd cut your time in half and save wear and tear on your tumbler.

Murphy

They're plenty clean enough in a couple of hours for most uses, and for the rest, one is likely going to uniform or clean them anyway, so you make a good point. What I have left after two hours is mostly stain, not crust, so no big deal. You're going to like that 17, it's money well spent.

Gear

[rondog]

I see Frankford Arsenal is offering a SS tumbling kit now.....

[Bayou52]

I see Frankford Arsenal is offering a SS tumbling kit now.....

Yes, I've read several posts on other forums about this new tumbler, called a F.A.R.T. (Franklin Arsenal Rotary Tumbler) for short.

Most of the comments were positive, and it appears to have a much larger capacity than the Thumbler's model B or the Extreme Rebel 17. One of the best features of this tumbler, that I can see just by looking at the picture of it - there's no belt.

Demo Video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X9rIyue6RC4